Deus Ex : Mankind Divided

limitedaccess said:
No the cover system is different. In DXHR you could fast switch cover side to side only via the jump key. You could not dash forward cover to cover much less specifically target where to dash to. I just opened the game to verify this.

The new system looks similar to Splinter Cell Blacklist. It is different from the more common cover to cover mechanics.

Edit: Just to the add, Deus Ex The Fall also used point to point cover traverssing on the mobile version (I'll have to check if they retained it for the PC). Although I suspect this decision was largely driven due to mobile game control limitations.
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Agreed. Not of fan of how this looks. I in general hate the auto moving ones if it is over long distances. Few games have a good cover system, and HR was good. Easy to get in/out and didn't take so much control away. The only automatic movement I used was to flip to the other side of a doorway or to another desk right next to the one I was currently behind.

We'll see how it pans out, but if we can control it like HR then that would be fine with me.
 
Interesting how no one has commented on the look of the game. Big change. DX:HR had very stylized visuals... these are significantly less so.

I may be in the minority, but I actually wish they'd bring the previous 'stylization' back. Too late in the development cycle to do so though, at least not without excessive cost.
 
I don't, I could go without the yellow tint to everyyyything and actually have some bloody colour in the game.

Blade Runner imo is a good style to aim for, allow for vibrant colours without forcing one specific colour grading to overtake everything else.
 
UnknownSouljer said:
Interesting how no one has commented on the look of the game. Big change. DX:HR had very stylized visuals... these are significantly less so.

I may be in the minority, but I actually wish they'd bring the previous 'stylization' back. Too late in the development cycle to do so though, at least not without excessive cost.
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How do you mean? I only watched the gameplay once, but it looked exactly like HR to me.

Cover movement... Indeed I really hope that it is like HR and you don't have to target it each time. HR was the first game with cover to make it simple and fluid enough that I loved it.
 
chockomonkey said:
How do you mean? I only watched the gameplay once, but it looked exactly like HR to me.
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Might be time or a replay.

DX:HR had a lot of specific design features that were highly intentional.

All of the upper society people were dressed in "neo-Victorian" clothes.
Yes the color palate was warm intentionally to be counter to the standard cold dystopian color palate.
The visuals were also more simple and streamlined. Somewhere between cell shaded and textured.

I tend to feel the new look just looks like everything else. DX:HR was unique.
 
UnknownSouljer said:
Might be time or a replay.

DX:HR had a lot of specific design features that were highly intentional.

All of the upper society people were dressed in "neo-Victorian" clothes.
Yes the color palate was warm intentionally to be counter to the standard cold dystopian color palate.
The visuals were also more simple and streamlined. Somewhere between cell shaded and textured.

I tend to feel the new look just looks like everything else. DX:HR was unique.
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Main difference I notice is clutter. HR was much more clean looking. Lots of trash & props around in this.
 
UnknownSouljer said:
Might be time or a replay.

DX:HR had a lot of specific design features that were highly intentional.

All of the upper society people were dressed in "neo-Victorian" clothes.
Yes the color palate was warm intentionally to be counter to the standard cold dystopian color palate.
The visuals were also more simple and streamlined. Somewhere between cell shaded and textured.

I tend to feel the new look just looks like everything else. DX:HR was unique.
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The "director's cut" had the gold cut down.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGB27zgAcDU
 
I really loved the art style and direction in HR but I'm not worried about MD: we've only really seen the slums in this demo.
 
imyourzero said:
You would think that the Director's Cut version would take the original and only improve on it, but apparently that wasn't the case. I'm still debating whether to get it or not...
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get it, its better. you'll notice the skin shading is better, the environments have more contrast..


but damn, the AI got a huge improvement. Stealth is a LOT harder.
 
KazeoHin said:
get it, its better. you'll notice the skin shading is better, the environments have more contrast..


but damn, the AI got a huge improvement. Stealth is a LOT harder.
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Yup, it's good. Highly recommended. Nice to have that Missing Link DLC incorporated chronologically into it, too.
 
