Digital Foundry: Xbox Series X Complete Specs + Ray Tracing/Gears 5/Back-Compat/Quick Resume Demo Showcase!

Just happy to have something other than virus news!

Really cool overall. Hardware wise, plenty of CPU and GPU grunt. Not quite as much total memory as I hoped, but 320 bit GDDR6 is awesome. There is a total of 13.5 GB for developers but this is sort of multiplied further with tricks from the nvme drive that also is very nice.

I am more excited about the software side. Sounds rather remarkable what it can do for older games. It can even take an OG Xbox game and add HDR and upscale to 4k. Crazy stuff. Then they is the Ray tracing that can't be ignored as well.

Well played Microsoft.
 
I'm really interested in the machine learning hdr algorithm, with some luck Microsoft will offer it to AMD dx drivers at least.

The hardware decompression is a smart move, taking a note from the ps4 and building onto it. The "separate yet one" idea of the memory pool is a really smart way to use the Nvidia's 970 memory shenanigans in a full product, I mean it seems to me that it was their inspiration.

I can't wait to see how the amd BVH acceleration stacks up in real world, I'm not a fan of current showcases of RT but it's here to stay regardless.

All in all, I'm impressed, I'll wait for the eventual unveiling of the ps5.
 
Verge said:
$600 they should probably both push to 2021
$500 they will sell very very few
$400 ps3 numbers maybe?
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Looking at the hardware, I'd be very surprised to see a $400 price tag.

While the highest end PC is still better, of course, these specs blow away basically any low to mid range PC (even new ones).

So, yeah, we are probably looking at $500 at least, but maybe up to $600 (above $600 would be dead in the water).
 
polonyc2 said:
impressive specs...is the PS5 rumored to be better or worse?
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Originally people were saying Xbox was better but then there is a rumor that PS5 will come in 2 versions and the Pro would beat the base Xbox (though MS might also release a Pro model, so it's going to be fun).
 
cybereality said:
Originally people were saying Xbox was better but then there is a rumor that PS5 will come in 2 versions and the Pro would beat the base Xbox (though MS might also release a Pro model, so it's going to be fun).
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but I'm guessing the Pro will not be released at the same time as the base PS5?...so this is the new normal going forward with consoles?...release a base model and then release an even more powerful one a year or 2 later that beats the competitions original model
 
And guess who was completely right about it shipping with 320-bit bus? But they need the extra bandwidth to feed 12 TFLOPS + the rest of the system (RX 5700 XT is 256-bit).


Does anyone have any more details on that strange memory mapping (16GB does no divide evenly into 320-bit)? This is the first time I've ever seen a segmented memory map from an AMD GPU. And the last time we saw somethign this stranbe from Nvidia, it caused the GTX 970 class action lawsuit.
 
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cybereality said:
You can read about it here. https://www.techradar.com/news/will-there-be-a-ps5-pro-in-2020-we-dont-think-so

I guess there was the idea that the base and pro would launch together, but I agree this is a bad strategy.
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I mean if there is the "pro" will almost certainly be on par with the Series X and the "regular" will be cut down, more in line with a PS4 Pro. Reason is simply cost. The Series X is a beast, it'll be hard to keep it to a reasonable price on the shelves unless MS is willing to take a loss. Same will be true for Sony, of course. So if Sony tried to make a "pro" model with even more beastly specs they'd be in the no-win situation of either charging a ton, which consumers would likely not pay, or taking a massive per unit loss, which they cannot afford.

Also be wary: A lot of "oh there is going to be a special powerful version" type of rumours come from fanboys who HOPE it is true and don't understand the economics, not any real information.
 
defaultluser said:
Does anyone have any more details on that strange memory mapping (16GB does no divide evenly into 320-bit)? This is the first time I've ever seen a segmented memory map from an AMD GPU. And the last time we saw somethign this stranbe from Nvidia, it caused the GTX 970 class action lawsuit.
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6*2+4*1
 
to equal the performance of a Series X at its full IO rate, you would need to build a PC with 13 Zen 2 cores. That's seven cores dedicated for the game: one for Windows and shell and five for the IO and decompression overhead
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So the 16core thread ripper cpus can now be put to use for gaming
 
Luke M said:
6*2+4*1
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Yes, but if it's segmented, that implies there;s penalty for transferring from one space to another (two memory controller is controlling three different planes.) The previous Xbox architectures were all unified. so this is a bit of a shocker..

