Dell U3011 coming soon.

bad144 said:
Depends upon the OS, the video card.
Under windows, with nvidia, there is an nvidia control panel setting "Change flat panel scaling".
Fonts can be better scaled by the OS, but sounds like you've got a visually handicapped case where you'd want graphics scaled too.
Click to expand...

The scaling option only determines how lower than native resolution are scaled. Depending on the implementation on the monitor, having the graphics card do the scaling can result in better or worse quality. The 3008WFP scaler is pretty good so no need for the graphics card to do the scaling.

It's a much better idea to run at native resolution and use the DPI scaling option in Win7 (Display -> Make text bigger or smaller) to resize everything. You want the XP style resize option on because lots of programs still don't properly support DPI scaling or don't have higher quality icons for it so without the XP setting (doesn't resize icons if the program does not support it) some programs will have very blurry icons etc, Google Chrome being one example of this.
 
kasakka said:
It's a much better idea to run at native resolution and use the DPI scaling option in Win7 (Display -> Make text bigger or smaller) to resize everything. You want the XP style resize option on because lots of programs still don't properly support DPI scaling or don't have higher quality icons for it so without the XP setting (doesn't resize icons if the program does not support it) some programs will have very blurry icons etc, Google Chrome being one example of this.
Click to expand...
That' assuming windows. Doesn't resize photos. Causes problems with some program's dialog boxes not keeping text within the box.

So, hardly much better... Depends upon situation, os, objective, etc. Beyond the scope of this thread really.
 
Does this monitor have OSD where I can adjust my RGB colors?
 
How is the AG on the U3011 compared to the AG on the 3007WFC-HC? Worse, better, etc?
 
Anyone have a new coupon they are willing to share or PM me?
 
I had a 15% off coupon that I tried to use today that came to my email.... but got shot down :(

It specifically says it excludes the U3011 :(
 
I got mine in yesterday. It took less than 24hrs from the time I ordered it to the time it arrived :)
 
chong67 said:
Thanks for telling us about the AG coating. I wish you can compare the AG coating to the 3008wfp and the 3007wfp.
Click to expand...

I received my U3011 last night and was able to get it set up and calibrated. As far as the AG coating goes, I think it is a lot better than the 3007WFP-HC. My text and everything seems to be sharp without any issues.

I am not sure what everyone's complaint about the AG coating is about. I think it looks just fine and have not had any issues with it. But I will report this after playing with the U3011 more this weekend.
 
3008wfp coating is alot better than 3007wfp. Way way much better.

Need more opinions on U3011 vs 3008wfp AG coating.
 
They are very similar. If you have a 3008, there really is no reason to upgrade to the u3011 in my opinion. I have both side by side, the only noticeable difference are improved preset color settings and better on screen controls, and I like the matte casing. The AG coating is very very similar if not exactly the same. I'm not bothered by it on either monitor unless my face is within 1 foot of the screen. But I was only slightly annoyed by the coating on my 3007wfp-hc
 
bad144 said:
Radeon hd 58xx reportedly can as well.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evergreen_(GPU_family)
claims all evergreen-based GPUs support 10-bit color, but that may be wrong.
ATI's specs show that the radeon hd 4870 does 10-bit too.
Click to expand...

Hello,

I have a 5870 connected via display port to the U3011. Should I go into anything such as the catalyst control center to make sure it is taking full advantage of this new monitor? If so could you please tell me specifically where to make any bit changes?

THanks
 
boe said:
Hello,

I have a 5870 connected via display port to the U3011. Should I go into anything such as the catalyst control center to make sure it is taking full advantage of this new monitor? If so could you please tell me specifically where to make any bit changes?

THanks
Click to expand...

Check for banding with this pattern:
http://www.amd.com/us/Documents/ramp.psd
See also:
http://www.amd.com/US/PRODUCTS/WORKSTATION/GRAPHICS/TOOLS/Pages/tools.aspx
which links to the catalyst documentation:
http://www.amd.com/us/Documents/48108-B_ATI_FirePro_Adobe_10-Bit_FAQ_R5_Final.pdf
showing the "Enable 10-bit pixel format support" entry if the driver lets you configure it.
 
Thanks for the reply! So the 10Bit is only to improve features of photoshop? If it is just for PS I won't need it since we don't use PS. I did look through the latest catalyst control center installed on this workstation and it doesn't appear to have that setting for the 5870 unless I'm doing something wrong.

I do notice the the 5870 has a darker almost purple tint vs. my 3007wfp out of the box.
 
