Dell U2412M

10e said:
Here you go:

dellu2412mservicemenuit.jpg


So it seems there are color temperature settings but no color temperature modes exist in the presets so I'm going to assume that these are modes that roughly correspond to different presets. 6500K probably corresponds to "standard" preset I would guess.

Weird.

The top and second button move you through the menu, the third button selects the item, and the top and second buttons modify the item. The fourth/bottom button seems to do nothing.

Once done you scroll on up to the "exit" menu. The changes will not stick upon reboot, but they will stick upon power save.

Either way, you can leave it in this mode because the other keys work as they did, ie. the 2nd, 3rd and 4th keys on the screen will continue to work.

I tried it with and without the OD. The only real big difference is the slight reverse ghosting on the trailing edge of something with OD on. The OD gain also works to allow you to balance things out for less or more.
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You have to select Color temp. in presets mode and then it will display the temperature options :)
 
10e said:
The changes get wiped with a re-start of the screen (but not sleep mode and back) but I'd recommend photographing the Service menu settings first just in case.
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So changes aren't persistent. That is kind of annoying.
 
Bergkamp said:
You have to select Color temp. in presets mode and then it will display the temperature options :)
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Thanks, I hadn't gone there.

Snowdog said:
So changes aren't persistent. That is kind of annoying.
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Yes, but it really helps for people who do things too quickly like myself. Update: The OD settings don't save, but the color settings do. Edit #2: I ran a quick test using PixperAn and that typical "car chase" on both the U2412M and LCD2690WUXI-BK with Over Drive on or off. Both displays showed very similar characteristics with a slight trailing reverse ghost on the back edge of the race car. So I am further along thinking that whatever test photos show insane amounts of reverse ghosting are tuned to display it as a worst case scenario that is not necessarily realistic.

sonic_blue said:
Nice find 10e! Do you know if there are any controls in there that can adjust the luminance of the blue primary?
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Probably the Offset and Gain beside "B"

Why does someone name Sonic_Blue want to lose their blue? Bad joke. Couldn't resist :)
 
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10e said:
Sometimes there are slight errors, and sometimes the calibration software will elevate the black level to go up to ensure the "distance" in luminance with the darker shades is equalized based on your gamma requirements. I don't like this as much because it seems to affect the contrast ratio and dynamic range of the screen.
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Neither do I and that's one of the reasons I use Monitor Calibration Wizard as the LUT loader because it saves the contents of the LUT into a file which you can edit in a hex editor and modify the RGB of any shade from 0-255 such as the bottom few shades which are important. Also it enforces the LUT when programs try to reset it, eg. full screen games. This tool is essential to me, without it I would be lost :)

I've also noticed that windows colour management will affect shadow detail in that it changes my calibrated gamma to sRGB gamma (i.e 1.0 from 0IRE-4IRE) which is too bright imo. I found that disabling all colour management in windows avoids this. Photoshop was also doing the same thing with the shadow detail so I had to disable all profiles in that too.
 
i saw it in other thread that this monitor is pretty good overall. So for those of you that received the monitor, how well is this monitor for fps gaming? I do some light fps gaming,such as L4D2.This monitor shouldn't have a problem for games like DOTA 2 and such right?
 
Played every major FPS since Wolfenstein 3D and this monitor is just as good if not better than my 2408 / 2410. I do not notice any ghosting or trailing when playing the games (black ops, battlefield, arma 2), but I suspect you could easily find it if you went hunting for it with a camera.

One day, there will be a better monitor out without any issues, but for today, unless you want a cheap TN panel, this seems to be a great buy.
 
10e said:
Probably the Offset and Gain beside "B"
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Hmm but I'm guessing that will just make the white balance lacking in blue. The problem on mine is with the actual colour decoding of the blue primary only. Are there any sub menus in there that give you more colour controls? I would check on mine but it's all packed up waiting to be collected by Dell :)
 
Photoshop was also doing the same thing with the shadow detail
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This is a normal behaviour. The transformations of the CMM account for the gradation of the source - if you for example open a picture in the ECI-RGB 2.0 color space you will of course get a representation according to its gradation (L* in this case) - absolute independent from you actual display gradation (as long as it is registered correctly in the display ICC profile) prior to these transformations.

Best regards

Denis
 
Sailor_Moon said:
This is a normal behaviour. The transformations of the CMM account for the gradation of the source - if you for example open a picture in the ECI-RGB 2.0 color space you will of course get a representation according to its gradation (L* in this case) - absolute independent from you actual display gradation (as long as it is registered correctly in the display ICC profile) prior to these transformations.

Best regards

Denis
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Ah yes but the test pattern image I use has no embedded profile and yet Photoshop was still altering the shadow detail on it to sRGB standards :)
 
sonic_blue said:
Ah yes but the test pattern image I use has no embedded profile and yet Photoshop was still altering the shadow detail on it to sRGB standards :)
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A lot of Windows apps, including Photoshop (I believe) will default to sRGB when handling un-tagged images, OR it will simply apply the current profile's color space to it unless you tell it not to.
 
