NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

Discussion in 'Small Form Factor Systems' started by wahaha360, Sep 15, 2012.

  1. Mannymal

    Mannymal Limp Gawd

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    Sorry I should have read the whole page.

    I guess if the V6 is a decent upgrade I'll be getting that plus its corresponding replacement panels.
     
  2. darrpara

    darrpara Gawd

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    I currently have a C14 + an intake fan on the side bracket and an Accelero III with fans set as exhaust and a 92 mm as exhaust. Now I am switching to a 2080 ti XC Ultra which can fit some slim fans underneath Assuming I have these fans as intakes on the bottom should I switch any of my other fans to exhaust? If I don't i'll only have a 92mm + the normal thermal heat rise for exhaust
     
  3. Bawjaws

    Bawjaws Limp Gawd

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    Has anyone fitted an EVGA 1660Ti XC into an M1? It's apparently "2.75" slots thick, but they don't publish the exact measurement on their website. It's quite a short card, but I'm not entirely sure if it's going to fit due to the thickness. Any ideas?
     
  4. doostin

    doostin n00b

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    Anyone know if it's still possible to get the slotted top panel for a disc drive?
     
  5. Nanook

    Nanook Limp Gawd

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  6. Mannymal

    Mannymal Limp Gawd

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    Whats the best cooling setup with a hybrid GPU and a Noctua U9S?

    I don't wanna intake from the rear as that would dump hot CPU air into the GPU radiator, let alone dumping hot radiator air into the CPU. So I'm thinking having both the U9S and the GPU radiator exhausting (rear and side exhausts) and having two 120mm fans in the bottom to try and maintain positive air pressure. Has anyone tried it? I'm afraid that the CPU and GPU radiator will be fighting for not enough air around them.
     
  7. Nanook

    Nanook Limp Gawd

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    Your idea is worth a try! However, I would probably have rear intake for the U9S, and gpu radiator as exhaust. Bottom fans intake. Hybrid cards usually runs so cool that even the warm air from the CPU won’t affect boost. I recommend testing yours and mine!
     
  8. Rhialto

    Rhialto Gawd

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    For the CPU you can intake from side panel and exhaust on the back. I did this and even use a duct from heatsink to the back so no leak of hot air.
     
  9. Mannymal

    Mannymal Limp Gawd

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    I receive the EVGA hybrid kit tomorrow
    and will install it on my 2080 Ti and test. Was hoping someone had already done it so I didn’t have to disassemble if it doesn’t work well. I’ll test with both as exhaust first, and hopefully they are far enough apart that they can get enough fresh air from the top panel ventilation.


    Can you elaborate? You mean repositioning the U9S 90° so that it exhausts into the motherboard, and then exhausting that air out the rear?
     
  10. Bawjaws

    Bawjaws Limp Gawd

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    He means (I assume) that you have the U9S orientated horizontally, so that air is flowing from front to back. Cold air is drawn in from the fan on the side panel, pushed over the heatsink by a fan on the right hand side (i.e. the side closest to the front of the case) of the U9S and then exhausted out of the back of the case by a second 92mm fan.

    Basically, like this:
    91d726ca_2186.jpg


    Rhialto mentions placing a duct between the LHS of the heatsink and the fan on the rear panel, so that hot air is more effectively drawn out of the case (i.e. as much as possible of the air that flows across the heatsink exits the case, rather than recirculating inside).

    Quick edit: oops, missed that you were using an AIO for the GPU. In that case, the AIO goes where the 120mm fan is on the side panel, with the fan still as an intake. Airflow is the same as above.
     
  11. Mannymal

    Mannymal Limp Gawd

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    That picture is exactly how I have it set right now. However, when I install the hybrid GPU cooler, the radiator will be where the side fan is, and the radiator's air will be exhausted. My fear is that the radiator's fan and the CPU's fan will be fighting for air.
     
