Samsung Odyssey+

Discussion in 'VR & Head-Mounted Displays' started by bobzdar, Nov 27, 2018.

  1. bobzdar

    bobzdar [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,596
    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2003
    So I picked up an Odyssey+ to go along with my Rift and HP WMR headset and have played around with it for about a week.

    tldr: Amazing display and serviceable controllers with easier setup.

    The main point of comparison is to the Rift as the HP headset was a cheap backup that I let my kids play minecraft in. It's definitely serviceable and a good cheap intro headset, but the Rift and Odyssey+ are on a different level.

    First, display comparison, and there really isn't one. The Odyssey+ is hands down better. Wider FOV, higher clarity display and almost non-existent sde. There is some visible mura, which replaces the sde as the most noticeable 'artifact' in the display, but the Rift has it as well. It's just tough to notice through the sde and is no worse on the Odyssey+, just more noticeable due to the improved display. There is some motion smearing in high contrast areas. This is only noticeable in certain situations, but I have never noticed it on the Rift and, in the right situations, is pretty noticeable on the Odyssey+.

    Lense wise, the Odyssey+ has vastly reduced god-rays. They are still there but nowhere near as bad as on the Rift. There is some increased banding due to the concentric circles in the lenses, but only in certain situations (like when looking at the sun or clouds in a bright sky in-game). The sweet spot is smaller, so you have to take care to get the headset in the correct position, but once in it the clarity is actually better across the screen. The edges of the view get a little less blurry than the Rift.

    Comfort wise, they're about equal. The RIft is a little more comfortable on the head but the Odyssey+ is much cooler. It doesn't hold heat in at all, unlike the Rift. The Odyssey+ is a little heavier, but in use they're both fine for extended use, I just don't end up with a sweaty face in the Odyssey+. I have VR covers for the Rift, but don't think they'll be necessary for the Odyssey+

    Sound wise both are similar, decent but not great. Neither are worth replacing, imo, but if you wanted to it's more difficult on the Odyssey+ as the headphones are hard wired in. Easy enough to rotate out of the way, but not removable without cutting them. This could come into play if you want to run long extension cables (see other considerations)

    Control wise the Odyssey+ is a step down from the Rift. The tracking is actually quite good, even for games like Onward where you have to reach behind your back and down to your belt for ammo etc. No issues there, but the controllers aren't as comfortable, don't rest in the hand as easily and when, say, pulling the pin on a grenade they hit each other due to the rings sticking out on the WMR controllers. They also don't sense finger location like the Oculus does, which reduces hand presence. The control schemes also aren't always as well thought out - for example using the track pads instead of the joysticks for movement, which is less reliable in my experience. Thoroughly workable, but it's a definite step down. I'm sure some of that can be tweaked, but on the Rift it all just works perfectly.

    Other considerations:
    - while there is no external tracking on the Odyssey+, it is sensitive to low light. You need to have a well lit area for it to track perfectly, otherwise it may work well for a while but then fall apart when you get close to the ground (like crouching or lying prone in Onward). A couple of times when I bent down to pick something up in the game (ammo or a needle) it'd lose it's positional tracking until I stood up again. With good light it doesn't do that, so easily fixable but you may have to add an extra lamp or something to your play area if it's darker.

    - It doesn't deal with extension cables as well as the Rift. I have 10' hdmi and usb extensions for my Rift, which lets me move around my whole room without issue and the cord stays mostly out of the way. Attaching the Odyssey+ to those resulted in the sound turning into a loud screech after between 3 and 10 minutes. I tried an 'active' usb 3.0 cable and same issue. I tried a 6' usb 3.0 extension and the problem went away. This still allows me to use the whole play area but the cable gets in my way from time to time. My solution was to order a Vive breakout box as it boosts the signal, so another consideration if you have a larger play area or your computer is off in the corner (like mine). Of course, I had to buy 3 usb extension cables for the Rift, and with a Vive you have to run power to the trackers (along with using the same breakout box), so still a better setup in that it requires a lot less work/setup even if you want to run a larger play area.

    - Setting up a new play area takes around 30 seconds. Hold the headset up to center it, click center, then trace the play area and it's done. It also remembers multiple play areas, so once you've mapped them out, it should recognize them when you go back, provided it hasn't changed much. Even if it has, it takes 30 seconds to map it.

