XFX R7770 Black Edition Super Overclocked Review @ [H]

darkstarcow said:
When you look at this card logically, it is a good/great card. This is a low end card which matches last years mid-high end offering. The price is about $20-30 too high right now, but pretty much has to be, so that all old stock can be cleared out. I am willing to bet that a price cut will happen next month, which will make this card an awesome buy. It is pathetic that all people see is the price.
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At first that seems quite logical, but then you have to ask yourself why they would release a video card that's going to be knowingly overpriced in comparison to its competition from other AMD cards. I'd imagine they're looking to sell them, so clearing out that old stock doesn't account for the price. Why not make the stock card $10 more than the current 5770? That way they'd at least have a better chance of selling them all and that small price difference would account for the 28nm shrink. My guess is these aren't that cheap to produce and that 28nm fab from TSMC, though great performing as far as yields go, isn't that cheap.

It's definitely an awesome GPU that improves upon the power-to-performance aspect drastically, along with its little sibling the 7750. But there are still plenty of the older 5770 and 6850/6870s around for cheaper. The price is something that will fluctuate depending on availability of the older gen cards as well as what nVidia will bring to the table so it's not going to be a lasting issue. At the moment, though, it certainly is and it's because of the performance and price of the older gen stuff :/
 
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JMccovery said:
Has anyone complaining about prices of the 7000 series parts think that the per-wafer costs could be much higher than 40nm?
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But as customers who only really care about price/performance, I don't think many people give a crap about that.

It may be a valid point, but if you're buying a new card you're probably not gonna be like, "Well, this card is newer and costs more for the same performance as a last-gen card that is now even cheaper, but this new one is 28nm so I'll go ahead and buy it."
 
The online store I usually buy from priced the 7770 between € 148 and € 157 BUT I'm not sure if those are actual prices or just "guesses". I sure hope not since I've paid € 119 for a new 4870 (1gb) in 2009 and the difference in performance isn't that huge.

Now I have 2 choices left:
get the 7850/7870 or wait for kepler if nVidia/EVGA can give me something to look forward to this weekend.
 
MavericK96 said:
But as customers who only really care about price/performance, I don't think many people give a crap about that.

It may be a valid point, but if you're buying a new card you're probably not gonna be like, "Well, this card is newer and costs more for the same performance as a last-gen card that is now even cheaper, but this new one is 28nm so I'll go ahead and buy it."
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It's also something that was known a long time ago. If you can't produce GPUs that improve upon their previous gen at the current and competitive prices then why release it at all? You have the option to wait or even bypass the low/mid tier and strictly improve upon the high end if it means you're going to be losing money or breaking even due to wafer cost. In fact, that's exactly what they did because they stopped at the 7750 and didn't bother to dip down further into the lower end to refresh those GPUs on 28nm. That probably has to do with the APUs cannibalizing the lower end and the fact that the wafer cost is higher so selling enough of the low end discrete GPUs at 28nm would be difficult to cover the costs when there's so many on 40nm at such cheap prices. Basically isn't worth it, which is what I'm assuming is the problem here with the price of the 7770. It just may not be worth dropping it lower until Kepler comes out because of production cost and issue of selling at high volume (so many 5xxx 6xxx already out there for cheap). It just seems the best option would have been to wait until the stock on 6xxx and 5xxx cards was depleted before they die-shrunk and released this GPU. Also appears to be another case of AMD just flat out pricing things poorly. Sometimes they get it right (Llano, Brazos, 7970/7950) and sometimes they get it flat-out wrong (7770 and Bulldozer).

I'm hoping these VLIW4 cards overclock extremely well, because that's what may determine whether they sell or not. If it's a strictly GCN thing then AMD is going to have a hard time selling any new cards other than those in the high end
 
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Until the release of the 7970 and the way they OC now I all but gave up on OC'ing my video cards the last few years as the benefits vs. stability/fps gains weren't worth it to me...If I have to OC a card to get the performance i want then it's not worth the money.
 
So I woke up this morning and found cards listed on the web. None of them are going for the $200 msrp. Most are going for $160 which I think is a very reasonable deal for a launch price.
 
