LG 48CX

sharknice

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Vincent said the panel gamma is calibrated for 120hz ~ 8.3ms frames.. so the farther from that you get from that with VRR, the more over-energized the frames are because their durations are longer.

Would it be possible to set the display to lower Hz as you are suggesting, then calibrate the gamma manually to a lower start point at 100Hz or 60Hz as far as the ODS settings go? - I'm not sure that there isn't a curve built in to the TV's hardware/scaler based on the 120hz scale that would take priority when VRR is active from what Vincent was saying in that video...

I don't think VRR mode is calibrated for 120hz. I think it's actually calibrated to whatever the maximum hz signal you send it. So when you're sending it a 120hz signal it's calibrated for 120hz. When you send it a 60hz signal it's calibrated for 60hz, etc. They didn't factor VRR into the equation.
 

gamerk2

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Yeah the Gsync module was absolutely worth it. It was pretty irritating to see people hate on it saying it was no better than freesync but being charged a premium regardless. The experience of having a gsync module vs no gsync module is more than worth the price increase that comes with it as the experience is just flat out better.
Because it's handling all the processing. In theory, you could do everything in SW within the firmware, but there's a LOT of really time-sensitive processing that would need to be honored. The Gsync module removes that as a limitation.

I said from the beginning that Gsync was the superior solution, since it handled these types of cases correctly and would guarantee the same level of performance across all displays.
 

MistaSparkul

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The only thing you can do at this point is see whether or not the raised near blacks actually bother you or not. It's pretty obvious that not everyone is bothered by this, or even notices it to begin with. Then you got those who claims it's super obvious and makes everything "look like shit". Funny because it only affects near blacks and absolute black value of 0 is still black so I don't get the whole argument that "black is no longer black" with VRR enabled when black level of 0 is completely unaffected by this :rolleyes:
 

Advil

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This is all when VRR(Gsync) is on. Don't use it, and you don't have these issues. I'm not as pessimistic that LG can't still improve the situation, but I've lived without GSYNC until now and I can live longer if I have to. The image quality is still so good I'd be hard pressed to give it up and go back to something else if VRR won't deliver.

BUT- It'll still piss me off greatly at this price point. So LG certainly still needs to keep working on it if they expect me to buy another one of these in a few years. They need to get up to speed on this tech and figure it out.
 

steiNetti

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This is all when VRR(Gsync) is on. Don't use it, and you don't have these issues. I'm not as pessimistic that LG can't still improve the situation, but I've lived without GSYNC until now and I can live longer if I have to. The image quality is still so good I'd be hard pressed to give it up and go back to something else if VRR won't deliver.

BUT- It'll still piss me off greatly at this price point. So LG certainly still needs to keep working on it if they expect me to buy another one of these in a few years. They need to get up to speed on this tech and figure it out.
This is exactly what was going through my head. They've lost me on false promises and under delivering plasmas about 10 years (or longer?) ago and they will lose me again as a customer if they don't get behind it.

I would have gone for something else - if anything at all would have come close feature wise but I once again feel like I got fooled by them, even though I'm currently not affected by any of those problems.
 

Kev13Dd

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I don't think VRR mode is calibrated for 120hz. I think it's actually calibrated to whatever the maximum hz signal you send it. So when you're sending it a 120hz signal it's calibrated for 120hz. When you send it a 60hz signal it's calibrated for 60hz, etc. They didn't factor VRR into the equation.
This might be one of the reasons I haven't noticed the shift as much when using VRR; I've had the TV set at 4K100Hz

But at least for PC resolutions in the NVIDIA panel, 100Hz is the lowest option at 4K. So even if this panel is calibrated at different refresh rates, I don't think 4K60Hz will be a solution
 

zehoo

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It'll be curious to see if LG have a hardware fix for overcharging the pixels in VRR with the C11 line (and 48Gbps). Sony and Panasonic should finally have their HDMI 2.1 48" version out next year as well.
 

kalston

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Updated firmware to the latest it offered me: 03.11.25, put the 3090 in and... 120hz looks totally off. It seems to have some slight chroma subsampling with RGB and text looks a little strange, as if stretched/blurred or something (pixel shift has been turned on and off to no avail, I think it might be the same look 120hz used to have with pixel shift on but I can't remember exactly). Even 120hz 4:2:0 looks worse than before (or 1440p 120hz which used to be flawless). Wth?

