NASA Hacker 'Too Fragile' To Extradite

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Oklahoma Wolf said:
As for the dude in question, I'd want to be sure he actually has Asperger's and if so, how severe is it? When that's determined, one can go about determining an appropriate punishment for the crime.
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I totally sympathize with anyoneone with a disability, but that should not be the main factor to determine a person's sentance when they are found guilty. Gary McKinnon has openly admitted to hacking the U.S. military networks. He is an IT professional by trade.

When / If they convict him, I am sure that they can make arrangements for him to do soft time in one of America's medium-low security white collar prisons. No need for him to remain in the UK. He knew what he was doing, and did this several times before he was caught.


If you can't do the time, don't the crime.
 
Your shipping dolly awaits.

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Runningflame570 said:
The Asperger's Syndrome bit is a load of crap, it's not a "mental illness", it's a social deficit and learning disorder. The idea that it explains away the crime or should somehow provide him immunity from extradition is garbage.

People need to read up on what that actually is before they try using it as an excuse. It's austism, but high-functioning and the idea that it could make stress result in "psychosis and suicide" is freaking laughable.
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You clearly have no idea what you are talking about.
 
I'm more concerned with the fact that a guy with a mental illness that makes him so fragile that he can't travel was able to break into secure(?) NASA systems and probe around.

So the question here is, did he have this before hacking into NASA or was it triggered by him shitting bricks when they started trying to extradite him?
 
sear said:
The amount of hatred that people here harbour towards those with mental illnesses is sickening to me. Regardless of whether or not our hacker's claims are legitimate, that you are dismissing him solely because "Asperger syndrome isn't a real disease" or "he's just a fucking pussy" shows me that you are disgusting people.

The fact is, conditions such as Asperger syndrome, or any severe social/mental illness, be it schizophrenia, sociopathy, chronic depression, etc. are often the source of actions deemed unacceptable by society, and to claim that they are "just an excuse" to get away with said unacceptable behaviour is incredibly insulting to the millions around the world who have to deal with these conditions on a daily basis.I have a variety of social disorders/illnesses and I interact with those who are much more severe than me on a fairly regular basis, and I can attest that Asperger syndrome can be incredibly debilitating in some situations. I have a friend who has it. He literally thought he was a cartoon character for the first fourteen or so years of his life, and it still takes him about half an hour to walk a distance of two blocks because his sense of direction is so poor and he can be distracted so easily. Great guy, but he really doesn't have a clue sometimes, and it is no fault of his own.

This particular case needs to be examined much more closely before any conclusion can be made, guilty or innocent - but for the record, I think that he should be given the benefit of the doubt. As for extraditing him? That's a harder question to answer, but I'm unsure why his family can't accompany him to the United States. The stress he is under may certainly be legitimate, especially considering his condition. Wouldn't the judicial system pay for it if it were necessary for his own health?
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Considering that I was one of the earliest people to be diagnosed with actual AS and was misdiagnosed quite a bit before that I think I'm qualified to say that the guy is full of crap.

From the description of your friend, he may well have some type of autism but if it's just AS he has something in addition to that. I've been around dozens of other people with it over a span of more than a decade and your description of your friend doesn't fit.

AS does not cause delusions, it causes an obsessive interest in certain topics, along with poor social and coordination skills. That of course is a gross oversimplification, but just about summarizes things.

From the sound of it, your friend likely has some sort of ADHD along with something else. The horrific sense of direction and delusions of being a cartoon character sound like nothing I've ever seen in somebody with it to be sure.

This guy may well be making it up and even if he isn't, AS is hardly like temporary psychosis or mental retardation. It's not an excuse or out for committing a crime, because frankly those of us with it are usually very intelligent and capable in most respects. Your claims about what AS is are the real insult.

P.S. Disorder is almost universally preferred to "illness" when discussing AS.
 