This is just like the 6870 fiasco.
Some people refused to understand that it was competing with the 5770 and insisted on comparing it to the 5870.

6770 is replaced by 7770.
6870 is replaced by 7870
Is this hard to understand? Nvidia people are all about bussiness sense (pricing your eol stock in such a way that it will clear out for those resellers that still have stock) when it comes to Nvidia but the moment AMD does something in the interests of its bottom line its treason...
If Nvidia prices something high end and expensive then its ok cause the performance justifies the price but when AMD does that with tis 7970 its just soo wildly expensive how could they think of doing that!
Its pathetic how the green blinders are just stuck on some people.
 
A Brand new generation card (7770) replaces a 15 month old 85 dollar card.
That "85" dollar card didnt launch at that price. It fell to that price as time went on. Just as this card will fall in price.
 
7700 seems to be the new x600 series, like the 4670. I guess that's fairly obvious in terms of branding (x800 -> x900) and die size/power consumption. Price simply needs to follow suit.
 
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{NG}Fidel said:
A Brand new generation card (7770) replaces a 15 month old 85 dollar card.
That "85" dollar card didnt launch at that price. It fell to that price as time went on. Just as this card will fall in price.
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Yup....just did a little digging. Not a lot of info but I think the standard ones released around $120 and ones with better cooling up to $150ish?
 
I don't get a get what all the debate is about. I don't give a rat's ass what it is meant to compete with, or what it is called, or that the 6850/70 will be gone in a couple months. I look at how it performs and what it costs. I don't care that the 6870 has dropped in price since it came out. Just because it was once in one price bracket doesn't mean that it stays there once it's price has gone down. I am fine with the price premium on the 7970, it's the latest and greatest and nothing can compete with it. The 7770 is the latest but not the greatest unless you care about power usage. So what if the 6870 is going to be gone in a couple months. In a couple months when the 6870 is gone I still won't suddenly feel like the 7770 is a great card. I will forever remember that there were better cards for the money (better refers to performance, not power usage).

In fact, I couldn't really care less about the 7770. The only reason that I'm paying any attention to it at all is because it gives me the feeling that the rumors about the 7870 having a suggested price of $299 are going to be correct. I've been waiting for several months to get a new card and I won't be happy if I end up paying the same price for the same performance. If the 7870 performs between a 6950 and a 6970 but costs $300 the only conclusion that I will be able to come to is that I should have just bought a 6950 6 months ago.
 
I really love a lot of the refinements and efficiency in AMD's new generation of cards, but it looks like I am sitting out one more generation with my 5850.
 
JapaneseGorilla said:
In fact, I couldn't really care less about the 7770. The only reason that I'm paying any attention to it at all is because it gives me the feeling that the rumors about the 7870 having a suggested price of $299 are going to be correct. I've been waiting for several months to get a new card and I won't be happy if I end up paying the same price for the same performance. If the 7870 performs between a 6950 and a 6970 but costs $300 the only conclusion that I will be able to come to is that I should have just bought a 6950 6 months ago.
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Stings doesn't it? I want the best damn performance (on the latest architecture) for my money and I know I'm not going to get it with the market as stagnant as it is right now. The only conclusion I can come to myself is to wait for nVidia to offer something competitive. The longer they make me wait... the more I end up having a bad taste for them. :)

That aside, the 7770/7750 is looking like it will probably make a great replacement for the 4000 series I currently have in my HTPC... once it drops down in price some.
 
http://www.hardocp.com/images/articles/13292578330y0Tl9FRWk_1_11_l.jpg

If these go to € 100 - € 120 euros, I'm picking 2 up. Will match well with my old HX620. Black motherboard and some red ripjaws... I can see it already ^^.

I didnt look much into other reviews, but the crossfire 7770 are about as fast as a single GTX580 in BF3 :/. With other games its usually around the performance of a single GTX570.

bf3_1920_1200.gif


I have no idea how drivers work with crossfire but I have to assume it can only get better over time.

/edit: to spare you the search: http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/HD_7750_7770_CrossFire/
 
Oh man, we've got people comparing an EOL price to the release price of its successor...

6770 release price was $125, it is a little higher in price but it's not like AMD is pilfering your 401k.
 
