Star Wars Outlaws

[Dan_D]

Thank the Gods!...sanity has returned to the forums...the Veilguard thread has been deleted...hopefully no more talk about DEI, Sweet Baby etc...gameplay only!...anyone who starts going on about that should be reported and banned

You are not the arbiter of what should or shouldn't be discussed on the forums here. If you hadn't noticed, virtually all the game threads are general discussion threads where virtually anything and everything about the game is up for discussion. This includes gameplay, technical issues, and even the narrative of the games. We've often discussed the history and development of these titles prior and post release which includes but is not limited to: Behind the scenes information and even the politics associated with the games themselves to some degree. We've also discussed sales figures, concurrent player counts and whether or not a game was a critical and financial success or an abject failure in either of these two categories.

You do not get to decide what aspects of a game we can or cannot talk about in a thread about a given game. I do believe that there is a fine line between discussing the DEI/Wokeness in a game as it relates to the game and the larger political issues that are best left to the soapbox. But again, you are not the arbiter on where this line should be drawn.

If you don't like what any specific users have to say, put them on ignore and stop commenting on the things they say.

 

[polonyc2]

You are not the arbiter of what should or shouldn't be discussed on the forums here

You do not get to decide what aspects of a game we can or cannot talk about in a thread about a given game. I do believe that there is a fine line between discussing the DEI/Wokeness in a game as it relates to the game and the larger political issues that are best left to the soapbox. But again, you are not the arbiter on where this line should be drawn.

If you don't like what any specific users have to say, put them on ignore and stop commenting on the things they say.

and I never said I was the arbitrator who decides what gets to be discussed or not discussed...I leave that up to the people above my pay grade WHO ARE THE ONES THAT DECIDE...and they obviously deemed that discourse or discussion not warranted...I'm not the one who made the decision to delete the thread...it was obviously the Admins who saw the discussion and deemed it inappropriate

I was referring specifically to the political nonsense that was being discussed...you know that...I don't know why you brought up game development, technical issues etc when you know that wasn't the issue...the DEI stuff is OT and I think there's a specific thread about that in Genmay

 

[Shoganai]

and I never said I was the arbitrator who decides what gets to be discussed or not discussed...I leave that up to the people above my pay grade WHO ARE THE ONES THAT DECIDE...and they obviously deemed that discourse or discussion not warranted...I'm not the one who made that decision to delete the thread...it was obviously the Admins who saw the discussion and deemed it inappropriate

I was referring specifically to the political nonsense that was being discussed...you know that...I don't know why you brought up game development, technical issues etc when you know that wasn't the issue

It wasn't the "political nonsense." It was the heated discussion and everyone was attacking each other. If people can remain civil, threads stay open. That thread was clearly not civil.

 

[pendragon1]

I never said I was the arbitrator who decides what gets to be discussed or not discussed...

no more talk about DEI, Sweet Baby etc...gameplay only!

seems like you are. Dan is right.

It wasn't the "political nonsense." It was the heated discussion and everyone was attacking each other. If people can remain civil, threads stay open. That thread was clearly not civil.

this is most likely.




View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyHvwYywcfc

 

[polonyc2]

I'm not going to clutter up the Outlaws thread anymore talking about another topic or game...last thing I want is to see is this thread closed...this is actually a game I'm interested in

 

[Dan_D]

and I never said I was the arbitrator who decides what gets to be discussed or not discussed...

Well that's interesting. How about we look at your previous post?

Thank the Gods!...sanity has returned to the forums...the Veilguard thread has been deleted...hopefully no more talk about DEI, Sweet Baby etc..."gameplay only!"...anyone who starts going on about that should be reported and banned

Seems to me that you are trying to be the one who decides on what should and shouldn't be discussed in a thread about a specific game. You decided what should be discussed by saying: "gameplay only!". This states that gameplay is the only topic that's valid for a game thread. You then went on to say that anyone who mentions DEI or SBI should be reported and banned. Thus, you are telling people what they should report and telling moderators they should ban anyone who brings up SBI or DEI.

