SENTRY: Console-sized gaming PC case project

Discussion in 'Small Form Factor Systems' started by SaperPL, Sep 1, 2014.

  1. Ej24

    Ej24 Gawd

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    In the previous page SaperPL quoted a Sentry owner that used the AXP-100. It seems to work decently. At this point though I'm waiting to make any upgrades to my system until we see the final performance of the Dan HSLP48 which will be released to market by Alpenföhn as the Black Ridge. It looks very promising. Maybe it's worth just using a cheap and widely available nh-l9i while waiting to see how new low profile options perform?

    I guess it'll be difficult if you stick with the 9900K. Gonna need like a - 0.09V offset. Maybe even -0.1V if it's stable. Maybe disable turbo boost or set max turbo to like 4.0ghz in the meantime?

    Edit:

    Also worth noting, the 9900K power consumption and temps seem to vary from reviewer to reviewer. According to Hardware Unboxed, this comes down to the motherboard used for testing. Some motherboards have strict power limits that really cap power draw close to the tdp of the cpu. Other boards with powerful VRMs intended for OC'ing let the power limit go up to 150-200W. So you could set the power limit in bios to say, 100W. That should make things tolerable.

    AFAIK, when comparing clock for clock with 8th gen the 9th gen is a bit cooler thanks to solder TIM, larger die surface area to transfer heat and the 14nm+++(4x+?:D) process Intel is on has actually been getting larger and larger since their first 14nm. That is transistor gate pitch has been increasing (therefore transistor density has been decreasing) in order to hit higher and higher clocks. Lower transistor density means less heat packed into a small area.

    Sooo long story short, there's a chance with all of this taken in to account that the 9900K could be feasible in Sentry.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2018
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  2. JesseJH

    JesseJH n00b

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    Yeah, I'm confident my LP53 and Noctua fan will be able to hold the line (For now...) and I will be disabling Multicore Enhancement if applicable on my board, as it technically runs outside of Intel's stock settings, and I will try to dial in the highest and most stable undervolt possible.
    I'm using an Asrock Z390 Phantom ITX. Seems like a high quality board. I've got everything I need now aside from my pre ordered 9900K, and a discreet GPU. Options for that are still up in the air, but I think I'm going to skip Turing and wait for a shrink (3080 Ti?) and go with a nice GTX 1080 Ti instead.
     
  3. NuclearLemons

    NuclearLemons [H]Lite

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    don't quote me on this but i believe you could fit a 120mm aio in with a gigabyte 1080 mini, its dimensions are listed as less than my vega nano and i managed to fit that.
     
  4. JesseJH

    JesseJH n00b

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    You can. I’ve already checked on that, but I definitely want no less than a 1080 Ti. I think I’m going to wait for the CPU to actually get here, test on my LP53+Noctua and reassess from there, asking you guys for advice again.
    I’m going to make it work one way or another.
     
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  5. JesseJH

    JesseJH n00b

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    Update: 9900K is in the Sentry. TDP limited to 95W. Voltage offset -20mV

    AIDA64 stability test sees CPU hitting 100C, but no thermal throttling.

    System specs:
    -i9-9900K (Using LP53 with Noctua slim fan)
    -32GB G.Skill 3200Mhz
    -No GPU at this time (still deciding what to get)
    -Samsung 970 Pro 1TB x2 (Raid 0 2TB)
    -AsRock Phantom Gaming ITX Z390
    -SilverStone 800W SFX-L 80 Plus Titanium PSU

    It’s a good system. I wanted to be able to undervolt my 9900K more, but I could be doing it wrong, because there’s not much headroom at all, or I really lost the silicon lottery.
     
  6. Neapolitan6th

    Neapolitan6th Gawd

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    Are we to assume that any greater negative voltage offset you attempted caused stystem instability/crashes?

    There's no doubt you can get the chip to "work", but there will likely have to be sacrifices. Hopefully others who are more knowlegable than myself regarding Z390 bios settings may be able to help.
     
  7. SaperPL

    SaperPL [H]ard|Gawd

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    Can you check idle temps and temps in cinebench + some games?

    Also I'm wondering what's your usecase for such CPU - video editing maybe?
     
  8. Pillars

    Pillars Gawd

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    When going ultra small form factor stuffing in the fastest chip may not be the best idea.
     
