Received my 3008WFP today.

shazza

Weaksauce
Joined
Mar 7, 2007
Messages
84
Received my 3008 ... I don't seem to have the backlight issues, and no dead pixels. Colors look good after slight adjustment.

Just to confirm my understanding of HDCP compatibility with this monitor ... my 8800 GTX video cards, although supposedly HDCP compliant - are not HDCP compliant over the Dual-DVI cable. So, in order to take advantage of my new LG Blu-ray/HD-DVD drive, I'll need to step down to a different card ... or hook up a different cable ???
 

Snowdog

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Apr 22, 2006
Messages
11,262
Yeah, you should be able to drive it with a single link DVI to 1920x1080p and have the monitor upscale it. It shouldn't look much different than having your computer scale it, but it is a PITA to switch cables to watch a movie.

This is really a lame bit of DRM.
 

struggles

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
235
Received my 3008 ... I don't seem to have the backlight issues, and no dead pixels. Colors look good after slight adjustment.

Just to confirm my understanding of HDCP compatibility with this monitor ... my 8800 GTX video cards, although supposedly HDCP compliant - are not HDCP compliant over the Dual-DVI cable. So, in order to take advantage of my new LG Blu-ray/HD-DVD drive, I'll need to step down to a different card ... or hook up a different cable ???

I am happy for you, glad to hear that we are the only ones so far. Enjoy the monitor, it is great.
 
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
58
I just received a call from Dell saying my replacement would not be coming in the next week. They told me they are back ordered for at least 15 business days.

This makes sense given the delay people are now reporting regarding trying to order this LCD screen.

Curious if this quality control on level of back light bleed is something that is already in the process of being addressed.

Having them pay for shipping to and from on these monitors can't be great for their profit.

Duhokay when is your replacement expected?
 

struggles

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
235
Nothing heard as of yet. I am assuming the same as you, I myself have thought something was going on the day after I placed my original order. The salesman told me everything was in stock, I get an email 24 hours later saying my delivery date was postponed to 2 plus weeks later. I immediately canceled and magically they managed to ship it the next day. There is no way they could have been back ordered because no one else had confirmed delivery on forums etc who had placed orders well before me. I am not sure, I just hope they can solve this issue, cause as far as everything else goes I am satisfied.
 

a ronin

Gawd
Joined
Jan 29, 2003
Messages
782
UNRELATED TOPIC: Do you guys know how to take the VESA plate OFF? I can't seem to find any tools at my disposal to take care of it; at first glance, I thought it was Allen Keys but these have a star edge to them.

Thanks very much.
 

daveswantek

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Oct 30, 2007
Messages
1,231
UNRELATED TOPIC: Do you guys know how to take the VESA plate OFF? I can't seem to find any tools at my disposal to take care of it; at first glance, I thought it was Allen Keys but these have a star edge to them.

Thanks very much.

Go to Sears and look at their driver sets; you should find them with the star pattern.

Best of luck

Dave
 
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
58
UNRELATED TOPIC: Do you guys know how to take the VESA plate OFF? I can't seem to find any tools at my disposal to take care of it; at first glance, I thought it was Allen Keys but these have a star edge to them.

Thanks very much.

It is a Torx screw.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_10664

Most any generic driver and bit set will contain a variety of the most popular Torx driver bits. (Walmart, HomeDepot, Lowes, etc..)

Any drill bit/driver set purchased in the last 10 years should probably have several of the Torx bits.
 

2gd4u

n00b
Joined
Feb 2, 2008
Messages
6
I just ordered my 3008WFP yesterday, however I'll have to wait more than 2 months before my screen is delivered :(

Delivery is set to 07.04.08
 

shazza

Weaksauce
Joined
Mar 7, 2007
Messages
84
2 months? Is that in the US (haven't checked the "out of stock thread" recently).

Glad I got mine ... no issues at all that I've found so far. While I will use it mostly for gaming and work applications, also played some Blu-ray today ... all good so far. The ONLY negative I've found is, I wish it would go lower on the height adjustment. The 2707 actually goes almost down to the desktop.
 

struggles

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
235
shazza: great to hear that you got a good one, has it performed to your expectations in gaming, how do you like it compared to the 3007 in overall performance? Do you guys think you can post pics of your backlight who dont seem to have problems? I would just like to to compare and see what we are looking at.