    - Software wise it's similar to Oculus, you have MR portal and Steam where Oculus has Home and Steam. Extra step if you want to use Revive for Oculus games. Since I already have a couple, I installed it and it worked with most of the Oculus games except Onward. I ended up re-buying it on Steam, lesson learned (buy from Steam, even if it's on sale elsewhere). Both allow easy access to the desktop virtually from within game if necessary - Oculus has higher clarity I think due to Carmack's magic ("Cylindrical TimeWarp Layers") despite the Odyssey having a better display and optics.
     
    noko, boocake and ProfessorUtopia like this.
  2. Adidas4275

    Adidas4275 [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    5,955
    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2006
    I have the HP and a Odyssey and I am no fan of the Odyssey's headphones.

    I have $900 headphones that I would much rather use ..... wish they were easy to remove :(

    But the screen is great. Hoping for better integration with steamVR and WMR as sometimes the two different software solutions do not play as nice together as I would hope.

    But the Odyssey's leather and screen are both very nice compared to the HP.
     
  3. PiERiT

    PiERiT 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,393
    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2010
    I've had the first Odyssey since around April and just picked up the Odyssey+ during the $300 sale last week. It was supposed to arrive Tuesday but didn't show up until today. :(

    The screens are an improvement and I would say they are the best screens in any VR headset, or at least any headset below $1000, so that's good. But it is far less comfortable for me than the original Odyssey, specifically the nose area. There's now also a huge gap that just wasn't there before, so light is always shining through and my surroundings are always visible.

    I'll try some more adjustments later today but I wish they just took the original one and upgraded the screens and left the rest alone. No such luck.
     
    Adidas4275 likes this.
  4. SuperSubZero

    SuperSubZero 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,538
    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2000
    How long is the cable? I have the HP too, was pondering getting the Odyssey+ but my gaming rig is on the floor in a corner. The HP -barely- lets me use all of my available space with the included cable.

    One issue with the HP is I am using 1.2v rechargeable AA's and it's utterly unreliable on detecting their charge. They will randomly falsely say "the batteries are low, disabling haptic" even though they have decent charge. I was gonna get some 1.6v rechargeables and charger but throwing yet more money at this and those batteries look shady as heck.
     
  5. BladeDancer314

    BladeDancer314 [H]Lite

    Messages:
    106
    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2018
    Nice, I have the Oculus and HP also. Thinking I'll give the HP to my son for Xmas and just keep the Rift.
     
    Adidas4275 likes this.
  6. tetris42

    tetris42 [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    4,518
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2014
    Thanks for the review, I'm wanting to upgrade and have been leaning towards either this or the Pimax 5k+, but I want more reviews on both before making a decision.
     
  7. bobzdar

    bobzdar [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,596
    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2003
    It's about the same, but I have extension cables. 6' usb extension worked without a booster, but more than that and I had to add a Vive link box or the sound would go wonky. I have 10' hdmi and usb extensions right now (usb through the link box).
     
  8. tetris42

    tetris42 [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    4,518
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2014
    Regarding the software, are you forced to automatically update it / have the option to go back to an earlier version? The Rift left a bad impression for me where it would sometimes update and break things, I was wondering if there is more control over that sort of thing with the Odyssey.
     
  9. bobzdar

    bobzdar [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,596
    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2003
    It seems to only update via major windows updates (ie 1803 to 1809). Right now my laptop and desktop are on different versions, and 1809 is having a minor issue in the MR portal in that when launched something sets the CPU to max power state which sets it to all core boost instead of letting it boost based on load. This costs some performance in games that are lightly threaded as my laptop can boost to 3.8-3.9 on 3-4 cores but only 3.4 on all 8 cores, which is what it gets stuck to. I can do some tricks to fix that, but it's a pita.

    Steamvr does the same thing by forcing the high performance power plan, but I was able to fix that by completely deleting the power plan. Windows MR (or maybe video card drivers or something) is doing something else in the background that isn't an easy fix.

    Problem there is, you will be forced to the latest windows version when you first install the Mr portal, however once you do that you don't have to upgrade beyond that (hence my desktop still on 1803).

    Not like oculus forcing 2 updates a week at times.
     
  10. equinox654

    equinox654 Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    316
    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2005
    I picked up an Odyssey+ Saturday. I started with a Vive and bought my son a rift.
    The cable the Odyssey comes with is a little short for my play area. I will need extensions.

    Haven't had any issues with tracking other than forgetting the light in my room was off. My Vive wands would sometimes jitter in vr and I have had issues with the rift tracking from cameras being a absolute bitch to setup in my spaces.

    As for the screen. It has been night and day for me. What has bothered me the most in vr is when there is text or floating menus or borders.... besides the text not being legible the lines didn't seem solid because of the screen door effect.
    With no tweaking everything in elite dangerous is legible. Objects seem solid now. Though resolution is still lacking in the distance, at least everything isn't a dithered hollow mess like it was on my Vive.