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  9. lhindir

    lhindir n00b

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    OK, I really am building this time around. I have all my parts except the GPU. I’m using a Ryzen 2600 with an L9i that I will probably put some kind of shroud on. There are two 2070’s I’m deciding between: the Gigabyte Gaming 8G and the Asus Turbo. Both are $530 at Amazon, where I have 10% off. The Gigabyte is an open-air cooler and I know it has four heat pipes, while the Turbo is a blower-style. I’m not sure how many heat pipes the Turbo has, but lower model Gigabyte cards have two so it’s possible the Asus does. I would use weather stripping or a shroud with both cards. What do you guys suggest?

    Edit: Got any specific weather stripping models for sealing off fans? Not sure on what dimensions would be best.
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2018
  10. NuclearLemons

    NuclearLemons [H]Lite

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    based on the cooling style, i would imagine weatherstripping to be more effective on the blower, pretty sure the gigabyte would just dump heat inside.
     
  11. Ej24

    Ej24 Gawd

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    As for the blower cooler, it really depends on the heatsink inside. I found the GTX 1070 Founders edition was vastly inferior to the GTX 1080 Founders edition cooler, even though the GTX 1080 has 30W higher TDP. That's because the 1080, 1080ti and Titan blowers have a vapor chamber between the gpu and fins to absorb and distribute the heat. The 1070 and some of the cheaper 1080 blowers (like the MSI blower and Asus blower models) don't have the vapor chamber and get quite a bit warmer, requires high fan rpm (thus more noise) and are just much more difficult to keep cool. So do try to figure out if the blower cooler has a vapor chamber or not, in my experience it makes a big difference.

    I had a decent experience with my GTX 1080 Founders Edition in my Sentry system. I just recently picked up a used EVGA 1080ti SC Black edition which is an open air cooler. I put weatherstripping around the perimeter of the face of the card so it doesn't recycle it's own exhaust. Its ok. It maxes out at 76C with a pretty aggressive fan curve which has the fan at 2400-2600rpm, so honestly it's almost the same noise level as my GTX 1080 Founders Edition. So for a lower TDP GPU like the RTX 2070, if the blower style has a vapor chamber, I say go with that. If it doesn't have a vapor chamber, go with the open air style.
     
  12. Ej24

    Ej24 Gawd

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    Adding to my previous post I thought I'd provide a more specific update.

    I opted not to go with an RTX card, but rather just get a used 1080ti for my Sentry PC. I got the EVGA 1080ti SC Balck with the ICX cooler. I placed closed cell foam rubber weather stripping around the face of the card to keep it from recycling hot air. I have a rather aggressive fan curve in MSI Afterburner that ramps up to ~65-70% fan speed (~2600rpm) at 70C. It maxes out at like 76C like I said before, that's after cleaning and repasting it with Thermal Grizzly Cryonaut. It's definitely louder than I was expecting. I have the fan set to idle at ~25% so idle temps are basically room temp.

    CPU temps changed very little for my delidded undervolted i7-4790K, maxes out at around 70-74C in most games with the LP53-NF-A9x14. However, my undervolt became very unstable. Tons of random bluescreens and crashes in games. I wonder if it has something to do with the beefy GPU pulling more current on the 12v rail of the PSU? Maybe a degree or two C warmer just made it less stable at the lower voltage? I had to go from -0.065V offset to more like -0.04V offset to get back to stability at stock clocks (4.4ghz all core).

    I have two SATA SSDs in my Sentry and the one closer to the CPU now gets crazy warm during gaming ( its also closer to the GPU die). According to HW Monitor, 58C. I've never seen a sata SSD that warm in Sentry. The one closer to the PSU only gets up to ~48C. They can handle it but it's not ideal. I had a game crash due to an "unrecoverable file system error". Strange, maybe a coincidence. Fixing the undervolt on the CPU seems to have fixed the random crashes, so maybe that was it.

    In my experience with a GTX 1060, GTX 1080, and GTX 1080ti in a Sentry pc, I'd say the 180W TDP of the 1080 was the sweet spot. Totally manageable temperatures, high performance, not too loud, didn't have to worry about anything else getting too hot. The 1080ti has netted me maybe 20% high fps at best, but I still can't do 4K60 Ultra in many games and 1440p doesn't always work well with my TV (usually get capped at 30fps, maybe a limitation of my AV receiver? Or the TV?) so most of the time I end up using it at 1080p anyway.