Runningflame570 said:
AS does not cause delusions, it causes an obsessive interest in certain topics, along with poor social and coordination skills. That of course is a gross oversimplification, but just about summarizes things.
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Did I mention he is obsessed with cartoons and animation, thinks The Simpsons is some of the best writing and animation in history and can rant for literally hours about why that is so, as well as his obsession with the music industry from about the late 1950s to 1990s? He is also extremely socially awkward. I don't doubt that he has more than Asperger syndrome; the point is that he does have problems and that they are sometimes quite debilitating for him. Again, I can't personally comment on this specific case offered in the news story, but even so the quantity and character of stigma that's apparent in this thread is extremely offensive, and I am distressed that this sort of thinking isn't just prevalent, but commonplace. I suppose we haven't built the same sort of awareness around disability and difference as we have around, say, gender, sexuality, or race.
 
sear said:
The fact is, conditions such as Asperger syndrome, or any severe social/mental illness, be it schizophrenia, sociopathy, chronic depression, etc. are often the source of actions deemed unacceptable by society, and to claim that they are "just an excuse" to get away with said unacceptable behaviour is incredibly insulting to the millions around the world who have to deal with these conditions on a daily basis.I have a variety of social disorders/illnesses and I interact with those who are much more severe than me on a fairly regular basis, and I can attest that Asperger syndrome can be incredibly debilitating in some situations. I have a friend who has it. He literally thought he was a cartoon character for the first fourteen or so years of his life, and it still takes him about half an hour to walk a distance of two blocks because his sense of direction is so poor and he can be distracted so easily. Great guy, but he really doesn't have a clue sometimes, and it is no fault of his own.
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The problem is that it seems like almost every computer nerd shut-in has self-diagnosed himself with Asperger's at some point.

If you actually have Asperger's then you have my sympathy. My own brother has a mild case of it and as you said, there's nothing that can be done about it, that's just how it is. That said, in many cases it isn't even true, its just an excuse to continue being a shut-in.

We'll see if this guy actually has it, but if its another common case of self-diagnosed Asperger's, then yeah....
 
sear said:
The amount of hatred that people here harbour towards those with mental illnesses is sickening to me. Regardless of whether or not our hacker's claims are legitimate, that you are dismissing him solely because "Asperger syndrome isn't a real disease" or "he's just a fucking pussy" shows me that you are disgusting people.

The fact is, conditions such as Asperger syndrome, or any severe social/mental illness, be it schizophrenia, sociopathy, chronic depression, etc. are often the source of actions deemed unacceptable by society, and to claim that they are "just an excuse" to get away with said unacceptable behaviour is incredibly insulting to the millions around the world who have to deal with these conditions on a daily basis.I have a variety of social disorders/illnesses and I interact with those who are much more severe than me on a fairly regular basis, and I can attest that Asperger syndrome can be incredibly debilitating in some situations. I have a friend who has it. He literally thought he was a cartoon character for the first fourteen or so years of his life, and it still takes him about half an hour to walk a distance of two blocks because his sense of direction is so poor and he can be distracted so easily. Great guy, but he really doesn't have a clue sometimes, and it is no fault of his own.

This particular case needs to be examined much more closely before any conclusion can be made, guilty or innocent - but for the record, I think that he should be given the benefit of the doubt. As for extraditing him? That's a harder question to answer, but I'm unsure why his family can't accompany him to the United States. The stress he is under may certainly be legitimate, especially considering his condition. Wouldn't the judicial system pay for it if it were necessary for his own health?
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as some that has been diagnosed with it I can tell your from the hart that you are full of it. It in NO WAY should be used to excuse illegal behavior. I actually find the bleeding hearts here to be insulting. For crying out loud, life is NOT FAIR. suck it up people
 
Valset said:
as some that has been diagnosed with it I can tell your from the hart that you are full of it. It in NO WAY should be used to excuse illegal behavior. I actually find the bleeding hearts here to be insulting. For crying out loud, life is NOT FAIR. suck it up people
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while I am at it I will blame my poor typing/spelling skills on it :D
 
Valset said:
as some that has been diagnosed with it I can tell your from the hart that you are full of it. It in NO WAY should be used to excuse illegal behavior. I actually find the bleeding hearts here to be insulting. For crying out loud, life is NOT FAIR. suck it up people
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I'd agree it's no excuse for breaking the law, but there has to be some kind of different consequence for somebody in the autistic spectrum as far as incarceration.. People with that kind of problem just simply isn't going to survive being in the general population of a US prison for very long.
 