I'm not going to clutter up the Outlaws thread anymore talking about another topic or game...last thing I want is to see is this thread closed...this is actually a game I'm interested in

This implies you weren't really interested in Dragon Age the Veilguard.

 

[polonyc2]

Well that's interesting. How about we look at your previous post?

Seems to me that you are trying to be the one who decides on what should and shouldn't be discussed in a thread about a specific game. You decided what should be discussed by saying: "gameplay only!". This states that gameplay is the only topic that's valid for a game thread. You then went on to say that anyone who mentions DEI or SBI should be reported and banned. Thus, you are telling people what they should report and telling moderators they should ban anyone who brings up SBI or DEI.

read that entire post instead of cherry picking words and sentences...'gameplay' involves all those things you mentioned earlier about development, technical issues etc...everything except political topics...the post of mine explains it all pretty clearly...I'll post it again

https://hardforum.com/threads/star-wars-outlaws.2028556/page-34#post-1045992891

 

[pendragon1]

This implies you weren't really interested in Dragon Age the Veilguard.

he said he didnt buy nor play it, he was just mad we werent talking about what he wanted to hear.



hey, they fixed the grass! a before and after:


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4cj7RZ0pdI

 

[polonyc2]

he said he didnt buy nor play it...

neither did you or most of the others...strange argument you're trying to make...if you were playing the game or interested in playing you could make a case...very strange argument you're making...very, very strange

 

[Shoganai]

he said he didnt buy nor play it, he was just mad we werent talking about what he wanted to hear.



hey, they fixed the grass! a before and after:


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4cj7RZ0pdI

That looks infinitely better than before. It's one thing for Storm Troopers to miss everything in the movies. It's legendary at this point and they made fun of this fact in The Mandalorian. But you expect to be shot in the games, especially since this character is incapable of using the force.

 

[pendragon1]

neither did you or most of the others...strange argument you're trying to make...if you were playing the game or interested in playing you could make a case...very strange argument you're making...very, very strange

im not the one telling people what they can or cannot talk about based on the topic or whether they own it or not. that was you two....

That looks infinitely better than before.

yeah, then theres stuff like this....


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTkTG-1t9_I

 

[Dan_D]

neither did you or most of the others...strange argument you're trying to make...if you were playing the game or interested in playing you could make a case...very strange argument you're making...very, very strange

Are you kidding me with this? The reason I watched my girlfriend play the game and watched so much coverage on the game is because I was interested in the game. It was after I learned about the game that I decided not to buy it.

 

[polonyc2]

Are you kidding me with this? The reason I watched my girlfriend play the game and watched so much coverage on the game is because I was interested in the game. It was after I learned about the game that I decided not to buy it.

that post was replying to another member!!!...he was never interested in the game...c'mon dude, you're looking for something to argue about...I was replying to another member altogether...and I used the words very carefully and purposely...I said "neither did you or MOST of the others"...C"MON DUDE!!

 

[Shoganai]

Can we not bring the reason for the other thread being shut down into this one, please?

 

[Blade-Runner]

so you cried until you got an entire thread removed instead of moving on... pat yourself on the back.

The thread is gone but not forgotten, we will remember polonyc2's delusional and asinine posts in perpetuity.

/press F to pay respects.

 

[Flogger23m]

did you understand my post?...where did I say the story wasn't true?...I said the title of the video doesn't look like it has anything to do with Sweet Baby or DEI etc so it was fine because it's releated to the game itself in a tangible way

DEI or Sweet Baby's involvement is certainly relevant to any game that may feature it. In this game, DEI made the character look.. weird and that probably makes less people interested in playing it. Yes, a likeable character can help boosts sales even if that comes down to looks. And yes they have admitted they tried to make the character look like an odd blend of all ethnicities which just looks odd. That isn't the only problem with the game though. I don't think it is quite as bad as some make it out to be, but up front the game has quite shitty mission design, pacing and gating. It does get better but you can't overcome those first 8+ hours and by the time the game gets more interesting in terms of gameplay it starts to end. Not that it ever achieves greatness, it doesn't and remains quite bare bones.