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boe said:
Thanks for the reply! So the 10Bit is only to improve features of photoshop? If it is just for PS I won't need it since we don't use PS.
Click to expand...
Banding could apply to anything you look at, such as video. Photoshop is just one of the apps that has been tested to support all 30 bits if your video card supports it.
boe said:
I did look through the latest catalyst control center installed on this workstation and it doesn't appear to have that setting for the 5870 unless I'm doing something wrong.
Click to expand...
I'm not surprised that control center isn't showing that setting. However your card may still be outputting 10 bits per channel. Here is a portable bitmap version of that ramp.psd file that you could open without photoshop, for whatever that's worth. I assume you see banding when you open it with a regular image viewer.

Edit, nevermind, forum says "You may not post attachments"...
boe said:
I do notice the the 5870 has a darker almost purple tint vs. my 3007wfp out of the box.
Click to expand...
Do you only see the purple in standard&custom mode, or also in adobe rgb/srgb modes? If you see the tint in the later modes its a problem as you can't adjust it with the monitor.
 
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Thanks - I should have said my u3011 has a darker purple tint. I did adjust it in catalyst so it appears much better.
 
boe said:
Thanks - I should have said my u3011 has a darker purple tint. I did adjust it in catalyst so it appears much better.
Click to expand...
Oh, I see, just that one color.
Still would be interested if you could test banding with that video card
 
Hi. According to the FlatpanelsHD review in regards to the Custom Mode calibration:

"The result is good and after calibration gamma is pretty much perfect and color deviations are very low. But notice that U3011 has an extended color gamut in the Custom Color preset. This means that you can’t use this as a sRGB mode and for most users the sRGB preset is preferably. This is the case because U3011 does not utilize hardware calibration like the more expensive Eizo ColorEdge and NEC SpectraView series. These monitors use a color gamut emulator instead of factory pre-calibrated color gamut presets such as the sRGB preset on Dell U3011. Therefore I also recommend regular users without a calibrator to use the sRGB preset."

Does this mean that this monitor cannot be calibrated in sRGB? Do the people that have this monitor confirm this? I am interested in buying a 30" for graphic design and being exclusively working in sRGB.
 
sound31 said:
Does this mean that this monitor cannot be calibrated in sRGB? Do the people that have this monitor confirm this? I am interested in buying a 30" for graphic design and being exclusively working in sRGB.
Click to expand...
Yes and no. As the article states "This [custom color preset mode] is the only preset that allows you to calibrate with RGB gain, offset, hue and saturation settings." So in sRGB mode, you can't adjust those controls in the monitor, but you could still calibrate by applying adjustments to the monitor's icc profile.

This is a pretty big limitation IMO. If you're lucky and sRGB/RGB modes have good factory calibration, then great. Otherwise your adjustment ability is limited to your software/video card. Not until my replacement monitor did I have reasonable results in those two modes.

Finally a review that touches on this issue between the preset modes (and that also pretty much mirrors my experience with standard&custom modes having worse out-of-box calibration than srgb/rgb).
 
This is the case because U3011 does not utilize hardware calibration like the more expensive Eizo ColorEdge and NEC SpectraView series
Click to expand...
A hardware calibration is no sufficient condition for a color space emulation. Not all displays that offer a hardware calibration also offer a color space emulation. Fixed sRGB and AdobeRGB modes of the DELL U3011 should be well implemented - at least if we take a look at U2410 and U2711 (DELL also avoided linearity problems in custom color mode with the latter one). I will receive our test sample in the next days.

Best regards

Denis
 
So I have a dell 15% coupon that expires on the 31st, and I know that this monitor is around 1399 now I gather? I am building a gaming rig in the next month or 2, and I want a 30" and gaming is most important...I have read over the threads/revies on this monitor, 3007,3008 and the zr30...

Considering my coupon and the biggest factor for me with gaming, do u guys think the zr30 would be the best bet? I know everything has there pros/cons and everyones opinions are subjective, but this is a alot of cash and I wanna make sure I can get the best bang for the $$....

I might watch the occasional bluray on my comp, so I guess having the built in scaler on the dell is a plus....I assume even with the zr30 that the gpu could scale to bluray specs though correct? I need to make a descision in the next few days....
 
Sailor_Moon said:
A hardware calibration is no sufficient condition for a color space emulation. Not all displays that offer a hardware calibration also offer a color space emulation. Fixed sRGB and AdobeRGB modes of the DELL U3011 should be well implemented - at least if we take a look at U2410 and U2711 (DELL also avoided linearity problems in custom color mode with the latter one). I will receive our test sample in the next days.
Click to expand...

Not only that but even when they do have they can be fairly weak and still not able to calibrate the sRGB mode in the monitor. The First version of the NEC 2690 had a weak sRGB that you couldn't really fix in the monitor.

The Dell 3011 should be well implemented after their previous experience, but it sounds like the white point is well off 6500K which is a disappointment.
 
bad144 said:
Yes and no. As the article states "This [custom color preset mode] is the only preset that allows you to calibrate with RGB gain, offset, hue and saturation settings." So in sRGB mode, you can't adjust those controls in the monitor, but you could still calibrate by applying adjustments to the monitor's icc profile.
This is a pretty big limitation IMO. If you're lucky and sRGB/RGB modes have good factory calibration, then great. Otherwise your adjustment ability is limited to your software/video card.
Click to expand...