I'm just surprised to see us going back to the bad old days of the GTX 660 2.0 gb
 
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I'm curious to see the cooling.

If PS5 has a more traditional console casing. I wonder if they will be able to have those clock speeds. I don't think they will be able to. But we will see!
 
defaultluser said:
Yes, but if it's segmented, that implies there;s penalty for transferring from one space to another The previous Xbox architectures were all unified. so this is a bit of a shocker..

I'm just surprised to see us going back to the bad old days of the GTX 660 2.0 gb But since we have no data on the access pnalty, we can't figure out that impact!
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Unlike previous efforts, all the memory in the XSX runs at the same speed. So hopefully there won’t be that much of a penalty. Plus with the GPU having access to 10GB on its own it shouldn’t run out of VRAM often.
 
So, by going with this architecture, they just made the consoles even more PC like? Dedicated GPU ram + dedicated CPU ram + desiccated multitasking OS ram.

What exactly is the point of buying a console anymore>
 
chameleoneel said:
I'm curious to see the cooling.

If PS5 has a more traditional console casing. I wonder if they will be able to have those clock speeds. I don't think they will be able to. But we will see!
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OH hey, they showed the cooling on the official site:
https://news.xbox.com/en-us/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2020/03/XboxSeriesXTech_HERO.jpg?w=1200

*looks like its an exhaust setup?! If that's the case then, Sony might be able to deliver those speeds in a more traditional console box, with intake cooling.
 
defaultluser said:
So, by going with this architecture, they just made the consoles even more PC like? Dedicated GPU ram + dedicated CPU ram + desiccated multitasking OS ram.

What exactly is the point of buying a console anymore>
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I don't think having a unique architecture was ever the point of owning a console. A console has the ability to jump right into a game. This is true now more than ever where you will have the ability to load from several different games that are in a 'hibernation' mode.

A lot of people will want a dedicated console for 4k gaming while the PC is available for the rest of the family to use.
 
Derangel said:
Price, ease of use, pop in and play games, etc. You know, the same point it’s always been.
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They're not selling 16GB GDDR6 for less than $550. The reason I figured they would compromise on 10GB 320-bit unified was because of this.
 
I think it's going to be expensive (500 to 600), and I think they're going to really push 2 year Ultimate Game Pass subscriptions that include a Xbox Series X.
 
For the specs it has, $500 is going to be a bargain. The exciting thing here is that with the PS5 not being too much less spec wise, game developers will have a new baseline for games. Right now, they still develop for the Xbox One S which is basically 8 Athlon 64 cores at 1.75ghz (performance wise), 8GB of DDR3, and a Radeon 7750 GPU. They managed to get some pretty amazing stuff from that pitiful spec, and it was slow at the time it launched even compared to mid-range PCs. The XSX will definitely encourage developers to push graphical boundaries a lot further.
 
Does this mean the PS5 will be adopting the vertical block design? In the past both consoles sported the same colors and textures - combination matte black and gloss black mostly - but I wonder how important they (Sony) think similarity in shape is to consumers.
 
For most normal people, I would agree that a console is cheaper and probably just easier/less hassle than a PC for gaming.

However, I like doing weird stuff with my computer. Playing really old games in 5K virtual resolution, high refresh, ultrawide monitors (and Surround in the past).

I like that I can play games from the 90's and they still work. You have mods and things like Quake II RTX. Developing games myself. Consoles will likely never be on the cutting edge.

But the next-gen systems will bring console players up to where PC gaming is now (or from a few years back), with 4K, ray tracing, high frame rate, VRR, etc. which is a good thing for everyone.
 
Thunderdolt said:
Today, yes. By the time release day rolls around, no.
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HA! The only way to get a GPU as strong as the series X is to buy a 2080 Super. That card isn’t going to drop several hundred dollars in six months. A 3800X isn’t suddenly going to cost $200 less by than either

You are NOT building a comparable PC for less than this consoles by launch.
 