60hz still looks absolutely perfect. And switching back and forth between 120hz RGB/4:2:0 etc. can sometimes cause a "no signal" screen. Yikes.
 

kasakka

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Updated firmware to the latest it offered me: 03.11.25, put the 3090 in and... 120hz looks totally off. It seems to have some slight chroma subsampling with RGB and text looks a little strange, as if stretched/blurred or something (pixel shift has been turned on and off to no avail, I think it might be the same look 120hz used to have with pixel shift on but I can't remember exactly). Even 120hz 4:2:0 looks worse than before (or 1440p 120hz which used to be flawless). Wth?

60hz still looks absolutely perfect. And switching back and forth between 120hz RGB/4:2:0 etc. can sometimes cause a "no signal" screen. Yikes.
Check the HDMI diagnostics to see what you are actually receiving on the display at 4K 120 Hz. Make sure pixel shift is off and quickstart+ is off so that pixel shift does not re-enable itself.
 

kalston

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Quickstart is off, had to do that before to fix pixel shift turning itself back on. Anyway I just did a full reset of the TV and it's still happening.

Ok, HDMI diagnostics shows the resolution as 4096x2160 which explains it (not sure this would affect the chroma though, but maybe it's just the scaling that makes it look off). Why is this now happening when I select any resolution listed under PC? :(
 

kasakka

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Quickstart is off, had to do that before to fix pixel shift turning itself back on. Anyway I just did a full reset of the TV and it's still happening.

Ok, HDMI diagnostics shows the resolution as 4096x2160 which explains it (not sure this would affect the chroma though, but maybe it's just the scaling that makes it look off). Why is this now happening when I select any resolution listed under PC? :(
It should not. For me it reports 3840x2160 as it should. I use the Club3D adapter though but even on an actual HDMI 2.1 port it should still have the correct res. Try if setting it from Windows Display Settings works better for some reason.
 

kalston

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Yep at 60hz it reports 3840x2160 just fine. And before the GPU upgrade and firmware upgrade it worked just fine at 120hz.

Doing it through Windows gives the same result at >60hz (and Windows even shows "active signal 4096x2160"...).

Did a clean video drivers install, reboot, and plugged into a different HDMI port on the GPU and still no go. I'll try a different HDMI port on the TV too. edit: didn't help

Could I just edit the EDID and get rid of this useless 4096x2160 res maybe? I'm a little scared of breaking something. Wish I could just downgrade the firmware but to my knowledge that is not an option.

Edit 2 : OK it's some nvidia scaling bug. I have to use aspect ratio/display AFTER switching to 120hz to fix it.

Means integer scaling is not usable for me at >60hz for now. Well I don't exactly need it right now but this is a really silly bug.
 
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b1gLoRD

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Are you using RGB or YCbCr 4:4:4 when you hooked up only to PC to play games or to watch some movies via some pc media players. Is there any noticeable difference ? I found so many conflicted answers for this.
 

SoCali

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The VRR raised blacks thing is super obvious to me in any medium to very dark game. As soon as you move the camera everything dark lifts in brightness and is a once you see it can't unsee type of thing.

TBH I don't think most people will notice it but it's basically ruined a near flawless display for me. Hopefully they can at least implement some kind of ghetto fix to mitigate it even 50%.
 
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RadXge

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The VRR raised blacks thing is super obvious to me in any medium to very dark game. As soon as you move the camera everything dark lifts in brightness and is a once you see it can't unsee type of thing.

TBH I don't think most people will notice it but it's basically ruined a near flawless display for me. Hopefully they can at least implement some kind of ghetto fix to mitigate it even 50%>
Not sure that LG will provide a band-aid solution with a firmware update.
But I think that this can be partially mitigated by manually calibrating the monitor... someone may provide settings that will partially mitigate this (e.g. something that works well at 90hz).

It is disappointing that VRR and deep black are mutually exclusive as these are key selling points for this monitor
 

kasakka

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Yep at 60hz it reports 3840x2160 just fine. And before the GPU upgrade and firmware upgrade it worked just fine at 120hz.