My knowledge about calibration is quite limited. I want to make sure that I get this right. If I am not lucky and the factory calibrated sRGB mode is not good, but I am still able to calibrate the monitor in this mode using a hardware device, where is the problem? I won't possible get a good result because I cannot alter RGB prior to calibration or something else?
 
The Dell 3011 should be well implemented after their previous experience, but it sounds like the white point is well off 6500K which is a disappointment.
Click to expand...
That's almost cetainly a limitation of the measurement equipment - if a colorimeter without additional correction for the WCG-CCFL backlight was used. But a whitepoint != 6500K wouldn't necessarily be a problem. Important is that it lies on/ near the blackbody curve - everything else depends on your colour matching conditions (which normally aren't very stable in the SOHO sector anyway). Typically one will end up with something in a range of 5000K-6500K. I'm using D50 normlight and calibrated my screen to 5800K which gives a good visual match.

Best regards

Denis
 
sound31 said:
My knowledge about calibration is quite limited. I want to make sure that I get this right. If I am not lucky and the factory calibrated sRGB mode is not good, but I am still able to calibrate the monitor in this mode using a hardware device, where is the problem?
Click to expand...
I'm not a calibration expert but some of the problems would include:
Having to maintain calibration profiles for every machine and every OS install you ever use with the monitor with in order to get corrected results, since you won't be able to adjust any problems with srgb/rgb modes in the monitor. (no set&forget).
Fixing the colors after the fact with your video card/profile can lead to side effects:
http://argyllcms.com/doc/monitorcontrols.html
I'm not experienced with quantifying the side effects, but it reminds me of having to use glasses to correct your contact lenses.
 
Sailor_Moon said:
That's almost cetainly a limitation of the measurement equipment - if a colorimeter without additional correction for the WCG-CCFL backlight was used. But a whitepoint != 6500K wouldn't necessarily be a problem. Important is that it lies on/ near the blackbody curve - everything else depends on your colour matching conditions (which normally aren't very stable in the SOHO sector anyway). Typically one will end up with something in a range of 5000K-6500K. I'm using D50 normlight and calibrated my screen to 5800K which gives a good visual match.

Best regards

Denis
Click to expand...
Prior posts show that delta E for white is far enough out of wack to make white appear visibly tinted. So not necessarily a problem in theory but sure is a problem in practice.
 
Sailor_Moon said:
That's almost cetainly a limitation of the measurement equipment - if a colorimeter without additional correction for the WCG-CCFL backlight was used. But a whitepoint != 6500K wouldn't necessarily be a problem. Important is that it lies on/ near the blackbody curve - everything else depends on your colour matching conditions (which normally aren't very stable in the SOHO sector anyway). Typically one will end up with something in a range of 5000K-6500K. I'm using D50 normlight and calibrated my screen to 5800K which gives a good visual match.
Click to expand...

That isn't good enough for me. I have a NEC2490 which is essentially an sRGB panel and it is calibrated to 6500K. If I switch from my calibrated whitepoint to the panels native whitepoint, the colors look wrong. Correct whitepoint is important to me.

From reports so far, 3011 has measured off and even before that people were reporting a green cast in observations. sRGB modes on wide gamut panels are unfortunately an imperfect solution.

I'll be using my 2490 until it burns out and I don't know what I will replace it with when that happens, perhaps in a couple more years, sRGB emulation will have improved and actually allow color/white point adjustments in sRGB emulation mode. But I would prefer is someone was still building quality sRGB monitors. Wide gamut only benefits a small minority and cause grief for the majority.
 
. Correct whitepoint is important to me.
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The problem is that there is doesn't exist the whitepoint. In the normative documents sRGB and AdobeRGB are defined relative to D65 but that doesn't mean that this is the only right whitepoint (but it should lie on the blackbodycurve anyway). It all depends on your color matching conditions. We must also consider some limitations like observer metamerie and the used distribution function (especially a problem in matching two screens with different spectra) but that leads to far at the moment. Maybe one important point: When using a flexible color space emulation you must adapt your desired primaries chromatically if you want to use an other whitepoint than that relative to which your reference was defined. Otherwise you will get increasing deviations.

sRGB modes on wide gamut panels are unfortunately an imperfect solution.
Click to expand...
On the high end screens with flexible color space emulation you will achieve quite perfect results with no linearity problems. Even tonal values near to the achromatic axis are reproduced very well. When directly comparing with a non WCG-CCFL display we must keep in mind that even a calibration of both screens to the same whitepoint will lead to a different perception. Main "problem" is the 2 degree observer function which limitates in this case (two different spectra). At the same time most non WCG-CCFL screens show some undercoverages of sRGB and don't reach the sRGB gradation out of the box.