Ah yes but the test pattern image I use has no embedded profile and yet Photoshop was still altering the shadow detail on it to sRGB standards
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That's because of the choosen working color space (in the PS color adjustments). PS will assume it if an image has no embedded profile.

Best regards

Denis
 
Walker said:
The Samsung is only 1920x1080 though, isn't it? I believe it's the resolution/aspect ratio that is one of the main selling points of the U2412 for most people.
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Plus the fact that it is IPS which is my favorite LCD technology for monitors.

The U2412 interests me because:

IPS
1920x1200
Standard Gamut
Reasonable price
Quick response/low lag
DVI + Display Port

This would be pretty much the criteria I would have given for adding another monitor. To this it also seems to quite decent characteristics and no show stoppers.

Really I think Dell hit a sweet spot for screens here and this monitor is going to be very popular.

I do plan on getting one, but I need a new graphics card to go with it (to drive three screens) and cash flow is tight, otherwise I would have already ordered one.
 
Switching from Nec 2490 to U2412 is really strange.
its also strange to choose a monitor for a display port when you have a gaming card.

PS: Is this a 10bit LUT monitor or only a 8bit?
 
sblantipodi said:
this monitor has the same price of the new samsung SA650 with PVA panel, imho could be an alternative to U2412M, what do you think? (PVA basher, please save us from trolling)

http://www.samsung.com/hk_en/consum...ail&subsubtype=sa650-and-sa850-led&returnurl=
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Since you already have a VA screen you should be fairly familiar with the visual qualities.

It should be fine, but I'd be worried that it's cPVA (based on the high static contrast), and has the associated poor response time similar to the F2380, but we won't know until it's in the wild and has been reviewed.

As walker mentioned though, it is 1920x1080, but if you are fine with that, hopefully it is a good one.

I always preferred S-PVA to cPVA and MVA screens. Less color shifting on the horizontal access and response time, judging from the three or four S-PVA screens I've seen.

EDIT: Hopefully they are correct, because TFTcentral says it's S-PVA/PVA. http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/news_archive/24.htm#samsung_sa650

sblantipodi said:
Switching from Nec 2490 to U2412 is really strange.
its also strange to choose a monitor for a display port when you have a gaming card.

PS: Is this a 10bit LUT monitor or only a 8bit?
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I think he's looking for a secondary screen to sit beside his LCD2490WUXI. It's an 8-bit LUT from what I know. Doesn't seem like a big deal. Gradients are smooth even after calibration from my viewpoint.
 
10e said:
Since you already have a VA screen you should be fairly familiar with the visual qualities.

It should be fine, but I'd be worried that it's cPVA (based on the high static contrast), and has the associated poor response time similar to the F2380, but we won't know until it's in the wild and has been reviewed.

As walker mentioned though, it is 1920x1080, but if you are fine with that, hopefully it is a good one.

I always preferred S-PVA to cPVA and MVA screens. Less color shifting on the horizontal access and response time, judging from the three or four S-PVA screens I've seen.
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ooh, I tought it was S-PVA not cPVA, excluded.
 
Yes it would be an additional screen.

I think one obvious hint would be that I stated I need a new graphics card so I can drive more screens to go with it. ;)

I wouldn't trade my 2490UXi for any shipping LCD monitor that exists today, but this should be a decent companion monitor.
 
Snowdog said:
I think one obvious hint would be that I stated I need a new graphics card so I can drive more screens to go with it. ;)

I wouldn't trade my 2490UXi for any shipping LCD monitor that exists today, but this should be a decent companion monitor.
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I wouldn't trade my Eizo S2433W for the same but I need to buy a fourth monitor and I'm thinking on saving some money.

What graphics card will you buy?
 
albovin said:
I've had 5 S-PVAs and 1 c-PVA.
c-PVA has same colorshift, slightly better visual contrast, no S-PVA blurry pixels, less glow, no WG issues.
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you need a better eyeglasses in this case. :)
I had the Eizo Foris F2331 and it was a completely different monitor, absolutely cheaper than S-PVA with some better contrast but nothing else.

WG refers to the backlight not to the panel technology, you need to do your homework before bashing non technical and absolutely personal hopinion.

Comparing cPVA to S-PVA is just like comparing eIPS with H-IPS, two different flavour for two different price range.
 
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albovin said:
I've had 5 S-PVAs and 1 c-PVA.
c-PVA has same colorshift, slightly better visual contrast, no S-PVA blurry pixels, less glow, no WG issues.
Click to expand...

What bothered me the most with cPVA was the extra slow response time. The change to the regular ||| pixels was an improvement.

It seems they have the higher contrast ratio on the PVA panels now according to TFTCentral, if it's quoted at 3000:1.

sblantipodi said:
you need a better eyeglasses in this case. :)
I had the Eizo Foris F2331 and it was a completely different monitor, absolutely cheaper than S-PVA with some better contrast but nothing else.

WG refers to the backlight not to the panel technology, you need to do your homework before bashing non technical and absolutely personal hopinion.

Comparing cPVA to S-PVA is just like comparing eIPS with H-IPS, two different flavour for two different price range.
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I think the differences between "eIPS" and H-IPS are probably even smaller than the difference between cPVA and S-PVA though.

