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Mortal Kombat (2011)

Plague_Injected said:
I don't just want shit for free. I just want what's on the disc that I paid for.

Maybe MKII will set the standard for quality DLC in fighting games with actual new fatalities, new characters, new stages, etc. I am hoping that happens and thus the game stays fresh and people are still playing in the event my backward-government lets me play this mortal threat to my psyche and moral integrity (it's banned in Aus). No other fighting game has fully utilised the potential of DLC, although I did really like how Soulcalibur 4 had every in-game item available as DLC but they could be unlocked through completing story modes, challenges, etc. The option was there to buy that new sword for $0.50 if you couldn't be bothered getting your rage on trying to beat that guy with only jump attacks while you health drains at 10%/second and blindfolded. Tekken 6 and Virtua Fighter 5 didn't have much in the way of good DLC and Street Fighter's DLC has so far just been plain exploitative.
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Wow, the sense of entitlement people have these days knows absolutely no boundaries. The business model of having content and making you pay to unlock it has been in the software world for more than a decade. It's only recently started hitting the game world with the introduction of the XBOX 360 and PS3. Companies like Veritas, Symantec, Lotus, Microsoft and others have done it this way for a very long time. Every version of the Microsoft server OS is on the physical disk but only the code you've obtained when you "purchased" the software allows you to use only the version you obtained. The others are on the disk that you paid for. Doesn't that piss you off? :rolleyes: Let's be clear, when you "purchase" a piece of software, either on a disk or otherwise you don't own shit. You have a "license" to use the software as outlined in the EULA.

Now you can get pissed about what the developer may or may not include but what you should be really pissed about is the fact that business models like this work very well and always have. As a developer, if you can make $80 on a game instead of $60, then why not? The market prices are what the market will tolerate which is based on what people are willing to pay for.
 
I'm well aware of the licensing deal. Getting an OS is hardly the same as buying a game. MS basically reduces the prices of the different versions and takes away features. Games don't do this; they stay at $60 and they just ask for more and more to unlock crap they don't need to charge for. If content on a disc was locked but the base game came out at $40 or $50 then it would be more comparable, not to mention a lot easier to swallow.

Accusing me of self-entitlement is a bit strong. The practice is underhanded and an insult to the people publishers are trying to sell their products to. "It's free market so therefore it's right" doesn't actually make it right. If it was such a truism and universally accepted we would see every developer do it, but it's currently only the ones who have the least amount of regard for the userbases besides Capcom, who at least listens to feedback. Free market comes at the price of regulation and a level of consumer protection, but I suppose to a lot of people in the industry that makes me a filthy communist or some other dismissive insult as a result of an allergic reaction.
 
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Apparently an operating systems licensing scheme and video game DLC is directly comparable. Who knew...

Maybe if Microsoft broke its features into small chunks for $20-$30 a piece and ONLY let you buy windows 7 starter for the price of home premium you could make that comparison. Otherwise its just silly to try and compare the two.
 
sd11 said:
You were always supposed to use ground ice in combos.... not to start them.
Click to expand...

Seriously? how can you use it in a combo when the time it takes pretty much takes away from any chance of comboing due to it's length in casting time?
 
Plague_Injected said:
I'm well aware of the licensing deal. Getting an OS is hardly the same as buying a game. MS basically reduces the prices of the different versions and takes away features. Games don't do this; they stay at $60 and they just ask for more and more to unlock crap they don't need to charge for. If content on a disc was locked but the base game came out at $40 or $50 then it would be more comparable, not to mention a lot easier to swallow.

Accusing me of self-entitlement is a bit strong. The practice is underhanded and an insult to the people publishers are trying to sell their products. "It's free market so therefore it's right" doesn't actually make it right. If it was such a truism and universally accepted we would see every developer do it, but it's currently only the ones who have the least amount of regard for the userbases besides Capcom, who at least listens to feedback. Free market comes at the price of regulation and a level of consumer protection, but I suppose that makes me a filthy communist or some other dismissive insult as a result of an allergic reaction.
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Sure an OS is different, but the concept is essentially the same even if the execution varies. If you want something a bit more comparable then look at products like Backup Exec however, they have all the features on the disk and you simply pay more in licensing fees to unlock those features. It is pretty much the same thing.
 
Dan_D said:
Sure an OS is different, but the concept is essentially the same even if the execution varies. If you want something a bit more comparable then look at products like Backup Exec however, they have all the features on the disk and you simply pay more in licensing fees to unlock those features. It is pretty much the same thing.
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Fair enough, I'll check that out.

Is anyone going to upload game footage when they get the game? I want to play vicariously through you all :cool:.
 