2 months is unbelievable wait time, something must have happened with production. I will tell you that something is definitely going on behind the scenes that they did not tell the salesmen. All these delays along with my very odd buying experience. Hopefully it all gets sorted out. I am assuming at this rate we will not get our replacements for some time.
 

Vega

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Oct 12, 2004
Messages
7,059
No one has yet posted any input lag numbers for this screen?
 

clark_carty

Weaksauce
Joined
Aug 1, 2004
Messages
127
Received my 3008 ... I don't seem to have the backlight issues, and no dead pixels. Colors look good after slight adjustment.

Just to confirm my understanding of HDCP compatibility with this monitor ... my 8800 GTX video cards, although supposedly HDCP compliant - are not HDCP compliant over the Dual-DVI cable. So, in order to take advantage of my new LG Blu-ray/HD-DVD drive, I'll need to step down to a different card ... or hook up a different cable ???

There's an even bigger issue going around in the Dell Forums. Apparently the 3008 isn't HDCP compatible when driven with dual link DVI. This has nothing to do with the video cards, it's in the monitor. They claim the 3007 doesn't have the issue.
 

shazza

Weaksauce
Joined
Mar 7, 2007
Messages
84
There's an even bigger issue going around in the Dell Forums. Apparently the 3008 isn't HDCP compatible when driven with dual link DVI. This has nothing to do with the video cards, it's in the monitor. They claim the 3007 doesn't have the issue.


Hmmnnn ... I wasn't expecting the 3008 to be HDCP compatible with dual link DVI, at least not with my 8800 GTX cards. I'm using a known software fix to play Blu-ray and HD-DVD disks (all purchased commercial disks). Guess we'll have to wait and see the final outcome.

Did some gaming yesterday, and no noticeable lag that I could see. BUT, I am not a good judge of this. I generally play only at easy/medium settings, and I thoroughly enjoyed BIOSHOCK, COD4 and even Crysis on a Dell 2707, which supposedly has relatively poor ratings for lag.
 

clark_carty

Weaksauce
Joined
Aug 1, 2004
Messages
127
Hmmnnn ... I wasn't expecting the 3008 to be HDCP compatible with dual link DVI, at least not with my 8800 GTX cards. I'm using a known software fix to play Blu-ray and HD-DVD disks (all purchased commercial disks). Guess we'll have to wait and see the final outcome.

Dell is saying to either reduce your resolution to single link (1920x1080), or use display port. There are cards out there that will do dual link DVI and HDCP (it's a shame the 8800GTX won't, I have one too), and the 3007 supports it. So does the Gateway XHD3000.

A few other quirks I've discovered. The display port connector is only video. It won't connect internally to the speaker output ports nor to the USB ports. Display Port was hailed as the connector that contained everything, but apparently it's too new for Dell to implement this now.

I was on the fence for getting either the Gateway or the Dell. I think I'll see what HP comes out with, with a scalar, or I'll just wait this round out.
 

beelzibub

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jul 11, 2007
Messages
153
Alright, this is new news to me....my GTX won't play Blu-ray disks on a 3008 if I end up getting one? It will work on other monitors that are HDCP compatible right?

Shazza: Where can I learn about this known software fix that you use?
 

shazza

Weaksauce
Joined
Mar 7, 2007
Messages
84
I'm using AnyDVD HD and the LG Blu-ray/HD-DVD optical drive in my PC (with the bundled software ... CYBERDVD, I think it is). Without the AnyDVD software, Blu-ray playback will start, but then stop after a few seconds ... this is with the Dual-DVI cable connected. With AnyDVD, you just start that program up, and it runs in the background and you play your HD disk as normal.
 

TheGooch69

Gawd
Joined
Dec 7, 2007
Messages
633
I am extremely interested in the level of input lag this display puts out. You say you didn't notice any playing Xbox360 and that's great. What about PC games?
 

clark_carty

Weaksauce
Joined
Aug 1, 2004
Messages
127
Alright, this is new news to me....my GTX won't play Blu-ray disks on a 3008 if I end up getting one? It will work on other monitors that are HDCP compatible right?

Shazza: Where can I learn about this known software fix that you use?