  12. Nanook

    Nanook Limp Gawd

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    I have tried what you’re describing back in 2016. I find rear and bottom intake, with side exhaust worked the best.

    I just want to encourage you try things out, as you might have different findings:

    • i7-6700K with U9S
    • GTX1080 with NZXT G10 with 120mm AIO (Corsair H75)
    nMjvosb.jpg

    lJ4c7gL.jpg

    XTV8UEJ.jpg
     
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  13. darrpara

    darrpara Gawd

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    To clarify: You think I should be running intakes for bottom fans, my 92mm rear fan as intake and my c14 fans + the side fan next to it as exhaust?
     
  14. vortaku

    vortaku [H]Lite

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    Okay, so I am rebuilt!

    BUT, I am worried about gpu temps the power temp and memory temp are upto 76c, granted the gpu temp, atleast from what I have seen is capping at 64.
    This is with the accelero 3, noctua a12s, and for the paste I did grizzly kryonaut. is 76c something to worry about? If i do max my fans out it does drop the memory temp to about 66 and power to about 66. The gpu temps is now at 59, now 58 in monster hunter world with aut detected high settings.
    This cooler, as far as the gpu temp itself is a beast. I am also surprised at how loud the noctuars are at full blast, it isn't all that bad.
     
  15. Nanook

    Nanook Limp Gawd

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    Yes, I believe that's the only way, since the bottom slim fans must be set to intake to play nice with your stock GPU intake fans. Both side fans will be exhaust, while the rear 92mm fan will supplement cool air for the C14. The CPU will run slightly hotter, but will stay cooler in the long run.

    I've also tried setting all 120mm fans as intake, and only the rear 92mm fan as exhaust, but the 92mm fan just couldn't keep up with expelling hot air. Your CPU will run cooler in the short term, but in the overall internal temperature will keep rising, and the CPU will be hotter than the other option.
     
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  16. enyownz

    enyownz [H]ard|Gawd

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    Aight need y'all opinions. Thinking of using an 9900k with NH-D9L cooler. I know its not ideal since 9900k gets HOT. But how would it fair if I undervolt it at stock settings. I like the aesthetics of D9L.
     
  17. Nanook

    Nanook Limp Gawd

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    It will work. Especially if you undervolt and set a power limit.
    The D9L can go up to 195w, according on this chart: https://noctua.at/en/cpu/Intel_Core_i9-9900K
     
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  18. enyownz

    enyownz [H]ard|Gawd

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  19. darrpara

    darrpara Gawd

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    Out with the 980ti and in with a 2080ti XC Ultra
     

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  20. Lankius Maximus

    Lankius Maximus n00b

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    Hi all, I know these feet have been recommended before....

    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Bre...lgo_pvid=67b228f7-4391-4591-b14d-344cb8ded60f

    However having installed an AMD 2600x I found my system was getting a little more toasty than usual when playing BFV and needed to raise my case (its worked a knocked about 5 degrees off, mine exhausts out the base of the case). The screws which come with the feet are not ideal for the case and I struggled to install two (one on top of the other) to get the height I needed, A simple fix I found was to use a 10mm rubber grommet (the black one pictured) with the screws and bolts the feet already come with. The grommet, when fixed to the top of the new feet fits perfectly in the feet which are already supplied with the case and sit quite snug. Doesn't look to bad either. Ive posted some pictures as the obviously paint a thousand words

    Only posted as it was an easy, relatively cheap fix which works quite well. Hope it helps someone.
     

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  21. SmootyPoody

    SmootyPoody n00b

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    @195W those fans are gonna be screaming and the system will be very close to TJ Max. I do not understand how that little cooler and those 92mm fans are rated for the same performance as a C14 with a 140mm fan.
     
  22. Nanook

    Nanook Limp Gawd

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    Yes, at 195w, ANY cpu cooler that fits in the M1 will be at maximum rpm. Water or air.
    The Noctua fans are hardly screamers, IMHO.
    Why mention the C14 when it’s no longer available, and the question was focused on aesthetics of the D9L?
     