 

[polonyc2]

DEI or Sweet Baby's involvement is certainly relevant to any game that may feature it. In this game, DEI made the character look.. weird and that probably makes less people interested in playing it. Yes, a likeable character can help boosts sales even if that comes down to looks. And yes they have admitted they tried to make the character look like an odd blend of all ethnicities which just looks odd. That isn't the only problem with the game though. I don't think it is quite as bad as some make it out to be, but up front the game has quite shitty mission design, pacing and gating. It does get better but you can't overcome those first 8+ hours and by the time the game gets more interesting in terms of gameplay it starts to end. Not that it ever achieves greatness, it doesn't and remains quite bare bones.

the main character certainly looks odd...but that won't stop me or I'm guessing a lot of people from playing the game...I've played as animals, monsters, doom slayers, knights, mages, pyromancers etc in various games...I'm not specifically looking for real world attractive characters to play...it's a 3D fantasy world, not real life

I didn't find Cal Kestis based on the actor Cameron Monaghan to be all that incredible to look at...but I did enjoy swinging the light saber, cutting down enemies, platforming, jumping, exploring etc...that's what video games are all about...it's not a fashion magazine or Victoria's Secret runway show in Paris

 

[Flogger23m]

the main character certainly looks odd...but that won't stop me or I'm guessing a lot of people from playing the game...

And clearly there are many others who think differently from you. The game performed poorly, Ubisoft has admitted this and has moved up the Steam release because of it so you can't refute that. This is just one of a number of reasons why the game had slow sales.

I've played as animals, monsters, doom slayers, knights, mages, pyromancers etc in various games...I'm not specifically looking for real world attractive characters to play...it's a 3D fantasy world, not real life

And the characters should fit with the theme/setting. Outlaws has a more realistic look to it, so most people expected a more realistic and nice looking human character to play as.

Example, if people bought the next Mario game and saw that Mario now looks like this:



The Mario game would probably suffer in sales. It isn't a hard concept. People expect certain character types or art styles to fit in the game they're play. You can say you enjoyed the Doom Guy all you want, but people expecting a family friendly game don't want to see Mario chainsaw a Goomba in half.

In Outlaws, they got the art style right but the main character just looks odd and statistically that will make people less interested in them.

 

[polonyc2]

And clearly there are many others who think differently from you. The game performed poorly, Ubisoft has admitted this and has moved up the Steam release because of it so you can't refute that. This is just one of a number of reasons why the game had slow sales

it has underperformed but it also sold over a million copies...so clearly those million people don't care what the character looks like...people keep trying to equate lower sales with something else...people want to play as Jedi's and the typical SW fare...as a huge SW fan I would buy the Respawn Jedi games on Day 1...with Outlaws it's a wait for sale

your Mario example is not a good analogy as the Mario games only have a certain limited set of characters you can play as

 

[Zorachus]

I never post in this thread, but just my quick observations of this game and the other 2 popular Jedi games.

Me, and old school PC gamer, just have no interest in these games, and I'm a big Star Wars fan, not crazy but I like SW, but these games just look cardboard generic with no real life in them, just a story on rails. I have not played any new Star Wars game in probably 15+ years so I really shouldn't comment, but all the trailers and gameplay videos did nothing to draw me in, they look to scripted or forced if that makes sense. And the combat and animation looks wonky at times. And story is always some generic sci-fi dribble, sprinkled in with little bits of stereotypical Star Wars stuff like Vader, etc...

Not my cup of tea.