8800GTX (and Ultra) will only do HDCP over single link DVI to any 30 monitor (which means no 2560x1600 with HDCP). I believe that most nVidia cards that came after them can do it (meaning all of the lower end cards (8800GT, 8600GT). Be sure to search and get specific details on the specific card as I am not claiming to be the expert here.

The Dell 3008WFP won't do dual link DVI with HDCP. People are starting to complain and moan about it in the forums. Dell says if you want 2560x1600 with HDCP it has to be display port.

The Gateway doesn't have this problem since it doesn't have display port. I'm interested to see what the Samsung 305T+ can do. It sounds to me like it might be a limitation of the various scalar chips used. Would need to look at the data sheets to be sure.
 

Frosteh

2[H]4U
Joined
Nov 30, 2004
Messages
3,664
Is it safe to say then, that the 3007 is still one of the better quality 30" monitors around if you are happy with just a DL-DVI Input?
 

Yelnats

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jun 4, 2006
Messages
234
Is it safe to say then, that the 3007 is still one of the better quality 30" monitors around if you are happy with just a DL-DVI Input?

The 3007 might actually be better if you don't want the extra inputs. The lower gamut will be better for most applications... things won't be over-saturated. Also, you may be less likely to get a panel with backlight bleeding issues, as the 3007 has been around for longer and has gone through some revisions.
 

Frosteh

2[H]4U
Joined
Nov 30, 2004
Messages
3,664
Yeah I already have the higher colour gamut model of the 3007, just sort of clarifying if my purchase was a good one or not, I'm more than happy with just the one input, it's a PC monitor not a TV.
 

Yelnats

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jun 4, 2006
Messages
234
Yeah I already have the higher colour gamut model of the 3007, just sort of clarifying if my purchase was a good one or not, I'm more than happy with just the one input, it's a PC monitor not a TV.

Even the 3007WFP-HC has a smaller gamut than the 3008WFP, so it should be better in that regard. The 3008 may have slightly less ghosting, but I can't confirm that.

By the time all the backlight bleed issues of the 3008 are fixed, the 3009 will be announced :)
 

Exobyte

n00b
Joined
Feb 4, 2008
Messages
3
The 3007 might actually be better if you don't want the extra inputs. The lower gamut will be better for most applications... things won't be over-saturated. Also, you may be less likely to get a panel with backlight bleeding issues, as the 3007 has been around for longer and has gone through some revisions.

Even the 3007WFP-HC has a smaller gamut than the 3008WFP, so it should be better in that regard. The 3008 may have slightly less ghosting, but I can't confirm that.

Yelnats stop spreading c**p. Lower color gamut is worser for everything. Do you even know what NTSC color gamut is?

High NTSC color gamut means the monitor can display more colors. You act as if it's the opposite. It does not mean saturated colors either, just more colors, and more accurate colors. It would be amazingly stupid for a designer (where color accuracy matters) to choose any variant of the 3007 over the 3008 is cost is not a problem.

With low color gamut displays, apart from not being able to display colors as accurately, they are particularly bad with reds. With LCD tech until recently it has not been able to reproduce reds very well. They have a murky orange tint to them.

Example:
My Dell 3008 on left, Dell 2405 on right:
colour.jpg


The Dell 2405 is a good monitor but the 3008 c**ps all over it with it's 117% color gamut, and you can see from the photo the 2405 has the classic LCD murky orange tinted red. Notice how the reds are far better on the 3008, and how the colors each stand out more from each other, color shirts are more noticable. In every possible way it is better display.


By the time all the backlight bleed issues of the 3008 are fixed, the 3009 will be announced :)

The 3007 also had backlight bleeding issues, and did it take Dell so long to fix it that the 3008 was almost out? No. So what makes you say that?
And for the record my 3008 has no backlight bleeding.

In the future Yelnats if you dont know what you're talking about it's best to say nothing.
 

grdh20

Gawd
Joined
Feb 19, 2001
Messages
583
Hmmm . . from this thread alone, the quality control on these seems iffy at best. I hope the NEC MultiSync LCD3090WQXi fairs better.
 

enyceexdanny

2[H]4U
Joined
Sep 22, 2003
Messages
2,618
Yelnats stop spreading c**p. Lower color gamut is worser for everything. Do you even know what NTSC color gamut is?