Valset said:
while I am at it I will blame my poor typing/spelling skills on it :D
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Heh, that's one problem I have when trying to post to forums.. I am obsessive about spelling/grammar, so I'll wind up spending 10 minutes editing and re-editing.. sometimes to the point where I'll lose track of the entire thread. :D
 
Draax said:
Too fragile for the water boarding, sleep deprivation, and stress positions .... yes I can kind of see where he is coming from. :D
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Oh, I doubt that he would have to worry about anything like that.







However, a cellmate nick-named "Meat", with 8 swinging inches..........:eek:
 
LOL assburgers.

"because of his condition"....oh fuck off. He should do the world a favor and end himself.

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Even the UK article claims that there was actual damage done in some way shape or form that the govt. estimated at $500,000 (probably more like $50,000 if that). Even without malicious intent, a crime was still committed. Also, this is no kid...this guy is 42 years old. Even at the time of the crime, he was in his early 30's. No excuses.
 
I want to know why this is just coming up now. This isn't something which just happens overnight, all of a sudden and out of the blue. If this was actually a problem it would have been brought up a long time ago.

 
SmokeRngs said:
I want to know why this is just coming up now. This isn't something which just happens overnight, all of a sudden and out of the blue. If this was actually a problem it would have been brought up a long time ago.

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My EXACT thoughts. I hope this is his last resort, I'd hate to see what he comes up with next to resist extradition.
 
This 'person' (being polite) makes me sick to my stomach.

I agree with another poster, sedate him before the flight. No muss, no fuss, no bother. Don't make Bubba in the jail cell wait any longer his stupid ass.
 
quote off BBC News article
"It is not uncommon for people with Asperger syndrome to develop single-minded, obsessional interests, and to be unaware of the effect their actions have on others."
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I read this and just thought, what a BS claim. How did he maintain his job and his life, if he supposedly developed a single-minded, obsessional interest?

I'm with AceGoober. Sedate his ass for the flight, the court hearings, and induce a chemical coma for his prison time too. I'm more for sedating him for the flight, have it go through court, and put him in a jail cell with knives, ropes, etc laying around. Let the problem resolve itself.
 
While I'm not one to support special priveledges being given to people because they are "special," who cares? I mean really: He hacked into NASA's shit, big deal. They should have had better security. It's not like he downloaded porn on there and got spyware up in their shit. He didn't really hurt anyone. Those "damages" were more likely money that they had to spend patching the holes he found, which should have been done anyways.
 
This guy could easily get off with a slap on the wrist and an well paying IT position if he shuts his mouth and stops blabbing about whatever he saw on NASAs computers to the media.
 
Powerage said:
While I'm not one to support special priveledges being given to people because they are "special," who cares? I mean really: He hacked into NASA's shit, big deal. They should have had better security. It's not like he downloaded porn on there and got spyware up in their shit. He didn't really hurt anyone. Those "damages" were more likely money that they had to spend patching the holes he found, which should have been done anyways.
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So your saying, as long as you can break into the place and don't damage anything, it's okay?

Like if you forgot to lock your house door, I can go in? I shouldn't get charged for anything? I go in, maybe take some pictures of your private life and so forth, it's perfectly fine. No big deal.

That's the dumbest excuse ever.
 
kirbyrj said:
Even the UK article claims that there was actual damage done in some way shape or form that the govt. estimated at $500,000 (probably more like $50,000 if that). Even without malicious intent, a crime was still committed. Also, this is no kid...this guy is 42 years old. Even at the time of the crime, he was in his early 30's. No excuses.
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Those of us who know anything about security and the damage that a truly malicious hack can cause know exactly why this story is full of shit from both sides. The US gov't have inflated what he did with so much bullshit that...well, to be perfectly frank, I wouldn't trust them to treat him right if he's extradited, and we've all seen how the US treats people it deems a threat to national security (hint: not many international laws get obeyed). If I was in Gary's position, I'd do absolutely everything I could to avoid extradition.

The sooner the UK gets out of this ridiculous extradition treaty with the USA, the better. Whoever negotiated it wants shooting.
 