 

[Dan_D]

DEI or Sweet Baby's involvement is certainly relevant to any game that may feature it. In this game, DEI made the character look.. weird and that probably makes less people interested in playing it. Yes, a likeable character can help boosts sales even if that comes down to looks. And yes they have admitted they tried to make the character look like an odd blend of all ethnicities which just looks odd. That isn't the only problem with the game though. I don't think it is quite as bad as some make it out to be, but up front the game has quite shitty mission design, pacing and gating. It does get better but you can't overcome those first 8+ hours and by the time the game gets more interesting in terms of gameplay it starts to end. Not that it ever achieves greatness, it doesn't and remains quite bare bones.

I don't think making the protagonist look like Eric Stoltz's character in the movie "Mask", but it doesn't help. People may not need to feel sexually attracted to the protagonist of a game or movie, but it certainly helps if they are appealing in some way. Kay Vess is anything but. She's a gender swapped Party City grade cosplay of Han Solo with none of the wit, charm or characteristics that made his character iconic and so memorable.

the main character certainly looks odd...but that won't stop me or I'm guessing a lot of people from playing the game...I've played as animals, monsters, doom slayers, knights, mages, pyromancers etc in various games...I'm not specifically looking for real world attractive characters to play...it's a 3D fantasy world, not real life

I didn't find Cal Kestis based on the actor Cameron Monaghan to be all that incredible to look at...but I did enjoy swinging the light saber, cutting down enemies, platforming, jumping, exploring etc...that's what video games are all about...it's not a fashion magazine or Victoria's Secret runway show in Paris

I don't know why I'm bothering to try and make you understand anything, but character design is important and dare I say almost critical to the success of a game. Having a good character design doesn't mean that the character is sexually appealing to the audience or anything like that. Appeal can be achieved through any number of design decisions. You can overcome a character that looks plain by making them likable and relatable to the player in some way. Star Wars Outlaws fails on this front for the simple reason that Kay Vess has no real personality to speak of. Her motivations don't make much sense either.

I don't think going with the actress's actual appearance would have made this game a financial success but it would have turned the character from a red flag that the game was going to be shit to an indicator that it might not be half bad. It would also help sell cosmetics. Spending cash shop money on a character that's not appealing makes no sense as its akin to putting lip stick on a pig. I think the game would have done better with a better character design, but it wouldn't have gone far enough. The smuggler archetype is probably the least interesting one they could have used for a Star Wars game and even if Kay Vess was hot, she still wouldn't have a personality or interesting story. She doesn't even really have a style that's all her own as again, she looks like she wears Han's clothes. Her concept from the start was not a good one in my opinion.

Of course, you probably won't believe that a character design can have any impact on a game. Even though I can literally point to Concord as proof that it does. Sony saw no point in monetizing it using a Free to Play model because no one would ever buy outfits, skins or any cosmetics for a game with unappealing character designs. Again, just so you don't put words in my mouth I'll be clear. Character design isn't the only thing that matters in a game's design, but it shouldn't be underestimated. It certainly plays a role in making the overall game appealing to players. Woke / DEI infested games are literally going against human psychology with this and trying to ice skate uphill by creating these bland, unappealing characters.

You can sit here and say that character design doesn't matter, but if you've ever customized a character, changed outfits one one or did anything to try and make it look better in your eyes, I've just proven my point.

 

[Dan_D]

it has underperformed but it also sold over a million copies...so clearly those million people don't care what the character looks like...people keep trying to equate lower sales with something else...people want to play as Jedi's and the typical SW fare...as a huge SW fan I would buy the Respawn Jedi games on Day 1...with Outlaws it's a wait for sale

your Mario example is not a good analogy as the Mario games only have a certain limited set of characters you can play as

This is false equivalency. You believe that because a million copies were sold that these people didn't have a problem with how the character looked. That is simply not the case and you have no reason to believe that it is. You can still dislike aspects of a product and buy it anyway. I for one have been very critical of the character's design and looks. However, I've already stated earlier in the thread that this fact alone would not stop me from playing the game. Again, character design is important and more important in certain types of games than others. Even so, people have different thresholds where their preferences are concerned. My girlfriend and a friend of mine don't care for Dragon Age the Veilguard's character designs but they are still both playing the game.