High NTSC color gamut means the monitor can display more colors. You act as if it's the opposite. It does not mean saturated colors either, just more colors, and more accurate colors. It would be amazingly stupid for a designer (where color accuracy matters) to choose any variant of the 3007 over the 3008 is cost is not a problem.

With low color gamut displays, apart from not being able to display colors as accurately, they are particularly bad with reds. With LCD tech until recently it has not been able to reproduce reds very well. They have a murky orange tint to them.



The Dell 2405 is a good monitor but the 3008 c**ps all over it with it's 117% color gamut, and you can see from the photo the 2405 has the classic LCD murky orange tinted red. Notice how the reds are far better on the 3008, and how the colors each stand out more from each other, color shirts are more noticable. In every possible way it is better display.




The 3007 also had backlight bleeding issues, and did it take Dell so long to fix it that the 3008 was almost out? No. So what makes you say that?
And for the record my 3008 has no backlight bleeding.

In the future Yelnats if you dont know what you're talking about it's best to say nothing.

You're free to express your own opinions, but there's no need to accuse someone of "spreading crap" and that they should say nothing.

First of all, we all know that higher color gamut is better in most cases. BUT the difference is barely noticeable, negligible at best at most scenarios. Sure, the extra gamut provides better accuracy for graphic professionals - but for most users, it doesn't justify the premium in price.

It would be amazingly stupid for a designer (where color accuracy matters) to choose any variant of the 3007 over the 3008 is cost is not a problem.

Where color accuracy matters and if cost is not an issue, both displays won't even catch a glimpse of their attention.

It does not mean saturated colors either, just more colors, and more accurate colors.

The higher the gamut, colors generally look more saturated. It seems that you don't really know what the term is. Higher saturatation doesn't necessarily mean bad or inaccurate. It just means that the color intensity is higher.

And for the record my 3008 has no backlight bleeding.

I can almost guarantee that there will be some backlight bleeding on your display. Even if it may be minimal at most. There are no lcd displays yet that does not exhibit any backlight bleeding. It's just the way they're currently built. Sure, there are some that are worse than others - but it's there on all monitors. I'm pretty sure if you did some thorough testing, you'll find some.
 

Exobyte

n00b
Joined
Feb 4, 2008
Messages
3
You're free to express your own opinions, but there's no need to accuse someone of "spreading crap" and that they should say nothing.

First of all, we all know that higher color gamut is better in most cases. BUT the difference is barely noticeable, negligible at best at most scenarios. Sure, the extra gamut provides better accuracy for graphic professionals - but for most users, it doesn't justify the premium in price.


Where color accuracy matters and if cost is not an issue, both displays won't even catch a glimpse of their attention.


The higher the gamut, colors generally look more saturated. It seems that you don't really know what the term is. Higher saturatation doesn't necessarily mean bad or inaccurate. It just means that the color intensity is higher.

I can almost guarantee that there will be some backlight bleeding on your display. Even if it may be minimal at most. There are no lcd displays yet that does not exhibit any backlight bleeding. It's just the way they're currently built. Sure, there are some that are worse than others - but it's there on all monitors. I'm pretty sure if you did some thorough testing, you'll find some.

Seems like your just saying all that because i've said something that annoyed you so your trying to nit pick the most tiny things from my post.

First of all, we all know that higher color gamut is better in most cases.

..Thats funny because it clearly seems Yelnats dont know this. I dont know why you're defending his posts anyway, they clearly are misleading crap - i dont mean to sound mean, but they are. You think that saying lower color gamut is a better thing is correct? I mean go read them... how can anyone who knows anything about this stuff think they are anything but misleading and wrong.

The difference from the usual 75 - 80% NTSC color gamut on most monitors, like my 2405 compared to the 3008 is very noticeable. Even friends that know nothing about this stuff have said when immediately entering the room "that smaller monitors colors look crap" ... even though they are infact good for LCD, but the 3008 is so much better anyone can instantly see it. It's finally got to point with the 3008 where it's up there with the best CRT's.

Obviously i know what color saturation is. Who doesn't? If a display with a higher color gamut is configured properly the colors will look fine. Theres also the possibility that after using an older LCD that cannot reproduce colors properly and as vibrantly they would have got used to washed out dull colors, so a LCD with the higher gamut may look saturated to someone who just switched, when it's actually not.

