Windows 11 Will Soon Block All Default Browser Workarounds

Does anybody even use Edge? What a disgrace. I still remember when I.E. was good (when there was nothing else available :D :D)
 
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Mosie100 said:
Does anybody even use Edge? What a disgrace. I still remember when I.E. was good (when there was nothing else available :D :D)
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I'll admit, Edge is pretty good, maybe one of the best browsers available, but I won't support Microsoft on principle.

But I do web development, so I need it installed and to test my websites, and it is a decent browser.
 
Jumpem said:
Linux is garbage for home use. It brings nothing to the table. None of the PC gaming capabilities of Windows, and none of the class leading software from Apple.
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That's a pretty hot take, but I do understand what you are saying. However, Linux brings a lot.

First, mostly all software is free and open-source. Meaning it does not cost money to install apps (or the OS for that matter) and this is important for a lot of people.

You can also modify things as you see fit, since you have the source and the license allows. For example, I wrote a plug-in in a few days so that the image viewer would sort the images differently. No way to do that on Windows, for example.

Gaming is in the pretty good spot with Proton, I would say about 80% of Windows games work out of box with no problems and maybe up to 90% of games if you have to do simple config changes (not counting online anti-cheat problems, this is something different).

In terms of Apple software, no, I don't think it is great. I learned Final Cut and Pro Tools in school, and while they were good, it's overkill for most people. For example, I use Shotcut for my YouTube videos. It was free, can handle 4K60 videos, and is easy to use. No, I wouldn't edit a feature film like this, but for 90% of people they aren't doing that.

Plus Linux is very stable, rarely crashes or corrupts anything (unless you make a mistake) and is great for developers, especially if you program for the web and want to work with local servers or database applications (since most servers run Linux anyhow). So it is very good.
 
Jumpem said:
Linux is garbage for home use. It brings nothing to the table. None of the PC gaming capabilities of Windows, and none of the class leading software from Apple.
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I use Linux every day and it's fantastic. Most of my software runs just fine under Linux either natively or using Wine and as a gaming platform Linux has quickly become the second most desirable platform under Steam. With performance that often supasses Windows running Windows native titles under Proton, especially when using the Vulkan API. Compared to macOS, Linux is basically Win32 compatible, has native Vulkan support, ongoing OGL support, better drivers and even the ability to run the latest Nvidia hardware. Considering native and Windows titles under Proton, Linux also has far more titles available to it compared to macOS - And that's not even including further titles available under Lutris.

Microsoft Office is the worlds least compatible with ISO standards office suite marketed as the most compatible and the average user doesn't need a pirated and outdated version of Photoshop for the few simplistic tasks they perform. If you're a professional, sure, get whatever device supports the Adobe CC. Bear in mind the VFX industry runs almost solely under Linux, from rendering farms, to servers and workstations.
 
DukenukemX said:
What are you talking about? Wireless has been working fine in linux for over nearly a decade. You'll get more stuff working out of the box with Linux than Windows. This is more of an issue with older laptops running Core2Duo's or older where you need to install Broadcom drivers like firmware-b43-installer.


I'm not about to use something inferior because Microsoft is a greedy asshole. Linux is the way to go.

You know who's fault that is?

View attachment 416655

I'm not sure what you mean but my Android phones works nicely with my PC. I can file transfer all day long without issues.
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I was responding to someone, do try to keep up. :LOL:
 
Jumpem said:
Linux is garbage for home use. It brings nothing to the table. None of the PC gaming capabilities of Windows, and none of the class leading software from Apple.
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You wanna hear the truth about the OS situation? Here's the truth. Linux is indeed hot garbage and I should know because I use daily on multiple PCs. We'll get to Linux is a minute, but Windows is a slow train wreck. Microsoft is too big of a company to be making an OS that most of the world has for home use. Windows 11 is looking like Windows 8 because Microsoft is trying to monetize every aspect of the OS. Making it more tablet friendly, try to sell you Office 365, and forcing you to use Edge because they can't accept that the world has far too many good web browsers to choose from and Edge isn't one of them.

