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Battlefield 6

lukem5 said:
recently tried it as f2p
brief review: turns out its only 3 gamemodes not full game. the game modes are basically lame mission competition, and pubg clone 4 and 2 man squad. really upsetting as a guy who came from battlefield 1 to vietnam, 2, 3 etc.
cant believe the graphics have stagnated so much, bf3 looks nearly as good-from 15 years ago!!! looks like theyre using a gfx engine from 2008 (frostbite). more corporate rebadged garbage. shameful.
ill still buy at $30 just for some old school battlefield vehicle/infantry mixed mmo combat i crave. planetside 2 was good for that b4 it died recently.
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Yeah the graphics are good, but not a major leap forward all these years later. Yes the detail in rocks and ground textures and mountains looks great, but a bunch of stuff just seems like stiff cardboard. Like trees and leaves or other stuff is like immovable paper concrete LOL.

BF1 was a big visual update, and BF6 barely much batter, but overall BF4 to BF6 isn't a huge leap forward, just a bit better and more detail. But the world itself still feels stiff or not real if that makes sense. Feels like big props on a movie set or something, bunch of fake stuff, that looks cool from far away but up close it's just stuck there or something.

Man I wish there was some true competition from another developer to make a rival series of realistic but still fun action type military shooter, with loads of drivable vehicles and huge outdoor maps with 128 players. Kind of surprised someone else hasn't made this type of Battlefield game. And no the Star Wars Battlefront games don't count, those suck worse than Battlefield.
 
socK said:
Visibility is really bad in a lot of cases. The previous titles look downright clean in comparison.

You kind of acclimate, but every so often I watch a BF4 video and it's just like shockingly more readable. The skins are shit in BF6 on top of visual clutter being at a stratospheric high.

In terms of raw graphics though, I don't think BF6 is really a spectacle. It's just a lot happening on screen all the time. Like that's the gimmick. Stuff like lighting is pretty... eh.
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I agree. It isn't awful looking, but it still looks a bit odd. Some things look a bit low resolution but had a sharpen type effect thrown on in Photoshop as well. The skins are kind of odd, at least for the weapons. And I'm not even talking about the crazy out of theme ones, but the regular camo unlocks.

BF3/4 had a good gritty look but it wasn't so over done. Map design also has more clutter than those games so it isn't just the graphics either.

I do think both of them are over corrections from BF2042 which looked too clean and had many large empty spots in maps.
 
I decided to give it a go and I like it, but don’t really love it. As others have said the visibility is wild, I can’t tell you how many times I’ve died to someone almost right in front of me that I just couldn’t see, and that red image you get when you die lets you know how ridiculous it is.

I might just not be all that into fps’s like this anymore, it’s just too much chaos. The vast majority of my deaths are getting shot by someone I can’t see or in the back. I like to be on the move constantly, especially since all modes are objective based, which allows people to just sit in corners essentially invisible and shoot you as you go by.

I don’t know if I haven’t found the guns I really like or what but nothing I try allows me to get into a groove and really excel. Most of the time I end up slightly over 1:1, sometimes 2:1, and rarely 3:1+, and when that happens it’s usually because I get lucky and end up with a bunch of people in front of me while I’m prone and spraying an LMG. Never could get into vehicles in any BF.

I think it looks good and it runs really well though.
 
ivandagiant said:
Man I think this is why I actually really enjoy playing BF6 vs something like BF4 back in the day. I go out of my way to destroy jets/helicopters, I couldn't stand playing against them in previous games.

just because I like it doesn't mean its good though. This definitely feels more like COD than a battlefield to me IMO. but man did vehicles make the game absolutely miserable for me in BF4. I just remember tanks shooting at me through smoke with thermal vision from across the map and helicopters farming kills the entire game.
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Vehicles in BF3/4 certainly had issues. Thermal vision is the kind of gadget that frankly doesn't belong in a (non mil-sim) video game because it's too OP, and all vehicles had it there - tank, IFV, choppers, even the attack jet could get it with the JDAM bombs.

Having played it again though, their firepower isn't better than in BF6, and they can be crippled and blown up quickly too, it's mostly mobility and the thermals for everyone (driver+gunner) that made them so oppressive in the right hands. And the ability to self repair pretty quickly.

So I don't think that BF6 is doing everything wrong with vehicles, but things like the excessive amount of mines, undodgeable RPG/TOW etc. encourage camping in the base and sniping from there because that's literally all you can do when a couple of engineers on the other team are doing their job.