And yes all LCD have backlight bleeding to some extent, but my 3008's bleed is so ridiculously small i may aswell just say it has none.
 

Deusfaux

Gawd
Joined
Apr 11, 2006
Messages
756
Sure, the extra gamut provides better accuracy for graphic professionals - but for most users, it doesn't justify the premium in price.

It's a good thing this monitor has several other superior aspects to it than just color gamut then, hey.
 

Yelnats

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jun 4, 2006
Messages
234
High NTSC color gamut means the monitor can display more colors. You act as if it's the opposite.
Your 3008WFP displays 16777216 colors, my 2007WFP displays 16777216 colors. The 3007WFP-HC displays 16777216 colors.

It does not mean saturated colors either, just more colors, and more accurate colors.
The same number of colors are spread further apart from each other, meaning that all non-gray colors get more saturated. Because the colors are further apart you won't have as many colors to choose from when calibrating, so it may be less accurate for most colors.

It would be amazingly stupid for a designer (where color accuracy matters) to choose any variant of the 3007 over the 3008 is cost is not a problem.
Any designer that needed something better than a 3007 would skip over the 3008 and get a monitor with a 12-bit LUT.


With low color gamut displays, apart from not being able to display colors as accurately, they are particularly bad with reds. With LCD tech until recently it has not been able to reproduce reds very well. They have a murky orange tint to them.

99% of the graphics you see on your monitor were designed by people using a monitor with a color gamut smaller than the 3008. You see the images more saturated than the designer intended. If everyone had the same monitor, this would not be a problem.

Example:
My Dell 3008 on left, Dell 2405 on right:.

Pictures like this are worthless... the one on the left is more blue and saturated, how do I know if that is correct? Did you calibrate your monitors? What is the camera white balanced to?

The Dell 2405 is a good monitor.
I had one, I thought it was quite bad. It crushed blacks when looking straight on. It had bad input lag. It had colored inversed ghosting.

The 3007 also had backlight bleeding issues, and did it take Dell so long to fix it that the 3008 was almost out? No. So what makes you say that?
And for the record my 3008 has no backlight bleeding.

My comment was in jest. You can always be waiting until the next revision comes out. There will always be a new revision that fixes some things and makes other things worse.
 

Exobyte

n00b
Joined
Feb 4, 2008
Messages
3
99% of the graphics you see on your monitor were designed by people using a monitor with a color gamut smaller than the 3008. You see the images more saturated than the designer intended. If everyone had the same monitor, this would not be a problem.

I agree to some extent. But also some designers still use CRT's, and one of the reasons is because the higher end ones can produce superior colors to LCD monitors. Atleast the lower gamut ones. With the new higher gamut LCD's colors are starting to look how they should, and how they do on professional CRT's. So for the designers that still use these CRT's you can see things how they were intended.


Pictures like this are worthless... the one on the left is more blue and saturated, how do I know if that is correct? Did you calibrate your monitors? What is the camera white balanced to?

Yes the 3008 on the left has more blue, because this is how the the picture actually looks, and it's not saturated at all.
The monitors have both been carefully calibrated with software, and the photo was taken with a Canon SLR, i spent quite a bit of time getting the image to look how it does when actually viewing the monitors yourself, it's very accurate for a photo.
The 2405 on the right simply cannot reproduce colours that the 3008 can. No matter what i do it will not produce that wine-red color (a known fact with lower gamut LCD's - they simply cannot do it).
Even with pure white or pure black lower gamut displays cannot do them as well. I have a lot of LCD monitors as i often sell them, none of the lower gamut ones can produce white or black as accurate as higher gamut monitors. For instance white will have a tint of yellow, orange or sometimes blue. But on the 3008 it's pure white.
One of the main reasons for the better colors and whites/blacks is that these monitors have improved back lighting. It's a lot closer to LED back lighting.

It seems as if your'd had a bad experience with a single higher gamut monitor and are basing you view on this.
Lower gamut LCD monitors are inferior, and over the next couple of years more and more new LCD monitors will be higher gamut until it gets to the point where they all are. And the percentage of gamut colors will keep increasing aswell.
 

Luthorcrow

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Dec 21, 2002
Messages
1,241
Exobyte

You should temper your claims. So far you've done nothing but display a high level misunderstanding and misrepresent the case for or against high gamut vs low gamut. You should also avoid insulting others that seem to have a much better grasp of the issues than you.