Then we have Apple and Mac OSX which if Linux is a dumpster fire then Mac OSX is the manure truck. Mac OSX doesn't work any custom hardware I've built. You use it with Apple hardware and only Apple hardware. Now it's moved onto ARM which fuck ARM. Sorry, but I don't feel like dealing with the compatibility and performance issues that come with running x86 applications on a ARM SoC. Mac OSX doesn't have vulkan support which is important if I plan to play games on it. You can't even upgrade Apple devices today without requiring to buy another more expensive model. God forbid one of these devices breaks as Apple is the most unfriendliest manufacturer when it comes to repair.

Linux though has no master to bow to like Microsoft and isn't limited to hardware or ecosystem like Apple. Best of all anyone can donate code to improve it. Valve for example has been donating so much code that they're responsible for the massive improvements towards Linux for the past several years. They're the reason why Intel GPU's have Vulkan on Linux. They're the reason why AMD GPU's have RADV which is derived from the Intel Vulkan port that Valve has done. So much optimizations and improvements were done by Valve in ways that neither Apple or Microsoft could understand because they don't make software other than the bullshit apps they create.
 
I've had Edge blocked in my non-MS firewall since day 1 almost. Guess we'll see if MS can work around that or not.

Going to be another game of whack a mole between MS putting out patches to put Edge back and hackers putting out patches to remove or block it.
 
1_rick said:
You Edge-haters know it isn't IE any more, right? It's Chromium-based now.
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It is also a completely bloated turd of a browser that has no business being as top-heavy and clunky as it is, especially since it is Chromium-based.
IE was never that bloated and clunky, and the only performance issues with IE now is that it hasn't had any feature or function updates since 2013.

Chromium-based Edge is slightly better than original Edge, but not by much, and don't forget what a memory hog that Edge is compared to other browsers, regardless of the web content contained in each tab.
I have used it enough in enough environments, operating systems, and low to high-performance systems to know that Edge is a pile of trash and to avoid it until absolutely necessary.

Also, calling people "Edge-haters" is juvenile at best, as there are many security reasons to block Edge (and Microsoft) in certain environments - not to mention, what do you care if someone decides to block Edge traffic on their personal firewall?
If you enjoy Edge, then use it, but please, don't start insulting others because they list numerous reasons for not liking or not using it.

Might want to consider leaving the Microsoft echo chamber, it isn't becoming of anyone to be a part of that, nor does Microsoft give anyone special treatment for doing so.
 
Red Falcon said:
It is also a completely bloated turd of a browser that has no business being as top-heavy and clunky as it is, especially since it is Chromium-based.
IE was never that bloated and clunky, and the only performance issues with IE now is that it hasn't had any feature or function updates since 2013.

Chromium-based Edge is slightly better than original Edge, but not by much, and don't forget what a memory hog that Edge is compared to other browsers, regardless of the web content contained in each tab.
I have used it enough in enough environments, operating systems, and low to high-performance systems to know that Edge is a pile of trash and to avoid it until absolutely necessary.

Also, calling people "Edge-haters" is juvenile at best, as there are many security reasons to block Edge (and Microsoft) in certain environments - not to mention, what do you care if someone decides to block Edge traffic on their personal firewall?
If you enjoy Edge, then use it, but please, don't start insulting others because they list numerous reasons for not liking or not using it.

Might want to consider leaving the Microsoft echo chamber, it isn't becoming of anyone to be a part of that, nor does Microsoft give anyone special treatment for doing so.
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I run Chromium on my Pi400 as it's quite simply more optimized under ARM than Firefox (I'm a 100% Firefox user under x86/64), and I hate Chromium.

Seriously, my whole business is based on Google Workspace and Chromium flat out refuses to save any of my Google Workspace credentials. All other credentials save and work just fine, but I have to re login to every aspect of Google Workspace, from Chrome syncing to YouTube, every single time I open the gawd damn browser - It drives me nuts.

What pisses me off the most is I have no doubt it's deliberate on behalf of Google - Hence the reason I'm beginning to hate tech monopolies.
 
1_rick said:
You Edge-haters know it isn't IE any more, right? It's Chromium-based now.
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I don't use Chrome or Chromium I use FireFox. I mainly use FireFox for it's addons because I like the web my way. I know you get access to addons on Chrome, though not sure about Edge, but if it wasn't for FireFox then ad block type addons would have been blocked long ago. Lots of web browsers are now based on Chromium and if Google makes a change like block ad block then everyone will do it. Also this is Microsoft so there's that problem.