    Comfort wise it fits me fine and is more comfortable than my Vive and less so than the rift. I put a Vive face cover on it and it made it more comfortable than the rift to me. I can wear my glasses with it with the stock face cover but not with the thinner Vive cover. With the ipd set all the way down I do not have any trouble with the sweet spot.

    At this point I can't recommend anything besides the odyssey if image quality has effect on your immersion.
     
    bobzdar, boocake and ProfessorUtopia like this.
  11. GreenOrbs

    GreenOrbs Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    346
    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2017
    To start off, I just wanted to say that I agree that the Odyssey+ has the best screen of all the reasonably priced VR headsets yet.

    One thing to note about the extensions--I found that if you go too long on the extensions the signal strength on the USB gets too low and then you will have random screeching on the audio. What I found was that <6 ft on an extension was okay but a 10 ft cable resulted in random full volume screeching. An active USB extension cable seems to solve it for me. Of course if your motherboard has a really strong USB solution, people have found that it is okay up to 10 FT on the extension. My cheapo H370M motherboard didn't cut it however.
     
  12. sirmonkey1985

    sirmonkey1985 [H]ard|DCer of the Month - July 2010

    Messages:
    21,097
    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2008
    i just got mine a couple days ago that i ordered on black Friday and have enjoyed it. there's a little light bleed in the nose area but once you're playing a game you don't notice it at all. played subnotica for a couple hours with it yesterday but using an xbox controller because i was to lazy to setup the controllers that came with the odyssey+. next game i want to try it with when i have the time is warthunder. i will say getting things setup is kinda annoying dealing with windows MR portal and steamVR but luckily google is a thing and got it figured out after a few minutes.
     
  13. equinox654

    equinox654 Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    316
    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2005
    You can use wall hangers with the adhesive backing and attach rubber bands to it. It will pull the bottom front close to your face and stop the light bleed.
     
  14. sirmonkey1985

    sirmonkey1985 [H]ard|DCer of the Month - July 2010

    Messages:
    21,097
    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2008
    it doesn't bother me at all, only time i really notice it is after i close a game and the screens go dark.
     
  15. PiERiT

    PiERiT 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,393
    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2010
    Do you have a photo of this? I'm not understanding how it would look and work.

    The light bleed doesn't bother me much but the image is clearer overall if I push the bottom of the headset towards my face. So this would be nice to have.
     
  16. bobzdar

    bobzdar [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,596
    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2003
    So after a month of use my biggest (and only, really) issue is that the facial interface kills my forehead after an hour or so. If I remove it, it's fine but then there's a lot of light bleed. I'm going to try retrofitting an Oculus VR cover as it's the same shape, but not sure it'll fill the gap on the sides.
     
  17. PiERiT

    PiERiT 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,393
    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2010
    I used this with the original Odyssey and it's a lot more comfortable than the one it ships with. It fits the Odyssey+ as well but sometimes it triggers the proximity sensor and turns on the headset when you don't want it to. Gotta be really precise with the placement.

    https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Odyssey-Foam-Replacement-Velour/dp/B0779VGT9W/
     
  18. turbolude

    turbolude Gawd

    Messages:
    784
    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    if anyone has a problem with light bleed on the odyssey plus just turn the damn lights out and get black out curtains problem solved
     
  19. bobzdar

    bobzdar [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,596
    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2003
    Can't do that with windows mr or the headset loses tracking. I had to add lighting to my room for the tracking to work properly.

    It's not a very big deal, the comfort is much more important.
     
  20. sirmonkey1985

    sirmonkey1985 [H]ard|DCer of the Month - July 2010

    Messages:
    21,097
    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2008
    i haven't run into that problem but obviously everyone's head is different, i was surprised how comfortable it ended up being for me after some tweaking since i noticed a lot of people complained about it in reviews.
     
  21. turbolude

    turbolude Gawd

    Messages:
    784
    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    I have to do more testing with the hand tracking in the dark but didn't have a problem sitting in my chair just using the headset
     
  22. Hagrid

    Hagrid [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,952
    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    Have people played Onward with their Odyssey's? How was it? The controllers are close to your HMD when using a scope.
    I have read many sites and they say it works but would not be good for competitive play or it is quirky when not in front of you.
     
  23. bobzdar

    bobzdar [H]ard|Gawd

    Messages:
    1,596
    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2003
    Yes, it works fine in onward. Only issue is occasionally the grenades don’t go where you want them but I had similar issues with touch.
     
  24. RazorWind

    RazorWind 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,183
    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2001
    Bought one of these yesterday when the dude at the door at Fry's handed me a "20% off literally anything you buy that isn't a Samsung TV" coupon.