Let's clear up some issues up.

First let's clarify an issue that gets confused quite a bit. It's not about whether your display is standard sRGB or one of several degrees of wide gamut, its whether you are displaying the current image in the correct color space and whether that display is capable of displaying all of those colors in that color space. All PC content (web, games, etc) is designed for sRGB color space. As a result for PC content and the Internet, sRGB is the only correct color space. Your monitor by default will display the native color space of your monitor outside of color aware programs (Windows is not coloraware). This means that the majority of PC content, which is sRGB (72%) will be displayed in whatever the none standard color space is of your wide gamut monitor. Generally this effect is described as being "over saturated" which in fact is not correct. What is actually happening is the same RGB values do not correspond to the same shade of a color between different color spaces. Because your monitor is not sRGB and in fact does not correspond to any defined color space used by designers (aRGB, etc) the wrong colors shades are displayed for every RGB value.

The only way this would not be true is if either you are using a color aware program such as Photoshop, Firefox 3 beta (if you have it enabled) or if you are using a HDTV device like a PS3, Xbox 360.

The red image you used as example does not look more red because there are more colors to be displayed on your wide gamut monitor or because the other monitor was missing colors (assuming this image is sRGB is likely), it simply that the colors on your wide gamut monitor are a different hue than the designer intended.


...First of all, we all know that higher color gamut is better in most cases. BUT the difference is barely noticeable, negligible at best at most scenarios. Sure, the extra gamut provides better accuracy for graphic professionals - .

That simply is just not true but is often an assumed in these discussions. The only scenario that a wide gamut monitor is more accurate would be for designing for print in cases where a wider gamut such as aRGB or ProRGB were being used. Again, it is about matching the color space to the image. Gamut only matters if you are trying to work on an image that exceeds your current gamut.

Web designers and others that design images for an electronic medium would see no advantage to the wider gamut monitor.

You can pretty much sum it up this way for wide gamut

PRO
  1. Better for color accurate print (which applies to about 1% of computer users).
  2. Better for HDTV content. This is the real driver for wide gamut and the only reason that is being widely adopted on consumer products. That said, if you are not someone that hooks up an Xbox360 or BlueRay player to their PC, then it would be moot.

CON
  1. All colors for 99% PC content is displayed in correctly with every single RGB value being mapped to the in correct color shade (over saturated). Because the color gamuts vary between monitors your colors are in any where between 22-45% off.
  2. Their potential issues with wider gamuts and 8 bit displays as designers generally use 16 bit for wider gamuts. This could make color correction an issue. Greater than 8bit data path for video would be a better match for wider gamuts. Particularly as they rise.

Wide gamuts in theory are a good thing. But only if they are matched with a standard which can be relied upon to display colors consistently between different devices and displays. Which of course is the reason why sRGB exists. Eventually gamuts will exceed the human color range. Microsoft, W3C, etc already have a standard ready for that, its called scRGB and it exceeds the human by a wide degree.

Until a new standard exists, the average user should be "buyer beware." Until a new color standard is implemented, you are jumping off a cliff with no parachute.
 

Mastakill

Limp Gawd
Joined
Apr 19, 2007
Messages
188
you explained wide gamut exactly as i feared it would be :(

a few questions arise:

1) there exists no OS at all yet that is color aware? (even not a linux distro)
2) are there plans to implement color awarness in the next windows (with all those different gamut monitors appearing on the market, it would seem usefull, no?)
3) IF a color aware OS would exist, would it be able to "correctly" map content "meant for one specific gamut" to another gamut? or is this too difficult? (I also suppose images hardly contain info about what gamut they are supposed to be viewed in)
 

Mastakill

Limp Gawd
Joined
Apr 19, 2007
Messages
188
and the biggest issue of this all is probably that 90% of the graphic designers do not know this

and they are all whining to get a high color gamut monitor from their bosses to design their web images in a high color gamut photoshop, not knowing that no one will ever see them correctly, even not on a high color gamut monitor (not considering the 0.0000001% of people using firefox 3 beta)
 

-Dragon-

2[H]4U
Joined
Apr 6, 2007
Messages
2,316
I picked up the 3007HC for $1050, can't imagine the 3008 is in any way worth $300-900 more. But I'm sure I speak for everybody in the thread when I say the worst 30" is better than anything else XD
 

spock

Gawd
Joined
Apr 5, 2000
Messages
521
Don't CRTs exceed the sRGB colour space? Wouldn't they also have these 'problems' with extended gamut?

