Dead Space PC controls suck balls

Okay, why are we talking about Bioshock in a Dead Space thread? Plus the mouse issues in Bioshock were because of input lag... this is NOT the case in Dead Space. Input lag was fixed by turning off vsync, and a few of us are seeing problems further along in the game with how the guy suddenly turns like the mouse sensitivity has dropped to 2.
 
Well, I mentioned it in passing, and it naturally ballooned into some larger discussion where people got a bit pissy and defensive :)

Just to clarify, the mouse issues in BioShock were due to mouse acceleration, not input lag. Mouse acceleration means the rotation rate corresponds to the rate at which the mouse is accelerated. When acceleration is disabled entirely (which isn't truly possible in BioShock), the rotation rate corresponds only to the distance the mouse is moved.
 
The only term I am familiar with really is input lag. The issue in Dead Space is really annoying, since the mouse moves slower in some places and perfectly fine in others, and I am not so sure why there is a difference at all. Just a screwy port that I hope they fix.
 
Well I just bought the game and now I'm struggling to get it to work without crashing to an "Dead Space has encountered a problem and needs to close." after playing for a while.
I'm now trying to roll back my forceware to 177.83.

EDIT: Now I just got some application error with 0x00000000fsomething blabla with 177.83. A lot of people are getting errors over at EA forums.
 
fornarmr said:
The only term I am familiar with really is input lag. The issue in Dead Space is really annoying, since the mouse moves slower in some places and perfectly fine in others, and I am not so sure why there is a difference at all. Just a screwy port that I hope they fix.
Click to expand...

Is there anyone else that's experiencing this issue? Is there any information about it in the official forums?

The general consensus in the thread is if Vsync is off, it plays fine.

I know I'm not experiencing what you describe with mouse movement.

I'm simply curious if I just don't notice it and it's a known issue or if it's limited to a small percentage of the customer base.
 
Vertigo528 said:
Is there anyone else that's experiencing this issue? Is there any information about it in the official forums?

The general consensus in the thread is if Vsync is off, it plays fine.

I know I'm not experiencing what you describe with mouse movement.

I'm simply curious if I just don't notice it and it's a known issue or if it's limited to a small percentage of the customer base.
Click to expand...
plays and feels fine to me and I even hate 3rd person.
 
Could it be something to do with the way the engine caps the framerate at 30? It seems to me from the descriptions of "slower mousing with lower detail" that any mouse input during "unshown frames" is not being treated appropriately. The more unshown frames there are (due to less detail) the more mouse information is lost.

I'm not a game programmer, but I kind of thought that each iteration of the main game loop would be synchronized with the graphics framerate. But if the input functions are running at different rate, this could lead to problems. Lets say that every time the mouse is polled, it does something like this: xdiff = new_x - old_x where new_x is the current x-position of the mouse and old_x was the x position from the last iteration. If the user is moving the mouse at a constant speed, then xdiff is inversely proportional to the polling rate. If xdiff is used to compute how much the player turns, then it's important that each and every xdiff is accounted for. If the polling rate is the same as the game loop rate then this happens naturally. But let's say the mouse is being polled at 90fps but the game loop is only computing the player's direction at 30fps. xdiff would end up being 1/3rd as much as it "should" be, so the user would experience only 1/3rd of the mouse sensitivity. As the mouse polling rate increases, sensitivity decreases.

It would seem to me that parts of the game (collecting input, rendering to screen buffer) are being allowed to compute as frequently as possible, limited mostly by the graphics. However, some parts of the game are only happening at 30fps, such as updating the character position & direction and displaying the screen buffer. (doublebuffering would of course be mandatory in this case). The fix to this is to make sure that old_x is updated only when the player direction is updated rather than every time the mouse is polled.

This is all just wild conjecture, of course. Do you think I'm completely off-base here or does it sound like a feasible explanation?

If the disabling of Vsync lets the game compute everything at the same rate, then it would 'fix' it, I think. Vsync causing input lag in general is a common issue, though.
 
Forget the mouse and help me with my errors. >.< I'm dying. Anyone playing with XP and what ForceWare are you using?
 
Having an option to utilize a hardware [controlled] mouse option wouldn't have the issue that is bound to the engine's refresh rate. I believe that the devs implemented a software controlled mouse input, which is why polling is limited by what is rendered & polled.

Please correct me if I'm wrong... just stating my experience & knowledge with games after many years of tweaking them.
 
Just got the game yesterday...no control issues at all. First thing I did when I setup my options was turn vsync off. The game is impressive so far.
 