This is clearly difficult to balance, but what is sad is that DICE is only ever talking about infantry. Even the upcoming december 9th patch that they are playtesting, is 100% infantry only changes. I think that one one youtuber had a good theory, that no one on the dev team is a capable vehicle player.
 
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w35t said:
I decided to give it a go and I like it, but don’t really love it. As others have said the visibility is wild, I can’t tell you how many times I’ve died to someone almost right in front of me that I just couldn’t see, and that red image you get when you die lets you know how ridiculous it is.

I might just not be all that into fps’s like this anymore, it’s just too much chaos. The vast majority of my deaths are getting shot by someone I can’t see or in the back. I like to be on the move constantly, especially since all modes are objective based, which allows people to just sit in corners essentially invisible and shoot you as you go by.

I don’t know if I haven’t found the guns I really like or what but nothing I try allows me to get into a groove and really excel. Most of the time I end up slightly over 1:1, sometimes 2:1, and rarely 3:1+, and when that happens it’s usually because I get lucky and end up with a bunch of people in front of me while I’m prone and spraying an LMG. Never could get into vehicles in any BF.

I think it looks good and it runs really well though.
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Getting shot in the back is partially about learning the maps. There are locations where people often camp, lanes that are high risk, lanes that are low risk, different ways of approaching points etc. and the frequency of getting shot in the back, declines a lot after you learn those. Granted visibility is piss poor in the game. I can know where they are and still barely see them at times. Doesn't help that they made some of the Nato skins dark, which makes it much harder to separate Pax and Nato. They should have kept Nato bright and Pax dark for easier separation of teams.


You need attachments to get the guns really good. Having a max upgraded gun vs level 0 can easily be the difference between 2 and 3 K/D. Silencers are golden as you only get spotted on the map within 15m or so. Vertical grips reduce the horizontal recoil so makes recoil more controllable, but don't improve ADS speed. I mostly run verticals (35 point one) on mid range setups. For close range it will depend on the gun. Avoid the 25 points silencer, use either the 20 point or one of the 30 point silencer, depending on the goal of the build.

Always burst fire at 20m or more, it can even be beneficial at 10-15m. The shorter the distance, the shorter the pause between bursts. At 20m fire 2-3 bullets, tiny pause, 2-4 bullets kills much faster than spraying. They usually die quick from spraying so a lot of people just spray, but if you burst fire they die slightly quicker, which gives you an advantage.

Guns that are available early that I would recommend:
AR: B36A4 - Average within 10m, but good allrounder and fairly accurate with a heavy barrel. Prefer the NVO-228E, but that takes quite a bit of time to unlock. The M433 is a beast close up, but so uncontrollable that bursting at 30m is really random, compared to the more allround weapons in the game. Better to learn how to approach situations with the other two guns IMO.
SMGs: SGX is maybe the best allrounder after the latest patches. MP5 (PW5A3) is another good alternative that is stronger at mid ranges than the SGX. Most other SMGs are niche. Extended barrel works wonders for SMGs TTK.
Carbines: M4A1 is a beast at 20m or less. One of the better guns overall in the game.
LMGs: DRS-IAR is the most allround LMG and behaves more like an assault rifle. The other LMGs are good at range, but a PITA to push with in close range fights.
DMRs: Don't bother unless you want to take lots of fights from behind cover or run it as a secondary on assault. The SVK is good when shooting people in the back from cover at distance, but you will lose a lot open terrain aim duels vs competent players at 20m or less.
Snipers: M2010 ESR is good and Mini scout is good. ESR for longer range sniping, the mini scout for aggressive sniper play.
 
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There is very little cover in maps for aircraft in BF6. Lock on range is infinite across all maps so you need to get behind the one or two places of cover all game basically and what happens when you peek? Lol you have 3 tow missiles and 4 lock ons and 2 rpgs flying directly at you all game and they know exactly where your covered cause there is nowhere else to use cover lmao. Imagine as infantry you had no cover and half the player base was always shooting at you. Feels bad. Take into account how slow the choppers are. I literally hit 4 rpgs in a row on helis the other day and I've had no practice with them think about that. 2 on the transport and 2 on the chopper 100% accuracy 4 for 4 direct hits. The rpgs are almost like hitscan they fly a million miles per hour instantly hitting it seems. They are waaaay faster than BF4. Also take into account how low the flight ceiling is on the maps. You're just a sitting duck flying like you're in molasses.
 