KazeoHin said:
get it, its better. you'll notice the skin shading is better, the environments have more contrast..

but damn, the AI got a huge improvement. Stealth is a LOT harder.
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Q-BZ said:
Yup, it's good. Highly recommended. Nice to have that Missing Link DLC incorporated chronologically into it, too.
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Yeah the Missing Link DLC really should have been part of the game from the beginning. They "fixed" the boss fights as well (so no more 1-hit-kill on Namar). However, people did like the gold so much that there were some SweetFX presets cooked up for it.
 
OK, thanks guys. I read some of the Steam reviews a while back and people were saying that the DC was based on an earlier, buggier version of code (and that said bugs weren't present in the original HR) and that the so-called improvements made the game inferior to the original. But I trust your opinions more.

If I buy it, it will sit alongside my original (no longer being sold) version of HR and not replace it, right? That's something that concerned me with this game and Doom 3 BFG edition, as I'd want to have both versions of the games...
 
imyourzero said:
OK, thanks guys. I read some of the Steam reviews a while back and people were saying that the DC was based on an earlier, buggier version of code (and that said bugs weren't present in the original HR) and that the so-called improvements made the game inferior to the original. But I trust your opinions more.

If I buy it, it will sit alongside my original (no longer being sold) version of HR and not replace it, right? That's something that concerned me with this game and Doom 3 BFG edition, as I'd want to have both versions of the games...
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DXHR, DXHR: Missing Link, and DXHR: Director's Cut are actually 3 different games. So yes they each are separate entries in Steam.
 
I never got far enough into the directors cut to see... Is the missing link incorporated into it as well as the dlcs? Or is it aptly named?

Regarding the code and bugginess.. I heard the same things about the dc, but I didn't have the issues that others were reporting. Though there was a lot of talk at the time about it.

The first boss fight which I did beat was much improved and it was great having all the dlc and not feeling like I was missing out like I had before.
 
limitedaccess said:
DXHR, DXHR: Missing Link, and DXHR: Director's Cut are actually 3 different games. So yes they each are separate entries in Steam.
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Thanks. I realize that they're separate games, but I just didn't want Steam to pull any shenanigans. Since they don't sell the base game anymore, I didn't want them to just try to "upgrade" my existing version. ;)

I'll pick it up next time it's 75% off. Appreciate the input.
 
chockomonkey said:
I never got far enough into the directors cut to see... Is the missing link incorporated into it as well as the dlcs? Or is it aptly named?

Regarding the code and bugginess.. I heard the same things about the dc, but I didn't have the issues that others were reporting. Though there was a lot of talk at the time about it.

The first boss fight which I did beat was much improved and it was great having all the dlc and not feeling like I was missing out like I had before.
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It's incorporated chronologically, as Q-BZ stated above.

I read that Missing Link wasn't that great and one person said its incorporation actually slows down the game (the pace, not the frame rate) when you get to that part. I don't see how it can be that bad...and if you're going to play it, might as well have it integrated properly into the game.
 
I watched the long gameplay video. There were some things I liked, some I wasn't too thrilled about.

The conversation in the open in front of a bunch of riot cops with your resistance girlfriend about how you were secretly infiltrating the Illuminati might have been the biggest turnoff. They were casually talking about leading a double life under the noses of the people who secretly control the planet with the same tone or care one might use to talk about the weather. I don't remember the writing being especially good in HR - does anyone else think the story was memorable? - and I'm worried about it in MD. Is anyone even going to act surprised when the big guy on the box and in the trailer turns out not to be the big bad?

Adam seems to be carrying a kitchen sink around in his arms now. Armor and invisibility from Crysis, 'nanoblades' that are like the bow from Crysis 3, the bullet time from Max Payne, the Dash from Infamous, and the hand stun-gun is pretty much Mark and Execute from Splinter Cell Conviction. I'm pretty sure I've seen that elbow cannon somewhere before too. This could go one of two ways - if they do it well, you'll feel like an unparalleled superhero who can effortlessly handle any situation with a myriad of options. If not, it could just end up feeling like a collection of unrefined ideas from other games and HR. It all looked incredibly smooth in the video, though.

I liked that the combat seemed tighter. I played HR like a stealth game because it felt like that was how it was meant to be played. Nothing encourages that like plasticy-looking soldiers that soak up entire magazines of bullets for no apparent reason. If run-and-gun gets the first-class treatment I might just have to try that instead of stealth for a playthrough.