 

[polonyc2]

You can sit here and say that character design doesn't matter, but if you've ever customized a character, changed outfits one one or did anything to try and make it look better in your eyes, I've just proven my point.

I'm allowed to like or not like whatever I choose in a game...I literally stated that the character looks odd and is not traditionally beautiful but I told you that I don't care as long as the gameplay is fun...you keep trying to tell me that my subjective opinion is wrong...if you think the character is ugly or unappealing than more power to you...stop arguing about everything...you're one of those people that loves to argue...I could say the Earth is round and you would argue semantics

 

[Dan_D]

I'm allowed to like or not like whatever I choose in a game...

I never said otherwise.

I literally stated that the character looks odd and is not traditionally beautiful but I told you that I don't care as long as the gameplay is fun...you keep trying to tell me that my subjective opinion is wrong...if you don't like it than more power to you...stop arguing about everything...you're one of those people that loves to argue...

You stated that a million people didn't have a problem with how the protagonist looked which isn't necessarily true. You just stated you didn't like the way she looked and you are still interested in the game. So if her looks aren't a deal breaker for you, then why did you state that a million people who bought the game didn't have a problem with how she looks? Again, you can buy a game even if you dislike a specific aspect of the game. You tried to argue that character looks don't matter at all and I refuted that claim because looks do matter. Otherwise people wouldn't spend so much money on cosmetic items in games or flat out reject games like Concord with unappealing characters.

 

[polonyc2]

I never said otherwise.

You stated that a million people didn't have a problem with how the protagonist looked which isn't necessarily true. You just stated you didn't like the way she looked and you are still interested in the game. So if her looks aren't a deal breaker for you, then why did you state that a million people who bought the game didn't have a problem with how she looks? Again, you can buy a game even if you dislike a specific aspect of the game. You tried to argue that character looks don't matter at all and I refuted that claim because looks do matter. Otherwise people wouldn't spend so much money on cosmetic items in games or flat out reject games like Concord with unappealing characters.

you can't speak for the other people that bought the game so you don't know what aspects they liked or didn't like...you can only speak for yourself and are trying to force your views on everyone

"which isn't necessarily true"

meaning it could be true...your own words

 

[Flogger23m]

I don't care as long as the gameplay is fun...

And we're telling you it matters to many people.

stop arguing about everything...you're one of those people that loves to argue...I could say the Earth is round and you would argue semantics

The irony here is when discussing how poorly this game sold, you're trying to argue semantics to try and claim it didn't sell poorly. Despite Ubisoft being quite blunt about its lower sales. It should of sold a good bit better given Ubisoft's profile as a large developer and the Star Wars branding.

 

[Shoganai]

 

[polonyc2]

The irony here is when discussing how poorly this game sold, you're trying to argue semantics to try and claim it didn't sell poorly. Despite Ubisoft being quite blunt about its lower sales. It should sold a good bit better given Ubisoft's profile as a large developer and the Star Wars branding.

I literally said replying to your earlier post that Outlaws (and Veilguard for that matter) under-performed in terms of sales...my entire point has been why it under-performed...are you guys not even reading my posts or so eager to just argue?

when I said "I don't care" I was referring to me...I don't care how the character looks as long as the gameplay is fun...I'm not talking about you or anyone else

 

[Flogger23m]

I literally said replying to your earlier post that Outlaws (and Veilguard for that matter) under-performed in terms of sales...my entire point has been why it under-performed...

And you can admit the DEI design choices played a role in making Kay less relatable to many gamers, which contributed to its slow sales. For some reason you keep trying to make it seem like a non-issue for would be customers with oddball commentary.

Here is an example of a not so attractive women protagonist, but she didn't get criticism for her design:



You want to know why Faith from Mirror's Edge didn't receive backlash from gamers? Because she generally looks like a real person.