The most crazy ones are the TOWs.

I could not hit anything flying with those in BF4, I can swat out ouf the sky choppers with almost 100% accuracy in BF6, and the range is far bigger than the maps are, so you don't even need to leave spawn. The MBT is the worst offender because it can spam them non stop, the IFV has a small delay though if you don't miss it's no problem anyway. Static TOW launchers do work as well, but they only cover a limited portion of the map, of course.

Jets are not that hard to hit either, but they are fast so usually you catch them during a dive. Meanwhile the inoffensive mobile AA watches you helplessly.

Vehicles are just a mess in general but this new DICE team has shown no interest in fixing it. They literally don't talk about it and seem to have no plans for that portion of the gameplay.
 
kalston said:
The most crazy ones are the TOWs.

I could not hit anything flying with those in BF4, I can swat out ouf the sky choppers with almost 100% accuracy in BF6, and the range is far bigger than the maps are, so you don't even need to leave spawn. The MBT is the worst offender because it can spam them non stop, the IFV has a small delay though if you don't miss it's no problem anyway. Static TOW launchers do work as well, but they only cover a limited portion of the map, of course.

Jets are not that hard to hit either, but they are fast so usually you catch them during a dive. Meanwhile the inoffensive mobile AA watches you helplessly.

Vehicles are just a mess in general but this new DICE team has shown no interest in fixing it. They literally don't talk about it and seem to have no plans for that portion of the gameplay.
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They did say they focused on infantry during development. The new team just fundamentally doesn't understand what makes a Battlefield game.
 
I had someone on my squad finish with 0 kills and like 5 deaths over a half hour game. They didn't even have many assists.

I have no idea what they spent the game doing or where they even could have been. Sometimes people get backfilled in late but it didn't seem to be the case here since I had a clip at roughly the beginning of the match and it was still the same group.

I can only assume they were literally walking around a half mile away from any action at any point and admiring the scenery or something.

I need to follow one of these people and see what the fuck they're doing to accomplish so little. It was on Eastwood breakthrough.
 
socK said:
I had someone on my squad finish with 0 kills and like 5 deaths over a half hour game. They didn't even have many assists.

I have no idea what they spent the game doing or where they even could have been. Sometimes people get backfilled in late but it didn't seem to be the case here since I had a clip at roughly the beginning of the match and it was still the same group.

I can only assume they were literally walking around a half mile away from any action at any point and admiring the scenery or something.

I need to follow one of these people and see what the fuck they're doing to accomplish so little. It was on Eastwood breakthrough.
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Reminds me of this pot head guy I used to play with that would go like 1-3 because he would just camp on some obscure part of the map waiting for someone to turn the corner.
 
socK said:
I had someone on my squad finish with 0 kills and like 5 deaths over a half hour game. They didn't even have many assists.

I have no idea what they spent the game doing or where they even could have been. Sometimes people get backfilled in late but it didn't seem to be the case here since I had a clip at roughly the beginning of the match and it was still the same group.

I can only assume they were literally walking around a half mile away from any action at any point and admiring the scenery or something.

I need to follow one of these people and see what the fuck they're doing to accomplish so little. It was on Eastwood breakthrough.
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I've seen some people being idle large parts of the game and others sit way out of the action missing every shot with a sniper or LMG. If he had decent score and a few captures then it could be possible he was just playing paddles, but would most likely have more deaths doing that. Could also be that he is a "vehicle only" guy that sits and waits for vehicles to spawn and just got owned every time he got in a vehicle.

Mostly stay away from breakthrough as it seems to have the worst players. It does feel like you are lucky if half the players want to play the objective in breakthrough now days with the rest hiding behind rocks "farming" kills with 7-10 stats when the few people that push are 20-8. The problem isn't players being bad at fragging, but that they don't come to play the mode and capture/defend points.

Played like 6 breakthrough games in the last week, won most of them, but only had 1 really good team and only 2 of the games were actually fun. When I had the good team, the game was over in a flash, on liberation peak, because 80% of the players who wanted to play as a team and PTFO was on my team, so we were sitting on the points capturing them with only like 5 or 6 enemies trying to defend. The rest of the defending team was hiding in buildings and on top of rocks far away from the points, trying to pad their stats rather than defending the objective. Basically I think we averaged 20 tickets lost per sector, with most of them being in the final sector. Most of the games was usually around 50% that PTFO and 50% being useless, which makes it boring.

