Nvidia Titan V

Discussion in 'nVidia Flavor' started by TaintedSquirrel, Dec 7, 2017.

  1. razor1

    razor1 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Right ok, I've been mining for 8 months now, and I have been getting anywhere from 4 bucks to 8 bucks a 1070 man. You just don't pull numbers out of your ass, and make things up ok?

    I don't give a shit if it implodes, as long as the cards are paying for the electricity they burn, I'm getting coins, that is what is important, its an investment, with out putting any money down. I was able to pay off 73 rigs, 3k each in 6 months, now I'm sitting pretty. Everything I make from now on till I get new cards, is all MONEY, making close to half of what I make at my day job right now! Imagine if I didn't stop buy rigs? I would be up to over 100 rigs by now that is close to a 800-900k per year! With an investment of 300k! So the coins I make now pay for the upgrades or new rigs, either way I'm sitting on hardware that I can sell of at a later date, So there is more money involved then just the coins I make.

    This was what I was saying since I started mining last March, if you aren't smart enough to figure out the 6 month cut off ROI you will be screwed cause you can't make money then. Right now Titan V will get paid off in 5 to 6 months. But will be the same once Volta or Ampere gaming cards comes out? Probably not cause difficulty will go up by a factor of 2 or more. So we can say 8 months pay off. Its on the fringes of not being profitable.

    Eth will not drop in price anymore,

    There are over 1000 major financial institutions that want to make cryptocurrancies a COMMODITY. Its already happening, Chicago Commodities Exchange introduced Bitcoin to their market. This was the reason why Bitcoin has been going up the past 3 months. People are thinking its a bubble. Its not a bubble, initially before it happened yeah that was the bubble, but now the demand for bitcoin is going up. All those people that don't understand cryptocurrancies, and didn't want to purchase them now are capable of doing it with backing without the risk as before.

    You don't know this shit, you can't correlate these and just think cryptocurrancies are based of a whim, they aren't, there are solid reasons for Bitcoins price hikes and if you followed any cryptomarket, everyone saw this coming! I even stated before bitcoin went from 4k to 12k, I'm going to start going for Bitcoin, all other coins don't matter to me much, cause it was that easy to see. This is just one exchange, what about all the others out there? Once they start with it, Bitcoin is going to go crazy, I would not be surprised to see Bitcoin at 50k at the end of this 2018. And that is a low estimate. If retailers and online shops start taking bitcoin as a form of currency, we are looking at 100k easy.

    The nicehash hack, should have hurt the market just like the hack that took down the biggest exchange years ago (that hack was a fraction of this hack, think it was 2 million). It didn't, it didn't do anything because that day was when CCE announced the introduction of Bitcoin to their markets.

    When you have people that much more interested in buying Bitcoin, 65 million is what 5% of the total bitcoin market cap, the price double since then, that means there is x2 the demand of Bitcoin since that point forward, cause supply goes up very slow.

    If you believe in AMD's BS about cryptomarkets going to collapse in 2018, you haven't been following what really is going on! Its the absolute opposite of what they are saying. What they are saying its going to collapse for them. Cause their products will not be able to be at the position they are at, at the moment.
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2017
  2. Gideon

    Gideon [H]ard|Gawd

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    People always say that then it collapses, Bitcoin is worthless and wastes resources and governments are taking notice as China has moved to ban it. When the market implodes just like it did before the value of that hardware will plummet as well since the market will be flooded with it. Banks want to try to regulate it and bring stability to a model that has none and make money on fees, nothing new there. All these continuing hacks will only add fear and more instability. If you see no end you can go ahead and invest in it, but a Titan V would be a waste for that purpose, I see it imploding early next year. It does work good for the black market but the general public doesn't even understand it let alone want to embrace it.
     
  3. razor1

    razor1 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Do you know why China moved away from it, cause they have NO control over it!, Any communist country hate cryptocurrancies, cause they are out of the loop, they can't embrace it, its against communsism.