Doing it through Windows gives the same result at >60hz (and Windows even shows "active signal 4096x2160"...).

Did a clean video drivers install, reboot, and plugged into a different HDMI port on the GPU and still no go. I'll try a different HDMI port on the TV too. edit: didn't help

Could I just edit the EDID and get rid of this useless 4096x2160 res maybe? I'm a little scared of breaking something. Wish I could just downgrade the firmware but to my knowledge that is not an option.

Edit 2 : OK it's some nvidia scaling bug. I have to use aspect ratio/display AFTER switching to 120hz to fix it.

Means integer scaling is not usable for me at >60hz for now. Well I don't exactly need it right now but this is a really silly bug.
Yeah you can just delete the 4096x2160 from the EDID using Custom Resolution Utility. Make sure you delete it from both "HDMI support" and "TV resolutions" sections.
 

MistaSparkul

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The VRR raised blacks thing is super obvious to me in any medium to very dark game. As soon as you move the camera everything dark lifts in brightness and is a once you see it can't unsee type of thing.

TBH I don't think most people will notice it but it's basically ruined a near flawless display for me. Hopefully they can at least implement some kind of ghetto fix to mitigate it even 50%>

So you're saying when the camera isn't moving then everything is normal?
 

kalston

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I did a g-sync on and off comparison in Control and I think it looks really bad in that particular game. Like really it makes the game look a lot worse than it should.

This is an extreme case and I'm sure most games will be fine but it's really disappointing and I'll definitely not always be using g-sync on this display (unless LG can come up with a decent workaround).

On the other hand I have not ran into any flickering issue, I even played some games that run at a horribly low framerate and it was fine, LFC was doing its part and it there were no issues other than the raised near-black.
 

hhkb

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May 24, 2013
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I can't seem to do 1440p@120hz w/ 10 bit color. Does anyone else have this issue? 4k works fine with full chroma. Just at 1440p it always drops down to 60Hz unless I set it to 8 bit. And yes it says 120hz in NVCP.
 

netjack

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How are you guys managing powering the monitor on and off? I'm used to never touching the power button on my past monitors. If the computer is on and idle, screens turn off (sleep mode) after X minutes. If I turn off the computer, the screens go in standby mode. When resuming from either scenario, the screens automatically wake up/turn on so I never have to reach around and turn them on by pressing a power button.

I'm not able to replicate this w/ the CX. When the CX hits the time limit for "turn screen off after X minutes," it appears to go into some deep sleep and I can only awake if I press the power button. If I turn the computer off, there's a "no signal" logo bouncing around indefinitely which forces me to manually turn off the screen.

Thoughts?
 
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Tol

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Alexa works as a decent power on/off solution but I usually just hit the button under the screen.
 

Porter_

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Has anyone here upgraded to this from a Samsung Q60 QLED? I know there are lots of articles/videos comparing OLED to QLED but I’m curious about firsthand experiences, particularly for gaming.
 

kasakka

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How are you guys managing powering the monitor on and off? I'm used to never touching the power button on my past monitors. If the computer is on and idle, screens turn off (sleep mode) after X minutes. If I turn off the computer, the screens go in standby mode. When resuming from either scenario, the screens automatically wake up/turn on so I never have to reach around and turn them on by pressing a power button.

I'm not able to replicate this w/ the CX. When the CX hits the time limit for "turn screen off after X minutes," it appears to go into some deep sleep and I can only awake if I press the power button. If I turn the computer off, there's a "no signal" logo bouncing around indefinitely which forces me to manually turn off the screen.

Thoughts?
I just have the remote on my table and use that. Two button presses instead of one. You could use the ColorControl app to automate this but I am not sure how well it works.
 

netjack

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I just have the remote on my table and use that. Two button presses instead of one. You could use the ColorControl app to automate this but I am not sure how well it works.
So I tried out the ColorControl App. I'm able to power it off w/ the app but not turn on - gives me an error exception dialog box. Strange.
 

kasakka

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So I tried out the ColorControl App. I'm able to power it off w/ the app but not turn on - gives me an error exception dialog box. Strange.
You might want to file an issue with the dev on Github describing your use case. It might be something like when you try to turn it on you need to send some sort of wake on LAN type package to the TV because it cannot connect to the TV API since it's not turned on.
 