I like the series but I'm not sure I'm as on board for the hype train as everyone else.
 
Flogger23m said:
Agreed. Not of fan of how this looks. I in general hate the auto moving ones if it is over long distances. Few games have a good cover system, and HR was good. Easy to get in/out and didn't take so much control away. The only automatic movement I used was to flip to the other side of a doorway or to another desk right next to the one I was currently behind.

We'll see how it pans out, but if we can control it like HR then that would be fine with me.
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I'm mixed about it.

On hand it does take control away from the player and is less fluid in play.

On the other hand it allows much more natural presentation of movement, as well as depiction of the characters unnatural abilities.

It's like Quake, which from a pure gameplay control perspective is rather pure (on that extreme). But if you think about it character movement is rather unnatural and not aesthetically pleasing to watch.

imyourzero said:
It's incorporated chronologically, as Q-BZ stated above.

I read that Missing Link wasn't that great and one person said its incorporation actually slows down the game (the pace, not the frame rate) when you get to that part. I don't see how it can be that bad...and if you're going to play it, might as well have it integrated properly into the game.
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It depends. It feels somewhat different because the design team is not identical, they had some different design philosophies, more experience with the tools, and different budget constraints (being DLC). You also have an issue where it was designed as a stand alone but now shoe horned into the game.
 
Look solid graphic looks alot better then human revolution and the new gadgets and bigger worlds will be good, but i hope they will fix this crap tho looked out of place...

DgF9Jkrl.jpg
 
Especially since the same ammo count is shown just to the lower right of that...lol.
 
New augs are always welcome, but damn it does seem like he'll be a bit overpowered now. I wonder what happened to the world from DX:MD > DX... as there weren't very many lethal augs in DX from what I can remember, mostly utility.
 
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Mortuus said:
Look solid graphic looks alot better then human revolution and the new gadgets and bigger worlds will be good, but i hope they will fix this crap tho looked out of place...

DgF9Jkrl.jpg
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Probably for the HUDless mode they offer. Deus Ex is pretty good about increasing difficulty by removing extra assets.
 
Flogger23m said:
Looks like a bit too many gadgets.
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It'd be okay if you had to choose in the talent tree, but like those nano blades? They have the same effect that the crossbow did. And it only took like 1/4 of his energy! Seems really overpowered for an instakill.
 
chockomonkey said:
New augs are always welcome, but damn it does seem like he'll be a bit overpowered now. I wonder what happened to the world from DX:MD > DX... as there weren't very many lethal augs in DX from what I can remember, mostly utility.
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Flogger23m said:
Looks like a bit too many gadgets.
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chockomonkey said:
It'd be okay if you had to choose in the talent tree, but like those nano blades? They have the same effect that the crossbow did. And it only took like 1/4 of his energy! Seems really overpowered for an instakill.
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It's a demo... even if you listen to the commentary, the guy has infinite health and infinite energy.

He more than likely has all augmentations too... at least all of the augs that they currently want to show. He's packed clearly with every mobility augmentation, hack augmentation, and attack augmentation. Including everything that has to do with stunning or killing, defense (like the new shield), and stabilization.

Talking about a skill tree is ridiculous for a demo that is really just designed to show a large cross section of possible gameplay.
 
UnknownSouljer said:
It's a demo... even if you listen to the commentary, the guy has infinite health and infinite energy.

He more than likely has all augmentations too... at least all of the augs that they currently want to show. He's packed clearly with every mobility augmentation, hack augmentation, and attack augmentation. Including everything that has to do with stunning or killing, defense (like the new shield), and stabilization.

Talking about a skill tree is ridiculous for a demo that is really just designed to show a large cross section of possible gameplay.
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ahh, yea, uh.. good point :eek:
 
imyourzero said:
I read that Missing Link wasn't that great and one person said its incorporation actually slows down the game (the pace, not the frame rate) when you get to that part. I don't see how it can be that bad...and if you're going to play it, might as well have it integrated properly into the game.
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They take away ALL your augs when it starts.
I quit playing the game when that happened, really ticked me off, since I had restarted the game for the 3rd time at that point. If my save is still good, maybe I'll finish it before this one comes out.
 
