GHOST S1 - When both size & performance matters

Bladestorm

[H]ard|Gawd
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I don't want to sound negative but a small Swedish review in 2 weeks will be too little too late I fear, I really think you need to go bigger and sooner to meet your goal, like many have said before a fast delivery of a case to LinusTechTips or HardwareCanucks could give you the media exposure you really need to be successful. I say all this because I really like your case and I want to do my Ryzen/Vega build in it!

I wholeheartedly agree with this. I can't effectively convey via this forum how much I want this to succeed. Pachalski, please do what it takes to get Linus, or some other high profile reviewer a case as soon as possible.
 

Mackan

Limp Gawd
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Jun 8, 2014
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379
I wholeheartedly agree with this. I can't effectively convey via this forum how much I want this to succeed. Pachalski, please do what it takes to get Linus, or some other high profile reviewer a case as soon as possible.

I think we are a bunch who feel the same. This project must succeed one way or another. I can even pay more for the case, if that means they can lower the minimum manufacturer qoute or whatever is necessary.
 

lunchtime

n00b
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Apr 21, 2017
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18
Amazing job on this case! Quick question for you, Pachalski:

You mentioned in a different forum that your personal fav heatsink/fan for this case was the Noctua NH-L9x65. Based on the specifications within the S1 website, it looks like the max cooler height is 63mm. Given that the NH-L9x65 is 65mm in height, does this mean it's no longer an option? If that's the case, what would you say are the best air cooling options that will fit in the XS S1?

Thanks!
 

Pachalski

Limp Gawd
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Mar 15, 2017
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327
I think we are a bunch who feel the same. This project must succeed one way or another. I can even pay more for the case, if that means they can lower the minimum manufacturer qoute or whatever is necessary.

I'll reach out to both of them tomorrow (Monday) to start a dialogue with them. Also, a representative from 3M (France) is coming to Stockholm tomorrow to discuss the ramp up. We have plenty to do in the coming weeks but first priority is to take the campaign all the way. Keep up the great work spreading the word and we will succeed together!
 

Pachalski

Limp Gawd
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Mar 15, 2017
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327
Amazing job on this case! Quick question for you, Pachalski:

You mentioned in a different forum that your personal fav heatsink/fan for this case was the Noctua NH-L9x65. Based on the specifications within the S1 website, it looks like the max cooler height is 63mm. Given that the NH-L9x65 is 65mm in height, does this mean it's no longer an option? If that's the case, what would you say are the best air cooling options that will fit in the XS S1?

Thanks!

I'm allergic to noise and have been a fan of the Noctuas for a long time. I'm one of those who believe that setting your fan settings to get heat spikes at 80 degrees during full load is optimal, any lower is just waste of power and noise in my opinion. So my choice is currently the noctua l9i that does the job great and is virtually inaudible. Maybe saying something obvious here, but thermal radiation laws state that the radiation is a function of the temperature difference between two bodies (measured in Kelvin) to the third power. if the delta temperature is twice as high, say 40 instead of 20, the cooling effect of a cooler at the exact same fan speed is 8 times higher. when the delta is 60 Kelvin instead of 20 we get 27 times higher cooling efficiency.

If Cooling power is more important than noise then the Cryorig C7 is great!

If we get this project of the ground we will set a team to develop an optimal cooler for this case together with RIOT (Roial Institute Of Thechnology) where may of us have studied.
 

lunchtime

n00b
Joined
Apr 21, 2017
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I'm one of those who believe that setting your fan settings to get heat spikes at 80 degrees during full load is optimal, any lower is just waste of power and noise in my opinion. So my choice is currently the noctua l9i that does the job great and is virtually inaudible.

Absolutely agree with you! I'm all about getting the quietest solution possible as long as it cools things "Lagom." (Not Swedish, but used to be married to one :)) Thanks for the response!
 

dondan

[H]ard|Gawd
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I do not agree with Pachalski maybe for the A4 the L9i and C7 are a good choices but with 63mm free space you can use much better heatsinks. The Thermalright AXP 100, Scythe Big Shuriken 2 or the Zalman CNPS8900 are much better options. Furthermore in this size class it is not really necessary to develop a new heatsink.