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The VRR raised blacks thing is super obvious to me in any medium to very dark game. As soon as you move the camera everything dark lifts in brightness and is a once you see it can't unsee type of thing.

TBH I don't think most people will notice it but it's basically ruined a near flawless display for me. Hopefully they can at least implement some kind of ghetto fix to mitigate it even 50%>

Not sure that LG will provide a band-aid solution with a firmware update.
But I think that this can be partially mitigated by manually calibrating the monitor... someone may provide settings that will partially mitigate this (e.g. something that works well at 90hz).

It is disappointing that VRR and deep black are mutually exclusive as these are key selling points for this monitor

Wonder if the C9 has this issue, it's a dealbreaker for sure. I have a C9 but no hdmi 2.1 card to test. I'll test when I get a 6900XT.
 

elvn

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So you're saying when the camera isn't moving then everything is normal?

From what I understand from everything published and posted about this as it is now, the gamma in VRR mode is set for 120Hz 8.3ms duration so when you run a lower fpsHz it will cause the longer frame durations to be overcharged which makes the black levels raised.

That sounds like the lower your actual frame rate at any given time, the brighter it will be. I don't know what the scale of this effect is though.

During the most demanding parts of a game like mass combat and FX going off or long detailed view distances, fast moving vehicles etc. - it would be the lower part of your frame rate graph compared to when your character and game camera are walking down a corridor or is investigating or passing through smaller rooms in a building for example. In those more demanding scenes your for example 75fps average game might drop to the shallow end of it's graph to rates 15fpsHz or even 30 fpsHz lower in some games (45fpsHz to 60fpsHz). The lower end of a 100fpsHz average graph running game could be 85fpsHz or as low as 70fpsHz in some games.

Metro Exodus 4k Ultra frame rate AVERAGE graph (no DLSS, no RTX), showing what 75.5 fps average can look like in actual frame rates.
https://hothardware.com/reviews/nvidia-geforce-rtx-3090-bfgpu-review?page=4

small_metro-3090.jpg

So it would make sense that you might be able to see the difference, especially if starting at a lower, and apparently brighter, frame rate average to begin with.

---------------------------

It's too bad we don't have a very low lag and no artifacting type of interpolation, something in the vein of what VR uses perhaps or some other type of frame duplication. That way we could duplicate a 90fps or 100fps average that would have a good # of native motion definition frames. That could be something like 70 - 90 - 120 graph doubled to a 140 - 180 - 240 ... which would just run at 117fpsHz capped at all times but with varying amounts of motion definition.

The way VR does it now, as I understand it, is: it cuts anything under 90fps to 45 and doubles it to maintain "90fpsHz" solid. If that tech ever happened for regular moniotrs ("pancake screens") it might have to be done similarly with an arbitrary frame rate amputation set point. Like 100 vs 50 or 120(117) vs 60. You'd potentially lose a lot of motion detail that way depending on the cut off and your frame rate.

The problem is GPUs are always going to be behind since graphics ceilings are arbitrary set points to where the devs whittled down complexity to fit "real time" gaming. Games and user settings will always be pushing the limits of graphics detail vs whatever frame rates are acceptable. That's why we need VRR in the first place, to ride a halfway decent roller coaster of frame rates based on an average rather than lowering settings a lot farther or suffering v-sync input lag and lower rates. A really good interpolation solution on top of a decent base frame rate (even if gained using AI upscaling) could potentially make VRR unnecessary someday.
 
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elvn

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So I tried out the ColorControl App. I'm able to power it off w/ the app but not turn on - gives me an error exception dialog box. Strange.