Plague_Injected said:
I'm well aware of the licensing deal. Getting an OS is hardly the same as buying a game. MS basically reduces the prices of the different versions and takes away features. Games don't do this; they stay at $60 and they just ask for more and more to unlock crap they don't need to charge for. If content on a disc was locked but the base game came out at $40 or $50 then it would be more comparable, not to mention a lot easier to swallow.
Click to expand...

You are forgetting the history for a lot of these games. I'll drag up blaz-blue again, because they are a pretty solid example of what is actually going on in the fighting game genre.

The company that makes BB, also used to make GG (Guilty Gear). For GG, a lot of new "versions" were simply a balance patch and some tweaks, sold for the same $60 all over again, you might be lucky and get a few new characters, at one point they released 3 copies of the same game, about one new character, all at that same $60. So you ended up paying 180 bucks for what was the same game, plus a new character and the proper tweaks to bring it up to date. And if you were seriously into GG, you had to buy it because the tournaments and community always standardized on the latest.

In the case of BBCS, you get all the tweaks and balancing for free, that's it, zip, zero, nadda. However you can opt to pay 15 bucks for the extra characters. So rather than pay 180 bucks ala the PS2/Dreamcast era, you now pay 75 bucks.

And this is a problem how?

And bitching about 60 dollar games is honestly, well, insane, and rather short sited. Super Nintendo games started at 60 bucks and went all the way up to 80 bucks a pop, and that was in the 90s. Add inflation into the equation and we are paying far less per game than we were before. And it's not like Capcom or Midway didn't pull the same sort of "release the same thing but fixed, pay full price please" nonsense back then.

Furthermore Capcom, the king of "charge you to play it" gives you the option of paying 15 bucks to patch/update SSF4 to SSF4AE, and if you don't want to do that they will sell you a retail disk for only... 40 bucks.

The truth is we are paying less than we used to for console games. And developers have chosen to give us the option of paying 15 bucks for the new content online with the rest of it free, or just gobbling up a new retail disk at 2/3rds of the price.

You can whinge about the injustice of DLC, but the truth is games are far cheaper and we are paying less for the fixes and additions than ever before.

IMHO, that's progress.
 
You keep missing my point about not having a problem with DLC and getting new characters through DLC. I admit I haven't played BlazBlue, I've seen it around but never got to checking it out. That would seem to be the only one that actually offers significantly new content other than the upcoming Arcade Ed of SF4.

My problem is releasing DLC that shouldn't have been DLC in the first place, and then going even further by continuing to ship it locked with the retail version. If you don't have a problem with that then kudos to you, but that's my problem...not "hurr, all DLC is evil" like I know a lot of gamers utter at every opportunity.

It's raw for me because in Australia we're paying more for our games than ever before...our dollar is worth US$1.05 and we pay AU$120 for our games. We paid that a long time ago as well for 16-bit games but our dollar was worth about half the USD back then. Then MS points cost Australians more than US Xbox'ers, and when someone could have to pay upto US$150 for the full-version of a game on Launch Day, then we are definitely not paying less for our games.

Anyway that's the end of my post-spamming on this issue.
 
Plague_Injected said:
You keep missing my point about not having a problem with DLC and getting new characters through DLC. I admit I haven't played BlazBlue, I've seen it around but never got to checking it out. That would seem to be the only one that actually offers significantly new content other than the upcoming Arcade Ed of SF4.

My problem is releasing DLC that shouldn't have been DLC in the first place, and then going even further by continuing to ship it locked with the retail version. If you don't have a problem with that then kudos to you, but that's my problem...not "hurr, all DLC is evil" like I know a lot of gamers utter at every opportunity.

It's raw for me because in Australia we're paying more for our games than ever before...our dollar is worth US$1.05 and we pay AU$120 for our games. We paid that a long time ago as well for 16-bit games but our dollar was worth about half the USD back then. Then MS points cost Australians more than US Xbox'ers, and when someone could have to pay upto US$150 for the full-version of a game on Launch Day, then we are definitely not paying less for our games.

Anyway that's the end of my post-spamming on this issue.
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While I agree, where's your proof that this is the case for MK? I don't deny that some backdoor shaningans probably happen in some games (and justified with the "it's a business bullshit"), but if you're going to make such a hurtful claim to this specific game and its specific content, you better have some proof to back it up.

Basically, I agree with your sentiment, but I see no proof that this is the case for MK.
 
It is quite funny the crap that people cry about today. Anyways, I can't wait until tomorrow - all day MK! I'm blood thirsty!
 
While you fools argue downloadable content which should be a separate thread, I'm happy to report that Amazon e-mailed me my Reptile skin code and have shipped both Kollector's edition of the game and guide.

I also decided to take off work tomorrow. The GF is jealous because she can't get it off. I'll have to send her pics of me playing the game. Lol
 
Jstamsek said:
While you fools argue downloadable content which should be a separate thread, I'm happy to report that Amazon e-mailed me my Reptile skin code and have shipped both Kollector's edition of the game and guide.