Kaldskryke said:
Could it be something to do with the way the engine caps the framerate at 30? It seems to me from the descriptions of "slower mousing with lower detail" that any mouse input during "unshown frames" is not being treated appropriately. The more unshown frames there are (due to less detail) the more mouse information is lost.

I'm not a game programmer, but I kind of thought that each iteration of the main game loop would be synchronized with the graphics framerate. But if the input functions are running at different rate, this could lead to problems. Lets say that every time the mouse is polled, it does something like this: xdiff = new_x - old_x where new_x is the current x-position of the mouse and old_x was the x position from the last iteration. If the user is moving the mouse at a constant speed, then xdiff is inversely proportional to the polling rate. If xdiff is used to compute how much the player turns, then it's important that each and every xdiff is accounted for. If the polling rate is the same as the game loop rate then this happens naturally. But let's say the mouse is being polled at 90fps but the game loop is only computing the player's direction at 30fps. xdiff would end up being 1/3rd as much as it "should" be, so the user would experience only 1/3rd of the mouse sensitivity. As the mouse polling rate increases, sensitivity decreases.

It would seem to me that parts of the game (collecting input, rendering to screen buffer) are being allowed to compute as frequently as possible, limited mostly by the graphics. However, some parts of the game are only happening at 30fps, such as updating the character position & direction and displaying the screen buffer. (doublebuffering would of course be mandatory in this case). The fix to this is to make sure that old_x is updated only when the player direction is updated rather than every time the mouse is polled.

This is all just wild conjecture, of course. Do you think I'm completely off-base here or does it sound like a feasible explanation?

If the disabling of Vsync lets the game compute everything at the same rate, then it would 'fix' it, I think. Vsync causing input lag in general is a common issue, though.
Click to expand...
Im not capped at 30fps anywhere so far whether using vsync or not. :confused:
 
I have vsync turned off. When I first started the game I saw the mouse lag that was happening at the menu. I turned off vsync and it was gone. But my issue is something else, and it's hard to describe. People have eluded to it exactly on the EA forums. I am clearly not the only one with this issue. This issue I have with the mouse movement has nothing to do with the vsync issue which I fixed when turning it off. I am referring to the actual speed in which my guy turns around, which sometimes, when in more closed off areas slows down by like 50%. Everything other than that feels fine.
 
Vertigo528 said:
Is there anyone else that's experiencing this issue? Is there any information about it in the official forums?

The general consensus in the thread is if Vsync is off, it plays fine.

I know I'm not experiencing what you describe with mouse movement.

I'm simply curious if I just don't notice it and it's a known issue or if it's limited to a small percentage of the customer base.
Click to expand...


YES! Read through this thread. I reported the same thing back on page 4, and several others are complaining about the randomized mouse speed over at the EA forums. Turning off Vsync does not fix this issue, and the game is still unplayable with a mouse / keyboard for users experiencing this problem.
 
Kaldskryke said:
Could it be something to do with the way the engine caps the framerate at 30? It seems to me from the descriptions of "slower mousing with lower detail" that any mouse input during "unshown frames" is not being treated appropriately. The more unshown frames there are (due to less detail) the more mouse information is lost.

I'm not a game programmer, but I kind of thought that each iteration of the main game loop would be synchronized with the graphics framerate. But if the input functions are running at different rate, this could lead to problems. Lets say that every time the mouse is polled, it does something like this: xdiff = new_x - old_x where new_x is the current x-position of the mouse and old_x was the x position from the last iteration. If the user is moving the mouse at a constant speed, then xdiff is inversely proportional to the polling rate. If xdiff is used to compute how much the player turns, then it's important that each and every xdiff is accounted for. If the polling rate is the same as the game loop rate then this happens naturally. But let's say the mouse is being polled at 90fps but the game loop is only computing the player's direction at 30fps. xdiff would end up being 1/3rd as much as it "should" be, so the user would experience only 1/3rd of the mouse sensitivity. As the mouse polling rate increases, sensitivity decreases.

It would seem to me that parts of the game (collecting input, rendering to screen buffer) are being allowed to compute as frequently as possible, limited mostly by the graphics. However, some parts of the game are only happening at 30fps, such as updating the character position & direction and displaying the screen buffer. (doublebuffering would of course be mandatory in this case). The fix to this is to make sure that old_x is updated only when the player direction is updated rather than every time the mouse is polled.

This is all just wild conjecture, of course. Do you think I'm completely off-base here or does it sound like a feasible explanation?

If the disabling of Vsync lets the game compute everything at the same rate, then it would 'fix' it, I think. Vsync causing input lag in general is a common issue, though.
Click to expand...