You might want to check these controllers out:

Global Caché IP2IR-P iTach TCP/IP to IR Converter with Power Over Ethernet (PoE) - Connects Infrared Control Devices to a Wired Connection
  • PROVIDES REMOTE CONTROL TO HOME SENSORS - The Global Caché IP2IR-P iTach lets you monitor infrared devices (e.g., flat panel TV, DVD player, cable boxes) over a network and internet.
  • CONNECTS UP TO 3 IR DEVICES - You can connect up to three infrared devices such as stereo equipment to the internet via wired PoE.
  • OFFERS POWER-OVER-ETHERNET - Unlike the standard IP2IR model, the IP2IR-P iTach has 802.3af compliant PoE input. You can now just use one cable get electric power and data connection to the IP2IR-P.
  • PROVIDES AN EASY, NO-FUSS SETUP - The IP2IR-P iTach has an integrated web server, which allows you to configure set-up commands through TCP/IP.
  • WORKS WITH PC, iOS, ANDROID CONTROL APPS - Based on open systems, the IP2IR-P seamlessly integrates with PC-based control software, iPhone/iPod/iPad apps, and high-end monitoring systems.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Or you could probably look for usb IR emitters for windows 10 and then find some usb controller software like IR Blaster type stuff.


http://www.usbuirt.com/
WHAT IS THE USB-UIRT?


The USB-UIRT is a USB version of the now-notorious UIRT (stands for Universal Infrared Receiver Transmitter). The USB version offers a simple plug-and-play solution without having to deal with some of the hassles of the classic serial-port (RS-232) version.


WHAT DOES THE USB-UIRT DO?


The USB-UIRT, along with Automation Software such as Girder, allows your PC to both Receive and Transmit infrared signals -- exactly like those used by the collection of remote controls you've acquired for your TV, VCR, Audio System, etc. The USB-UIRT can:


- Receive signals from the remote controls you already have (allowing your PC to perform actions when the 'Play' button is pressed on your VCR remote, for example)


- 'Learn' from remotes you already have and Transmit a duplicate of these signals from your PC (for example, your PC could automatically turn ON your VCR and tune it to channel 3)


- Use codes available from the Web for other remotes (such as the Philips Pronto) to control all of your equipment with Remote (IR) receivers (including special 'discrete' remote codes your brand-name remote doesn't include!). For example, the USB-UIRT could transmit the discrete 'Input 3' code to your TV to directly switch it to input 3, rather than cycling through all of the inputs.


HOW DOES THE USB-UIRT WORK?


The USB-UIRT contains a small micro-controller which is capable of 'listening' for Infrared codes which are transmitted from most remote controls. When IR signals are detected, the USB-UIRT interprets these signals, decodes them, and sends them to your PC via a USB connection. Automation Software such as EventGhost or Girder can be programmed to respond to these codes. In addition, software on the PC can send IR codes to the USB-UIRT to be transmitted. The USB-UIRT's microcontroller will translate these codes to an Infrared stream and transmit them using built-in IR emitters or a connected IR extension.

http://www.eventghost.net/
One of the best features about EventGhost is that it is extensible, and has over 300 unique extensions (plugins) available. Some examples of devices that EventGhost is able to talk to are Yamaha, Denon/Marantz, Pioneer, Sony, Sonos, Samsung, RTI, Amazon Echo, MicasaVerde Vera, Phillips Hue, and many others. Supported automation protocols include but not limited to MQTT, IFTTT, TCP/IP, Serial (RS-232), CIR (IR remotes), X10, xAP, xPL, pretty much any spoken human language. EventGhost can even automate tasks on the computer it is installed on. Things like keyboard operations, mouse movements, opening and closing running programs, changing sound and video settings, and powering on and off you monitors. Some examples of events that get triggered from various changes on the computer are plugging or unplugging a USB device, when the computer changes from outlet to battery power (UPS or laptop), logging on or off, starting and stopping of remote desktop sessions, you can even have EventGhost trigger an event if a file has changed. Abilities like this are what make it the most powerful tool in your home automation arsenal.
 

madpistol

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Has anyone here upgraded to this from a Samsung Q60 QLED? I know there are lots of articles/videos comparing OLED to QLED but I’m curious about firsthand experiences, particularly for gaming.

I'll do you one better. I have both a Samsung Q90R and an LG CX.

At first, I was like "man, the Q90R is good because it gets so bright", but the truth is, the LG CX is much clearer for gaming, mainly due to the fast pixel response. Color pops way more on the CX, and the CX handles HDR, especially in gaming, significantly better. That being said, the Q90R is an excellent TV for gaming, but it feels like the LG CX is better.