It looks like you have to do more research on compatible hardware to advertise your product better.
 

darksable

Limp Gawd
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Mar 9, 2015
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431
I agree with both of you guys, actually.

Pachalski, your philosophy makes a lot of sense to me, but dondan is absolutely correct that there are larger coolers that are just as quiet. If you can get cooler temps at the same level of virtually inaudible, you may as well, right? :)
 

Mackan

Limp Gawd
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Jun 8, 2014
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379
I also use a Noctua l9i + 25mm Noctua 92mm redux fan and it is virtually inaudiable using a 6700K 4 GHz at 100% load in a small case. It will probably also not make any turbulence noise in the Ghost S1. I like that is a small cooler, which means I can see more of the motherboard, as well.
 

Pachalski

Limp Gawd
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Mar 15, 2017
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327
I'm no expert here, but it looks like a slightly chewed fancy-pants cinnamon-bun. Reminds me of the semla-wrap/semmel-wrap so possibly from a bakery in Stockholm?
Yes, correct! It is from "Vetekatten" (a bakery in Stockholm) and it's a cinnamon-bun. :) Even a fancy one.
 

Pachalski

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I agree with both of you guys, actually.

Pachalski, your philosophy makes a lot of sense to me, but dondan is absolutely correct that there are larger coolers that are just as quiet. If you can get cooler temps at the same level of virtually inaudible, you may as well, right? :)
Yes, defiantly a nice feeling knowing your components are not maxed out!
 

Pachalski

Limp Gawd
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327
I do not agree with Pachalski maybe for the A4 the L9i and C7 are a good choices but with 63mm free space you can use much better heatsinks. The Thermalright AXP 100, Scythe Big Shuriken 2 or the Zalman CNPS8900 are much better options. Furthermore in this size class it is not really necessary to develop a new heatsink.

It looks like you have to do more research on compatible hardware to advertise your product better.

Thak you for the help, and you are right. There are very likely better alternatives out there. Well before September we will invite all manufacturers to participate in a bench-marking run and do some proper testing. The results and recommendations for different configurations will be published.

We will ask all the backers in a survey what coolers they would like for us to include in such a test beforehand.
 

illram

[H]ard|Gawd
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Sep 19, 2011
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I agree with the idea that the wide variety of cooling options in such a diminutive space is primarily what makes this case interesting. I've been eyeing the Reeven Steropes for air cooling, with either an off the shelf hybrid GPU and cutting out a slot in the "core" or spine or whatever for the water pipes, or do something custom. Zalman CNSP8900 is a good performer but apparently super loud.
 

varzock

n00b
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Apr 27, 2011
Messages
45
I really wish this would make it on Kickstarter but I agree it needs alot more marketing work to happen.
 

Excallibur

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Jan 11, 2017
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Thak you for the help, and you are right. There are very likely better alternatives out there. Well before September we will invite all manufacturers to participate in a bench-marking run and do some proper testing. The results and recommendations for different configurations will be published.

We will ask all the backers in a survey what coolers they would like for us to include in such a test beforehand.

The problem IMHO with this approch is you are now asking for people to pledge and you only have ~20 days left to get funded. As your project has not had much leadtime a lot of people have a lot of questions and makes it more difficult to pledge. this would have been far better to do upfront before launching the campaing. you know to create the attention and desire.

Real details and good product only photographs are now lacking and indepth details about tophats, CPU coolers (air&AIO) and benches too. This makes it really difficult to buy in on top of that it is even more a shame that your shipping costs seem a bit steep.
Comparing the Ncase or A4-sfx where far more resonable.

Finally you target the globae but a lot of people do not really know what SEK is or easily know how to convert it to local curency. when you see 2000, some might even think it is rather expensive.
I think your campaing would more appeal if you would use an international currency like the Dollar or Euro.

I really hope you succeed the goal as I backed it too, but you should not forget that you operate in a niche and the market is quite picky and lots of interesting plans/designs come to market these days so competition seems steep too.