Wish they would segregate the player base based on capture time etc. and put all the players that want to get on the point in the same game. Just get tired of players who would rather hide on a hill than try to get the objective. The first objective on liberation peak is super easy to take, just have a few snipers and a tank in the hills suppressing the crest where defenders and attackers meet, then just smoke rush the point and prone around the house. Just sad how many times it takes forever to take the first point on that map. When you have a team that gets it then it takes a few minutes and maybe 20 tickets to take it.
 
Man the more I think about the weapon customization, I'm tempted to say it's pretty meh

Like the #1 goal by far is to just homogenize everything into being as close to a zero recoil laser as possible - that's it. You don't really do anything interesting, there's hardly any tradeoffs anywhere. Just jam whatever you can into the point budget to reduce recoil while keeping a silencer. If recoil is low enough, use one that lowers ADS speed. That's pretty much it.
 
Matchmaking is fucking balls in this game.

I keep getting stuck in losing games. I played 15 rounds and lost each onenin escalation, every time being in the top quarter of the team. Just can't get shit done with these no reviving no attacking pitches. Im salty
 
MisterClean said:
Matchmaking is fucking balls in this game.

I keep getting stuck in losing games. I played 15 rounds and lost each onenin escalation, every time being in the top quarter of the team. Just can't get shit done with these no reviving no attacking pitches. Im salty
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I'm half convinced the game just TRIES to force balance by giving you the dumbest most useless people imaginable if you've had the audacity to win recently. If you had a good game, the next one is near guaranteed to be the most braindead shit imaginable.

Also FUCK when the matchmaker drops you into a game that's basically a mile gone already. I assume a bunch of people rage quit, and you get backfilled into a game where you've lost every flag already and there's literally nothing to do but lose in the coming 3 minutes.

I just had a 20 minute game where someone in my squad ended with 1600 points. The next person had like 1900, and then 2600. I was at like 8000. One dude was rank 100, that's higher than me. There's 10 useful things you can possibly be doing at any given point and people somehow figure out how to do literally none of them.

Also I want to strangle everyone who sees LAST SQUAD MEMBER ALIVE and immediately proceeds to YOLO into guaranteed death instead of just sitting still for 5 more seconds so we can spawn 10 meters from the point instead of 200.
 
socK said:
I'm half convinced the game just TRIES to force balance by giving you the dumbest most useless people imaginable if you've had the audacity to win recently. If you had a good game, the next one is near guaranteed to be the most braindead shit imaginable.

Also FUCK when the matchmaker drops you into a game that's basically a mile gone already. I assume a bunch of people rage quit, and you get backfilled into a game where you've lost every flag already and there's literally nothing to do but lose in the coming 3 minutes.

I just had a 20 minute game where someone in my squad ended with 1600 points. The next person had like 1900, and then 2600. I was at like 8000. One dude was rank 100, that's higher than me. There's 10 useful things you can possibly be doing at any given point and people somehow figure out how to do literally none of them.

Also I want to strangle everyone who sees LAST SQUAD MEMBER ALIVE and immediately proceeds to YOLO into guaranteed death instead of just sitting still for 5 more seconds so we can spawn 10 meters from the point instead of 200.
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You are not imagining, it happens to me too a lot. If you win enough games in a row with good score, you get several games in a row with only a few good players in the team. Basically you usually win 4-5 in a row and then lose 3-4 in a row most of the time. You get the best teams at the start of your winning streak and worst teams at the start of your losing streak.

Same for the late game joins, but at least they said they will make changes on the next patch, to try to reduce the amount of times people are dropped into games that are almost over.
 
socK said:
I just had a 20 minute game where someone in my squad ended with 1600 points. The next person had like 1900, and then 2600. I was at like 8000. One dude was rank 100, that's higher than me. There's 10 useful things you can possibly be doing at any given point and people somehow figure out how to do literally none of them.
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Sometimes the challenges are to blame and that fault lies completely with the developer. I don't blame people trying to unlock the skins they paid for, I blame the dev for making the challenges to unlock them the most BS ever. Many of them can be replaced with "ignore the objectives and teamwork completely until you complete this challenge".

