it is officially according to Lucasfilm a part of the Skywalker Saga...there's nothing to debate...you're just wrong...plus I just listed all the legacy characters that were main parts of the sequel trilogy...now you're changing your opinion and talking about how the characters were 'inconsistent' compared to the OT...that's not the point...seems like you just want to double down on your incorrect opinion no matter how much evidence is presented to the contrary
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Star Wars Outlaws
- Thread starter polonyc2
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it is officially according to Lucasfilm a part of the Skywalker Saga...there's nothing to debate...you're just wrong...plus I just listed all the legacy characters that were main parts of the sequel trilogy...now you're changing your opinion and talking about how the characters were 'inconsistent' compared to the OT...that's not the point...seems like you just want to double down on your incorrect opinion no matter how much evidence is presented to the contrary
They are shit movies with tons of inconsistencies and continuity problems. You are also avoiding the rest of what I said about the shit show that is the Acolyte.
Flogger23m
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All of those characters had what was essentially minor cameos. The direction of the trilogy was trash, it is almost like they are three independent films.
M76
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And the official position is that the people who dislike their shows are racist or worse. Something being an official position doesn't make it factually true.
They were relegated to supporting characters and their legacy was destroyed, they might as well have been called Stan and Pan, because they had zero resemblance to the OT characters.
The sequel trilogy is not the story of the skywakers. Just as Rebel Moon is not a brilliant scifi epic as Snyder thinks. I bring that up to demonstrate that just because the creators think they achieved something doesn't mean they actually did it.
Clearly the main characters of the ST are Rey and Kylo Ren, neither of whom is a skywalker.
you sure about that?
I agree that the sequel trilogy sucked but to deny it's officially part of the Skywalker Saga is silly...it is...it's a fact...there's no arguing...debating the merits of the movie or TV is subjective but certain things are objective facts
The sequel trilogy is objectively bad. I think that could be proven beyond a reasonable doubt in court. Also, canon in fictional IP's is fluid in that any of it rejected hard enough by fans can be cast aside. One need look no further than the Highlander franchise for evidence of that. All of them connect to the first movie, but almost every installment ignores all but the first film. The series acknowledges only films 1 & 3 and indirectly acknowledges 4 as four follows the series, but 4 ignores every film but 1. The reason this happened was because the fans rejected attempts to change the lore and explain where Immortals came from or add magic and other bullshit to the mythology.
You are still ignoring what's been said about the Acolyte and how it sucks from a big picture standpoint because its nonsensical and creates continuity issues. Things like Kiadi Mundi (who's species only lives for about 75 years) appearing over 100 years before he's supposed to appear in the Clone Wars. The origins of the Sith aren't really addressed despite your claim to the contrary, and nothing about the "High Republic" is interesting because its depicted exactly as everything we've ever seen before. Which itself contradicts other sources approved by Disney themselves.
So tell us again how the Acolyte is good, worth watching or does anything but act as a cancer to the Star Wars franchise.
Comixbooks
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Waiting for Peter Pan Star Wars version from Disney.
you would lose in a court of law because the public has already spoken...The Force Awakens is the #1 movie of all time in the USA...all-time...Last Jedi is ranked 13th and Rise of Skywalker is ranked 20th...so by any official objective measurement the movies were a huge success...unless you're arguing that the movie made $936,000,000 and everyone hated it?...which sounds ridiculous
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/chart/top_lifetime_gross/?ref_=bo_cso_ac
Comixbooks
Fully [H]
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What is Solo ranked? That is the last one I watched.
GoldenTiger
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I wonder why that keeps happening... /s
it didn't do well...it's outside of the Top 200
M76
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They are so successful in fact that Disney has scrapped the entire Ruin Johnson trilogy and they haven't greenlit a movie in almost 5 years. They bought Star Wars to print 1 billion every 2-3 years, not to relegate it to "content" on their failing streaming service.
There is no universe where Disney's star wars tragicomedy can be called a success story.