  23. Vittra

    Vittra Gawd

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    D9L is small enough that something like a Prolimatech Ultra Sleek Vortex will fit above it as an intake should you choose to do so. I imagine newer 15mm thick fans that subsequently came out should also be ok. I used the Prolimatech setup for awhile. That's it's only real advantage over the U9S.
     
  24. b21

    b21 n00b

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    Hi, I am newly a proud owner of a NCase M1 and need your knowledge.
    Is there a possibility to change the front USB cable to a more flexible one? Or how did you solve it?
    I will have a RTX 2080 FE in the case. What is the best cooling solution for it? In blowing 120x25mm Fans?
    Thanks for your help.
     
  25. thomps33

    thomps33 n00b

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    Maybe I missed it in the thread but SFFlab announced a front panel with USB-C is coming later this year.

    I've been waiting for them to release a case with USB-C front panel but now the grey vented panel version is sold out. Just my luck. haha
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2019
  26. Bawjaws

    Bawjaws Limp Gawd

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    I'll be honest, I've never really got the fuss about USB-C front panel connectivity. There's only one or two boards that actually support 3.1 Gen 2 front panel connections, so what's the benefit of having a USB-C port on the front of the case if functionally it's identical to the existing Type A port (And you can just use an A to C cable)?

    Obviously I must be missing something here, because it seems lots of people want Type C ports on their NCases!
     
  27. M1AF

    M1AF Limp Gawd

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    I'm probably in the minority on this, but I'd prefer no I/O. I just want the power button hole. Looks cleaner with custom switches.
     
  28. Bawjaws

    Bawjaws Limp Gawd

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    I actually don't use the front USB or audio very often at all, but they are handy to have from time to time. I tend to use a USB hub and plug my headphones into the socket on my desktop speakers.

    Edit: actually, I wonder how easy it would be to disconnect the USB grade from the front panel. That would save having to endure the unwieldy internal USB cable, which is a real pest.
     
  29. QuantumBraced

    QuantumBraced Gawd

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    Well I'm probably in the super minority on this, but I don't care for a power button, however, I do want front audio and USB. I press my power button maybe once every 6 months, you simply don't need it anymore as it's all handled thru software nowadays. Even for powering on from a complete shutdown (which I only do when cleaning the PC), lots of motherboards have the option of using the keyboard. So the power button may as well be on the back, ideally integrated into the rear I/O if more motherboards start doing that.

    But front audio I use because it's much more natural for the headphone cable to come straight out of the front of the PC and the M1 is perfect for that. I also wouldn't buy a case with the audio ports on top facing up as those are incredibly awkward unless you're some animal who puts their computer on the floor. Using the rear is also very awkward, plus my mobo has a built-in amp that only works with front audio. I guess if you use an external DAC then that's all you need, but otherwise plugging headphones in the rear every time, even for SFF, is definitely not ideal, and you can damage the connector and cable (and even the PC) much more easily that way if you yank it out while rocking out to AC/DC.

    And front USB comes in handy from time to time, though that heavily depends on usage, some people need that daily, some people only need it when installing their OS, and you have a lot more options there with peripherals and dongles. So, in terms of importance, I rank front I/O:

    1) Audio (unless you use a DAC)
    2) USB
    3) Power button

    I gotta say, amount and positioning of I/O was a major reason why I chose the M1, nearly every other case gets that wrong. It is positioned perfectly on the case and even within the panel, the fact that the audio ports and the USB ports are next to each other is not something you can take for granted these days. So many I/O panels have the 2 audio ports on oppose sides of the I/O row, which is just stupid. Such a simple thing, yet case manufacturers suck at it.
     