Shago said:
http://www.hardocp.com/images/articles/13292578330y0Tl9FRWk_1_11_l.jpg

If these go to € 100 - € 120 euros, I'm picking 2 up. Will match well with my old HX620. Black motherboard and some red ripjaws... I can see it already ^^.

I didnt look much into other reviews, but the crossfire 7770 are about as fast as a single GTX580 in BF3 :/. With other games its usually around the performance of a single GTX570.

http://tpucdn.com/reviews/HIS/HD_7750_7770_CrossFire/images/bf3_1920_1200.gif

I have no idea how drivers work with crossfire but I have to assume it can only get better over time.

/edit: to spare you the search: http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/HD_7750_7770_CrossFire/
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Eh...it's already at about 100% scaling according to that graph. I wouldn't bet on it getting any better.
 
Out of the whole review...one thing gets me

How can a 5% overclock result in 10% more FPS. It just doesn't seem "reasonable" unless there is bottleneck somewhere in the system.
 
People will bitch all day about $20. Well AMD released there 28nm arcitecture before Nvidia and they have the market, till Nvidia makes a move, hell the chances of Nvidia lowering there prices on year old tech ever cross the mind, NO chance... deal with it!
 
Alpert said:
People will bitch all day about $30. Well AMD released their 28nm arcitecture before Nvidia and they have the market, till Nvidia makes a move, hell the chances of Nvidia lowering their prices on year old tech ever cross the mind, NO chance... deal with it!
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Probably one of the more rational posts made in this thread.
 
lloose said:
So I woke up this morning and found cards listed on the web. None of them are going for the $200 msrp. Most are going for $160 which I think is a very reasonable deal for a launch price.
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Where does it say that the MSRP is $200? I think it's more like $159.
 
MSRP isn't 200 , that's 7850 territory (from leaked graphs and they were right on the hd7770, so they are real).
 
Alpert said:
People will bitch all day about $20. Well AMD released there 28nm arcitecture before Nvidia and they have the market, till Nvidia makes a move, hell the chances of Nvidia lowering there prices on year old tech ever cross the mind, NO chance... deal with it!
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Thats true, but the 6850 launched for just 30more. As anandtech put "if you go by launch prices you’re getting the same amount of performance per dollar today as you did in October of 2010." The 7770 has potential. Its bronze at this price point, silver at 130.
 
lloose said:
So I woke up this morning and found cards listed on the web. None of them are going for the $200 msrp. Most are going for $160 which I think is a very reasonable deal for a launch price.
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That is because the msrp isn't $200. Its $159
 
Trepidati0n said:
Out of the whole review...one thing gets me

How can a 5% overclock result in 10% more FPS. It just doesn't seem "reasonable" unless there is bottleneck somewhere in the system.
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128bit wide memory bus that was overclocked 21% vs out of the box.
 
lloose said:
FINALLY. The midrange is here.
Edit: Hopefully the price dips a little from the $200 MSRP. Right now its still a tossup between the 6870 and this card. 28nm and lower temps add some value, but people like me who buy in this price range are generally looking at raw numbers for the $. Great review as always.
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The HD7770 is nice...the HD7750 however, is a problem-causer - even compared to the HD6750 and HD6670 (both of which it should send southward in price).

Why it's a problem - http://www.techspot.com/review/498-amd-radeon-hd7770-hd7750/ (the only review that included the HD7750 so far).

AND

Newegg Pricing - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161403 (the identically-priced ASUS model is out of stock!)
 
Brent_Justice said:
Let me see if I can make this even more clear: A $159-$179 video card sits where at launch, last year, a $239 video card use to sit.

We are getting last years $239 performance, for $159.

That, IMO, is GOOD, and an improvement generationaly.

Its an improvement in performance for this price point compared to last generation.
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you are NOT getting last year's $239 performance though so please stop claiming that. the $179 factory oced 7770 only matches the stock 6850 which also released at $179 16 months ago and can be had for $129 now.
 
Pretty excited for this card to start hitting single slots, shouldn't be hard to get that with a 75watt card.
 
The 7770 is fail at the current price. It's $179.99 on Newegg where the MUCH better performing 6870 is $149.99 after rebate.

