New SFF gamer case: Mini ITX

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Jack Flash said:
Chances are that people are going to buy a new DVD drive for this case (How many already have a slim drive?) And they're honestly not that much more expensive than tray drives.
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Yeah, but some people are not going to want a slot loader and some may already have a slim drive they've scavenged from a laptop or other place. It's better to sacrifice a bit of looks to accommodate the most users than it would be to redesign it and increase the cost of the product.

Jask Frost said:
I may speak for a minority, but I wouldn't be terribly heart broken seeing the front I/O ports removed entirely, or to a lesser extent losing the headphone and microphone jacks.
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This case is first and foremost a gaming case, and I know I wouldn't like it too much if any of the front I/O's were removed especially since I like to plug and unplug my headset (while keeping my main speakers plugged in) and other various usb attachments (gamepads, usb drives) a lot.

Honestly, you are really buying this case to stick high powered gaming components in it, and I for one really only care about the functionality of it. Looks matter somewhat, but I wouldn't remove any functionality/flexibility just to increase the looks of it. But of course, that's just my opinion.
 
I'd be ok with mic ports up front, if they were simply black (or otherwise matched the case as possible) instead of color coded. I'd say that I'd want USB up front, but it would really stick out. Can we get USB ports that are case colored as well?

And I'm all about stealth. The cleaner it looks, the better.
 
Looks pretty cool. I cant really see this costing anywhere near how much Da Box costs. Also that dvd slot looks awkward. Maybe have a piece that makes it look stealth. And how will big heat sinks fit?
 
So here is my feedback

1, Make it USB3 on those front ports. The cost shouldn't be that much of a factor. Also, one of your main competitors is Lian-Li. They are upgrading all the front ports with the new standard.
2, Make the back grills for fans removable. Im thinking a lot of people are going to cut these out. Or at least make the holes bigger... use hexagons like the other companies.
3, Rubber feet?
4, +1 to the guy that wanted better fanmounts so we can use rubber plugs instead of screws.
5, The screws on the sides look terrible. But im guessing this is just a prototype thing.
6, Would it be possible to move the power cord next to the MB? This would mean more room and maybe the ability to use bigger fans instead of the 80mm at the back. Hard to tell from the pictures.
7, Is there nowhere to gain that extra space so that its 1x2,5SSD and 2x3,5HDD? I just need one SSD for speed... but more HDD for storage.
8, Dustfilters? Are there any?
9, Id rather have the powerbutton on the front.

I like where this is going... but right now Im afraid that case might be a bit noisy.
 
Fan mount holes in the back for the 80mm fans look fine. They look like they're countersunk, and rubber fan mounts fit just fine.

Now the ones on the side could be a problem. If it's like the micro ATX Da Box, rubber fan mounts stick out a bit too far and hinder closing the case. I used rubber HDD mounting grommets on the other side, and it works quite well.
 
I agree with Bakkone on the back grills, if I ever get one, I'll cut it out, its resistive for my tastes

As for my analysis, it seems there are no ways of putting an H50 on this, the 2 x 120mm fans are close to the proc socket and the PSU
 
Right, about the optical drive front again. Despite many people apparently preferring slot-loading in this thread, I'd wager that by far a majority will use a tray-loading drive in this case, just like in other ITX cases. Also I don't know about the USA or so, but when people say the price "isn't that different"... well, over here in Finland you pay over double for a slot-loading DVD-RW drive compared to a tray-loading one. For Blu-ray, the cost increase is also about 50 euros or so. It's not really insignificant. Having the choice to use one is one thing, but being forced to? Bad idea. Not only is it the price either, some people simply don't like slot-loaders. Personally I'd in fact prefer one, but the cost differential kept me from getting one when I bought my slim BD drive.
 