  30. mod4win

    mod4win n00b

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    A little late replying to this, but don't give up on watercooling the M1. With the correct hardware, you can make a very silent and powerful gaming NCase M1 system and still maintain good temps. With the config below, my gaming temps for 1440p have never got above 60c and the system stays silent. The slim fans with the slim radiator are perfect for this case. I did, however, have to make taller feet to allow more air intake.

    It drives me crazy to hear fans during a game. Above all, my first priority is a dead-silent system. During gaming I don't hear them at all. The second was not to modify the case (my only mod was to drill two holes in the front to mount the pump which seemed acceptable.) The radiator was positioned in the system in a way that did not require cutting the USB or audio cables on the front panel. I had to move the radiator toward the back of the case about a half-inch or so. The compromise here was to only mount the bottom fans to the case with only two screws. Initially I was concerned there would be audible vibration as a result, but this has not been the case. They're pretty well sandwiched in there.

    This config is my best one yet. My old config had the TX240 with Noctua 25mm thick fans, but the air was choked between the radiator and GPU. Even with the stronger fans, it was louder and temps were higher. The config below is much better allowing more airflow ( 1/2" between radiator and GPU).

    i5-6500 (no overclock)
    GTX1070, (no overclock)
    XSPC TX240
    (2) Nocuta NF-A12x15 PWM (intake fresh air from the bottom)
    (1) NF-A9 PWM (exhaust)
    EK D5 pump

    upload_2019-3-17_12-11-41.png

    Pump:
    upload_2019-3-17_12-21-51.png

    Radiator Fans:
    upload_2019-3-17_12-23-6.png

    Case Fan:
    upload_2019-3-17_12-23-34.png
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2019
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  31. b21

    b21 n00b

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    Can anyone of the RTX 20X0 owners please answer this. I have to decide between the Asus Strix 2080, EVGA RTX 2080 XC Gaming or XC Ultra.
    What are your experiences with it. I would prefer the Asus, but have concerns about the minimal airflow on the windowside, because of the little air gap between the tall card and the window glas.
    On the EVGA side, would be a XC with 120x25mm better than a XC Ultra with 120x15mm? I use a C14s with an Ryzen 2700X, so it gets hot in there.

    Thanks a lot.

    Edit: I know the great charts of M1AF for air cooling. But found nothing to the airflow "problem".
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2019
  32. AG1M

    AG1M n00b

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    Yes a single 240mm radiator is fine for this kind of hardware, I had in my first Ncase M1 watercooled build a very similar setup:

    Intel i7-3770 @ 4.15 Ghz (delidded)
    EVGA GTX 1070 @ 2 Ghz GPU / 4.5 Ghz memory
    240mm radiator (27mm thick) with 2 good fans

    Gaming load at 24°C ambient and 850 rpm fanspeed:

    CPU peak at 51°C
    GPU peak at 41°C

    Prime95 load was something under 60°C

    1.jpg 2.jpg
    3.jpg 4.jpg
     
  33. Boil

    Boil [H]ard|Gawd

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    Which way were your fans running...?
     
  34. AG1M

    AG1M n00b

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    Because this are Noiseblocker fans on the radiator, always at push, because with pull they get much louder, this special fans need enough clearance if used in pull (like a shroud between fan and radiator with 2cm or more space), due the special form. With Noctua fans you don't have this "problem", they perform the same in pull and push from the noise level. But I had choosen this Noiseblocker fans instead of Noctua fans, because their tone on higher rpm (above 600 rpm) was a way more pleasant for my ears and for subjective more silence I gained 2-3K better temps in total, because I could ran this fan setup slighty faster.

    The fresh air is taken from Ncase M1 top input and the hot air gets out of the side panel. This was on my testing the best result for my setup.
     
  35. Verdi

    Verdi n00b

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    I recently made a change to my PC which I'm really happy about.

    I had the "standard" 2 bottom intake fans and open air cooler GPU configuration, which in my opinion although the easiest, its not the best by far. 2 fans mismatched in size and position working that close seems counterproductive.