Here's a couple of addons that I consider essential at this point.
https://sponsor.ajay.app/
https://returnyoutubedislike.com/install
 
Yeah, I really like Firefox the best. Though it is not as fast as Chrome, the customization options are better, and it's more private/secure anyhow.

And you can install add-ons on Edge, I think it uses the same Chrome Web Store, so that is not a problem. But at that point, just use Chrome.

Also, Google is changing the API to possibly kill adblockers. They say that is not the intent, but it looks suspicious. Might be good to move to Firefox to be safe.

https://www.pcgamer.com/big-changes-coming-to-chrome-may-kill-ad-blockers/
 
cybereality said:
Yeah, I really like Firefox the best. Though it is not as fast as Chrome, the customization options are better, and it's more private/secure anyhow.

And you can install add-ons on Edge, I think it uses the same Chrome Web Store, so that is not a problem. But at that point, just use Chrome.

Also, Google is changing the API to possibly kill adblockers. They say that is not the intent, but it looks suspicious. Might be good to move to Firefox to be safe.

https://www.pcgamer.com/big-changes-coming-to-chrome-may-kill-ad-blockers/
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That's the problem with all web browsers being based on Chrome in that when Google does decide to prevent ad blockers then everyone will comply. This is not the first time Google tried to block ad blockers in their browser. Now that most popular web browsers are based on Chrome then it's easier for Google to get away with it this time.
 
GoldenTiger said:
Don't bother. It isn't worth it.
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It all depends upon your use case. I dual boot and the majority of the programs I use on a daily basis in linux are the same programs that I use on Windows 10 (jEdit, Thunderbird, Vivaldi, Libre Office, VueScan, g++, etc). The only programs I have that make me keep a Windows partition are Affinity Photo (I really dislike Gimp), games that won't work under linux and Turbo Tax (TT might work under Wine but I haven't tried it yet). Most of the time I boot into Linux to handle my daily computer needs.
 
Mosie100 said:
Does anybody even use Edge? What a disgrace. I still remember when I.E. was good (when there was nothing else available :D :D)
Click to expand...
Edge was hot garbage for several years until they switched it to being based on Chromium. Now it is actually usable and in some respects decent. I completely understand why some hate it because it isn't without it's flaws. Edge is quite commonly used in businesses due to all the MS integration.

I'm sure it has been addressed in this thread already, but if not... the article's title is clickbait. It only applies to Edge specific links... the type's of links that only MS software uses. It's not going to affect someone's use of another browser for their day-to-day web browsing unless someone specifically sends a link with the url link "microsoft-edge://" as stated in the article. For example typing in microsoft-edge://hardforum.com (this will open the site in Edge) versus https://hardforum.com

I'm almost positive this has something to do with how MS is handling logins to their online services like Office365, Outlook, Teams, etc. I've noticed already how integrated and seamless these things are at my work as opening these services logs in automatically by assuming my microsoft ID.
 
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GoodBoy said:
You can make the same (accusations) about all of the other browsers.

And Firefox has had it's share of nasty 0-days.

Edge is fine.

People like being in the 'cool club' and jump on every bandwagon that passes by.
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Nah, I just prefer being in the commonsense club, as indicated by all the things that happened this year alone. Hey, I use Linux exclusively at home and have no reason to go back. I use Windows at work and that is fine as well but, I only use edge when necessary.
 
DukenukemX said:
That's the problem with all web browsers being based on Chrome in that when Google does decide to prevent ad blockers then everyone will comply. This is not the first time Google tried to block ad blockers in their browser. Now that most popular web browsers are based on Chrome then it's easier for Google to get away with it this time.
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I can tell you right now that Chromium lets ad's under YouTube 'slip past' uBlock Origin on occasion. Run Firefox and you get no ads whatsoever, it's 100% leakproof running the exact same version of uBlock Origin.
 
Mosie100 said:
Does anybody even use Edge? What a disgrace. I still remember when I.E. was good (when there was nothing else available :D :D)
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Edge is one of the best Chromium-based browsers out there.
CaptNumbNutz said:
Edge was hot garbage for several years until they switched it to being based on Chromium. Now it is actually usable and in some respects decent. I completely understand why some hate it because it isn't without it's flaws. Edge is quite commonly used in businesses due to all the MS integration.