 

[polonyc2]

And you can admit the DEI design choices played a role in making Kay less relatable to many gamers, which contributed to its slow sales. For some reason you keep trying to make it seem like a non-issue for would be customers with oddball commentary

I believe in the developer making the game they set out to make...whether it's Outlaws or Veilguard or AC: Shadows...I don't believe these conspiracy theories about diversity being forced on them or some Illuminati Sweet Baby organization forcing developers to bend to their will...Sweet Baby is a consulting company...they don't have the final word on anything...in the end the developer makes the game they want to make

 

[Shoganai]

And you can admit the DEI design choices played a role in making Kay less relatable to many gamers, which contributed to its slow sales. For some reason you keep trying to make it seem like a non-issue for would be customers with oddball commentary.

Here is an example of a not so attractive women protagonist, but she didn't get criticism for her design:

View attachment 691192

You want to know why Faith from Mirror's Edge didn't receive backlash from gamers? Because she generally looks like a real person.

The main issue is that they "modeled" her after the beautiful voice actress, and then made her ugly for no reason.

 

[peppergomez]

in the end the developer makes the game they want to make

That's often untrue. There are numerous examples of developers not being allowed to make the game they wanted to make, due to publisher interference, being forced to release before the game is representative of the game they wanted to make, etc. Redfall is a notable recent example. And it cost that studio their very existence.

 

[polonyc2]

That's often untrue. There are numerous examples of developers not being allowed to make the game they wanted to make, due to publisher interference, being forced to release before the game is representative of the game they wanted to make, etc. Redfall is a notable recent example. And it cost that studio their very existence.

that's a different scenario...publisher interference...that happens a lot...I was not talking about the publisher

 

[Dan_D]

I believe in the developer making the game they set out to make...whether it's Outlaws or Veilguard or AC: Shadows...I don't believe these conspiracy theories about diversity being forced on them or some Illuminati Sweet Baby organization forcing developers to bend to their will...Sweet Baby is a consulting company...they don't have the final word on anything...in the end the developer makes the game they want to make

You've proven that you know absolutely nothing about how game development works. Game developers almost never get to make the game they want to make for a number of reasons. Interference from publishers, investors, management, etc. can often lead to developers having to compromise on the product. Things from budget to scope all impact the final product. I don't think a game has ever been made that didn't have to scale back something, cut features, or change direction in some way due to any one or more of the things I just mentioned. When you do not have publishers or investors holding developers accountable to deliver a product within a specific time frame and budget, you get crap like Star Citizen.

As for the DEI, you bet its being forced into these games. All you have to do is follow the money trail and you'll know who's really pulling the strings here. What you obviously don't know is that behind Disney, Electronic Arts, Ubisoft and many other major corporations is an investment company called BlackRock. BlackRock owns shares of all the companies I mentioned. Specifically, its a major shareholder in Electronic Arts, Ubisoft, and Disney. Their CEO is on video explaining that social engineering and changing behavior at a cultural level is their goal. Haven't you ever wondered how companies like Ubisoft can lose hundreds of millions of dollars and not go out of business? If you have, you probably thought to yourself: "Oh, that company makes hundreds of millions of dollars. They can handle losing a hundred million here and there." What you don't understand is those same businesses often have expenses that are seemingly disproportionate to their revenue. A company that makes billions might actually only clear 10's of millions or a couple hundred million dollars in profit after all is said and done.

A couple major failures in the gaming or film industry would leave them insolvent overnight. When companies like Disney, EA, etc. need to spend a bunch of money on a 200 or 300 million dollar project, they do not necessarily spend their own money. They will often secure a line of credit in order to make sure they can finance these projects while still keeping money in their accounts for things like payroll. Lines of credit are key to making sure that the company stays solvent.