    If they were smart, they will figure out ways to control it. Like the exchanges taking control over them. Right now, there is no control over cryptocurrancies here either, but the moment someone wants to cash out, the government knows ya got em. In China they can't do that, cause the exchanges aren't there for them to see it happening. It will utterly collapse their economy eventually cause they can't control it.

    Look up the reasoning that people gave once the USD went off the gold standard and why the USD will collapse, you sound exactly like them!

    Black market? Have you ever delt with black markets? What is your extensive experience in black market trading? The black market is based off the white market man., without the legit markets the black market dies Don't take Silk road as an example cause that was when no one really knew about what was going on, once people caught on, everyone one in Finance figured out the way of the future is cryptocurrancies.
     
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  4. spine

    spine 2[H]4U

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    Well for me, every game I've ever played now and in the past has been pushed to the max thanks to nvidia DSR or Sparse grid SSAA before that. I've always needed more power regardless of resolution or game settings.

    So when buying the Titan X Pascal I instantly get to replay all my old games in spectacular 4K + 4-8x msaa in basically everything. Even Guild Wars 2 which I'm currently playing is maxed out at 4K + 4x msaa.

    This card was the best PC purchase I've ever made. Any new games and I just hit 'max' and forget and walk away. No longer do I ruin the first part of a new game because I've spent most of it focused on tweaking settings. That's what a Titan buys you, zero hassle, and I have to say, I may well be set on them as a matter of course from now on.
     
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  5. Dayaks

    Dayaks [H]ardness Supreme

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    I don't think this was posted yet.



    Looks like he got a little above 32k on Firestrike with a properly cooled Titan V. (2,000+ stable Mhz).
     
  6. Rvenger

    Rvenger [H]ard|Gawd

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    1080ti does that for you too.
     
  7. GoldenTiger

    GoldenTiger 3.5GB GTX 970 Slayer

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    Several months later it did, sure.
     
  8. thesmokingman

    thesmokingman [H]ardness Supreme

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    3K is a not too much to ask for the level of epeen we are talking about here!
     
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  9. Zarathustra[H]

    Zarathustra[H] Pick your own.....you deserve it.

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    I'm not quite sure what you mean.


    1.) I have tried both SLI and Crossfire at different times now, and IMHO both result in atrocious results. They look good on paper, but the experience is pretty bad.

    2.) The 2013 Titan was the first single GPU that could actually get playable performance at 2560x1600, and that's why I bought it.

    3.) The Pascal Titan was the first single GPU that could actually get playable performance (if only barely) at 4k, and that's why I bought it.

    4.) The 1080ti gets pretty much identical performance to the Pascal titan when both are overclocked as high as they will go.

    (Note that the Titan Xp is a different, GPU, faster than the Pascal Titan X.)

    Essentially, when I bought the Pascal Titan, I was more or less buying a 1080ti 8 months before launch, for $500 more.

    For those 8 months I got to play titles on my 4k screen I otherwise would have been unable to play.

    After those initial 8 months, I'm getting pretty much the same performance I would have gotten had I waited and bought a 1080ti

    I don't mind the $500 pricetag for getting 8 months of decent performance I otherwise wouldn't have had.

    I don't see the same equation above working in the favor of the Titan V.

    The Pascal Titan X cost ~70% more than a 1080 at launch, and gave me 30+% better performance at 4k.

    The Titan V costs ~330% more than a 1080ti today, for about the same performance increase of ~30%.

    There are many things the Titan V is great at and intended for. Compute & Deep Learning, and even cryptocoin mining (lame) but getting one for games or forum epeen points is really just silly, especially considering what is right around the corner in early 2018 from Nvidia in their next gen gaming GPU's.
     
  10. Gideon

    Gideon [H]ard|Gawd

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    Titan V is a great compute card but it sucks if your just using it for gaming considering the costs, it's not even 25% better then a 1080ti. I would hope the gamer oriented Volta is far superior or I see most people passing on it.
     
  11. razor1

    razor1 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    It should do better, you can see the how much more throughput the new shader core has, as long as its not bandwidth or pixel fillrate limited its doing 40%+ better, which is higher than the theoretical flop increase. nV has never been to really make chips that are limited by one metric or another at launch, unlike......
     