TFA's box office is not a good indicator. Everybody was bright eyed optimist when that came out, it took a while for it to sink in how bad it actually was. But nothing could've prepared us for TLJ.Which wasn't just simply bad, but malicious. TFA, TLJ, and ROS are two manbabies taking and breaking each other's toys in a hissy fit. That is Disney SW for you at the movies. And the TV side? Well I already covered the quality of the Acolyte.
Yes, I'm sure, he is a Solo at best, but even that is just semantics, because in reality he is a discount Vader cosplayer. None of his connections to the Skywalker name means anything to us because it was never established.
We are not denying the official line, we just trust our own eyes over the official narrative.
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M76
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So questioning the quality / success of Disney Star Wars is considered anti woke now?
Dion
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Star Wars has become trash since Disney bought it... /thread
Legendary Gamer
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Man, there's a lot to unpack here. Maybe you're a Star Wars normie... I'm an old fuck, that remembers the Expanded Universe (EU) and read most of the books. All the new shit that Disney does steals ideas and direct source material from the EU... You know, all the material that Kathleen Kennedy decided to disavow and say didn't exist. Disney is so creatively bankrupt they have to steal from other people's work.
Now, I never really considered a lot of the EU to be great. I even hated the Yuuzhan Vong for a while... Jesus, now compared to Disney's take on things the EU is fucking masterpiece theater.
The High Republic, just for the factual basis and all is Kathleen Kennedy's initiative to create "new" content that fills in an area of time that wasn't covered in the EU (1-200 years before the clone wars) even though there was the Knights of the Old Republic and more. It is a dogshit, failed property, that never sold any comics or books and lost a lot of money. That's factual. No one likes the High Republic Era.
The Acolyte is Canon Breaking. The Sith had not been seen for a thousand years or more in the Clone Wars... It's set 100 years before. The Jedi are portrayed as incompetent and effeminate and this has been confirmed by Leslie Headland herself. To make all the women masculine and all the men effeminate. She added lesbian space witches that conceived twin girls in the force that even Darth Plageuis and Palpatine could not accomplish... The Jedi do not warn the council and even after the deaths of numerous Masters and other Jedi no one but Jedi master Neppo (Green) Headland's Wife is the wiser.
S1 of Mando was good, the rest is ok and steals the show and focus from him
Book of boba was utter trash with limited decent world building
Obi Wan was hot garbage that breaks all established lore and canon but had great world building
Andor is gem, based off a mediocre Rogue One movie that broke EU lore and some canon but overall was decent. In the original take Jyn Erso and Cassian Andor survive and take (I would imagine Krennic's shuttle to the tantive IV with the plans and are the reason why the Empire Pursues it). I mean, they did walk right past his shuttle on the beach in order to sit down and die at the water's edge waiting for the shockwave to hit them... that was a waste of reusable heroes that didn't have to explore the Skywalker stories... What a fucking waste and lack of vision.
Andor as a show explores the origins of the Rebel Alliance and the dirty things people have to do to fight the Empire. It's an amazing exploration of detail and characters. Well written, slow burn, big payoffs. Not the normal pacing of Star Wars.... but what is these days? Only six to 7 films really matter, the rest are copied shit with no plan and it shows.
The squandered the best thing they could ever do, never reuniting Han, Luke and Leia and making her die from unknown causes. Luke died from a brain fart and Han was a deadbeat dad that was murdered by his own son. Those 3 movies are dogshit.
The Acolyte is a platform for injecting Pronouns and Current day politics and agendas into a platform that was always for everyone. Now it's just like all the other dogshit out there.
forgot one... Solo, it was ok. I didn't have a problem with that one. It got a lot of hate because of all the other stupid stuff Disney was churning out.
Star Wars is dead and it shows. Disney has killed a beloved franchise in 12 years?
If you like it, good for you. Like it. But this is, in my and many other's opinions, dogshit.
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peppergomez
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What's most entertaining about All this is that fan boys take this lore far more seriously than the creators.They don't give a s*** at this point.They're just cashing the check.They probably laugh at you guys for arguing about it..