Good luck
 

illram

[H]ard|Gawd
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Yeah I agree with Excallibur and varzock. (I am crossing my fingers this succeeds as a backer, so this is all, I hope, constructive criticism.) There should be benchmarks, videos, pictures of different hardware etc. now. Not before September. Yes, there are some pictures on the kickstarter page, but those are not enough in my opinion. For example when you did that big benchmarking run earlier (post 100)--pics of the hardware in action while testing all of that would be great, and post it on the kickstarter so people can see what this case can do. A lot of people are not sure what is a render and what is not, all the types of hardware that can or cannot fit, and so on. Particularly with the tophats, people really want to see what those can do.

With the NCase and A4 and Sentry there was this long, very engaged build up to the kickstarter with a lot of people being involved in small parts of the design, with polls for little choices here and there, tons of pictures of prototypes and benchmark runs, etc. etc. All of that prior to the campaign. So there was a ton of pent up anticipation--based on the community's knowledge and excitement about the product and what it could do--that exploded when the campaigns went live. You guys are facing an uphill battle to do all that now while the campaign is live.
 

Pachalski

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
327
The problem IMHO with this approch is you are now asking for people to pledge and you only have ~20 days left to get funded. As your project has not had much leadtime a lot of people have a lot of questions and makes it more difficult to pledge. this would have been far better to do upfront before launching the campaing. you know to create the attention and desire.

Real details and good product only photographs are now lacking and indepth details about tophats, CPU coolers (air&AIO) and benches too. This makes it really difficult to buy in on top of that it is even more a shame that your shipping costs seem a bit steep.
Comparing the Ncase or A4-sfx where far more resonable.

Finally you target the globae but a lot of people do not really know what SEK is or easily know how to convert it to local curency. when you see 2000, some might even think it is rather expensive.
I think your campaing would more appeal if you would use an international currency like the Dollar or Euro.

I really hope you succeed the goal as I backed it too, but you should not forget that you operate in a niche and the market is quite picky and lots of interesting plans/designs come to market these days so competition seems steep too.

Good luck

Truly appreciate this feedback, we will take it to heart and do what's possible to adjust this!
 

Pachalski

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 15, 2017
Messages
327
Yeah I agree with Excallibur and varzock. (I am crossing my fingers this succeeds as a backer, so this is all, I hope, constructive criticism.) There should be benchmarks, videos, pictures of different hardware etc. now. Not before September. Yes, there are some pictures on the kickstarter page, but those are not enough in my opinion. For example when you did that big benchmarking run earlier (post 100)--pics of the hardware in action while testing all of that would be great, and post it on the kickstarter so people can see what this case can do. A lot of people are not sure what is a render and what is not, all the types of hardware that can or cannot fit, and so on. Particularly with the tophats, people really want to see what those can do.

With the NCase and A4 and Sentry there was this long, very engaged build up to the kickstarter with a lot of people being involved in small parts of the design, with polls for little choices here and there, tons of pictures of prototypes and benchmark runs, etc. etc. All of that prior to the campaign. So there was a ton of pent up anticipation--based on the community's knowledge and excitement about the product and what it could do--that exploded when the campaigns went live. You guys are facing an uphill battle to do all that now while the campaign is live.

Thank you for this as well illram! We will not give up. Tomorrow we are receiving the new shell with the expanded open area and some new CPU cooler. I'll be posting the results here shortly and would greatly appreciate your continued HONEST feedback on the report and results.

We are still trying to get in touch with the big reviewers, it might be time to conciser smaller fish?
 

StrawKite

Limp Gawd
Joined
Nov 17, 2016
Messages
164
Thank you for this as well illram! We will not give up. Tomorrow we are receiving the new shell with the expanded open area and some new CPU cooler. I'll be posting the results here shortly and would greatly appreciate your continued HONEST feedback on the report and results.