  12. Vega

    Vega [H]ardness Supreme

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    All cards overclocked, my V is doing ~30% better than my Xp in games. So it will be about 40% better than the 1080Ti.
     
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  13. thesmokingman

    thesmokingman [H]ardness Supreme

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    Hey man, you can't put a price epeen, baller. Don't hate the player, hate the game. :whistle:
     
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  14. Gideon

    Gideon [H]ard|Gawd

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    This is stock to stock not a variable overclock comparison. Glad your Titan V is performing well for you tho. I just keep seeing the benchmarks from the few sites that have one and based my opinion on that.
     
  15. Gideon

    Gideon [H]ard|Gawd

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    Things always sound better on paper but something in that architecture is causing a issue as it's not living up to the potential by quite a bit. There are a few tests that show the raw power that test a specific function of the card but in a game something is stalling out. Volta so far has fallen far short of your estimates and others as well, heck it's struggling to meet my 25% and you thought I was crazy as you pointed out all those specs to me. I figure this must be why the rumors of Ampere started to appear, they just know it's a issue they cant fix with software.
     
  16. sk3tch

    sk3tch [H]ard|Gawd

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    My question is this - what did people expect? NVIDIA has always rolled out 25-40% gains in performance with every generation in the past, what, 5-7 years? Why would they change with AMD not putting up a huge fight?
     
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  17. Shintai

    Shintai [H]ardness Supreme

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    Dont tell me you believe that's the reason.
     
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  18. Dayaks

    Dayaks [H]ardness Supreme

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    780ti-> 980ti -> 1080ti were all 45-55% gains.

    Titan V is compute. If they wanted they could make GV102 significantly faster by replacing tensor cores with shaders and such.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2017
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  19. {NG}Fidel

    {NG}Fidel [H]ardness Supreme

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    3Gs for 40% better?
     
  20. razor1

    razor1 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    err no it hasn't, the tests that it does around the same as Titan Xp are tests that are fillrate bound, this is why I stated you need to wait and see for individual tests before you jump to any conclusions on how the chip is functioning. Without those fillrate bound applications, its 40% faster easily. And that is with lower clocks and a 800m2 core, something I was not expecting to see in a desktop consumer part to begin with.

    If you haven't realized it yet, nV's chip the ROPS and memory bus are joined together. That disabled memory bus (HBM stack) in Titan V cut its rops down to 96 the same as Titan Xp. Hence the fillrate issues, the full fat Titan V or gaming chip won't have that issue, and this of course all affected the amount of total bandwidth available to it. Interesting enough with Eth mining a coin that is heavily bandwidth bound, Titan V doesn't have any issue of surpassing all other cards even though it doesn't have much more bandwidth than some of them.

    So what you are looking at, is a gaming card if it doesn't have Tensor and DP cores, is a much smaller chip. If this card is using 250 watts with all those extras, the gaming card without those extras will use A LOT less power. So if the gaming card's power envelope ends ups at 250 watts, expect much higher clocks on the chip then we see now. We see overclocked results of the Titan V its not a slouch and we also see the power curve, its actually at the low end of its power curve, so its can be pushed without worrying about its power consumption going crazy.

    The difference between HBM and GDDR6/5x power draw is negligible too. So end of the day. You are easily looking at 50% more efficient architecture for Volta over Pascal, which is coincidentally what nV was going for (50% perf/watt is x2 increase of perf/watt). Its up to nV if they want to push clocks or push down power usage, or a combination of both, it will depend on what AMD does or what nV thinks AMD is capable of. But as it is right now, expect 40% improvements across the board, that is a base line.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2017
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  21. sk3tch

    sk3tch [H]ard|Gawd

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    OK, well you get the idea. I guess I always thought of it from the perspective of 980 Ti to 1080 versus what you outlined above. I also get that this is a specialized card, but do you really think their gaming part is going to be that much better at gaming? In the past (I know everything is different wtih TITAN V) the TITAN part has been the best part a consumer/prosumer could procure.