I think its very likely something along those lines. Every report I have seen on NVnews, EA's Dead Space forums, and from my own experience with the game, the mouse slow downs are happening in sections of the game with low details. It would seem to indicate that there is some sort of synchonization issue happening causing the frustrating controls.
 
fornarmr said:
The only term I am familiar with really is input lag. The issue in Dead Space is really annoying, since the mouse moves slower in some places and perfectly fine in others, and I am not so sure why there is a difference at all. Just a screwy port that I hope they fix.
Click to expand...

So what you are saying is that you are experiencing mouse "dead space" in Dead Space?
 
A couple of others like myself have experienced weirdness with the mouse speed changing depending on the detail levels of the scene you are in. For example, if you are in a low detail corridor space, the controls would respond VERY sluggishly, and when in a more detailed area, the mouse controls would move quite quickly. Turning on the ingame Vsync helped this somewhat, but caps the framerate at 30FPS and also introduces a huge amount of input lag to the game. After playing around with the game again this evening, I finally found a fix and am now enjoying the game in high resolution goodness on PC using the mouse / keyboard combo. The fix is forcing Vsync on under your Nvidia control panel, and then turning Vsync off ingame. Doing this caps the frame rate at 60FPS, and the mouse speed when moving and aiming is consisent through all areas! Just thought I would pass this on to anyone else having the same problems. One thing I have noted is there is still slight lag when navigating the ingame menus, but once in game this doesn't seem to be noticeable.
 
loafer87gt said:
A couple of others like myself have experienced weirdness with the mouse speed changing depending on the detail levels of the scene you are in. For example, if you are in a low detail corridor space, the controls would respond VERY sluggishly, and when in a more detailed area, the mouse controls would move quite quickly. Turning on the ingame Vsync helped this somewhat, but caps the framerate at 30FPS and also introduces a huge amount of input lag to the game. After playing around with the game again this evening, I finally found a fix and am now enjoying the game in high resolution goodness on PC using the mouse / keyboard combo. The fix is forcing Vsync on under your Nvidia control panel, and then turning Vsync off ingame. Doing this caps the frame rate at 60FPS, and the mouse speed when moving and aiming is consisent through all areas! Just thought I would pass this on to anyone else having the same problems. One thing I have noted is there is still slight lag when navigating the ingame menus, but once in game this doesn't seem to be noticeable.
Click to expand...

for most people turning vsync off not on fixes any sluggish controls. also technically its capping it half the refresh rate not 30. of course that ends up being 30 for most people since they used lcds. turning it off in game and forcing it on from the ATI CCC doesnt work at all so I guess only Nvidia users can do that.
 
cannondale06 said:
for most people turning vsync off not on fixes any sluggish controls. also technically its capping it half the refresh rate not 30. of course that ends up being 30 for most people since they used lcds. turning it off in game and forcing it on from the ATI CCC doesnt work at all so I guess only Nvidia users can do that.
Click to expand...

I think he's saying that whatever way Dead Space handles it's own Vsync is broken, and if you want lagless Vsync (which is possible.. it's actually kind of rare that Vsync causes input lag. Usually depends on the game engine from my experience), you need to force it through nVidia.

I suggested trying this in this thread earlier =/ Guess nobody saw
 
Tylerdurdened said:
I think he's saying that whatever way Dead Space handles it's own Vsync is broken, and if you want lagless Vsync (which is possible.. it's actually kind of rare that Vsync causes input lag. Usually depends on the game engine from my experience), you need to force it through nVidia.

I suggested trying this in this thread earlier =/ Guess nobody saw
Click to expand...

Not to nitpick, but this is what you said:

"Make sure you have vsync OFF both ingame and in the control panel, and just to be sure, make sure your nvidia settings are set to allow the game to control everything (i.e make sure it's not forcing any crazy AA settings or stuff like that in the control panel that could reduce performance/compatability)"

This is not what you want to do. You want to force VSync to ON in your Nvidia control panel, not turn it OFF like you had suggested. I should also add that I enabled tripple buffering in my Nvidia control panel, allowing for the more fluid 60 FPS with Vsync enabled.
 
loafer87gt said:
Not to nitpick, but this is what you said:

"Make sure you have vsync OFF both ingame and in the control panel, and just to be sure, make sure your nvidia settings are set to allow the game to control everything (i.e make sure it's not forcing any crazy AA settings or stuff like that in the control panel that could reduce performance/compatability)"