I also decided to take off work tomorrow. The GF is jealous because she can't get it off. I'll have to send her pics of me playing the game. Lol
Click to expand...

I just got my shipping notification. It's arrived in my city and should be here tomorrow. I haven't seen my Reptile Klassic costume code yet though.
 
i cant decide between the 360 and ps3 versions....

Visually, is there a great deal of difference between the 2? I have been leaning towards my 360 for most games because they look better to me over the ps3 counterparts.
 
Absolut Talent said:
i cant decide between the 360 and ps3 versions....

Visually, is there a great deal of difference between the 2? I have been leaning towards my 360 for most games because they look better to me over the ps3 counterparts.
Click to expand...

If I had a PS3 I'd grab the PS3 version. For whatever reason XBOX 360 owners are getting shafted on this one. The PS3 gets Kratos and XBOX 360 doesn't. The XBOX 360's controller is also not as good for fighting games in my opinion. So I'd get the PS3 hands down if I had the choice.
 
Dan_D said:
If I had a PS3 I'd grab the PS3 version. For whatever reason XBOX 360 owners are getting shafted on this one. The PS3 gets Kratos and XBOX 360 doesn't. The XBOX 360's controller is also not as good for fighting games in my opinion. So I'd get the PS3 hands down if I had the choice.
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I concur.
 
I'd recommend getting some decent triggers for the PS3 controller like what Tigerblade posted a few pages pack. The normal PS3 controller triggers are a bit slippery and could be problematic in the sweaty heat of battle.
 
Dan_D said:
If I had a PS3 I'd grab the PS3 version. For whatever reason XBOX 360 owners are getting shafted on this one. The PS3 gets Kratos and XBOX 360 doesn't. The XBOX 360's controller is also not as good for fighting games in my opinion. So I'd get the PS3 hands down if I had the choice.
Click to expand...

It isn't a case of getting shafted with Kratos, he's the main character in one of the PS brands biggest exclusives so would never appear on anything 360 related. It's akin to Master Chief appearing in the PS3 version of MvC3 (besides not being a marvel or capcom character of course)....never gonna happen.
 
sd11 said:
You are forgetting the history for a lot of these games. I'll drag up blaz-blue again, because they are a pretty solid example of what is actually going on in the fighting game genre.

The company that makes BB, also used to make GG (Guilty Gear). For GG, a lot of new "versions" were simply a balance patch and some tweaks, sold for the same $60 all over again, you might be lucky and get a few new characters, at one point they released 3 copies of the same game, about one new character, all at that same $60. So you ended up paying 180 bucks for what was the same game, plus a new character and the proper tweaks to bring it up to date. And if you were seriously into GG, you had to buy it because the tournaments and community always standardized on the latest.

In the case of BBCS, you get all the tweaks and balancing for free, that's it, zip, zero, nadda. However you can opt to pay 15 bucks for the extra characters. So rather than pay 180 bucks ala the PS2/Dreamcast era, you now pay 75 bucks.

And this is a problem how?

And bitching about 60 dollar games is honestly, well, insane, and rather short sited. Super Nintendo games started at 60 bucks and went all the way up to 80 bucks a pop, and that was in the 90s. Add inflation into the equation and we are paying far less per game than we were before. And it's not like Capcom or Midway didn't pull the same sort of "release the same thing but fixed, pay full price please" nonsense back then.

Furthermore Capcom, the king of "charge you to play it" gives you the option of paying 15 bucks to patch/update SSF4 to SSF4AE, and if you don't want to do that they will sell you a retail disk for only... 40 bucks.

The truth is we are paying less than we used to for console games. And developers have chosen to give us the option of paying 15 bucks for the new content online with the rest of it free, or just gobbling up a new retail disk at 2/3rds of the price.

You can whinge about the injustice of DLC, but the truth is games are far cheaper and we are paying less for the fixes and additions than ever before.

IMHO, that's progress.
Click to expand...

the biggest reason SNES games were expensive was due to the MEDIA they came on ROM memory (up to 8MB of it for a 32mbit cart) not to mention some of the custom chips that some of the carts came with (Star Fox).....
 
YeuEmMaiMai said:
the biggest reason SNES games were expensive was due to the MEDIA they came on ROM memory (up to 8MB of it for a 32mbit cart) not to mention some of the custom chips that some of the carts came with (Star Fox).....
Click to expand...

I'm aware of that but it still doesn't change the fact that games prices have gone down. Disk media has allowed them to sell games at lower prices, and 60 is a lower price when you look at all factors, and DLC has allowed them to sell you the updates for 15 bucks rather than charging you 60 more for another game.

This is progress.