    I see what you're saying.

    However, I do believe that, in part, they are somewhat holding back what they can do. Just look at how they milked Pascal with the 1070 Ti. With AMD's stuff not causing a huge stir, there was little reason to bring out the big guns. Which, in a lot of ways, allowed NVIDIA to get even bolder with the TITAN V. I also fully understand that TITAN V is focused on compute and AI and dev and all of that - but the simple fact that they used the TITAN naming to get the prosumer gamers interested...
     
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  22. razor1

    razor1 [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Although I don't believe they will increase the shader counts cause that will have ramifications on the rest of the chip, ROPS/Memory bus, fixed function parts that will hold back the chip if they aren't balanced out. We don't even know if Volta is coming to the gaming side of the market as is, what if those rumors are true, they did decide to create a modified Volta? The shader arrangements of Volta is considerable different than the current gaming parts. We saw this with GP100 too, its shader arrangements are different over GP102.

    They should have removed Titan level cards to their own bracket when they first started out with Titan. But with the first Titan card, they still didn't diverge the GPU architecture purposefully enough away from gaming, they only had one core at the top end. This is was a design decision and I don't think they could have just lopped off the DP units without changing the architecture. After that they weren't able to get DP cores in a reasonable size core that was manufacturable. GP100 was the first card to have DP units again, and this is when they started diverging chips for what line to use, at this point they were able to change the architecture for different needs, hence why the shader arrangement changes between the Geforce variants and Tesla variants. Titan V with all those extras, tensor cores and DP units, is not a gamers card, nor is it a "prosumer" card, its made for professionals with needs in AI. Those tensor cores are absolutely useless in anything else. Can it do other things sure, but its hamstringed by power and thermal limits and that is a direct relationship with the die size.
     
  23. Dayaks

    Dayaks [H]ardness Supreme

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    It depends how big they make the die. If they make a full 800mm die (which would likely cost $2k+) it could be significantly faster.

    IMO I could see them releasing something as fast as a Titan V without DP and saving the larger die as a refresh... all speculation of course. If they did do a 800mm^2 die right off the bat I'd be all over that.
     
  24. Zarathustra[H]

    Zarathustra[H] Pick your own.....you deserve it.

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    To be honest, I'm not really sure what to expect.

    Remember, Volta was originally supposed to come out before Pascal, but Volta was an HBM2 only design and Nvidias partner for HBM2 stacks messed up, so they shelved Volta, moved Pascal forward in the queue, and only came out with Volta later, as a professional GPU.

    Now rumors are that Volta won't make it into consumer oriented video cards at all, but that what we see in early 2018 will be a new architecture named Ampere. Who knows what to make out of these rumors, and what Ampere really is, but we are likely talking die shrink, some optimizations to the silicon, and GDDR6 support, instead of HBM2. (it seems to me right now like HBM2 will remain a professional feature)

    So, things are a little confusing at the moment.

    What we can say is this:

    The current 1080ti performs very well, so next gen xx80 card (whatever they call it, but rumor right now seems to be 2080) will have to do better. Nvidia has nothing to gain by releasing a product that doesn't improve on its previous product (why would anyone buy it?) I'm guessing they are targeting this next gen card at 10%-15% above where the 1080ti currently sits, and that a xx80 ti (2080 ti?) variant will make it to market later in 2018 based on this same arch, and will likely marginally outperform the Titan V in games, but at a much lower price, and do much, much worse in compute applications.

    This seems to be the Nvidia formula.

    That being said, we know next to nothing for sure right now, except that partners have leaked that a GDDR6 based next gen Nvidia GPU is due out in early 2018, so this is all rampant guesswork on my part.
     
  25. Shintai

    Shintai [H]ardness Supreme

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    Volta before Pascal? No, never been so. Volta also outperforms Pascal in all metrics by a quite large margin.
     
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  26. Reality

    Reality [H]ard|Gawd

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    I keep telling people, Wildlands maxed out is the most gorgeous game on the planet right now
     
  27. Zarathustra[H]

    Zarathustra[H] Pick your own.....you deserve it.