Especially the ones involving flying. Most of the playerbase cannot and do not want to learn to fly, yet they get "fly x vehicle for y metres" challenges, and they just grab a vehicle and crash it over and over and over for a couple matches. Purely the devs fault. (maybe they should just give unlimited rerolls).
 
The other day got a kill on an attack helicopter with an IFV. 2-3 hits with the cannon took it out, maybe it was already damaged. Then a few moments later was in a tank, 1 shot with the main gun. Both felt satisfying. :D I do feel bad for the heli pilots, they were slow and fast, which is the only way to avoid the instant AA/SAM death.
 
The bonus path points is really pissing me off, doesn't seem like any challenges gives points, have to do specific ones.
 
Yeah I’m in the “cautiously hyped, slightly worried” camp on this one.

The destruction looks awesome in clips, but I’m with Flogger and brennok – if every rocket turns whole buildings into swiss cheese in 30 seconds, everyone just ends up dolphin diving in a rubble field and there’s zero reason to fight for indoor space. Cool effect the first few rounds, miserable long term. I’d rather see BC2/BF3 level destruction where you slowly peel open buildings and create new sightlines instead of just deleting half the map.

Gun meta sounds like early-test nonsense to me. Every BF has had “that one stupid broken gun” in alpha/beta. If they actually listen and tune it before launch, whatever. Bigger question for me is the same as a lot of folks here – anti-cheat and servers. You can nail the vibes and destruction and still kill the game if it’s 2042 all over again with no real rented server program and cheaters running wild.

If they really stick the landing with BF2/3/4 feel + proper destruction + decent admin tools, I’ll happily sink stupid hours into it again. Just not preordering another “live service experiment” dressed up as Battlefield.
 
FearTheCow said:
The bonus path points is really pissing me off, doesn't seem like any challenges gives points, have to do specific ones.
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Weekly challenges from the last 3 weeks gives bonus points (silver sign on the far right side of the challenge). Not like the prize is much to write home about though, so can safely ignore that path. Only "must have" gun in the entire battle pass is the mini scout, rest have similarly good, or better, alternatives already.
 
Whoever was in charge of skins in this game should be fired

It's like basically impossible to even tell enemies apart just by skin since you can have tan, black, white, and blue in the same game, on the same team, at the same time.
 
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FearTheCow said:
The bonus path points is really pissing me off, doesn't seem like any challenges gives points, have to do specific ones.
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There are two different battle pass coins. Only the last two weeks give points towards both types. You have silver and bronze colored ones. The new week challenges give points to both. I like the shotgun, DP-12, but it is kind of gimmicky. You have two rapid shots but need both to hit to do damage. So essentially it is really an 8 round pump action. Okay in close spaces though.
 
Man the shotgun is kind of ass

I think I audibly groaned when I headshot a dude sniping from across a street on Cairo with a slug and did like 66 damage

BC2 this is not
 
I now feel dumb for not realizing it was the weekly challenges I needed to do, knocked out a bunch and almost finished the battle pass.
 
The worst is the engineer challenge #2 where you need to get 2000 damage with anti tank mines. Like, WTF is that ? Going in front of their base and trying to plant mines in the driveway with out getting shot and getting out alive. What a horrible challenge. Gonna take forever. How much does each mine do damage anyway?
 
xDiVolatilX said:
The worst is the engineer challenge #2 where you need to get 2000 damage with anti tank mines. Like, WTF is that ? Going in front of their base and trying to plant mines in the driveway with out getting shot and getting out alive. What a horrible challenge. Gonna take forever. How much does each mine do damage anyway?
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How is that challenge so bad? It just comes naturally as mining around and on capture points is a big help for the team. Didn't even make an effort on that one, just let it complete by playing the game.
 
evhvis said:
How is that challenge so bad? It just comes naturally as mining around and on capture points is a big help for the team. Didn't even make an effort on that one, just let it complete by playing the game.
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I normally don't make it deep enough into enemy territory. A lot more chance of getting killed. Usually I try to keep a majority or the flags in conquest like 3/5 is good enough to win so instead of trying to capture the base in front of the enemy Spawn I'd rather just defend from mid map and back towards my base. So for me to go out of my way into a route where the enemy tank is going to drive through is rare to be honest. Why would I be in the middle of the road anyway? I'm flanking off sides from cover. I don't think I would ever run through the middle of the street unless it was needed to run to a different point. Even then stopping in the middle of the road in usually the middle of the map to slowly throw down 3 mines with the delayed pause in between each one is about the most unnatural style of gameplay with me. Top of off I'm mostly in a helicopter and if not the tank.
 