For whatever reason XBOX 360 owners are getting shafted on this one. The PS3 gets Kratos and XBOX 360 doesn't.
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That's the only silly thing I think they've done, both versions should have the same roster, but then again Kratos is a Sony character, won't ever be on the 360. IMHO they should have just left him out.
 
when someone gets his hands on it , i was an avid mk2 player. But i watched movies of the actual game and i had a feeling of sf4. I dont want another sf4.

hows the overall feeling?
 
pothb said:
Seriously? how can you use it in a combo when the time it takes pretty much takes away from any chance of comboing due to it's length in casting time?
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMVpFOBvHKc

You tube is your friend. In general, at mid-high, or high level game play, you do not want to use any of subzeros freeze or trap moves outside of a combo. There are ways around them, you will eat a combo, and you will for die doing something stupid. The moves have pretty much always been combo extenders or things to toss out knowing they won't hit to try and get them to jump.
 
Tigerblade said:
It isn't a case of getting shafted with Kratos, he's the main character in one of the PS brands biggest exclusives so would never appear on anything 360 related. It's akin to Master Chief appearing in the PS3 version of MvC3 (besides not being a marvel or capcom character of course)....never gonna happen.
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Then we should have gotten an exclusive character rather than getting the total shaft.
 
Soul Calibur 4 had exclusive characters specific to the xbox 360 amd PS3.
 
Pretty sure the PS3 had Vader as a character and the 360 had Yoda. It was a really brainless move. But ultimately worthless as I'm pretty sure that lead to them both being tournament banned. So nobody worth playing used them.

Which is what will probably happen with Kratos. The PS3 is the tournament standard, so they might not ban him, but he'll probably get banned and the relatively few players that go to weekly events and the like will simply drop connection or walk away and get something to eat if they run into him online. Enough of the good players avoid it, people stop playing the characters.

It's stupid, but generally not much of an issue.

It's like HDR, Akuma is banned in HDR and super turbo as he rapes the entire cast for free. So nobody good bothers with him and the issue worked itself out.
 
Dan_D said:
Then we should have gotten an exclusive character rather than getting the total shaft.
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Ed Boon talked about this. He said they really wanted to get an Xbox exclusive character in the game, but couldn't. He wouldn't say why. The way Microsoft's been behaving lately, they probably put up some unreasonable demands that Netherrealm wasn't able to meet.
 
from what I was reading the developer made it sound as though MS would not allow them to use any of their characters. He said he was not allowed to talk about it, which always makes me think something is up.
 
DeathCloud said:
from what I was reading the developer made it sound as though MS would not allow them to use any of their characters. He said he was not allowed to talk about it, which always makes me think something is up.
Click to expand...

That could definitely be it. I don't think Microsoft wants the Master Chief pulling off peoples arms and beating them to death with them, or ripping them in half, etc.
 
Dan_D said:
That could definitely be it. I don't think Microsoft wants the Master Chief pulling off peoples arms and beating them to death with them, or ripping them in half, etc.
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Dont think Master chief would fit in i was thinking it would be cool to have Marcus Fenix in MK. He already has a gun with a chainsaw.
 
Disposed said:
Dont think Master chief would fit in i was thinking it would be cool to have Marcus Fenix in MK. He already has a gun with a chainsaw.
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Yeah, that would have worked better. As bloody as Gears of War is, I don't see why they'd have a huge problem with his appearance in Mortal Kombat.
 
One of the Locust variants from Gears of War would be an even better fit, given Fenix is still a hero in a much different way than Kratos from God of War is. Skorge (the "skinny-Predator" boss from Gears of War 2) would have been great. Also some symmetry between the two platforms given that each exclusive character came from a franchise with the acronym "GOW" and the "OW" both standing for the same words.
 
Played this game for 4 hours after i got off work this morning. Everyone online uses sub-zero or scorpion. Pretty cheap w/ the spamming of spear / teleport / ice blast / ground slide / ... Would be nice to play a diff character every now & again... gets boring running in to the same predictable fights every single time.

Also, ran in to a cheater ALREADY... his rec. came up as 1000 wins / 1000 losses / 1000 disconnects so I was kind of curious... maybe just an error? anyways, I could not get out of his flurry of moves he was using, He got a flawless victory x2. I replayed him just to check it out to see if it was legit... Again, I got destroyed, couldn't even use block or duck to avoid it, every time i let go of block or tried to use a breaker, i was done for. It's not like he was just moving around waiting for me to stand up or get out of block position, it was constant combos performed + moves...

Regular game play is pretty hot. I'm loving the game overall so far... but online play sure needs to improve. Any sign of lag and it's pretty difficult to pull off moves / combos, let alone get off an x-ray, I missed quite a few due to lag spikes in the middle of a few fights when on the screen my opponent was in the vicinity, but the response time was just too slow to get it off.
 
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