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    Meh, 3rd person kills it. That's why I never got into the series.
     
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  28. Araxie

    Araxie [H]ardness Supreme

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    Whats wrong with 3rd person?.
     
  29. Zarathustra[H]

    Zarathustra[H] Pick your own.....you deserve it.

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    IMHO everything.

    A good game sucks you in. I don't see myself from above and to the right of my right shoulder, so I can't suspend disbelief in a game that uses that perspective, whether you are controlling a person or a car.

    Short of like strategy games that work well top down, I don't see the point of any non-first person game to exist.
     
  30. Araxie

    Araxie [H]ardness Supreme

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    I understand that factor in certain games but about everything?

    So you haven't played things as the witcher 3 because of that?.. mass effect titles? old jewels as dragon age origins? Dragon Age inquisition? Hitman (absolution or 2016)?.. GTA? Splinter cell? Tomb raider (specially newer ones)? Those as few examples of major tittles without mention consoles games, even great FPS as deus ex have a nice third person mechanic that I dont think hurt anything, but damn, man, that's a good way to not enjoy great games..
     
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  31. Zarathustra[H]

    Zarathustra[H] Pick your own.....you deserve it.

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    Yep. I tried the Witcher and Mass Effect series. Hated them so much because of 3rd person that I only lasted 10 minutes then never touched them again.

    When I first tried PUBG I hated it, until they launched the pure FPS mode, then I could enjoy it a little.

    3rd person just reminds me too much of console garbage, and I haven't owned a console since the 80's when I got rid of my NES. I don't want one.

    I don't do casual gaming. Unless I can be completely and totally sucked into a title I just don't play it, and 3rd person requires too much suspense of disbelief to me.

    Haven't played anything that wasn't either FPS, first person driving, or strategy since the early 90's. I couldn't even stand Diablo in the early 2000's.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2017
  32. defaultluser

    defaultluser I B Dum

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    3rd-person cover shooters are the only reason the genre should exist, even though I find them incredibly boring.

    For 3rd-person shooters where you just fire at what's directly in front of you, what exactly is the point over an FPS? Just Cause series, I'm looking at you.
     
  33. demondrops

    demondrops Limp Gawd

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    after seeing price of titan V and reading up slightly more, it do seem like it's not really meant for gaming but. if they release another titan Vp? haha, ok sure. that cost half or somewhere close. or they just gone batshit on titan pricing for real, that is one hefty tag, double of the previous already extremely expensive cards? that is prety sick. maybe next chip after volta will double that also? by that logic. can buy a brand new rig with 1080ti for that price, probably with everything else like screen periphials ++ that why it's gold colored cause it's only for pimps now. while old titan was expensive as fuck, it wasnt completely wild, this is.
     
  34. demondrops

    demondrops Limp Gawd

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    wait what how a shallow way to really judge so many great games by wow :p
     
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  35. Gideon

    Gideon [H]ard|Gawd

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    Yeah just look at them huge margins [​IMG]
     
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  36. Zarathustra[H]

    Zarathustra[H] Pick your own.....you deserve it.

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    Well that's a pity. Even this thing isn't enough for 4k ultra At 60fps in Mankind Divided.

    When I played Mankind Divided on my overclocked Pascal Titan X (not Xp) I created a custom 21:9 3840x1646, so it was letterboxed, and since I game on a TV, I was able to sync it to the European TV 50hz refresh rate (which is apparently supported on US models too) and this was ALMOST enough to make the game never tear :p
     
  37. thesmokingman

    thesmokingman [H]ardness Supreme

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    Gonna have to get two now right? Doh!
     
  38. Shintai

    Shintai [H]ardness Supreme

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    For a pure HPC chip without a fully optimized gaming driver that´s lower clocked vs the other, you bet it´s huge. 25% there alone.

    The gaming version will be even faster in all aspects. Clocks, memory bandwidth etc.

    You can try compare GP100 vs GP102 and then you have to add even more in the 102 favour this time.
     
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