This is not what you want to do. You want to force VSync to ON in your Nvidia control panel, not turn it OFF like you had suggested. I should also add that I enabled tripple buffering in my Nvidia control panel, allowing for the more fluid 60 FPS with Vsync enabled.
Click to expand...
triple buffering from the control panel is only for OpenGL and doesnt do anything for Directx games so your "more fluid fps" is all in your mind. ATI and Nvidia both require third party software to force triple buffering in DirectX games.
 
loafer87gt said:
Not to nitpick, but this is what you said:

"Make sure you have vsync OFF both ingame and in the control panel, and just to be sure, make sure your nvidia settings are set to allow the game to control everything (i.e make sure it's not forcing any crazy AA settings or stuff like that in the control panel that could reduce performance/compatability)"

This is not what you want to do. You want to force VSync to ON in your Nvidia control panel, not turn it OFF like you had suggested. I should also add that I enabled tripple buffering in my Nvidia control panel, allowing for the more fluid 60 FPS with Vsync enabled.
Click to expand...
Just got it.

Confirmed: Vsync is causing the mad lag. It defaults to on and basically unplayable with it.

Turning Vsync off makes it perfectly smooth and natural. How can these reviewers be so stupid/uninformed about graphics technology? Vsync causing input lag is nothing new.. I get it with Doom 3 even worse than I do with this game, yet Doom 3 is a perfectly fine PC game?

Anyone try forcing Vsync through ATI/nVidia drivers? I'd try but I can never get those to work (I remember trying to force AA in HL2 through my drivers with no success).

There is some tearing, but it's very little.

Too bad those early reviews probably turned off a lot of potential buyers.
Click to expand...
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?p=1033200841#post1033200841
 
So why is the framerate 60FPS with the Nvidia control panel Vsync enabled, and 30FPS with the ingame VSync turned on? Just curious, I thought it might have had something to do with the combination of Vsync and tripple buffering enabled through the NV panel. To be quite honest, I usually play with Vsync off in all my games, so all this mucking around with settings is kinda new to me.

Anyways, the game is working great for me now. Looks like it could be a lot of fun now that I have the controls working properly on my machine.
 
loafer87gt said:
So why is the framerate 60FPS with the Nvidia control panel Vsync enabled, and 30FPS with the ingame VSync turned on? Just curious, I thought had something to do with the combination of Vsync and tripple buffering enabled through the NV panel.

Anyways, the game is working great for me now. Looks like it could be a lot of fun now that I have the controls working properly on my machine.
Click to expand...
no because triple buffering from the control panel is only for OpenGL games. also it would not make your framerate go from 30 to 60 even if it did work. the in game vysnc is to blame because for some reason it will cap you at half your refresh rate where using vysnc from Nvidia control panel wont. I wish I could force it on from the ATI CCC but it doesnt work.
 
loafer87gt said:
So why is the framerate 60FPS with the Nvidia control panel Vsync enabled, and 30FPS with the ingame VSync turned on? Just curious, I thought it might have had something to do with the combination of Vsync and tripple buffering enabled through the NV panel. To be quite honest, I usually play with Vsync off in all my games, so all this mucking around with settings is kinda new to me.

Anyways, the game is working great for me now. Looks like it could be a lot of fun now that I have the controls working properly on my machine.
Click to expand...

Just tried forcing Vsync through nVidia, and it does cap it correctly at 60 FPS, whereas ingame is 30.

I disabled it anyway because I still felt minor lag with forced Vsync. Maybe it was my imagination, but just incase :p I didn't have trouble with tearing anyway. Which is weird because the scene I tested Vsync off with I was getting 150 FPS and moved my mouse violently around and got no tearing =/

As far as triple buffering: http://www.tweakguides.com/Graphics_10.html
Enabling Triple Buffering for OpenGL-based games such as Doom 3, Quake 4, Prey or ET:QW is very simple - go to your graphics card's control panel and enable it from there. However enabling Triple Buffering for Direct3D-based games - the bulk of modern games - actually requires more effort. You will need to use a utility called DXTweaker or D3DOverrider (which comes with RivaTuner) for Nvidia graphics cards - see the Advanced Tweaking section of my Nvidia Forceware Tweak Guide; or use ATI Tray Tools as covered under the Advanced Tweaking section of my ATI Catalyst Tweak Guide. Note that SLI users may have problems enabling Triple Buffering and will need to experiment with various SLI modes to get it to work properly.
Click to expand...
 
Tylerdurdened said:
Just tried forcing Vsync through nVidia, and it does cap it correctly at 60 FPS, whereas ingame is 30.