At this point they are pulling these stories and n these characters out of their ass.
You guys are aware of the fact that somewhere around 1983 George Lucas decided to turn this franchise into a way to sell toys, not to tell stories right? So you guys are actually arguing about a toy franchise for children tthat Hollywood and Lhcasarts has fooled you into thinking is an actual epic saga. LOTR this is not.
At this point they are pulling these stories and n these characters out of their ass.
You guys are aware of the fact that somewhere around 1983 George Lucas decided to turn this franchise into a way to sell toys, not to tell stories right? So you guys are actually arguing about a toy franchise for children tthat Hollywood and Lhcasarts has fooled you into thinking is an actual epic saga. LOTR this is not.
Legendary Gamer
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I think it's just become another platform that they want to virtue signal from. Ultimately, this has backfired. Turning a predominantly male brand into a female one. Good for them, they can keep writing 180 Million Dollar checks for shit no one wants to watch. None of this will bankrupt Disney, but eventually, it's gonna hit them where it hurts and arguably it already has. the company is just too deep into activists to recover. It will, eventually, kill them. However, they don't care how much money they lose, because they're right and everyone else is wrong.
I think this shit pops up in this channel because of what they did to the main character in this game. Most people are tired of ugly or bland female protagonists. Men sell and so do hot women. Bland chicks, forcing an adgenda don't sell. This is gonna be a light on content, linear story with zero replay ability and forgettable characters. I'm not buying it an I recommend everyone else avoid it unless it's free too. Maybe it will be 5 bucks on a steam sale in two years or Free on Epic. Otherwise, I suspect Outlaws is not worth your time or money.
you wrote an essay but I can summarize your post in this one sentence:
"The Acolyte is a platform for injecting Pronouns and Current day politics and agendas into a platform that was always for everyone. Now it's just like all the other dogshit out there"
sounds like you're one of those people that automatically will hate a game or movie or TV series if it happens to have a person of color or LGBTQ actor etc...I could care less about that stuff and care about the content, meaning story first...acting, visuals etc also play a role but story is always more important...now if the actor playing the role sucks and happens to be Black then so be it but I don't go into it with a preconceived notion of hating the color of the person or their sexual orientation first
Well said.
That's literally what's happening in Acolyte.
Legendary Gamer
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You would be wrong. You make some massive assumptions.
No one is complaining about it in House of the Dragon, do you know why?
Because it's well written and it works. It's an excellent show written by competent people. they have race swapped and injected a lot of gay and lesbian stuff in there and no one cares. because the story and character development is excellent and it feels natural.
The Acolyte is poorly written, directed by an armature that was the personal assistant to Harvey Wienstien and willingly fed/led women to him... Think about that. She's also put together a terrible script and the agenda here detracts from a property that was always accessible to everyone before. No one knew the characters, no one is invested in their story, no one cares. the story is a reflection of her own personal trauma with her sister.
the only thing that was good is episode five kills off a bunch of jedi we never cared about because we never knew them. Arguably the Sith is the best part of the show. Even though he shouldn't exist or shouldn't have revealed himself.
Looks like you're an activist. I prefer to have zero further interaction with you. Have a nice day, enjoy your eco chamber.
pendragon1
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can you please make up your mind on which side of this you are fallin? im seeing you complain about the things we are, then turn around and mock people over it. make up your damn mind.
ps: this game looks like its gonna be shit.(on topic)
Legendary Gamer
[H]ard|Gawd
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Yeah... There's nothing (Star Wars) cool anymore. How hard would it be to make 1313? Seriously... Lucas derailed it saying it had to be Boba Fett. But I think all of us would have gone nuts over a new protagonist exploring the underbelly of Coruscant. This game... Meh...
You sound like the shill media who automatically assumes that racism, transphobia, homophobia, etc. are the only reasons why people complain about identity politics, political messaging or forced DEI. This is a false assumption. First off, the forced DEI means that actors are hired based on their race, sexual orientation or based on their political beliefs. This forced DEI isn't even just a facet of casting but it seems to impact the writing and production staff as well. This means people are being hired based on criteria that has nothing to do with merit, skill or ability to do the job.