Videos don't do justice to the difference in perceived quality between Samsung's QLED and LG's OLED. It's night and day.
 

equinox654

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Messages
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Has anyone here upgraded to this from a Samsung Q60 QLED? I know there are lots of articles/videos comparing OLED to QLED but I’m curious about firsthand experiences, particularly for gaming.
I have a 2018 q60fn in the living room. While I was moving. I had it on my desk for a week using it as a monitor.
The q60 looked great in desktop use. Almost like when you crank the Nvidia digital vibrance slider. 120hz 1440 was smooth. Played some ark on it and was impressed.
Keep in mind... I am very fond of my q60. I picked up a Q80T before the CX and took it back because the Q60 looked better.

My CX came in last week and they are not even comparable. The oled feels like a completely different display technology.
The pixel response on an oled is an order of magnitude faster than LCDs
I periodically check out face book and craigslist looking for high end CRT monitors. (I have a sony F-520 that will not power on anymore) I will not be doing that anymore. The motion blur is not perceptible to me on the oled. It has perfect geometry and clarity....

Blacks are perfectly black with no glow bleeding through.. I have never seen gray uniformity this good. Contrast ratio is infinite.
The color in games is spectacular. Especially in the games that support HDR.

There are some issues with gsync stuttering and flickering at 120hz. I can't really speak about that. Waiting to secure a new card, so im stuck with 4k 60 and mostly 1440 120. Haven't had an issue with those.
 

4hf

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Does anyone know the difference(s) between the models in Europe? I noticed that price varies significantly in my country.

48CX9~1530 Euro
48CX8LB~1734 Euro
48CX8LC~3000 Euro !!! (Some say the sellers are preparing the prices for Black Friday)
55CX3LA~1270 Euro - The 55 model is cheaper, but I think is too big to use it mainly as a monitor

I observed different colors (grey vs black) and the pricier version has Bluetooth in description. For the cheaper models aren't displayed many pictures to see if the stand differs or not.
 

kasakka

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Does anyone know the difference(s) between the models in Europe? I noticed that price varies significantly in my country.

48CX9~1530 Euro
48CX8LB~1734 Euro
48CX8LC~3000 Euro !!! (Some say the sellers are preparing the prices for Black Friday)
55CX3LA~1270 Euro - The 55 model is cheaper, but I think is too big to use it mainly as a monitor

I observed different colors (grey vs black) and the pricier version has Bluetooth in description. For the cheaper models aren't displayed many pictures to see if the stand differs or not.
You would have to ask LG about the differences if they are not in any way apparent from the product pages. But for the most part they will be the same TV for anything that really matters. Mine is 48CX6LB and I paid 1399 euros for mine in Finland.

The 55" model is cheaper because it's cheaper to manufacture and more popular.
 

steiNetti

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Sep 23, 2020
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Does anyone know the difference(s) between the models in Europe? I noticed that price varies significantly in my country.

48CX9~1530 Euro
48CX8LB~1734 Euro
48CX8LC~3000 Euro !!! (Some say the sellers are preparing the prices for Black Friday)
55CX3LA~1270 Euro - The 55 model is cheaper, but I think is too big to use it mainly as a monitor

I observed different colors (grey vs black) and the pricier version has Bluetooth in description. For the cheaper models aren't displayed many pictures to see if the stand differs or not.
CX<regioncode>LA

Region code:
9... mostly sold in western europe
6... UK (I think)
3... eastern europe (and it also only has a single tuner vs dual tuner on the other models).

I got a 55CX3LA from hungary for about 1200 shipped. But I also think eastern europe only gets limited stock of the 48" models. They haven't been available there for several months.

LG Model codes explained:
https://en.tab-tv.com/?page_id=7111
 

4hf

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Messages
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Thank you for the answers, now I have an idea about the meaning of different models.
steiNetti - I agree that in Eastern Europe the availability is scarce, not just for this TV/monitor, but for other components/devices too. Also, the price is usually higher...
 

steiNetti

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Messages
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Thank you for the answers, now I have an idea about the meaning of different models.
steiNetti - I agree that in Eastern Europe the availability is scarce, not just for this TV/monitor, but for other components/devices too. Also, the price is usually higher...
Yeah, not with LG though as they generally provide cheaper TVs for that market that are facelifted in some form.

For desktop and gaming usage I couldn't care less about having one less tuner if it saves me 500 EUR.. lol
 
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