Derangel said:
HA! The only way to get a GPU as strong as the series X is to buy a 2080 Super. That card isn’t going to drop several hundred dollars in six months. A 3800X isn’t suddenly going to cost $200 less by than either.
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A 3700 may be out with similar performance by then but yes, it will cost around the same as the console. But this is normal, consoles are sold at or below cost typically. Over time it will get better and PCs will became much faster. But it won't be as quick as previously seeing that GPU generations seem to stretch to around 2 years now. So these consoles will probably hold their performance/value longer than traditionally.

It could also result in cheaper GPUs this go around. Not a guarantee, but it is a possibility. If the 3700whatever costs $500-550, it will be a tougher seller when you can get a console about as fast. Some people may just skip a GPU upgrade cycle and go with a console. Something Nvidia has to consider.
 
Flogger23m said:
A 3700 may be out with similar performance by then but yes, it will cost around the same as the console. But this is normal, consoles are sold at or below cost typically. Over time it will get better and PCs will became much faster. But it won't be as quick as previously seeing that GPU generations seem to stretch to around 2 years now. So these consoles will probably hold their performance/value longer than traditionally.

It could also result in cheaper GPUs this go around. Not a guarantee, but it is a possibility. If the 3700whatever costs $500-550, it will be a tougher seller when you can get a console about as fast. Some people may just skip a GPU upgrade cycle and go with a console. Something Nvidia has to consider.
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It really depends on how long the virus keeps things shut down. Next generation PC parts might end up being more expensive this year if things don’t improve quickly. Though anything made in Taiwan shouldn’t be overly effected.
 
Flogger23m said:
A 3700 may be out with similar performance by then but yes, it will cost around the same as the console. But this is normal, consoles are sold at or below cost typically. Over time it will get better and PCs will became much faster. But it won't be as quick as previously seeing that GPU generations seem to stretch to around 2 years now. So these consoles will probably hold their performance/value longer than traditionally.

It could also result in cheaper GPUs this go around. Not a guarantee, but it is a possibility. If the 3700whatever costs $500-550, it will be a tougher seller when you can get a console about as fast. Some people may just skip a GPU upgrade cycle and go with a console. Something Nvidia has to consider.
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Honestly with how these consoles are shaping up I might just be done with PC gaming. Unless Nvidia stops being douche bags with their prices I don't see the value in PC gaming anymore. Sure all I need a GPU upgrade atm to best the new Xbox but that requires a 2080s which is more then what the Xbox will sell for. 3080 is going to be at least $700 and definitely over $1200 for the TI. Console with their special sauce and features are just going to be hard to beat at the price point when they are released. Sure they going to suck compare to PCs in 5 years but hopefully someone puts Nvidia in their place and GPUs start to return to same prices. Is it going to happen? It could if these console eat away at Nvidia profits since no one will b buying their grossly over priced GPUs by then.
 
vegeta535 said:
Honestly with how these consoles are shaping up I might just be done with PC gaming. Unless Nvidia stops being douche bags with their prices I don't see the value in PC gaming anymore. Sure all I need a GPU upgrade atm to best the new Xbox but that requires a 2080s which is more then what the Xbox will sell for. 3080 is going to be at least $700 and definitely over $1200 for the TI. Console with their special sauce and features are just going to be hard to beat at the price point when they are released. Sure they going to suck compare to PCs in 5 years but hopefully someone puts Nvidia in their place and GPUs start to return to same prices. Is it going to happen? It could if these console eat away at Nvidia profits since no one will b buying their grossly over priced GPUs by then.
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Gotta say I'm almost rethinking my $700 budget for an rtx 3080 after seeing these specs and capabilities on the new consoles. I've never spent that much on a card before but this just highlights how out of whack the card prices are...

I just upgraded the rest of my system on preparation (3900x 12 core, 32gb ddr4 3600mhz c16, x570 mobo, 1tb Samsung pro nvme ssd, etc.).

That alone cost nearly twice as much as the console would if it comes at $500! I do need the pc for work too, but the video card pricing leaves a bad taste in my mouth. It's a shame the Xbox series x can't run unity and visual studio! (half joking...)
 