LeviathanZERO said:
They take away ALL your augs when it starts.
I quit playing the game when that happened, really ticked me off, since I had restarted the game for the 3rd time at that point. If my save is still good, maybe I'll finish it before this one comes out.
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They did the same thing in DX1 when you get captured... so it makes sense. In the missing link there is no reason at all why you would have your shit taken away.

When they put it in the DC, they should have made it more seamless, or did something so it makes sense why you got your gear/augs taken away.
 
LeviathanZERO said:
They take away ALL your augs when it starts.
I quit playing the game when that happened, really ticked me off, since I had restarted the game for the 3rd time at that point. If my save is still good, maybe I'll finish it before this one comes out.
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In the original game, you start from scratch as The Missing Link was standalone. In the DC, you get all your gear/praxis packs back. Meaning you are right where you left off, just with extra gear/augs.

Now, you have to manually pick them up. And reconfigure your augs. So you can choose different upgrades or get the ones you had previously. Took me a few moments to get my gear ready. Had to toss some of the stuff I picked up along the way in The Missing Link in my DC playthrough.
 
chockomonkey said:
They did the same thing in DX1 when you get captured... so it makes sense. In the missing link there is no reason at all why you would have your shit taken away.

When they put it in the DC, they should have made it more seamless, or did something so it makes sense why you got your gear/augs taken away.
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Literally went from almost fully powered > cut scene > we took ALL your shit, get out of prison. Basically at the end of the game.
Maybe it wouldn't have bothered me if I hadn't restarted the game 3 times by then, but that was infuriating.
 
LeviathanZERO said:
Literally went from almost fully powered > cut scene > we took ALL your shit, get out of prison. Basically at the end of the game.
Maybe it wouldn't have bothered me if I hadn't restarted the game 3 times by then, but that was infuriating.
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They give it all back at the end of that mission before you progress, just in case you didn't know.
 
Is there any way to disable the 3rd person view? I found that really jarring...
 
Youn said:
Is there any way to disable the 3rd person view? I found that really jarring...
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tl;dr: No.

Long answer: Considering that when you're under cover there isn't really a better way to see left/right and clear yourself, there isn't a better method.

If you're in first person, you'd either be a) staring at a wall, or b) staring at an incomplete picture of one direction or the other without awareness of any of your surroundings. It's complex. There isn't anyway of making cover work outside of third person... or perhaps having monitors that go 360 degrees around yourself, or at the very least show 180 degrees like they do when you're in third person.
 
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Youn said:
Q and E is normally used to peer left and right, while something like Ctrl is used for duck-cover. This is simple stuff used in tons of 1st person games to great success.

Also the devs admit to going to 3rd being for aesthetic reasons: http://www.siliconera.com/2010/11/1...bout-third-person-camera-and-player-feedback/

It's more likely a console thing...
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DX in generally isn't really an FPS. If the whole game was straight combat with zero choice, staying in "gun mode" all the time might make sense.

Another reason is game mechanics like I mentioned. You get a very different picture and field of view around the player character that you can't get in first person. If you've played DX:HR (which I don't know if you have or haven't), there are plenty of points in the game if you're trying to do a 100% stealth run where you're sticking to cover for minutes a time. Starring at a wall would be pretty boring. Not to mention limiting if you're trying to keep track of multiple guards.

Even the link you brought up essentially says that it's about conveying information to the player. Near the end of the article he notes that the third person camera (for stealth) is a design pillar. There is 'obviously' more than one way to design a game and gameplay. Obviously you don't like the devs design decisions but even if you don't, you can't ignore that it changes drastically the way the game is played. As an example, the cover system allows direct movement from cover to cover, a mechanic that would be extremely jarring at best in first person.

Saying it's "a console thing" ignores the player/gameplay mechanics and even ignores the article you're quoting. Really the only thing he's talking about there it terms of aesthetics is specifically for takedowns and upgrades to give information to the player. It wasn't a discussion about the stealth mechanics which is a disservice to the discussion.
 
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Witcher 3 is making it difficult not to be disappointed with the graphics in all the new games, but I'm still excited for this game. I'm an old School DX fan, so Human Revolution was a welcome revival for me. Glad this game is being done by the same team with the added lessons from HR. May be my most anticipated for 2016 so far.
 
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