I disabled it anyway because I still felt minor lag with forced Vsync. Maybe it was my imagination, but just incase :p I didn't have trouble with tearing anyway. Which is weird because the scene I tested Vsync off with I was getting 150 FPS and moved my mouse violently around and got no tearing =/

As far as triple buffering: http://www.tweakguides.com/Graphics_10.html
Click to expand...
yeah the tearing isnt bad unless the lights are flickering and then its awful. its not as bad as in FEAR where I thought I was going to have a seizure until I enabled Vysnc. of course all this depends on many things including your monitor.
 
Hey guys, im normally just a lurker but I thought I'd comment as this is a game I'm planning on getting and theres no way I want to use a console controller on any FPS game.

Can someone please try the game with VSYNC on and triple buffering forced via D3DOverrider (comes with Rivatuner), and im suprised I've seen no one mention this tool yet.
It's a great tool that makes sure all games run with triple buffering (in DirectX). I'd never run a gaming machine without it.

I personally play all games with VSYNC and triple buffering forced on as I can't stand tearing. Works fine with every game and I get the same framerate as when I have VSYNC disabled. That being said I have a powerful machine, a gtx 280 and 4gb ram.

I should mention that enable triple buffering does use more memory, and can actually introduce more lag if your rig isn't powerful enough to handle it or memory is at a premium.

Finally, does changing the process priority have any effect on the mouse lag?
 
loafer87gt said:
A couple of others like myself have experienced weirdness with the mouse speed changing depending on the detail levels of the scene you are in. For example, if you are in a low detail corridor space, the controls would respond VERY sluggishly, and when in a more detailed area, the mouse controls would move quite quickly. Turning on the ingame Vsync helped this somewhat, but caps the framerate at 30FPS and also introduces a huge amount of input lag to the game. After playing around with the game again this evening, I finally found a fix and am now enjoying the game in high resolution goodness on PC using the mouse / keyboard combo. The fix is forcing Vsync on under your Nvidia control panel, and then turning Vsync off ingame. Doing this caps the frame rate at 60FPS, and the mouse speed when moving and aiming is consisent through all areas! Just thought I would pass this on to anyone else having the same problems. One thing I have noted is there is still slight lag when navigating the ingame menus, but once in game this doesn't seem to be noticeable.
Click to expand...

I read this on the EA official forums. I haven't tested it out but already have my vsync forced on in the control panel so I am ready to try it out. Capping at 60 fps is no big deal for me I just want to be able to not feel like my guy is looking around with a mouse sensitivity of 1.

Also, any idea how to get AA and AF to work in this game? It doesn't seem to work in the control panel but there is a dead space.exe and a deadspace.exe (space in between) so maybe I used the wrong one.
 
Tylerdurdened said:
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?p=1033200841#post1033200841
Click to expand...

The people that are saying that turning off Vsync in game is not the solution to the problem that loafer and I have... they were referring to the mouse lag, which is apparent on the main menu in the game and when in the game, there is a delay when turning your guy. This is fixed when turning off vsync and it fixed the "lag" problem.

Our problem occured with vsync OFF still. It has to do with looking at certain areas of the game with low textures or whatever it is, which was causing the sensitivity of the mouse to effectively feel like it had dropped to the lowest setting.

I am going to try what loafer suggested and if it works then that's fine with me. Although I do hope they fix the problem with a patch.
 
Don't know what all the fuss is about. I just picked it up yesterday and played about an hour. No problem at all, buttery smooth and responsive.

Must play imo.
 
loafer87gt said:
A couple of others like myself have experienced weirdness with the mouse speed changing depending on the detail levels of the scene you are in. For example, if you are in a low detail corridor space, the controls would respond VERY sluggishly, and when in a more detailed area, the mouse controls would move quite quickly. Turning on the ingame Vsync helped this somewhat, but caps the framerate at 30FPS and also introduces a huge amount of input lag to the game. After playing around with the game again this evening, I finally found a fix and am now enjoying the game in high resolution goodness on PC using the mouse / keyboard combo. The fix is forcing Vsync on under your Nvidia control panel, and then turning Vsync off ingame. Doing this caps the frame rate at 60FPS, and the mouse speed when moving and aiming is consisent through all areas! Just thought I would pass this on to anyone else having the same problems. One thing I have noted is there is still slight lag when navigating the ingame menus, but once in game this doesn't seem to be noticeable.
Click to expand...

Interesting. This must be why mine is going 60fps, because this is how I have it set up. I forgot that I did this while experimenting.
 
Well guys after painfully analyzing the entire thread, I've concluded this one absolute: there's a lot of ball sucking going on here.
 
How in the heck do I enable AA through the control panel? There are two nvidia profiles, one for "deadspace.exe" and "dead space.exe" and the shortcut I have points to the 2nd one, but when I force it, it doesn't seem to work.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top