    Long story short, probably avoid the top tier card. Just go with the xx80 card rather than the Ti. I can't imagine an RTX 2080ti in Sentry.
     
  13. Rysen

    Rysen Limp Gawd

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    Here are some images of my fully protable Sentry with 1080p touch monitor and 25mm fan attached. (As well as wireless keyboard/mouse) perfect case for portability. Everything fits in my backpack. Only a regular power cord required to power everything. Turned my PC into an ALL In One PC.
    IMG_20181202_152621[1].jpg IMG_20181202_152722[1].jpg IMG_20181202_152841[1].jpg IMG_20181202_152734[1].jpg
     
  14. Zeerroouu

    Zeerroouu n00b

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    Hi everyone,

    jus wanted to share my build to you guys.. as Im very sure there are someone out there who wants to throw in a AIO cooler for our SENTRY case, but why not an external AIO ? =)) I'm planning to make a custom stand for the radiator so it'll stand nicely beside my SENTRY .

    cheers from Singapore


    Updated photo with a simple custom stand for the 280mm rad
     

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    Last edited: Dec 25, 2018
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  15. JesseJH

    JesseJH n00b

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    Update;

    System specs are the same as above still, no voltage changes to CPU. 9900K seems to run fine without throttling when slightly undervolted and TDP limited to 105W.

    Radeon VII was added. Barely fits, had to purchase low profile, 90 degree 8 pin cables to make it fit. Radeon VII is slightly taller than top of PCIE bracket, barely clears the Zaber Sentry serial # plate screws/rivets.

    The Radeon VII is a pretty hot card, but like the 9900K, I undervolted it from it's stock ~1100mV down to 999mV, and overclocked the 16GB HBM2 from 1000MHz to 1100MHz. Stability tests are ongoing. Difficult to ascertain whether any instabilities found are due to bad voltage settings or immature drivers. Card seems to be stable with these settings. Noise is also reasonable.


    What I've learned;
    If I really want a no-compromises PC within this Sentry,
    10nm Intel CPU with a lower TDP but higher performance than 9900K needs to come out. Can't use LP53+Noctua combo on AMD CPU's. Can't find a comparable cooler that fits in Sentry with full size GPU and is also compatible with AM4.
    NVIDIA's die shrunk future (7nm?) RTX cards comparable to 2080 Ti or better with lower heat output needs to come out.

    As it sits, I'm satisfied with my Sentry. I think I've crammed a lot of performance into it, much more than initially hoped, and my 9900K undervolted and TDP limited seems to still outperform the Ryzen 2700X.

    As a bonus, 9900K seems to run just a tad cooler after Radeon VII was installed. The way the heatsink in that card is shaped, causes the card to blow fresh air down into the choked up CPU compartment.
     
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  16. Ej24

    Ej24 Gawd

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    Very impressive setup! If you're looking for a different CPU cooler you could try the Alpenfohn Blackridge. Its compatible with everything as far as modern platforms go. Though it can be difficult in Sentry if you're using the 2.5in drive mounts. I got it but haven't used it in Sentry yet due to this incompatibility as I'm using both 2.5in mounts.

    Edit: it should physically be compatible with modern sockets from Intel and AMD but whether or not it works well in the particular case of Sentry remains to be proven.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2019
  17. SaperPL

    SaperPL [H]ard|Gawd

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    I'd be careful with such bold statements. I broke two risers testing black ridge and returned it for RMA but got only refunded. There are two main issues of black ridge: it's designed for A4-SFX and it ignores some of restrictions/requirements of ATX form factor around the CPU.
     
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  18. Ej24

    Ej24 Gawd

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    True, I suppose I should clarify, it can be mounted to any modern platform. However it may not be fully compatible with all cases, or motherboard layouts.
     
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  19. REX666

    REX666 n00b

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    One last post of my final setup now the new one is coming out. I did mount the crazy Morpheus cooler to a nano and got the C7 cobber. I bend a sheet of 4mm steel hole plate so airflow and temps are quite good now. Cant recommend the morpheus as it did fit the mounting holes, but the chip is like 5mm further back than the furry model so had to take out the central support to make space for the heatpipes on the back, but it did end up working fine.
     

