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People have been saying DirectX is dead and going nowhere at every new release for the last 15 years. Here it is, powering more games than ever. Keep on dreamin', fella.
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Linux is awful...apparently
- Thread starter Lunar
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People have been saying DirectX is dead and going nowhere at every new release for the last 15 years. Here it is, powering more games than ever. Keep on dreamin', fella.
B00nie
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If you didn't notice Vulkan is making waves like no other option so far.
naib
[H]ard|Gawd
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that doesn't dispute what B00nie stated.
new DX9 games in 2017: 9
new DX10 games in 2017: 10
new DX11 games in 2017: 21
new DX12 games in 2017: 2
new Vulkan games in 2017: 5 ( 4 more not released, also this does not include a large number of back converts)
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So 42 DirectX games and 1 Vulkan game and 4 not released and who knows if they will. Good argument.
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Vulkan is all talk and no show. It was when it was Mantle and it has done very little since becoming Vulkan. It will have a niche market like OpenGL does these days and outside of that, meh.
naib
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Again, you are missing what B00nie wrote. He didn't say DX was declining, but that newer DX wasn't living up to its sales pitch & that it is a lot harder to work with. This is reflected in hte numbers that were shown. 2 DX12 games... while there is five Vulkan games...
Why do you think there is only 1? there is 5 release and 4 MORE not released . I purposefully didn't include these like I purposefully didn't include ports completed in 2017 like ashes of singularity that is a 2016 game BUT was ported this year..
so 2 DX12 games to 5+ Vulkan games... People are still making DX9 games when windows7 supports what? DX10.
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You're right, I was using a bit of a flawed argument. B00nie was saying DX12 vs Vulkan, and in that sense, he is correct, I'll concede that. DirectX 12 HAS been much slower to come around than previous versions.
Reference the 5 and 4 more statement. When you write "I have 5 cats (4 black)", that references 5 to me, not 9. If you meant 5 completed games AND 4 more in development, then I will concede that argument as well.
Reference the 5 and 4 more statement. When you write "I have 5 cats (4 black)", that references 5 to me, not 9. If you meant 5 completed games AND 4 more in development, then I will concede that argument as well.
naib
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I have edited my post to make it clearer that there are 5 new games released this year, 4 more new games not yet release & equally this does not include older games that were ported this year
M76
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That's an actual example.
M76
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How much more exact can I be? I wanted to find out what Hardware was in a server, they just gave to me to administer.
naib
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lspci ...
or lshw ...
Code:
lshw -short
H/W path Device Class Description
==========================================================
system MS-7A32 (To be filled by O.E.M.)
/0 bus X370 GAMING PRO CARBON (MS-7A32)
/0/0 memory 64KiB BIOS
/0/28 memory 16GiB System Memory
/0/28/0 memory 2400 MHz (0.4 ns) [empty]
/0/28/1 memory 8GiB DIMM DDR4 Synchronous Unbuffered (Unregistered) 2400 MHz (0.4 ns)
/0/28/2 memory 2400 MHz (0.4 ns) [empty]
/0/28/3 memory 8GiB DIMM DDR4 Synchronous Unbuffered (Unregistered) 2400 MHz (0.4 ns)
/0/2a memory 576KiB L1 cache
/0/2b memory 3MiB L2 cache
/0/2c memory 16MiB L3 cache
/0/2d processor AMD Ryzen 5 1600 Six-Core Processor
/0/100 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/0.2 generic Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/1.1 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/1.1/0 storage NVMe SSD Controller SM961/PM961
/0/100/1.3 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/1.3/0 bus Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/1.3/0/0 usb1 bus xHCI Host Controller
/0/100/1.3/0/0/9 input MX-Board 3.0 Keyboard
/0/100/1.3/0/0/a input Razer Diamondback
/0/100/1.3/0/1 usb2 bus xHCI Host Controller
/0/100/1.3/0.1 storage Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/1.3/0.2 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/1.3/0.2/0 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/1.3/0.2/0/0 enp30s0 network I211 Gigabit Network Connection
/0/100/1.3/0.2/1 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/1.3/0.2/2 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/1.3/0.2/3 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/1.3/0.2/4 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/1.3/0.2/8 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/1.3/0.2/8/0 bus ASMedia Technology Inc.