    GPU temps would hit about 67 degrees even in light gaming and in heaven benchmark up to 80ºC at 50% fan speed, at which it was very audible (ambient temperature around 30ºC, I have to use a very thick filter in the bottom intake, GPU fan profile set to default, NF-B12 fans at fixed 900 RPM)

    I was thinking about replacing the GPU cooler with on of those aftermarket coolers, but I think the stock heatsink is actually well sized for the thermal load, and the shroud looks good.

    So I just removed the GPU fans and made a EVA cover for the bottom fans with openings matching the shroud openings where the stock fans were, so all the bottom fans' output goes through the heatsink. Also connected the bottom fans to the GPU fan header and made a custom fan profile, always on, ranging 600-1200 RPM.

    It actually works better than I expected! Light gaming does not go over 55ºC (somehow DMC5 on ultra is in this category?), even at a lower RPM than my previous solution. Heaven now tops at 75ºC. In both cases it takes much longer to reach the equilibrium temperature. I can never hear it.

    GPU is an EVGA GTX 1070 SC, bottom fans NF-B12 Redux 1700.

    Some pics (at some point I plan to work on cable management and better fitting the cover to the fans...)
    2.jpg 3.jpg 4.jpg 5.jpg
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2019
  36. cjone2

    cjone2 n00b

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    Looks great! How did you make the EVA cover, I'm interested in trying the same thing?
     
  37. Verdi

    Verdi n00b

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    I took the measures from the card, cut the circular holes in the same size and spacing in an EVA sheet, than cut around the holes a piece bigger than what the final piece should be (exacly the size of 2 120mm fans). I left a margin of around 2-3 cm in each side. Then, started a process of inserting it in the gap between the card and the fans, aligning the holes by eye, removing it, cutting some of the excess from the extremities, repeat. As you can see in the pictures, I've stopped short of doing a good job of removing the excess...

    Originally, after the cover was finished I had planned to cut another identical piece and place it over it for a more tight fit. But I was tired and skipped this step...

    One thing to keep in mind if you are going to try this, is that it will increase the total amount of airflow passing through the GPU heatsink, but it will decrease the overall airflow to the case. So, bottom intake will output less air and at a higher temperature than the standard solution.

    It might be a good idea to have another intake to feed fresh air to the CPU (I don't have it, but I'm using an undervolted i5-4670 and my current cooler is oversized for it's load, maximum it ever reaches is 65 ºC).
     
  38. SOAREVERSOR

    SOAREVERSOR Limp Gawd

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    you have a build log?
     
  39. cjone2

    cjone2 n00b

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    Awesome thanks. I have an 240mm AIO so not worried about the CPU but the GPU can hit 82 during gaming, so want to improve that. Have just placed intake ans underneath which is helping a lot, just in terms of how the case feels but want to know what to consider next.

    Final questions - did you go after any particular EVA foam, thickness etc. and what program are you using to control the fans and are you having to use the fan grills?

    Cheers!
     
  40. Verdi

    Verdi n00b

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    I noticed after changing the GPU stock fans to the Noctuas, the Fan tachometer monitoring shows random spikes at some points in the graph. Like, its sitting at around 700 RPM, but suddenly there is a single data point at 1600-1650 RPM (close to the max speed of the fan), than back to 700 RPM. It seems to happen at around 2 times per minute, at random intervals, and the "% fan speed" graph does not show a corresponding spike. Oh, also, 50% fan speed in msi afterburner actually corresponds to the max speed of my fans.

    Any idea why that might be?

    I just bought a random sheet of black EVA, around 2 mm thick i guess. I've picked it because it's easy to work with, does not deteriorate and looks fine. But honestly any material that you can cut and is thick enough to fill the gap between the GPU and fans will do, even some cardboard perhaps. I do not use the fan grills. I'm using MSI Afterburner to control fan speeds. What GPU model are you using?
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2019 at 2:32 PM