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  20. riba2233

    riba2233 [H]Lite

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    OMG you're a savage :jimlad:
     
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  21. REX666

    REX666 n00b

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    Yeah power and silent operation requires some effort, it will likely go back to looking nice with the original shield as a NAS server or something some years down the road.
     
  22. Morzy

    Morzy Limp Gawd

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    It's been a while. My mini itx mobo ended up blowing, and kaby lake isn't supported(thanks intel). My little sentry is sitting in a box with it's sfx psu.

    I've been thinking of getting a laptop, but I've also been thinking of rebuilding the sentry, and finding a portable monitor for roughly under $200. I could easily build a system in it that compares to the specs of a ~$1000 laptop.

    What I need is feet for the sentry. Horizontal feet. Has anyone been able to find a competent portable monitor? I see some USB-C ones, and my question is would I be able to use video over USB-C with any mobo that has a USB-C port on the back? Or does the mobo manufacturer have to have something special like thunderbolt?
     
  23. NuclearLemons

    NuclearLemons [H]Lite

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    didn't the sentry come with a set of rubber feet?
     
  24. Morzy

    Morzy Limp Gawd

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    Oh those? Those are lost and gone. XD

    edit: even so, I'd prefer some that are more stable. I don't recall them being firmly attached. Not to harp on the sentry, I love it <.<.
     
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  25. JesseJH

    JesseJH n00b

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    Hello all, I vertically stand my Sentry, and regularly transport it to my girlfriend's house to play on LAN with her computer. One of my Sentry's rubber feet seems to have fallen off at some point. I didn't notice it until a couple of days ago, so it honestly could have happened at any time. I checked the bag that I transport it in, and of course, it's not there. Can't find it anywhere. I assumed, apparently wrongly, that there is adhesive holding these on. I checked the other feet, and alas, they slip right off with almost no effort.

    I guess I'm going to get adhesive to adhere the remaining three.

    I'm not rough with this thing, but given these slide right off, I'm not surprised I lost one at some point.

    Anyways. I need a replacement rubber foot. Can anyone tip me off on where to purchase more? I emailed the Sentry team-- No response yet.
     
  26. ZombiPL

    ZombiPL Limp Gawd

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    We have your email, and you will get answer about your particular situation, but it takes time. Every day we are receiving many emails, and sometimes we just can't answer to everybody within 48 hours. We are replying to emails according to the order in which we received them. Sometimes we get 10-20 emails and you will get your answer faster and sometimes we are processing more of them, and you just have to wait. Right now we are in campaign for new Sentry 2.0, and we are receiving a lot of emails, and it takes time to answer properly to them (as you know, we don't answer with just 'yes' and 'no').

    Probably in the evening you will get your answer. Please be patient.
     
  27. emakar

    emakar n00b

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    Hi all! I'm planning my future sentry 2.0 build and currently investigating cpu cooling options with lower noise level in mind (65w, possibly zen2 ryzen).

    It seems lp53 should give better thermals (thus it should possible to keep rpm low), however this cooler is hard to buy, whereas l9a with fan shroud is expected to bring acceptable thermals as well as low noise level.

    So, I decided to model such a shroud (inspired by this solution - it seems to me velocity thing could indeed optimize airflow while reducing turbulence).
    Unfortunately I don't have appropriate chassis to test it myself, so I'd just share the shroud model with community - I'd be happy if someone could share noise/thermals results (with it or similar solution) :)

    It's first attempt and pretty rough, but it shouldn't be hard to 'manually adjust' it for ram compatibility issues if any (I expect it to fit tightly with 40mm height ram)
     
  28. Gr8Scott

    Gr8Scott [H]Lite

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    That's awesome! I don't have access to a 3D printer, but it looks like that site has printing options. I'd love to print this. I can speak from experience with the l9a, as it is what I have in my Sentry 1.1 now. Even without a fan, it's temps stay around 50-60 under load (vertical position).

    So, I also came to see what people thought on the forum about this little gem. It seems a bit pricey, but, if I'm looking at Sentry dimensions correctly, it would fit the Sentry and almost anything that you needed to connect, if you wanted to travel with it. I've had some good and bad travel stories (mostly around hotel internet), but this, if it works, would make all of my problems with bringing a bunch of extra gear go away! Thoughts? My only guess would be that you would need sufficient rubber feet to allow airflow at the bottom, in order to not starve the GPU for air.
     
  29. Ej24

    Ej24 Gawd

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