/0/100/1.3/0.2/8/0/0 usb3 bus xHCI Host Controller
/0/100/1.3/0.2/8/0/1 usb4 bus xHCI Host Controller
/0/100/3.1 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/3.1/0 display GM204 [GeForce GTX 970]
/0/100/3.1/0.1 multimedia GM204 High Definition Audio Controller
/0/100/7.1 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/7.1/0 generic Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/7.1/0.2 generic Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/7.1/0.3 bus USB3 Host Controller
/0/100/7.1/0.3/0 usb5 bus xHCI Host Controller
/0/100/7.1/0.3/0/2 bus USB2.0 Hub
/0/100/7.1/0.3/0/2/1 input USB HID
/0/100/7.1/0.3/0/2/5 bus USB2.0 Hub
/0/100/7.1/0.3/0/2/5/1 input USB HID
/0/100/7.1/0.3/1 usb6 bus xHCI Host Controller
/0/100/8.1 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/8.1/0 generic Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/8.1/0.2 storage FCH SATA Controller [AHCI mode]
/0/100/8.1/0.3 multimedia Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/100/14 bus FCH SMBus Controller
/0/100/14.3 bridge FCH LPC Bridge
/0/101 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/102 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/103 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/104 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/105 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/106 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/107 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/108 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/109 bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/10a bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/10b bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/10c bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/10d bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/10e bridge Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
/0/1 scsi0 storage
/0/1/0.0.0 /dev/sda disk 256GB OCZ-VERTEX4
/0/1/0.0.0/1 /dev/sda1 volume 238GiB Linux filesystem partitionand if you need a gui... lshw comes with a gui...
OpenGL is niche I will grant you that. That isn't because it isn't superior to DirectX though... which it is.
Game developers and publishers are easily bought. That is the bottom line. Pretty much every game that is cross platform with PS4 start life using GNMX. A lot of game houses start with the Sony code because they like working with GNMX and sonys tools. From there things get ported to directx. That is pretty smooth these days but it was the main reason so many xbox versions where crappy at one point. Things developers can do in GNMX with a couple commands that require little overhead can sometimes require crazy nests of code that eat resources under DX.
Anyway back to what I was talking about OpenGL is superior in many ways which is why ALL pro software everywhere uses OpenGL and not DirectX.
Game developers fell into the DirectX trap long ago though... what can you do.
Vulcan is slowly making progress.... the truth is though if you are a game developer creating a game that doesn't need to "touch metal" opengl is still in ways easier to deal with. Not that it matters to most smaller studios though... any company creating games going forward using Unreal / Unity / Cry and pretty much any of the other major engines has full Vulcan support these days. Most games released this year and into next started development before that changed. The real test for Vulcan will be 2018 imo. If a large % of games hitting next year don't list Vulcan then ya they failed and MS wins. We'll have to pretty much wait and see... its hard to know if MS is throwing money around to keep publishers DX only or not. That is how they got the share they have, although they seem less willing to pay off developers lately.
M76
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And I was supposed to know about those obscure console commands how? This is exactly my point. Using Windows I never had to look up anything, because I could find the solution on my own because it was always intuitive.That changed with 8 and 10, but I'm no fan of either of those.
I did a google search on how to find out what cpu the computer is running, and the best result was an app called "hwinfo" which was not installed on the computer, so I had to install it, then read the command line parameters to be able to use it.
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They often forget that Windows offers so many small helpful things that most don't even consider. Then we need to known console commands that are obscurely named to do things. lshw... lol, OF COURSE!
tacohunter52
Gawd
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LOL at "obscure console commands". ITT, the computer illiterate.
It takes just a second to learn these basic commands.
It takes just a second to learn these basic commands.
naib
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because linux isn't windows. Linux exposes the kernelspace into /proc and a simple cat /proc/cpuinfo would have told you what CPU & 10seconds on google would have seen that.
and obscure? an obscure console command would be q a gentoo-portage plugin command. Cat is not obscure, /proc is not obscure COREUTILS is not obscure, the FHS is not obscure. These are well documented and are fundemental to *NIX
What is the different from, as you put it, obscure console command to an obscure gui application
what you just said would be the equivalent to stating the registry hives are obscure & yet the FHS has been around since 1993
M76
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That's exactly my point. How hard is it to understand? YOU HAVE TO LEARN THEM. You can't just get to it without prerequisite knowledge of the commands. And that applies to almost every task I ever had to do in linux. It's like we're back in 1993 and using DOS. But it's 2017 and we're still stuck with using the command line on linux, and editing conf files, instead of an intuitive GUI.
And I have no problem with a command line it has it's use and it's place, but all those people bitching about linux not spreading, this is the exact reason for it. Command line should be available besides a gui option for most tasks, not exclusively.
tacohunter52
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I have no respect for people who complain about having to learn something.
naib
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but you don't have too... and you havn't had to for quite some time.
linux veterans will break out the command line because it is 2nd to none the FASTEST interface
GUI's are good if you do not know what todo, command lines are good when you do.. For decade MS tried to kill it until they finally saw sense and introduced powershell..