    I want so badly to like it, but I am not impressed. The screens and optics are WAY better than my Rift, and the setup was reasonably painless, but man alive it's worse than the Rift in basically every other way.

    No matter how I adjust it, it's horribly uncomfortable after 20 to 30 minutes, the built-in headphones kind of suck, the tracking isn't even in the same league, and it doesn't stay put on my head, meaning that if I can get it on comfortably, it moves around if I play games like Beat Saber where you have to move your head around really fast.

    I feel like the comfort issues could be fixed if the goggle part had a hinge so you could adjust the angle of the headband thing, but as it is, the goggles kind of hang out 1/4" from my face if I get the head band on such that it's comfortable. I can get it to sit flat against my face, but then I have to put the band on awkwardly and really tighten it down.

    The tracking doesn't work, then. It uses cameras mounted in the goggles that rely on visible spectrum light.
     
  25. Hagrid

    Hagrid [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,952
    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    Yeah, I am not sure on the Odyssey but the Rift plays well in near dark. I have my screen and 2 small night lights on in the room, with blinds and curtains.

    I have never actually looked at a unit. Does it have the same adjustments as the Rift and the HMD is just off, or?
     
  26. RazorWind

    RazorWind 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,183
    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2001
    The Odyssey just outright doesn't work for room scale in the dark. Its tracking works by having cameras inside the HMD that actually look at the room, the same way a living organism with eyes would figure out its position. In contrast, the Rift HMD and handy-twiddles have LEDs all over them that emit a wavelength that human eyes can't see, and it's these LEDs that the sensors look for. So, because it provides its own illumination, it works in the dark, whereas the Odyssey does not. WMR complains when you put it on in a dark room that it can't figure out its position. It still works OK for cockpit games, though. It's just coarse positioning that it doesn't do well with.

    The Odyssey+ HMD is a halo design, like the PSVR. It doesn't have the top strap like the HTC and Oculus headsets do, and I think this contributes to the discomfort for me. I'm thinking I may stop by a fabric store on the way home from the office and see if I can't get some nylon ribbon to make a third strap out of to help support its weight on top of my head.

    Also, it lacks an adjustment that the Vive and Rift have where you can pivot the goggle part relative to the mounting strap.
     
  27. GreenOrbs

    GreenOrbs Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    346
    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2017
    Yeah, I can see how the ergonomics of the Odyssey+ would be troublesome for some since its not very adjustable. I'm very lucky that it fits me like a glove. My nose goes right up to the flap so there is barely any light leakage. The only adjustment you can make is tightening the band and changing the IPD. I will note that the Odyssey+ has the biggest eye box so of the ones I've tried so I can fit my glasses in comfortably whereas the rift required an insert.

    Lighting is everything for accurate tracking on this one. I've got the overhead fan lights on then a whole other lamp with six 100W equivalent bulbs so my room is like as bright as day when I play (minimal light leakage because my head just happens to fit so well). One thing that might be helpful is that I've noticed that tracking performance seems to go down when the batteries are low at least for me. I have a bunch of rechargeable Eneloop AAs and I put a fresh set in everytime I start a session.
     
  28. Hagrid

    Hagrid [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,952
    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    I would rather have the insert. I sometimes just play a game or two, take a break and then come back, and do it again. Much easier with the insert.
    Dam, every time? They wear down that fast?
     
  29. GreenOrbs

    GreenOrbs Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    346
    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2017
    They don't wear down that fast but I hate having them get low when I play.

    It's like having a flashlight on since the way it works is that the cameras on your headset track the lights on the controllers. If you play 4 hours or so each time you tend to get low on the second go round and then at the end I feel tracking gets wonky even before it's totally drained. I don't replace after a short beat saber session for example.
     
  30. SuperSubZero

    SuperSubZero 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,538
    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2000
    Apparently NiMH rechargeable AA's act weird with the WMR controllers, probably due to their lower voltage. They are known to misreport their charge and act like they are low charge when they aren't. I have some Energizer rechargeables that act fine in other things, but in the WMR controllers they start complaining about being low soon after being installed, and disable haptics and track oddly afterwards. The newer Ni-Zn types behave better but they have more finicky charge babysitting (don't leave them partially charged, etc.).
     
  31. turbolude

    turbolude Gawd

    Messages:
    784
    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2005
    VRCOVER has released a new Leather face pad thats alot thicker and should help all around.
     
  32. RazorWind

    RazorWind 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,183
    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2001
    I was able to improve comfort by making an extra strap that went over my head out of nylon ribbon. You don't have to cinch the ring part down so hard this way.