There are also some screens with a very usable fixed sRGB mode. Our DELL U2711 showed quite impressive results for a consumer screen.

From reports so far, 3011 has measured off and even before that people were reporting a green cast in observations.
Click to expand...
Prior posts show that delta E for white is far enough out of wack to make white appear visibly tinted. So not necessarily a problem in theory but sure is a problem in practice.
Click to expand...
All reviews I've read so far haven't used the proper equipment for a WCG-CCFL screen. Deviations in measurement can be very high in this case. But as I said: The U3011 is on its way and I will give a quick feedback on the measured whitepoint.

Best regards

Denis
 
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Sailor_Moon said:
All reviews I've read so far haven't used the proper equipment for a WCG-CCFL screen. Deviations in measurement can be very high in this case. But as I said: The U3011 is on its way and I will give a quick feedback on the measured whitepoint.
Denis
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*I* have the proper calibrator for the u3011. But I didn't need it in order to see that white was off in custom&standard modes. If white is only off to a degree that requires a spectrometer to detect it then who cares?. But that's not the situation here.

Also it's not a matter of the observer, the tint, when present, is detectable to the eye in a room with daylight, no light, or warm artificial light.

Also, others with so-called improper measurement tools reported white being off as seen by eye.
 
Simple question regarding this monitor (first time user of WQXGA):
Any advantage using DisplayPort over dual link DVI at native resolution? (GTX 480)
 
loki7 said:
Simple question regarding this monitor (first time user of WQXGA):
Any advantage using DisplayPort over dual link DVI at native resolution? (GTX 480)
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I can't think of a distinction unless that video card+driver happens to deliver 10-bit per channel via displayport but not DVI. The specs say:
"10-bit internal display processing, including hardware support for 10-bit scanout" and some other nvidia specs for the gtx285 go on to say "Requires external DisplayPort transmitter. 10-bit per component scanout requires future GeForce driver support."
 
Also it's not a matter of the observer, the tint, when present, is detectable to the eye in a room with daylight, no light, or warm artificial light.
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We must not underestimate the noted limitations which can (and practically do) lead to some confusion and misinterpretation of many users. But I think mentioning of colorimetrical limitations/ constraints was not a good idea of me. That's a subject that is worth its own thread.

Regarding the U3011 I could only interpolate results of our U2711 which reached D65 in sRGB mode with a DeltaE < 1 (accordingly near the blackbody curve of course). Factory setting was quite far off the blackbody curve (DeltaE > 6) which is typical for the native whitepoint (CCT around 6500K). After the complaints here I'm quite excited to get the test sample. I can of course not exclude that DELL has a problem in their factory calibration for the U3011.

Best regards

Denis
 
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bad144 said:
I can't think of a distinction unless that video card+driver happens to deliver 10-bit per channel via displayport but not DVI. The specs say:
"10-bit internal display processing, including hardware support for 10-bit scanout" and some other nvidia specs for the gtx285 go on to say "Requires external DisplayPort transmitter. 10-bit per component scanout requires future GeForce driver support."
Click to expand...

Hm, I looked around the web and Nvidia's website.. can't find anything about GeForce 400 series supporting 10-bit color through DisplayPort. Only the Quadro.
 
loki7 said:
Hm, I looked around the web and Nvidia's website.. can't find anything about GeForce 400 series supporting 10-bit color through DisplayPort. Only the Quadro.
Click to expand...

I think you would also need programs with special drivers to bypass windows.
 
loki7 said:
Hm, I looked around the web and Nvidia's website.. can't find anything about GeForce 400 series supporting 10-bit color through DisplayPort. Only the Quadro.
Click to expand...
Right, like I said, I only see that extra detail in nvidia's marketing promises for some of their other geforce models. (Note the promise is from old datasheets about future GEFORCE driver support).
 
Guys, I have to say something. The quality control of this panel is remarkably inconsistent. I have one out of the 14 I've seen that is brighter and clearer than the rest. The coating is amazingly transparent. The worst I've seen is a lot less vibrant. Though, with that said, I see that the right side of the screen is brighter than the left. I see this on all of the samples. Could someone please check their panel for me?
 
Im as picky as they come and Im very happy with my unit. Very uniform and very bright and clear. I hardly notice the AG coating and that is saying something.

Most of you sound like apple fan boys. When the HELL are you going to notice a minute bit of variation in a panel.. seriously? returning 14 freaking panels? Cmon man, and we wonder why they cost these products cost what they do...
 
They cost a lot less than you think. The reason I raise this issue is because the U3011 has these problems, whereas the U2711 does not. No one has mentioned Apple and I do not believe they have a 30 incher yet.
 
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