Also, don't most of these LCD's have an sRGB mode that brings them (technically) back into calibration? That way the choice would be up to the user.
 

enyceexdanny

2[H]4U
Joined
Sep 22, 2003
Messages
2,618
Luthorcrow, nice way to sum it up.
Although I never implied that it is beneficial for electronic medium.
 

enyceexdanny

2[H]4U
Joined
Sep 22, 2003
Messages
2,618
Don't CRTs exceed the sRGB colour space? Wouldn't they also have these 'problems' with extended gamut?

Also, don't most of these LCD's have an sRGB mode that brings them (technically) back into calibration? That way the choice would be up to the user.

CRT covers a significant portion of the visible color space.

I'm not totally sure what you mean by "back into calibration" but from my understanding, no - there are no options within the display that lets you cover a larger portion of the color space due to the fact that the gamut is limited to the spectrum of the backlight.
 

Yelnats

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jun 4, 2006
Messages
234
Lower gamut LCD monitors are inferior, and over the next couple of years more and more new LCD monitors will be higher gamut until it gets to the point where they all are. And the percentage of gamut colors will keep increasing aswell.

One specification being better does not mean that the other specifications are there to back it up. IPS panels have a lower contrast ratio than PVA or TN panels, but they are still much better overall.

Once other technology and standards match up to the wider gamut specifications, wide gamut will be better. Right now, the software and hardware support isn't there to manage a different gamut well. (for most computer uses)
 

Luthorcrow

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Dec 21, 2002
Messages
1,241
Don't CRTs exceed the sRGB colour space? Wouldn't they also have these 'problems' with extended gamut?.
To my knowledge none of the CRTs were wide gamut. Somebody feel free to correct but I am pretty sure that is accurate.

Also, don't most of these LCD's have an sRGB mode that brings them (technically) back into calibration? That way the choice would be up to the user.
Yes, the sRGB mode would display the correct color space and it is better than nothing but its not the best solution because it is a preset. What you would really want is to have a profiled your monitor with a hardware calibrator and then to have the color profile applied while using the custom profile. No monitor is color correct of the box so having that custom profile is pretty important.

That said, for the average user, assuming their gamma is set to 2.2 with the preset would be fine.


and the biggest issue of this all is probably that 90% of the graphic designers do not know this

and they are all whining to get a high color gamut monitor from their bosses to design their web images in a high color gamut photoshop, not knowing that no one will ever see them correctly, even not on a high color gamut monitor (not considering the 0.0000001% of people using firefox 3 beta)
The designers I know are all aware of the issue and use sRGB LCDs for that very reason. The designers that I know that want wide gamut are all print designers.

If a designer is not aware of this issue, they should retire now or go take a class color management.

you explained wide gamut exactly as i feared it would be...
Apple has more color management options but to be honest I don't use that OS. Does anyone know?

But yes, if an OS was color aware, with the right color management settings this would not be an issue. That said, I think that is a highly unlikely scenario. I don’t think the solution that Firefox is experimenting with will catch on. The reason the real push behind wide gamut is HDTV and none PC media. Color standards are designed with both the web (PC) and HDTV in mind.

W3C, Microsoft and those that set the color standards for the web and electronic media are all about standards. Each color standard has been designed to be backward compatible with sRGB. The HDTV color standard has its primary RGB values matched with sRGB to ensure that sRGB content will display correctly on a HDTV wide gamut device. The same is true for the future standard scRGB (which vastly exceeds visual color range). If something happens in the near future my guess would be an adoption of the HDTV color standard as it would require no change for the web but would still support the wider gamut of the new HDTV media content.

Keep in mind the wide screen and wide gamut market is a tiny fraction of the user installed user base. I am sure as the gamuts rise and more users buy new LCDs we will see a consumer push to fix the problem.
 

struggles

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
235
Wow what happened here. For those with no backlight issues can you please post some pics? I am very curious as to how bad my monitor really is. It would be greatly appreciated.
 
Top