For gui's in linux...
kdeinfocentre
lshw...
and more & all of these under the system categories as defined in the freedesktop specification
As a heavy linux user thrown into using windows10 I could say the same about some of hte obscure things that MS chose to do, but hey its "easer" because its a GUI (facepalm). Guess what 30seconds on google and I eventually found the bits that had moved.
M76
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For a first time linux user or someone who only uses it occasionally, everything that is not easily reachable trough a gui is obscure. In my dictionary obscure means "not clearly presented" or "readily apparent" There is no better description for something that needs to be learned, instead of just being able to find it by clicking trough a GUI.
Of course it's known to you if you've been using it for years, but it still remains obscure. Something doesn't get any less obscure by the amount of time it has been around. It gets less obscure if it's exposed to the first time user fumbling with the OS.
BulletDust
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If you run OSX/macOS, you'll have to use very similar commands in very similar situations unless someone has made a GUI software application to effectively take the place of the terminal command - Of which there are similar GUI software applications available under Linux.
What I'm reading is "I tried to use Linux, it wasn't Windows so I gave up". Like I keep saying, linux is not Windows, there is no prerequisite for all operating systems to behave like Windows. As a Linux desktop user I'm of the opinion that Windows feels all wrong, it's simply a matter of what you're used to, I'm sure there's older generation UNIX sysadmins that struggle their asses off with Windows.
And to compare Vulkan adoption to Mantle adoption is being a little ridiculous. Vulkan is growing steadily and adoption is progressing well, why anyone would want a scenario where we're all tied to DX like it's 2000 is beyond my comprehension.
What I'm reading is "I tried to use Linux, it wasn't Windows so I gave up". Like I keep saying, linux is not Windows, there is no prerequisite for all operating systems to behave like Windows. As a Linux desktop user I'm of the opinion that Windows feels all wrong, it's simply a matter of what you're used to, I'm sure there's older generation UNIX sysadmins that struggle their asses off with Windows.
And to compare Vulkan adoption to Mantle adoption is being a little ridiculous. Vulkan is growing steadily and adoption is progressing well, why anyone would want a scenario where we're all tied to DX like it's 2000 is beyond my comprehension.
BulletDust
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I use the terminal (Command line is Windows) to install software via apt (very simple) and ssh into my server, any modern Linux distro should allow you to do most things via the GUI just like OSX/macOS.
System Profiler and Benchmark utility available in the Ubuntu software centre:
System Profiler and Benchmark utility available in the Ubuntu software centre:
M76
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That's a completely bogus argument. I never said I refuse to learn anything. I said that's what makes linux inconvenient, and hostile to new users.
Why are you arguing the same thing that I just written in the exact post you're replying to? I use the command line regularly in many programs / circumstances because it's faster, but that's no excuse for not having a properly thought out easy to use interface as well.
That still seems to require some prequisite knowledge about the existence of such an application "kdeinfocentre" is not a name I'd find without knowing about it. And we're back to root of my problem with linux.
Facepalm indeed, I've just written one post prior that W10 / 8 broke the easy to understand and intuitive part, but don't even break a sweat about it just continue to argue your strawman. And why would I want to go to spending 30 seconds to find out every single thing instead of finding it instantly without outside help?
BulletDust
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And as stated, the situation would be absolutely no different if they were using OSX/macOS. There is a period of adjustment and learning any time change is involved.
How do you work things out under Windows when you haven't got a clue? How is this situation any different? How do you think the rest of us worked out the answers? A little Google Fu, as always. The OS is different, the procedure for finding the answers most definitely is not.
Wow, as a tech myself I have to Google answers for a good 30 seconds when facing certain challenges under Windows all the time, are you trying to claim that you don't have to search for answers under Windows at times?
naib
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because this is oh so much more intuitive
also... “The only intuitive interface is the nipple. Everything else is learned.”
--edit--
I just remembered the most RETARDED change in windows10 that frustrates me no end... changing power policy... for I don't know how long you click on the battery in the taskbar and a list of power options are available... this is handy because when I am running large Matlab simulations I sort of want full power but when I am doing powerpoints or mobile SHOCK HORROR I want energy saver.
oh look that ability has gone now and there is a non-intuitive method to change power schemes on the fly (actually took me quite some time to figure it out as google kept pointing me to other frustrated people who installed 3rd party apps to return the useful, "intuitive" feature
Windows is far from intuitive, each major release in windows is far from intuitive. The ribbon while because quite useful for the most common tasks is FAR FROM INTUITIVE for the more obscure tasks since you cannot visually scan a menu list...
also... “The only intuitive interface is the nipple. Everything else is learned.”