Bakkone said:
So here is my feedback

1, Make it USB3 on those front ports. The cost shouldn't be that much of a factor. Also, one of your main competitors is Lian-Li. They are upgrading all the front ports with the new standard.
2, Make the back grills for fans removable. Im thinking a lot of people are going to cut these out. Or at least make the holes bigger... use hexagons like the other companies.
3, Rubber feet?
4, +1 to the guy that wanted better fanmounts so we can use rubber plugs instead of screws.
5, The screws on the sides look terrible. But im guessing this is just a prototype thing.
6, Would it be possible to move the power cord next to the MB? This would mean more room and maybe the ability to use bigger fans instead of the 80mm at the back. Hard to tell from the pictures.
7, Is there nowhere to gain that extra space so that its 1x2,5SSD and 2x3,5HDD? I just need one SSD for speed... but more HDD for storage.
8, Dustfilters? Are there any?
9, Id rather have the powerbutton on the front.

I like where this is going... but right now Im afraid that case might be a bit noisy.
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I agree with you about the fan grills, bigger perforations or removable, or none at all would be nice.
I also agree rubber/silicon feet would be a good touch.
As for the fanmounts, if it drives up costs, I don't want to see it. I imagine if they could do what Antec has done, and offer an extended screw that can allow you to mount the fan to a grommet, that'd be the best case for myself, but I don't want them to do it if it's going to add to dev. time and costs. Also, I can always just buy my own silicon/rubber fan mount plugs on my own.

As for the power plug, the only benefit to moving it lower, as I can see, is 120mm fan installation. They don't get any added height to the rear fans by moving the plug, so you'd still be stuck with 80mm in one dimension, and I don't think anyone makes a oval fan.

I think the hdd capacity is fine, this is a gaming case, not a server chasis.

As for filters, maybe give us the option to buy some, but plastic parts will add to the complexity I imagine, I like the all metal design myself, and if dust becomes an issue, I'll just get my own filters, or make sure I clean the case regularly.

I like the clean front, so, I don't second the notion to move the power button up front.
 
I mean to ask, Matt, the specs say coolers up to 150mm, but the height is listed as 5.97inches, or 151mm, which is the external dimension, right? So inside we'll have slightly reduced height for coolers due to the motherboard being on risers. Does that mean max cooler height is more like 140-145mm? Just trying to get an idea what I can fit in there. Thanks!
 
CRB, they're adding .25'', but that still only brings it to around 310mm, and that's external dimensions. I'm confused as you are.
 
m1 grant said:
So is there any ETA on this thing, Ill need a compact computer very soon (like in a month or so) and this would be perfect if released by then.
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Bump, would like to know when we can be expecting this thing
 
Bakkone said:
So here is my feedback

1, Make it USB3 on those front ports. The cost shouldn't be that much of a factor. Also, one of your main competitors is Lian-Li. They are upgrading all the front ports with the new standard.
2, Make the back grills for fans removable. Im thinking a lot of people are going to cut these out. Or at least make the holes bigger... use hexagons like the other companies.
3, Rubber feet?
4, +1 to the guy that wanted better fanmounts so we can use rubber plugs instead of screws.
5, The screws on the sides look terrible. But im guessing this is just a prototype thing.
6, Would it be possible to move the power cord next to the MB? This would mean more room and maybe the ability to use bigger fans instead of the 80mm at the back. Hard to tell from the pictures.
7, Is there nowhere to gain that extra space so that its 1x2,5SSD and 2x3,5HDD? I just need one SSD for speed... but more HDD for storage.
8, Dustfilters? Are there any?
9, Id rather have the powerbutton on the front.

I like where this is going... but right now Im afraid that case might be a bit noisy.
Click to expand...

Hi Bakkone,
Thank you VERY much for this detailled feedback.
Here are the answers:
1. we will look into that. I think it should be doable.
2. Yes, we will change the design to make the back grill removable.
3. Yes, we will have rubber feets
4. Yes, we will look into that. I know exactly what you mean. We are working on it.
5. No, the screws on the side will stay. Honestly, I barely notice them and it makes it a lot easier to remove the top cover. Plus it reduces production cost. But maybe we can have them sprayed white?
6. I don't think so, it would hit the fan behind... You can't fit anything bigger than 2 x 80mm fans in the back. It's as big as you can go. But please, keep in mind that these two fans + 2 x 120mm for a rig where overclocking is limited (by the motherboard - read DFI MB review on SFFclub.com) should be more than enough (for mild OC).
7. No, that's the best we can do. 2TB is not enough for a mini ITX? + SSD?
8. No dust filters now, because we don't have any space. BUT, you could add some on the 2 80mm fans (and have them as intake) and use the 2 x 120mm for exhaust.
9. We must have the Power Button on the top because of clearance (every fraction of an inch count for us on this design). We are trying to not go over the volume of the SG05.
 