In fact eIPS is widely considered to be just a marketing name as it shares the same pixel structure and most characteristics of H-IPS.

The only difference nowadays seems that H-IPS panels are 8 bit or 8-bit + FRC (and wide gamut) versus 6-bit + FRC and sRGB. It's likely that "eIPS" will be characterized by W-LED and standard gamut in the coming while, as we have a 23" and 24" panels now with W-LED back lighting.

For me I'm happy with my Dell U2412M, LCD2690WUXi-BK and LCD2490WUXi2-BK Trifinity set up. The 25.5" in the middle being slightly bigger gives EyeFinity a slightly more realistic point-of-view.
 
10e said:
What bothered me the most with cPVA was the extra slow response time. The change to the regular ||| pixels was an improvement.

It seems they have the higher contrast ratio on the PVA panels now according to TFTCentral, if it's quoted at 3000:1.
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Yes, regular pixel structure was an improvement.
The first review confirmed measured 3000:1, but that is on paper. Visual difference with "regular" CR was minimal.
Response time did not bother me as it did not affect movies playback.

U2412 looks like much more solid economy class performer for different tasks (24", full resolution 1920x1200, IPS, decent picture, low price, good mechanics).
 
Just for doing some homework about S-PVA and C-PVA
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/monitors/display/samsung-sm-f2080-f2380_2.html

C-PVA is clearly cheaper with cheaper value since isn't able to do all rounding because of its slow response time.
At the opposite S-PVA is really good for all rounding.

I'm sorry with all people for pushing this thread off topic, we started by comparing two new monitors with the same price range.

Going back to the topic, what about the U2412M LUT? Is it 8bit?
 
sblantipodi said:
Is it 8bit?
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6

10e can you take a picture of the Digital Versus Ghosting test using the same camera settings which you took thePixerPixAn Photos with?
http://img1.lesnumeriques.com/pub/autopromo/Remanence17.html

Digital Versus French Review

I see there is a silver and black version, maybe there are different panels being used in these, or the monitor is just slow with the harsh low contrast colors used in their test which does not really represent real world performance, except for ugly console ports like Left 4 Dead. I double checked PRAD's review and all their response time tests come up with very low reactivity numbers.
 
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NCX said:
6

10e can you take a picture of the Digital Versus Ghosting test using the same camera settings which you took thePixerPixAn Photos with?
http://img1.lesnumeriques.com/pub/autopromo/Remanence17.html

Digital Versus French Review

I see there is a silver and black version, maybe there are different panels being used in these, or the monitor is just slow with the harsh low contrast colors used in their test which does not really represent real world performance, except for ugly console ports like Left 4 Dead I double checked PRAD's review and all their response time tests come up with very low reactivity numbers.
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Is there a non TN monitor that show no ghost at all on that image?
Just made a photo, my S2433W (S-PVA) is way faster...
 
Digital Versus only uploads the first green image so that is the best any one can do for now. A fast IPS like the U2311H/PA246Q/ST220T should show almost no ghosting on any of the images
 
so, the U2412M is a bad monitor?? Should I return it? I will see ghosting when watching a movie or something? I do not game, all I want is a good monitor for pictures and can handle some OK movies without ghosting, blurring etc..
 
itshardtochoosealcd said:
so, the U2412M is a bad monitor?? Should I return it? I will see ghosting when watching a movie or something? I do not game, all I want is a good monitor for pictures and can handle some OK movies without ghosting, blurring etc..
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I don't think that it is really good for movies but this depends on you, there are people that doesn't see ghosting (also if this is quite heavy).
If you are bothered from the ghosting return it, if not, enjoy your monitor.
 
Movies should be fine. PRAD and 10e's findings indicate that it does have a very fast response time. What I am trying to find out is if there are different versions with slower response times.
 
in any case, that flash file is quite unprecise.
making more than one shot is the same way with same settings create always different results.

that flash file lags, I noticed that with firefox is faster than IE. absolutely no good way for a comparison like that.
 
itshardtochoosealcd said:
so, the U2412M is a bad monitor?? Should I return it? I will see ghosting when watching a movie or something? I do not game, all I want is a good monitor for pictures and can handle some OK movies without ghosting, blurring etc..
Click to expand...

Trolls come here to crap this thread.
They tried crystalline effect, now they switched to ghosting.
For unknown reason a few zealots cannot tolerate the fact that a new affordable (but not a TN) full resolution (not 16:9) IPS (but not anything else) monitor finds its way to popularity.
Forget about Digital Versus toys.
Skip it. Skip trolls.
Listen to real owners only.
There will be no problem with movies.
 
:confused: Actually reading the above posts would give you a different conclusion.

Maybe some people are interested in knowing if LG is using different panels just like TV manufacturers do with TV's, because as of right now that is the only good explanation for such contrasting response time findings from DV and PRAD/10e.

Only going by owner opinions would tell people that every monitor has either no ghosting or tons of ghosting due to different sensitivities while also creating mass confusion, what a silly statement. McDonalds must make amazing food then because millions of fat americans love to eat there daily.
 
Is it the first "contrasting finding" found on Digital Versus?:eek:
How many other monitors have different panels?
 
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