--edit--
I just remembered the most RETARDED change in windows10 that frustrates me no end... changing power policy... for I don't know how long you click on the battery in the taskbar and a list of power options are available... this is handy because when I am running large Matlab simulations I sort of want full power but when I am doing powerpoints or mobile SHOCK HORROR I want energy saver.
oh look that ability has gone now and there is a non-intuitive method to change power schemes on the fly (actually took me quite some time to figure it out as google kept pointing me to other frustrated people who installed 3rd party apps to return the useful, "intuitive" feature
Windows is far from intuitive, each major release in windows is far from intuitive. The ribbon while because quite useful for the most common tasks is FAR FROM INTUITIVE for the more obscure tasks since you cannot visually scan a menu list...
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New user says "This is my issue with Linux". Linux guru calls them a noob and tells them to go back to Windows. Helpful as always.
NoOther
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I am sorry, but how did you first learn to use Windows? Was everything just "intuitive"? It was intuitive to find the information you are now asking for in Linux? Had you learned Linux first, most of these commands you are saying are obscure are the core commands you learn in any basic Linux class. Your argument isn't really very persuasive here.
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because this is oh so much more intuitive
also... “The only intuitive interface is the nipple. Everything else is learned.”
--edit--
I just remembered the most RETARDED change in windows10 that frustrates me no end... changing power policy... for I don't know how long you click on the battery in the taskbar and a list of power options are available... this is handy because when I am running large Matlab simulations I sort of want full power but when I am doing powerpoints or mobile SHOCK HORROR I want energy saver.
oh look that ability has gone now and there is a non-intuitive method to change power schemes on the fly (actually took me quite some time to figure it out as google kept pointing me to other frustrated people who installed 3rd party apps to return the useful, "intuitive" feature
Windows is far from intuitive, each major release in windows is far from intuitive. The ribbon while because quite useful for the most common tasks is FAR FROM INTUITIVE for the more obscure tasks since you cannot visually scan a menu list...
He specifically said that Windows 7 and below were good and that 8 and 10 weren't. Reading comprehension, 0.
BulletDust
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They aren't noob's? Who's telling them to go back to Windows?
naib
[H]ard|Gawd
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I know exactly what he stated, but that doesn't change the fact that HID in windows has been deteriorating since XP. It equally doesn't change my previous statement that there is no difference between obscure command and obscure gui.
your reading comprehension is zero. go back and check.
1) He vaguely stated he has an issue,
https://hardforum.com/threads/linux-is-awful-apparently.1943004/page-6#post-1043198037
2) when pushed
https://hardforum.com/threads/linux-is-awful-apparently.1943004/page-7#post-1043198233
https://hardforum.com/threads/linux-is-awful-apparently.1943004/page-7#post-1043198477
https://hardforum.com/threads/linux-is-awful-apparently.1943004/page-7#post-1043198480
3)VERY helpful replies as to how such information can be obtained very,very quickly
https://hardforum.com/threads/linux-is-awful-apparently.1943004/page-7#post-1043198492
4) this was met with "I don't want to learn"
https://hardforum.com/threads/linux-is-awful-apparently.1943004/page-7#post-1043198656
5) that's when fucks given have gone to zero
had the chain of events been #1 then I would agree, but it wasn't was it? thankfully its nicely recorded here so your views on the recorded events are mealiness & are not needed
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BulletDust
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How difficult is it to understand that when the supposed transitioning Windows user is making an obvious attempt to dump on Linux, as opposed to calmly and approachably asking for assistance and working together in an attempt to resolve the problem in an open and friendly manner, there will be no fucks given in relation to assistance?
Therefore:
Therefore:
BulletDust
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lspci/lshw = List PCI/List Hardware.
Seems fairly logical and straightforward to me, not to mention easy to remember. Really no different to ipconfig and tracert under Windows - Two commands I use all the time.
Seems fairly logical and straightforward to me, not to mention easy to remember. Really no different to ipconfig and tracert under Windows - Two commands I use all the time.
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No comparable at all. Everyone uses the term IP and throwing config after it makes complete sense. Tracert is similar in that it uses an ENTIRE word (trace) in the name. Here is one for you "ltauweh". Do you know what that stands for? Of course not as it could be the first letter of ANY word in the english language, sorta like the commands you listed.
At this point we are both just arguing opinions, which won't get us anywhere.
BulletDust
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Daily, either in the term PCI-e or people who run equipment on older PC's sure. They definitely don't use the term Peripheral Component Interface, do they?
BulletDust
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What?
I have no idea just what point you are trying to make here? The people using these commands are nearly always the more advanced users and these commands are easy to remember. If you can't remember these commands, than you have no place near a PC as a technical enthusiast whatsoever.
This is not difficult stuff. Get a post-it-note and stick the commands to your screen until you remember them, that's what I do.
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You asked a simple question, I answered it. Don't reply what.
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