I'm sure it has been addressed in this thread already, but if not... the article's title is clickbait. It only applies to Edge specific links... the type's of links that only MS software uses. It's not going to affect someone's use of another browser for their day-to-day web browsing unless someone specifically sends a link with the url link "microsoft-edge://" as stated in the article. For example typing in microsoft-edge://hardforum.com (this will open the site in Edge) versus https://hardforum.com

I'm almost positive this has something to do with how MS is handling logins to their online services like Office365, Outlook, Teams, etc. I've noticed already how integrated and seamless these things are at my work as opening these services logs in automatically by assuming my microsoft ID.
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The original Edge engine was more HTML5 compatible than Chrome was at the time. For a while it was the only browser that could play Netflix 4K with any kind of good performance. Chrome is still hot garbage when trying to stream any kind of content through it compared to other browsers, but at least Edge Chromium does a good job at it. That is one of the things Microsoft gets right.
 
Mazzspeed said:
I can tell you right now that Chromium lets ad's under YouTube 'slip past' uBlock Origin on occasion.
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Interesting. I use the same adblocker with Edge, and the only time I ever see ads in Youtube is when the browser reboots to update itself. It looks like the extension doesn't get properly restarted. Closing all browser windows and opening a fresh one fixes that.
 
I got tired of the adblocker blockers and random glitches, so I just paid for YouTube premium. I guess it's worth it.
 
I use both Edge and Chrome. They're 90% the same and use the same plugins for better or worse. I flip flop between the two when testing different sites for work. Most of the time I don't even notice which is which. If you take 2 minutes to setup the fonts, download folder, etc. the way you like 'em, I bet most people wouldn't know the difference.
 
sadsteve said:
It all depends upon your use case. I dual boot and the majority of the programs I use on a daily basis in linux are the same programs that I use on Windows 10 (jEdit, Thunderbird, Vivaldi, Libre Office, VueScan, g++, etc). The only programs I have that make me keep a Windows partition are Affinity Photo (I really dislike Gimp), games that won't work under linux and Turbo Tax (TT might work under Wine but I haven't tried it yet). Most of the time I boot into Linux to handle my daily computer needs.
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I use WSL daily for my job. That plus all Quake mode with Windows Terminal is like I'm living in the future.

It's incredibly seamless for the most part. Windows+Tilde and there's my terminal.

code .

Bam, VSCode happily launches under Linux, like it's any other GUI app, and everything works. Debugger attaches without a hitch, file system access between the operating systems works. It's pretty slick.
 
1_rick said:
Yeah, but I just got told "get a real wifi adapter" without any named ones. The top seller on Amazon, btw, says it only supports thru kernel 4.4.3. There are a couple of Panda wireless-N models. Really slim pickings, though.

Personally I found that the Android tethering recommendation works best--although if you didn't already have one, that could well be more pricy than buying a spare router.
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Panda wireless N is solid though, that's my go to for USB
 
The Panda is solid, but it's kind of slow these days. I just use it for troubleshooting now as a backup.
 
GoodBoy said:
You can make the same (accusations) about all of the other browsers.

And Firefox has had it's share of nasty 0-days.

Edge is fine.

People like being in the 'cool club' and jump on every bandwagon that passes by.
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More importantly Edge doesn't need to exist. What's the point of a web browser being based on Chrome when Chrome is all you need? Opera is based on Chrome as well as several other web browsers. What exactly does Edge offer that Chrome doesn't offer other than telemetry data collection for Microsoft and not Google? Brave for example is based on Chrome and it's more privacy focused and even blocks ads. Waterfox which is based on FireFox and supports older Firefox extensions as well as being compiled with various different compilers to get the most performance out of it. Edge doesn't do anything different other than existing to punish people who installed Windows.
cybereality said:
I got tired of the adblocker blockers and random glitches, so I just paid for YouTube premium. I guess it's worth it.
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Not really worth it since for me I wouldn't be getting enough of the functionality I want. YouTube Premium only blocks ads. It doesn't skip sponsorships which nearly every YouTuber now does, and it doesn't bring back the down vote counter.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/ublock-origin/
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/sponsorblock/
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/return-youtube-dislikes/

For Android devices there's YouTube Vanced which again shows the superiority of open source over Apple's closed source.
https://vancedapp.com/
 
You can fast forward the promotions in the videos, though. You can't fast forward through actual commercials on YouTube. Right arrow key or on android tv hold the right side of the circle button and hold it until the shilling is over.
 