However, to get those lines of credit these days you have to have a good ESG score. Who's the one loaning out much of this money? BlackRock. Who won't extend credit without a good ESG score? You guessed it. BlackRock. Their CEO is literally on video talking about DEI and forcing companies to adopt it. He speaks openly in a 2017 interview about forcing behaviors. Don't take my word for it. You can hear it from him directly.
https://www.foxbusiness.com/video/6328848893112

Black Rock is often the one pulling the strings here. They supply the money, but only when companies do things their way. Part of making sure your agenda gets pushed in your product is ensuring that the people making the product share your values. Nepotism, packing companies with cronies and yes men (or they/them's in this case) is a concept as old as business itself. The activists masquerading as game developers are there because the powers that be at EA, Disney, and Ubisoft want to maintain ESG scores and secure that sweet BlackRock money. Don't kid yourself, many of these companies do not believe in this crap at their executive level and are only doing it because they have no choice.

 

[peppergomez]

that's a different scenario...publisher interference...that happens a lot...I was not talking about the publisher

Doesn't matter, your statement is still completely incorrect

 

[Flogger23m]

I believe in the developer making the game they set out to make...whether it's Outlaws or Veilguard or AC: Shadows...I don't believe these conspiracy theories about diversity being forced on them or some Illuminati Sweet Baby organization forcing developers to bend to their will...Sweet Baby is a consulting company...they don't have the final word on anything...in the end the developer makes the game they want to make

Ubisoft bluntly stated Kay was designed to look like a mixture of all races in an attempt to please everyone. Like they bluntly stated the game sold below expectations. You're essentially arguing against Ubisoft's own statements at this point.

 

[Hershy]

Ubisoft bluntly stated Kay was designed to look like a mixture of all races in an attempt to please everyone.

Really? They actually said that! Those specific words!

Utterly moronic.

Can you link me to the quotation though? I can’t find it?

 

[Dan_D]

Also, this is just me… I’m only stating my personal preference here… I’m not saying everyone needs to agree with this… lol.. but I actually don’t care what a character looks like.

A character’s looks, for me, don’t define wokeness. There are some people (no one here, I’m sure) who will go berserk over any female lead, saying, wow, way too woke for me.

Others will scream woke simply because the cast of characters is diverse. You know what - the cast of real people at my workplace is diverse and we weren’t even trying for it… it just happened!

For me, woke is not how the characters look, but how they act.

I didn’t find Kay to be woke in her actions… except for the time when she wanted to join the ‘Wookie Lives Matter’ movement. Who gives a shit about that crap. Keep it out of the fucking narrative.

When you see a female character that looks super plain and unattractive or she's way uglier than the model she's based on, its a red flag. That means that identity politics are likely infused in the game. We have been seeing this crap in the AAA gaming space since Mass Effect Andromeda. We've learned to recognize the patterns over all these years which tell us if the main character is simply female or an indicator that the game is woke garbage.

Again, wokeness isn't having a female lead or a organically diverse cast. I've already explained the difference between organic and inorganic diversity. With female characters their looks are part of the equation as woke games tend to make the characters diverse in settings where they shouldn't be or they make the characters plain or ugly looking. They aren't allowed to be sexy or feminine. They act masculine and often exhibit toxic traits but its OK because its women doing it instead of men. They are your typical Hollywood approved, unlikable girl boss characters that don't need no man and can do everything better than any man. They usually build up these characters by tearing men down.

Woke games do not always necessarily contain each of these tropes but they often contain several of them.

 

[Hershy]

Also, I actually don’t care what a character looks like.

A character’s looks, for me, don’t define wokeness. There are some people who will go berserk over any female lead, saying, wow, way too woke for me.

Others will scream woke simply because the cast of characters is diverse. You know what - the cast of real people at my workplace is diverse and we weren’t even trying for it… it just happened!

For me, woke is not how the characters look, but how they act.

I didn’t find Kay to be woke in her actions.

 

[KickAssCop]

If you want to play a game with a female character with good looks try Stellar Blade.