Steeeeve said:
I'm also a little worried about the height thing. You got 6in which is 151mm. The XIGMATEK HDT-S1284 is well over 150mm in height.

This is also confusing:


The SG07 is 350mm in length and can barely fit the 5970

http://sffclub.com/index.php?option...tone-sg07-specs&catid=1:latest-news&Itemid=58
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Yes, this is all correct. I will post some new specs after we make a final decision,
The 5970 -> please, don't forget that we are only trying to fit the PCB in it. When you read the specs of the card, it also include the bend at the end of the card where it attaches to the chassis. This is outside the chassis in this Mini ITX.
We also heard that there will be some slighlty shorter 5970 coming out soon.
Right now, the 5970 is 30.9cm long. The PCB is 29.3cm long.
http://www.pcgameshardware.com/aid,699630/Radeon-HD-5970-Review-of-the-fastest-DirectX-11-graphics-card/Reviews/
The inside of the mini ITX will be about 30cm+ once we make the modification for the prototype. So it will fit (tight:D).
 
m1 grant said:
Bump, would like to know when we can be expecting this thing
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ETA: I want to tell it will be there in June, but it all depends on the manufacturer.

Question (important):
Would you mind if we had 2 (black) scews (flush with the surface) visible on the front of the case? it will help us make the structure studier and cut the fabrication cost down.
 
As far as heigh goes, as long as it can fit a 125mm cooler, it can fit a Noctua NH-U9F and thus would be enough (since I have one spare soon, probably). And HD 5870 would be easily enough length-wise. So I suppose the specs would be enough for me regardless. Well, I can dream anyway, unless I win a lottery :)

As far as the screws in front... hard to say. Where would they be located? As long as they were there symmetrically, I don't imagine it being too much of an issue for me at least.
 
mattinv said:
Yes, this is all correct. I will post some new specs after we make a final decision,
The 5970 -> please, don't forget that we are only trying to fit the PCB in it. When you read the specs of the card, it also include the bend at the end of the card where it attaches to the chassis. This is outside the chassis in this Mini ITX.
We also heard that there will be some slighlty shorter 5970 coming out soon.
Right now, the 5970 is 30.9cm long. The PCB is 29.3cm long.
http://www.pcgameshardware.com/aid,699630/Radeon-HD-5970-Review-of-the-fastest-DirectX-11-graphics-card/Reviews/
The inside of the mini ITX will be about 30cm+ once we make the modification for the prototype. So it will fit (tight:D).
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Thanks for the reply about length Matt. I know that part of the case isn't completely known until you finalize the design changes, but what of the height? I like that it's just under 6'', any larger and it'll be taller than my mATX case, but internally, what's the tallest heatsink that will fit?
 
ryboto said:
Thanks for the reply about length Matt. I know that part of the case isn't completely known until you finalize the design changes, but what of the height? I like that it's just under 6'', any larger and it'll be taller than my mATX case, but internally, what's the tallest heatsink that will fit?
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Hi Ryboto,

What case do you have?
I will have an exact answer about the maximum cooler heights on April 9th.
Thank you
 
Matt, I've got an NSK-1300, modded so I can use a full tower heatsink (Thermalright HR-01), and a DC-DC power supply/power brick combo. It's ~8'' (7.9)tall. Which is a bit far off from 6'', still, I'd hate to see your case grow too much from the initial specs, since smaller is better, and I'd love to be able to reduce size while maintaining (or in the case of the power supply-increasing) the use of high end hardware.
 
mattinv said:
ETA: I want to tell it will be there in June, but it all depends on the manufacturer.

Question (important):
Would you mind if we had 2 (black) scews (flush with the surface) visible on the front of the case? it will help us make the structure studier and cut the fabrication cost down.
Click to expand...