xDiVolatilX said:
I normally don't make it deep enough into enemy territory. A lot more chance of getting killed. Usually I try to keep a majority or the flags in conquest like 3/5 is good enough to win so instead of trying to capture the base in front of the enemy Spawn I'd rather just defend from mid map and back towards my base. So for me to go out of my way into a route where the enemy tank is going to drive through is rare to be honest. Why would I be in the middle of the road anyway? I'm flanking off sides from cover. I don't think I would ever run through the middle of the street unless it was needed to run to a different point. Even then stopping in the middle of the road in usually the middle of the map to slowly throw down 3 mines with the delayed pause in between each one is about the most unnatural style of gameplay with me. Top of off I'm mostly in a helicopter and if not the tank.
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Not that hard to throw down a few mines on the access path to one of the 3 points you want to keep. E.g. throw them on C or D on liberation peak, around C on Eastwood, around A, C, or E on Kairo etc.

You are complaining about a challenge that is fairly simple to do because it doesn't suit your playstyle? You know you can safely ignore the challenge if you can't live with it not being handed to you a silver platter. Not like it is 30 headshots in a match or revive 50 in a match etc. like some of the challenges were earlier on.
 
xDiVolatilX said:
The worst is the engineer challenge #2 where you need to get 2000 damage with anti tank mines. Like, WTF is that ? Going in front of their base and trying to plant mines in the driveway with out getting shot and getting out alive. What a horrible challenge. Gonna take forever. How much does each mine do damage anyway?
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Use the EOD bot, I would cruise behind enemy tanks and throw down all 3, then hit them with an rpg to freak and backup
 
Looks like a relatively buggy patch in true DICE fashion from what I'm seeing online.
 
evhvis said:
You are complaining about a challenge that is fairly simple to do because it doesn't suit your playstyle?
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Certainly a good reason to complain. I hate being forced to play modes or do things I don't want to do to get content. I have the most fun playing at my own pace, doing what I like. I had 10 times more fun playing Conquest in tanks than I did playing whatever game mode they hid behind a challenge for the shotgun. I wouldn't mind if they did not gate content behind it.
 
I can confirm they fucked up a bunch in this patch

The UI is bugged on the main menu
Reports of performance issues
Helicopters are fucked up in BR and their rotors are sideways
The hit boxes are bugged in the firing range, especially the close one
Some weapons have bugged attachments now

I have no idea how they released something where the main menu UI immediately breaks.
 
socK said:
I can confirm they fucked up a bunch in this patch

The UI is bugged on the main menu
Reports of performance issues
Helicopters are fucked up in BR and their rotors are sideways
The hit boxes are bugged in the firing range, especially the close one
Some weapons have bugged attachments now

I have no idea how they released something where the main menu UI immediately breaks.
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Dice gonna dice. :confused:
 
So I finally threw myself in the line of fire for a couple games and tossed mines the slams and the trip sensor mines at the other end of the map on their side down both main enterances and got the 2000 damage points to vehicles with mines to check off that portion of the challenge.
Now I just need to get the 5000 points of damage to vehicles with a hand held launcher to vehicles to fully unlock and complete the combat engineer level 2 upgrade.
It was obnoxious and I died a lot literally while throwing down the mines but it's done and I'm glad it's over 😵‍💫
 
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I have noticed a large number of level 1 to 10 players tonight playing strike point that are just wrecking everybody by far, seems a bit odd.
 
I guess my biggest problem with this game is the ridiculous spotting and minimap. If you are even remotely in any action, you are spotted like 100% of the time and people are looking at the mini-map so much, they are pre-firing where you are constantly. This game is basically who hits who first wins ADD fest. Like zero strategy/flanking. Just zerg zerg.
 
Vega said:
I guess my biggest problem with this game is the ridiculous spotting and minimap. If you are even remotely in any action, you are spotted like 100% of the time and people are looking at the mini-map so much, they are pre-firing where you are constantly. This game is basically who hits who first wins ADD fest. Like zero strategy/flanking. Just zerg zerg.
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Flash hiders do keep the automatic spotting to a minimum, and why I still use them in most maps.
I can compensate for recoil - not with being lit up from every angle.
 
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