GoldenTiger said:
Gotta say I'm almost rethinking my $700 budget for an rtx 3080 after seeing these specs and capabilities on the new consoles. I've never spent that much on a card before but this just highlights how out of whack the card prices are...

I just upgraded the rest of my system on preparation (3900x 12 core, 32gb ddr4 3600mhz c16, x570 mobo, 1tb Samsung pro nvme ssd, etc.).

That alone cost nearly twice as much as the console would if it comes at $500! I do need the pc for work too, but the video card pricing leaves a bad taste in my mouth. It's a shame the Xbox series x can't run unity and visual studio! (half joking...)
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Exactly what I am thinking. Nvidia may have to bring prices down again this generation or see some sales taper off.
 
GoldenTiger said:
Gotta say I'm almost rethinking my $700 budget for an rtx 3080 after seeing these specs and capabilities on the new consoles. I've never spent that much on a card before but this just highlights how out of whack the card prices are...

I just upgraded the rest of my system on preparation (3900x 12 core, 32gb ddr4 3600mhz c16, x570 mobo, 1tb Samsung pro nvme ssd, etc.).

That alone cost nearly twice as much as the console would if it comes at $500! I do need the pc for work too, but the video card pricing leaves a bad taste in my mouth. It's a shame the Xbox series x can't run unity and visual studio! (half joking...)
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Yea I got similar spec but with a 3950x. Hell the mb was $350 alone. I kept my wc 1080ti waiting for the 3080ti and I might just leave it at this point. As my syst m stand the new Xbox and I'll be the better gaming machine for 1/3 the cost before even factoring a GPU. Grant It don't need a 3950x and a $350 mb with 32gb for 3600 c16 memory gaming. Nvidia is still killing the PC gaming market with their prices. I honestly believe Nvidia doesn't care and wants to move everyone to Geforce now. We need AMD and Intel to come in and save the market.
 
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If this was a PC, it would be a Microsoft Mac Pro (trashcan). Given I have a FT03 and FT03 Mini, I like it.

Since basically any MSFT game worth anything will likely be launched on the PC as well, there really isn't much of a reason for me to get one. If it booted regular Windows 10, however, I'd be interested for the form factor alone.
 
I planned on building a new AMD machine in the next 6 months, using my old 1080 until the 3080 drops then upgrading. As of now I'm just going to transfer my PC to a smaller HTPC case for home theater control and PC exclusive gaming and grab a OneX for multiplatform gaming. Especially with Gamespass, PC doesn't really hold the "cheaper games card" exclusively like it used to. My 1080 should hold me over for another year or I can grab a used 2070 down the road if I feel the need but I'm hoping the OneX will satisfy my gaming needs for a couple of years then I can drop some serious coin into a new build once PC gaming tech starts pulling away from consoles again. Historically that's taken about 2 1/2 to 3 years before it's an extremely noticeable difference.
 
To quote Harvey Keitel in Pulp Fiction, "let's not start sucking each other's dicks just yet".

- Teraflops are relative. Let's see the games before we declare "it's literally a 2080 Super for $499"

- The word "Series" X would imply a line of consoles, and naturally they'd focus on the most expensive one to maximize hype, which could be $999 or $799. And the $499 Lite version will not be seen until unveiling. Or it might be three consoles.

- Won't play Steam or VR Games, so no HL Alyx.

- There is no free lunch (or free performance

That said, Microsoft needs a hit after the unremarkable run the Xbox One had, and Sony is going to be relentless with the blockbuster exclusives, so MS needs a force multiplier here. And everyone needs to wish them success because their continuing investment in gaming helps the whole space. Xbox Game Pass has also been utterly fantastic on PC. Finally, big props for embracing raytracing - for that alone I'll buy this console.
 
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Auer said:
What's the life expectancy of this thing? 2-4 years?

120fps 4K is just around the corner for PC's.....just saying..
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It still looks like an impressive hardware package: modern CPU, top-end GPU whose release on PC should more or less coincide the console's release date. Far better than prior gen (PS4, Xbox1X) with a gimped version of a 6-month old mid-range GPU and the CPU was entirely enemic. They're still going to do a mid-cycle refresh, but at least they're starting with the bar higher.
 
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