This manifests in numerous ways, not the least of which is the stories take a back seat to identity politics and political messaging. Again, you can have movies and films with diverse casts that are accepted by the audience. The 1987 film Predator is a great example of this. Aliens is another one. The alphabet agenda, creates similar issues in the form of character's sexual orientation being the forefront of who they are rather than a preference. In this case, the communist lesbian space witches and how ridiculous it is to have them using the force for immaculate conception, force rape, force impregnation, etc. This is not only contrived to include a coven of lesbians but its lore breaking and creates a number of continuity problems. Again, forcing the story to focus on the sexual orientation of characters to this degree means that once again, story and even characterization take a back seat to simply checking off a list including people that represent the alphabet mafia.
You say this and defend the Acolyte which literally has a story that's incompatible with other Star Wars films and TV shows as it breaks the lore, violates continuity and even plain logic. The story barely exists and relies on contrivances and coincidences to move the plot forward. Character motivations make no sense and change from scene to scene or episode to episode. The actors can't act either and their performances are cringe inducing. So that's another thing you can't point to being good about the Acolyte.
No one is complaining about the fact that there are non-white actors in the roles. At least, nothing I've seen from anyone says anything of the sort. In fact, many videos praise the acting capabilities of Squid Game Guy and even remark that Smilo Ren's actor would probably be good if he had something to work with but the script doesn't help him very much. He does the best he can with the shit dialog and script.
Circling back to modern politics, allegory has been a staple of good science fiction since the 1960's. However, there is a sharp difference between doing it in the style of classic Trek Shows where both sides of the issue were presented with equal validity and despite the choices of characters within the narrative, the viewer was left to make their own decisions on what was right or wrong and which side they agree most with. The viewer wasn't beat over the head, lectured or told they were wrong for disagreeing with one point of view or the other. Let's also not forget that Star Wars was never about modern day politics as it was always sci-fantasy and effectively more about rebels and space samurai fighting space Nazi's if you want to get down to it. It was much more action focused and operatic without trying to be high-brow entertainment.
The way "woke" shows handle politics is to basically echo the absolute far left wings political views and tell the viewer that every other perspective is wrong and without merit. Proper representation of the opposing view is never part of the equation either. Only one side is presented cherry picking around any flaws in the left's arguments and the right is made to seem incompetent and outright brain dead. If they present anything from the right, its only the worst arguments or extremist (far right) views being presented, but they are done so in the least credible and serious way. In other words, you are told that the opposing view point is wrong and its wrong for a reason that seems simple, but its far from truthful.
And again, story telling takes a back seat to shoehorning modern day political agendas into the shows. No one writing this garbage has any idea how to be subtle. Nothing counts if you don't smack everyone in the face with a hammer covered in your bullshit.
Of course, someone like you probably assumes a disdain for pronoun nonsense can only come from a place of hatred and bigotry right? Wrong. First off, the English language does not allow one to simply choose their own pronouns for a very good reason. No one person can remember everyone else's made up bullshit. It's not reasonable to use non-standard pronouns and expect the rest of society to conform to you and remember whatever bullshit you came up with to describe yourself. So unless all of society starts tattooing pronouns on everyone's foreheads it will always be impractical to have more than a couple of them in the language.
Secondly, there is no need to inject our modern day garbage into Star Wars. That movie was already made and its called "Idiocracy."
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M76
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That's all true, but they are not just laughing at us, oldschool people. But the "modern fans" as well, who they are supposedly catering to who were "afraid to be star wars fans" before now. They came up with theories as well, but the creators never even considered those when writing
That is the weakest excuse ever. "OH it's just a show about space wizards for children" Even if it was true that it is for children it is a false premise, chidlren's shows don't automatically mean nonsensical writing and inconsistent characters. I watched a ton of shows that were actually made for children that have brilliant writing, characters, and social commentary.
And you know what sells toys best? Well written shows with interesting characters. There is a reason the OT and Prequel trilogy toys still outsell the sequel trilogy.