Personally? I like a clean appearance as stated above, so as long as they match in color and luster, where they don't stick out at all and aren't immediately noticeable, I'm happy. Lower costs make me happy too.
 
Oh, as far as cost goes... I actually wouldn't mind a more plain "steel" version as an option. Aluminium looks great and all, but as I've come to notice with the SG03, the smaller size of the case is kind of negated in ease of portability since I get paranoid with scratching that precious aluminium and thus always have it wrapped in the original packaging when moving it rather than just tossing it in the car as is (like I used to do with my previous steel ATX cases, and if I had kept the SG06 for longer, a mere plastic bag probably would've done the job).

Now, obviously the internal design of this Mini-ITX case (what is it going to be called, anyway?) offers for great options in components, but it essentially is a deluxe case because of the aluminium build. I reckon there might be some market for a case that's lower cost due to materials but with the same internal configuration.

Is there any chance of this happening at some point? For me, a portable rig in a cheaper but fully-featured tiny case like that would be hard to resist for sure. By comparison the SG05/06 still lack in component compatibility quite a bit, obviously, and thus isn't as well suited for the role. I just don't know how much of a cost and difficulty it would be for you to manufacture this case with another material.
 
PSU adapater to handle SFX PSUs.

front panel option without slim ODD.

HD rack system for 4x 3.5" HDs.

...and there you have a great WHS box. :)
 
I think people should keep in mind that a computer case has to appeal to the masses and not very specific cases. Not many people want a PC with an HD rack. For those that do and want mini-itx, they probably want an HTPC type of thing and that is a different style of case. Furthermore, you increase the size and limit other options which hurts other users.

Whenever you start adding options the cost goes way up. Simple is good.
 
Steeeeve said:
I think people should keep in mind that a computer case has to appeal to the masses and not very specific cases. Not many people want a PC with an HD rack. For those that do and want mini-itx, they probably want an HTPC type of thing and that is a different style of case. Furthermore, you increase the size and limit other options which hurts other users.

Whenever you start adding options the cost goes way up. Simple is good.
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Thing is, this is a gaming case, it's been mentioned a few times. Matt has said there'll be an ultra compact version, and I'm sure the focus there will be HTPC+storage. Everyone should stop complaining about the slim drive, as well as the HDD limitations. It's a small case that can pack a huge punch, but that punch (full size atx psu and long video card) take up space that would otherwise allow for larger optical drives and more hdd's.
 
Really nice looking case, virtually ideal for when I build a sff computer for going to university. Does anyone know roughly when and what the EU release data and price will be?

Also now the 450w silverstone sfx psu is coming out that would work quite nicely with this case for a bit more room, would that be able to fit or would an adapter be needed?
 
Jen said:
still i prefer a tower mini itx design as to me taller is better than longer
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As I understand it, the length is needed to fit high end graphics cards.

IdiotInCharge said:
I've looked before, but, does anyone know of a slim, slot loading Blu-ray reader/DVD burner combo drive?
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AFAIK they are all EOL.

Sony made a SATA reader combo and Panasonic made SATA and EIDE reader combos and BD burners, but they are all EOL (all the slot-load versions). Supposedly Panasonic will have a replacement model for the BD burner towards the end of the year, but not for the reader combo. I'm not aware of any upcoming Sony (or other brand) Blu Ray slot load drives.. As for regular DVDRW, several brands are available.
 
Do the 2.5 inch hdd mounts support 12.5 mm 2.5 inch drives (such as 1tb western digital) or only standard 9.5 mm height drives?
 
Exocet956 said:
Do the 2.5 inch hdd mounts support 12.5 mm 2.5 inch drives (such as 1tb western digital) or only standard 9.5 mm height drives?
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That's a good question, even though many of us would intend to use those mounts for SSD's.
 