We are still trying to get in touch with the big reviewers, it might be time to conciser smaller fish?
No, you need to go on a plane to linustechtips HQ and kick his door in right now. You got no time to waste.
 

nadeboy

Weaksauce
Joined
Apr 3, 2017
Messages
71
Have backed it on Kickstarter, as others I think have mentioned, it'd be really great to see some more live photos of the case and any builds. Might be best - if can't get in touch with these youtube reviewers, just tag them in social posts and just keep at it until they pickup on it. I'm not on the linus forums but would be worth posting photos/info of the case there as well and hope people pick up on it and start spamming them with info :)
 
Joined
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Messages
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Hello, I have been browsing hard forum for years but have finally signed up just to post. Really love this case and have backed it, really hope that this is a success. Can't wait to see more photos!
 

Bladestorm

[H]ard|Gawd
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Messages
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Going off of this, is it fair to assume a "M TopHat" would be necessary to clear the power connectors on a 1080 Ti FTW3 with it's height listed at 142.69mm?

 

Pachalski

Limp Gawd
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Mar 15, 2017
Messages
327
Is there a plan if the KS doesn't succeed? Looking at the stats doesn't look promising, sadly.

https://www.kicktraq.com/projects/926379907/ghost-s1/#chart-daily

Yes, defiantly. We don't see Kickstarter as a do or die project. The feedback we are receiving both here and in other channels gives us enough confidence not to stop either way. The challenges with exposure and product presentation that are discussed here are all fixable and I totally agree that's where the problem lies for the Kickstarter to gain traction.
 
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Pachalski

Limp Gawd
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Mar 15, 2017
Messages
327
Going off of this, is it fair to assume a "M TopHat" would be necessary to clear the power connectors on a 1080 Ti FTW3 with it's height listed at 142.69mm?


Bladestorm

If you have spotted that the TopHats together with the opening in the "Creative Platform" (need to find a better name for this!) create a vertical clearance just where the GPU power connectors are you are good or the product presentation is. Probably the former ;)

On this specific card (not tested) the connectors sit at the very top of the PCB as far as I can see, as opposed to the ASUS STRIX for instance, and could make the cards total operational height exceed the 144mm. But the S TopHat would do the job clearing this. The M TopHat would allow you to add two full size 120 case fans on top, maybe good when running TI?
 
Joined
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Yes, defiantly. We don't see Kickstarter as a do or die project. The feedback we are receiving both here and in other channels gives us enough confidence not to stop either way. The challenges with exposure and product presentation that are discussed here are all fixable and I totally agree that's where the problem lies for the Kickstarter to gain traction.
I saw on Sweclockers that you had a big meeting yesterday about the campaign, any news you can share about that?
 

dondan

[H]ard|Gawd
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MOQ = minimum order quantity. So you will be not able to lower it. Furthermore I think the tooling fees for this case will be very high so you need many units to have a fair price.
 

backfeed

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jun 22, 2010
Messages
480
MOQ = minimum order quantity. So you will be not able to lower it. Furthermore I think the tooling fees for this case will be very high so you need many units to have a fair price.

As far as I know, MOQ doesn't usually mean a hard minimum (although it can), but only the minimum quantity for a specific price-per-unit level. But yes, the price rise with a lower MOQ could be steep, especially considering tooling as you say. And if the current MOQ is actually a hard mininum, nothing can of course be done (except perhaps looking for alternative manufacturers).

Personally I'd even be ok with a doubling of the price, no problem, but most people wouldn't agree so it would likely be a hard sell.
 

nadeboy

Weaksauce
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Apr 3, 2017
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71
Damm, just had the email from kickstarter :( I backed it, and would love to get to support it once it's ready to go again.
 

illram

[H]ard|Gawd
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Probably for the best. Want going to hit the goal and it sounds like they actually didn't have a review ready case...
 

nadeboy

Weaksauce
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Apr 3, 2017
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71
Yeah totally understand, frustrated but understand might be best to stop before waiting until end of the campaign and use the time to improve and replan another campaign.
 
Joined
Apr 11, 2017
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I wonder how long it takes for a new Kickstarter campaign, I will build my Ryzen/Vega system in the summer and I guess this new campaign will not be online by then, a shame this didn't work out but I hope they prepare better for the next one!
 
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