Which means once 6870 stock dries up we'll have a lower performing card taking over it's price point. I don't see how anyone could be impressed with the 7770.
 
Darksword said:
The 7770 is fail at the current price. It's $179.99 on Newegg where the MUCH better performing 6870 is $149.99 after rebate.

Which means once 6870 stock dries up we'll have a lower performing card taking over it's price point. I don't see how anyone could be impressed with the 7770.
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Everyone seems to think that the 7770 prices will drop as soon as current 67xx stock is exhausted. I'm guessing that if they sell a decent amount of 7770s at this price that's probably not going to happen.
 
ITT: people who have no business sense argue about consumer goods.

If this card isn't a good buy for you NOW, and there are better options, then don't buy it, and buy what you think is a better deal instead. AMD is obviously aware the 68xx series is faster than the 7770, as it should be. They are going to replace the 68xx series soon with the 78xx series, and if they introduce the 7770 at rock bottom prices it will fuck everyone's inventory up. The 6870, despite it being cheap now, was not introduced as a sub-$200 card, so you are comparing apples and oranges. If you are buying strictly based on performance, then go for it - buy a 6870. But in two months when everyone is out of stock, and won't be getting more, the 7770 will be a fantastic buy in it's price range, and that is what this review shows.
 
lol, maybe the 7870 will be a little slower than the 6950 and cost the same as the 6970.

and sorry but the stock 7770 only beating the 2.5 year old 5770 by just over 30% overall is a joke.
 
Ieat said:
Roughly the same price for the same performance 15 months later doesn't exactly sound like a great product to me.
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I kinda agree. I've to my 5770 running close to a standard 7770. Or close enough not to warrant an "upgrade". Still, it looks like a fine card to jump on. I like it but it doesn't provide enough of a performance upgrade to bother with it.
 
Darksword said:
The 7770 is fail at the current price. It's $179.99 on Newegg where the MUCH better performing 6870 is $149.99 after rebate.

Which means once 6870 stock dries up we'll have a lower performing card taking over it's price point. I don't see how anyone could be impressed with the 7770.
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I agree with you completely.
 
Rizen said:
ITT: people who have no business sense argue about consumer goods.

If this card isn't a good buy for you NOW, and there are better options, then don't buy it, and buy what you think is a better deal instead. AMD is obviously aware the 68xx series is faster than the 7770, as it should be. They are going to replace the 68xx series soon with the 78xx series, and if they introduce the 7770 at rock bottom prices it will fuck everyone's inventory up. The 6870, despite it being cheap now, was not introduced as a sub-$200 card, so you are comparing apples and oranges. If you are buying strictly based on performance, then go for it - buy a 6870. But in two months when everyone is out of stock, and won't be getting more, the 7770 will be a fantastic buy in it's price range, and that is what this review shows.
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But how exactly does that explain why the 7770s are currently overpriced? It's not as if AMD is price-locked here. The prices of the cards will fluctuate, both up and down. The MSRP that AMD gave the retailers seems like it's ignoring current GPU prices.

Taken from Anandtech

Ignoring the current price of the 6850 for the moment, on average the 7770 delivers 90% of the 6850’s gaming performance for 90% of the 6850’s launch price. In other words in 16 months AMD has moved nowhere along the price/performance curve – if you go by launch prices you’re getting the same amount of performance per dollar today as you did in October of 2010. In reality the 6850 is much cheaper than that, with a number of cards selling for $159 before a rebate, while several more 6870s sell for $159 after rebate. The 7770 is so far off the price/performance curve that you have to believe that this is either a pricing error or AMD is planning on quickly halting 6800 series production.
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Considering the 6850s and 6870s aren't exactly drying up, it doesn't make sense now. Whether it'll make sense months down the road is another story altogether but that shouldn't have any bearing on how much these cards are going for today.

It's the exact opposite of the 7970. Where the 7970 whooped the GTX580 at a slightly lower price, these 7770s aren't able to keep up with cheaper cards. It just so happens these cards are also AMD cards, but that doesn't matter. If the whole objective is to sell them then why not make them worthy of recommendation? If they're afraid of clogging up an already crowded segment then why release them at all? At least wait until there's a place for it.
 
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