Legendary Gamer
[H]ard|Gawd
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Idiocracy was way ahead of it's time
Legendary Gamer
[H]ard|Gawd
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This is so true.
You would think this would signal something to the execs at Disney... but they already had a toy line for the Acolyte mocked up just waiting for the success of this show.
Legendary Gamer
[H]ard|Gawd
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While many of us may like Andor, the show is being poorly viewed. At least 70% of the core audience for mainstream Star Wars has checked out completely. Almost 50% walked away after the Last Jedi. I know people that were stalwart Star Wars fans and collectors that have turned their backs on the brand because they have been branded bigots and racists dozens of times now, just for disagreeing with Disney's Star Wars. There are Andor toys, but they don't sell. Nothing Disney Star Wars sells.
When I was a kid there were only the Kenner toys and they were made for older kids but you bought em anyway. In every department store I go to, Star Wars is a clearance brand. They have this idiotic looking dumbed down toys for children that have zero value and don't even reflect the movies and shows and they just collect dust on shelves. Disney has none of the marketing skills that Lucas had.
Andor's viewership was VERY LOW. But it was WAY better than anything else that came after it including Ashoka. It's amazing it's supposedly getting a second season. By the time it comes out next year, most of the people that watched it won't even realize it's back out. Because most of them were bigots and racists and they unsubbed from Disney Plus as a result of the platfrom no longer being kid and family friendly. It now pushes agendas and sexual orientation even in children's cartoons.
2 years hiatus is too long between seasons. It hurts all properties. Next year, Andor will flop. But I will watch and enjoy it all the same.
MavericK
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I think the only reason it got delayed was due to the writer's/actor's strike. But yeah, sucks, Andor is/was really great.
M76
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Andor is a show about a dead character with no space to go anywhere else but Rogue one. People are just not interested in it. Including me, I haven't watched a second of Andor. Good writing in of itself is no guarantee of immediate success, ask Firefly. But I guarantee you the acolyte will never become a cult show that good friends make each other watch 20 years from now.
It's not about age, a lot of adults don't care about writing. Just the themes. But this is the type of fan who forgets the movie existed 10 minutes after watching it, they won't buy collectibles and merch. When toys are mentioned normies automatically assume it is made for kids, but a ton of toys are clearly made for adults and some adults even collect kids action figures. Except I see no-one collecting the Disney era stuff.
Legendary Gamer
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Honestly, that was my entire argument initially. A show about a dead character.
No one collects the Disney Era Star Wars stuff at all. I see a bunch of their merch at nearly every Flea Market I go to. No one buys it there either.
Hawkwing74
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That's me (walked away based on reviews of the last Jedi, couldn't watch that abomination). I was a hard core Star Wars fan. I have pictures playing with the toys years ago, when I was 5. I saw Ep 1-3 opening weekend. I love Rogue One and rate it 3rd best of all of them. If you told me that they could kill this franchise for many people, including me, I would not have believed you.
As I see it, they purposefully destroyed the characters of Luke and Han, and that's unforgivable to me. I wouldn't mind watching Andor after hearing good things, but I refuse to give a penny to Disney ever again.
To polonyc2 - throwing the racist card is beyond tiresome. Lando Calrissian and Mace Windu are great characters. That card is so overplayed that it doesn't have much resonance. You won't get your way calling us racist.
peppergomez
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You want a clear opinion? star wars sucks
GoldenTiger
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That's not the opinion he was asking you about, and you know it
.If this game is good enough I may buy it once it hits $5-10. Don't want to feed the beast too much now.
Comixbooks
Fully [H]
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Coolest guys around Gamorrean Guard
I never owned one star wars figure but my Gradeschool classmate owned like them all used to play with them his Sandbox he had a pit made of sand he wanted to think it was the scarlett Pitt. I had more fun shooting sling shots over by his house though in a old Gravel Pitt.
Comixbooks
Fully [H]
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We all know what this thread is about UBI and their first attempt at making a Star Wars game.