DukenukemX said:
More importantly Edge doesn't need to exist. What's the point of a web browser being based on Chrome when Chrome is all you need? Opera is based on Chrome as well as several other web browsers. What exactly does Edge offer that Chrome doesn't offer other than telemetry data collection for Microsoft and not Google? Brave for example is based on Chrome and it's more privacy focused and even blocks ads. Waterfox which is based on FireFox and supports older Firefox extensions as well as being compiled with various different compilers to get the most performance out of it. Edge doesn't do anything different other than existing to punish people who installed Windows.

Not really worth it since for me I wouldn't be getting enough of the functionality I want. YouTube Premium only blocks ads. It doesn't skip sponsorships which nearly every YouTuber now does, and it doesn't bring back the down vote counter.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/ublock-origin/
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/sponsorblock/
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/return-youtube-dislikes/

For Android devices there's YouTube Vanced which again shows the superiority of open source over Apple's closed source.
https://vancedapp.com/
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UX is pretty much the only reason to use different browsers based on the same engine. I like Edge's UX much more than Brave, Chrome, or Opera.
 
CaptNumbNutz said:
I'm sure it has been addressed in this thread already, but if not... the article's title is clickbait.
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True, but then so are all titles from online media outlets. Zarathustra can hardly be blamed for that (and I don't think that was your intent). The underlying issue is quite valid, however.

Much of this thread has been dominated by childish squabbles over operating system superiority... To stave off more of the same, I'll say upfront that I have zero interest in persuading anyone to use one OS over another. Every desktop OS sucks, and if that contradicts your experience, you aren't using it correctly.

CaptNumbNutz said:
It only applies to Edge specific links... the type's of links that only MS software uses. It's not going to affect someone's use of another browser for their day-to-day web browsing unless someone specifically sends a link with the url link "microsoft-edge://" as stated in the article. For example typing in microsoft-edge://hardforum.com (this will open the site in Edge) versus https://hardforum.com
Click to expand...

These microsoft-edge:// links aren't analogous to those found in the help documentation of earlier OS editions, which typically referenced local content and was tightly integrated with their proprietary viewer. They're just ordinary links prepended with the microsoft-edge pseudo protocol in order to circumvent browser choice, and none of the competing attempts to explain their existence seem plausible, especially considering the potential for anti-trust litigation.

These links occur throughout the operating system, and reference ordinary content that any web browser is capable of rendering. There's nothing special about Bing, for example, other than its role as a revenue source through advertising and data collection. Is Microsoft really so concerned about whether Bing search results are rendered in the wrong font size?

These Edge-specific URIs were questionable but evidently not deal-breaking behavior, as people tolerated them for years. But that's not what the recent fuss is about. Firefox (and I believe Brave) recently added support for the microsoft-edge protocol, and it was at that point Microsoft decided to block all workarounds that allowed opening microsoft-edge URIs in alternative browsers, even those browsers that advertised explicit support for the Edge "protocol". It's important to note that the user had to take deliberate steps to change the handling of these URIs, so this was very much a user-hostile change, and it angered many Windows users.

If there's anything to be learned from Microsoft's behavior over the decades, it's that one should always assume the worst. Why anyone would give a company with their history the benefit of doubt is beyond me. EEE.

See also:

https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/microsoft-edge-protocol-competition.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Edge#Reception
 
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Right. And even if it is a help article, it should be my choice to open the article in Firefox or Brave or whatever I choose. That is not Microsoft's decision what browser I want to use just cause I run their operating system.

On that note, how come I can't change the default search engine in the Start Menu to Google? I don't like Bing, their results are poor at best. But I am forced to use a substandard product, which might even violate anti-trust laws, for what reason exactly?
 
ElementDave said:
If there's anything to be learned from Microsoft's behavior over the decades, it's that one should always assume the worst. Why anyone would give a company with their history the benefit of doubt their money and support in relation to usage is beyond me. EEE.
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Fixed.
 
lopoetve said:
Only real game in town?
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Not a point worth arguing, as someone will make out like 99% of all PC users absolutely 'need' MS Office, the Adobe Suite, and the latest and greatest gaming title with client side DRM/anticheat that isn't far off Malware.

The reality is far from what many people have been conditioned from primary school to believe. There's a reason why MS Office and the Adobe suite is literally given away to students, and it's not because the companies in question have the best interests of the children at heart.

It's a circle of consumerism.
 
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