    If I were a betting man, I'd bet that replacement pad makes a pretty big difference. I found it improved comfort substantially to just remove the original face pad completely, although you then get light leakage from outside of it.

    I ended up returning mine, since I couldn't set the IPD low enough anyway, but it seemed the real issue with comfort for me was that the original face pad pressed on my face right above the bridge of my nose.
     
  33. GreenOrbs

    GreenOrbs Limp Gawd

    Messages:
    346
    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2017
  34. ronan_zj

    ronan_zj n00b

    Messages:
    58
    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2009
    does Odyssey+ fit asian face or ? I am Asian and I had issue to fit Oculus go
     
  35. RazorWind

    RazorWind 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    3,183
    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2001
    I would wager it fits asian people better than it does white guys like me.

    It's too wide for my face with the original face pad, and I couldn't get the IPD adjustment low enough. I need about a 59 or 60, and the lowest it goes is about 63.

    There's not much that can be done about the IPD adjustment range, but a lot of the fit issues can be addressed by replacing the face pad with a different one from VRCover or similar. I also found that adding a center strap to it so it didn't have to clamp so tight helped as well.
     
  36. funkydmunky

    funkydmunky 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,240
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2008
    Samsung has no option to ship to Canada, and B&H which offers free shipping to Canada (over $99) bizarrely notes, "No shipping to Canada." WTF?
    Samsung Canada does not even sell the Odyssey. I can buy an overpriced Odyssey from a number of places, and they all ship to Canada.
    If anyone knows how a brother can buy a sale Odyssey+ that ships up here, please let me know.
     
  37. funkydmunky

    funkydmunky 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,240
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2008
    Well being I found an answer, I'll answer my own question.
    https://www.microsoft.com/en-ca/p/samsung-hmd-odyssey/8n2d0nk20p8m?activetab=pivot:overviewtab
    It is currently on sale from the MS-Store for $450 CA free shipping. This is also $200 off from regular price and about what it would cost for the $299 US with import fee's and shipping.
    I am very happy to get a head-set of this quality at that price. Really a steal when you factor in it has the same display as the Vive-pro plus the anti-SDE tech which reviews rave about.
    I have also ordered a set of face mask replacements from VR Cover. They apparently address the issues of comfort/fit and light-bleed that some experience.
    https://vrcover.com/product/samsung-odyssey-plus-replacement/
     
  38. Hagrid

    Hagrid [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    7,952
    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2006
    I keep hearing bad stuff on the tracking. It would be nice if they could use the Vive's/Rift's sensors as well.
     
  39. funkydmunky

    funkydmunky 2[H]4U

    Messages:
    2,240
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2008
    I have seen some of the same stuff. Seems as though if you are mostly SIM based it is far superior at head tracking for leaning in and such in a cockpit. For standing games with controllers it is said that it will temporarily loose a controller when behind your back. Just takes a little more conscious effort not to do that I guess.
    The inside-out tracking as it is called has the benefit of no satellite/lighthouse sensors so it is far more portable, if that is a need, which it is of mine.
    That said there are apparently hacks to run a Rift/Vive set-up. I haven't read much into it yet.
     
  40. odditory

    odditory [H]ardness Supreme

    Messages:
    5,097
    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2007
    This is indeed a phenomenal headset, and hands down the best VR display at this pricepoint. I owned both Vive and Rift for quite a long time but ultimately sold them because the SDE made me not want to VR, but I loved VR as a tech and knew I'd return to it with Gen 2 HMD's. Odyssey+ isn't Gen2, but its a great Gen 1.5 placeholder until then.

    One thing to note is that it requires a powerful GPU to really get the most out of the display. The clearest image quality is at around 200% SuperSampling, determined after many hours of research and tweaking. SteamVR will adjust on the fly by default but I like to keep it pegged at 200. 140 is kind of the minimum or image is needlessly blurry. My GTX 1060 wasn't cutting it so I had to upgrade. To monitor and really dial in SuperSampling on a per-app basis for your particular H/W configuration (CPU/GPU), the "fpsVR" app on Steam ($3.99) is absolutely critical.

    I do scratch my head at WMR as a platform since its turning out exactly as predicted -- yet another Microsoft half ass effort like the windows store that they don't bother creating content for. The Mixed Reality Portal app always sitting there resident in addition to SteamVR just creates clutter and confusion - its a glorified setup wizard that never leaves. But at least there are occasional minor usability improvements (though they're tied to new windows builds - ugh).

    Bottom line: Odyssey+, I love this thing and its the first HMD I can say that about, the first HMD I have no doubts about keeping.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2019