So, color choices. Will it come in anything other than black? I'd like a silver brushed aluminum. Anyone else?
 
ryboto said:
Thing is, this is a gaming case, it's been mentioned a few times. Matt has said there'll be an ultra compact version, and I'm sure the focus there will be HTPC+storage. Everyone should stop complaining about the slim drive, as well as the HDD limitations. It's a small case that can pack a huge punch, but that punch (full size atx psu and long video card) take up space that would otherwise allow for larger optical drives and more hdd's.
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Actually, the ultra compact case would be oriented toward portability. Since hard drives are volume consuming, we were not going to put more than 1 inside.
When I say compact, I mean the kind that you can put in a purse almost. One that would allow for basic HTPC and gaming tasks. Better than what you have out there.
The thing is that, if you want something compact with lots of storage, Lian Li offers a good option with the Q08. So I'm not sure it makes lots of sense to try to design a case that would beat that (in terms of size). Not that it wouldn't be doable, but I think it's already doing great at what it is meant to be: a small home server that you don't move around but that doesn't take lots of space.
 
bufo802 said:
Really nice looking case, virtually ideal for when I build a sff computer for going to university. Does anyone know roughly when and what the EU release data and price will be?

Also now the 450w silverstone sfx psu is coming out that would work quite nicely with this case for a bit more room, would that be able to fit or would an adapter be needed?
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Yes, but you have some short ATX PSU that can do as well. If you are 5.9" or less, I'm almost positive you are not anywhere close to the CPU socket. So I'm not sure what would you use the extra space for? (always keep in mind of the OC restriction with mini ITX motherboards).
The advantage of the SFX format is that it is not as tall and wide. The reason we did not go this route is that we wanted to allow for some CPU heatsink clearance. If we reduce the height of the PSU and thus the case, you would have to reduce the size of all the fans in the case, you could not fit tall heatsinks, watercooling would be limited, etc...
Right now, we are closed to the "perfect balance" because the case is as compact as what is already out there, but it offers everything they don't. It's very difficult when you want to make some changes, because like Steve said, you need to make it practical for everybody.
We decided that it will be better to offer another totally different case for people looking for something more compact. And to once again, reduce it's size by 70%.
 
Thanks for the replies Matt. Any updates on final dimensions? Specifically I'm curious about what heatsink I'll be able to use.
 
Have you considered flipping the PSU to the side. Moving the ODD shifted to top over the VGA. HDD space below the ODD and the front fan 120mm? It would take away the front side fan becasue PSU would block it entirely. With standard ATX it would total height over 150mm tho. Then 180mm MB plus 150mm PSU that's 330mm in depth. Width about 220 mm. That is almost Sugo 05 (except depth) but smaller than Sugo 07.
 
ryboto said:
Any word on those dimensions Matt?
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Not definitive dimensions yet. But we are looking at: 12.1" (L) x 9.29" (W) x 5.97" (H)
As I said, it might change but we'd like to stay in this area. It just depends on what people want.
 
huguberhart said:
Have you considered flipping the PSU to the side. Moving the ODD shifted to top over the VGA. HDD space below the ODD and the front fan 120mm? It would take away the front side fan becasue PSU would block it entirely. With standard ATX it would total height over 150mm tho. Then 180mm MB plus 150mm PSU that's 330mm in depth. Width about 220 mm. That is almost Sugo 05 (except depth) but smaller than Sugo 07.
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Unless people are unhappy with the position of the PSU, we'd like to leave it the way it is. But we love the suggestion and will give it a look.
The reason for that being that although it's probably hard to see on the pictures we have now, it is almost a "perfect fit". If you move the PSU to any other position, you'll have to sacrifice cooling or volume (increase big time).
The objective is of course to be smaller than a SG07 but we already feel like the SG05 is "big". So if we can have a similar volume and twice the capabilities, we would just be very satisfied.
We did spend quite a bit of time looking at various possibilities but having the PSU over the RAM allows for extra cooling and space saving. It's the same thing with Da Box where we fitted the HDD over the RAM. There is a sweet spot where you have enough airflow (/clearance) and save quite a bit of space.
But at the end, you also have to look at how easy it is to connect everything. Which can be a true nightmare...
Right now, the biggest challenge is to find a spot for the H50 that will work easily. But I'll keep you all posted.;)
 
mattinv said:
Right now, the biggest challenge is to find a spot for the H50 that will work easily. But I'll keep you all posted.;)
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I hope you can figure it out! After using one in an SG03 last year on an i7, that's the type of cpu cooler I'll be using in any future sff builds.
 
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