Being a fellow Brit and a computer enthusiast I think that most of the comments on here are dissapointing to say the least.

I dont know anything about Assburgers Syndrome, and I dont care if its BS or not.

I do think that Gary is being offered to relocate to the USA and will probably get offered work for the US government, that's what always used to happen stealing the other sides spies right?

Stop being a wuss Gary and go work for the only people who are going to look after you for what you do best: Freedom Of Information. It's more important than stuff right now!
 
They should actually drop the case against this guy

He actually found ufo evidence in some of the computer systems, a list of off world officers as well as unretouched nasa photo's containing actual space ships.

If anyone should be inprisoned, it should be all the officials who have been covering up, and all around lieing.. which lieing itself is a prosecutable offence, for the past 60 yrs about ufo's

Not to mention we send people up in a space shuttle that takes damage ever trip, and is an all around death trap compared to the actual craft the government is secretly flying.
 
People responses in this thread give me a headache... seriously so many of you are so very wrong and conceited.
 
Wow and you don't provide your own input. We'd like to see your own opinions on the matter. There is no right or wrong in personal opinions.
 
:LJ: said:
Those of us who know anything about security and the damage that a truly malicious hack can cause know exactly why this story is full of shit from both sides. The US gov't have inflated what he did with so much bullshit that...well, to be perfectly frank, I wouldn't trust them to treat him right if he's extradited, and we've all seen how the US treats people it deems a threat to national security (hint: not many international laws get obeyed). If I was in Gary's position, I'd do absolutely everything I could to avoid extradition.

The sooner the UK gets out of this ridiculous extradition treaty with the USA, the better. Whoever negotiated it wants shooting.
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I find it pretty ridiculous to think that someone from a friendly country with a longstanding history isn't going to get a fair shake at trial, especially with so much interest in the case. There is a difference between terror suspects and your average British citizen. If I sit here and break into British defense systems looking for whatever, I'd expect to be treated the same way this clown is being treated, AND I'd expect the US govt. to extradite me. The funny thing is, if you don't do anything wrong, you don't have to fear some "ridiculous" extradition.
 
kirbyrj said:
I find it pretty ridiculous to think that someone from a friendly country with a longstanding history isn't going to get a fair shake at trial, especially with so much interest in the case. There is a difference between terror suspects and your average British citizen. If I sit here and break into British defense systems looking for whatever, I'd expect to be treated the same way this clown is being treated, AND I'd expect the US govt. to extradite me. The funny thing is, if you don't do anything wrong, you don't have to fear some "ridiculous" extradition.
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No, you missed my point about the extradition - it's the treaty which is ridiculous. It's so one-sided it's insane - basically, it states that the USA has the right to demand extradition of any British citizen on suspicion, but the UK has to beg and plead for a chance at extradition.

In any case, the trumped-up "damages" should be enough to make the trial a joke. A realistic look at what happened would end up with a drastically reduced sentence, though, and that would really make it difficult to make an example of the guy.
 
Well, I don't know much about the treaty particulars. I agree that the damages are most certainly exaggerated. However, even with lesser charges, I think this guy deserves a day in a U.S. Court.

This could easily get expensive though. For one thing, the information on those computers has been compromised and who knows how many changes needed to be made "just in case." When you start getting into defense computers, you very well might see troop locations, etc. No need to risk someone else's safety over someone snooping around.
 
Look sir, more people who think prison rape is an acceptable punishment for haxxing a computer looking for UFOs.
 
So your saying, as long as you can break into the place and don't damage anything, it's okay?

Like if you forgot to lock your house door, I can go in? I shouldn't get charged for anything? I go in, maybe take some pictures of your private life and so forth, it's perfectly fine. No big deal.

That's the dumbest excuse ever.
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If I saw you didn't take/break anything and had no intent to, I wouldn't really care. I'd be like "Dude, wtf", kick you out, and remember to lock the door, but I wouldn't try to put you in jail and fine you. If you did it again, that'd be different.
 
Aww too bad...shouldn't have hacked NASA then. Get it over with and ship his ass over here. He committed a crime and should be treated just like any other criminal.
 
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