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Copilot or else! (for OEMs...eventually)

emphy said:
Aaaand as predicted, all that fancy ai hardware will be used to process 24hour/day usage for your profile, on device so they can pretend they're fans of "privacy". The only thing that surprises me here is that microsoft beat google to the punch:

Source: https://www.windowscentral.com/soft...ut-microsofts-upcoming-defining-ai-pc-feature

Company with a demonstrated willingness to put profit margins before user experience integrates the most powerful optimization technology known to man into the os on your device. Whatever could go wrong?
Click to expand...
That is horrifying to a degree I've never even heard of before. I wonder if you can bypass this next level telemetry with a third party firewall? Or disable it entirely? Who in the actual flying donkey balls thought anyone would think this is a good idea?
 
It can be disabled, allegedly. Sounds like MS left themselves plenty of wiggle room on however "much" data they collect when the process is running.
Windows Central said:
I'm told that much of this experience is rendered on-device and does not reach out to the cloud to process information. This is important for privacy reasons, but also for performance reasons. To reduce latency, AI Explorer will rely on NPU silicon to process content that has been recorded. I also understand that users will be able to filter out specific apps from being recorded by the AI Explorer process, or disable AI Explorer entirely.
Click to expand...
 
emphy said:
Aaaand as predicted, all that fancy ai hardware will be used to process 24hour/day usage for your profile, on device so they can pretend they're fans of "privacy". The only thing that surprises me here is that microsoft beat google to the punch:

Source: https://www.windowscentral.com/soft...ut-microsofts-upcoming-defining-ai-pc-feature

Company with a demonstrated willingness to put profit margins before user experience integrates the most powerful optimization technology known to man into the os on your device. Whatever could go wrong?
Click to expand...
Good thing there are still third-party file explorer programs for Windows. The only bad thing is that Windows Explorer is embedded into the desktop system so you can never turn it completely off, which means Microsoft is still going to be snooping on the files you're accessing.
Prince Valiant said:
It can be disabled, allegedly. Sounds like MS left themselves plenty of wiggle room on however "much" data they collect when the process is running.
Click to expand...
It's going to be like the data reporting setting where you can just set it to share "minimal" information instead of turning sharing completely off.
 
Armenius said:
...

It's going to be like the data reporting setting where you can just set it to share "minimal" information instead of turning sharing completely off.
Click to expand...
Not to mention that we're talking about the company that is dark patterning users into upgrading entire operating systems. There will be a strategically placed (as in: where normally a cancel button would be) "no thank you, I would prefer to keep using your creepy ai feature" option when you try to disable it.
 
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This will be what makes me move to Linux, hate to do it, but I draw the line there. At least for now can still disable on taskbar and registry.
 
M$ do new crap things that I don't like.
Fine, turn off or uninstall it, problem solved.

But they add a new key on the keyboard - oh no, another key that I can just unplug physically if I cannot remap.

Fully updated Win 11 here, cleaned from what I don't need or like, of course, both at work and at home.
 
1_rick said:
Article says it won't be remappable, although how you'd know that for sure unless MS came right out and said so, I don't know.

Edit: I swear I read that but now I can't find it. But laptop keyboards aren't usually remappable the way a QMK-powered one would be. Also, I'm thinking that most likely, this will just be a hotkey, like under the hood, it'll generate something like win+shift+alt+C, because there isn't really a "completely custom key" functionality in USB HID as far as I know from the small amount of searching I've previously done.
Click to expand...
There's always pulling the key off and applying a bit of glue.
 
Armenius said:
It's going to be like the data reporting setting where you can just set it to share "minimal" information instead of turning sharing completely off.
Click to expand...

Accurate. "Off" was removed from their UX design vocabulary long ago because it has a quantitative value. There's no ambiguity.

The shift in language to "Minimal", "Minimum", "Basic", etc was devised and focus-grouped to create the illusion of user choice, while having no quantitative value MS can be held to. From their standpoint, "the user can decide whatever they want it to mean", while MS decides what it actually means inside the encrypted telemetry tunnel they don't document or disclose. Years ago after a backlash, they tried to create the illusion of transparency by publishing a partial set of datapoints for the "Basic" setting - which was hilarious to read through because it was still thousands of datapoints being collected.

The shift from Uninstallable, to Disableable-but-not-Uninstallable is part of this bad faith ambiguity doctrine, since MS decides what "Disabled" actually means. Same for updates, with "Security Updates" meaning whatever MS decides it means, evidenced by past Security Updates found to have included components unrelated to system security - almost always without disclosure.

Anyhoo, I knew rough waters were ahead for Windows when Satya Nadella began shitting himself with excitement for, once again, co-opting and weaponizing someone else's innovation (AI/LLM) to breathe new monetization life into a platform he'd already written off as legacy, and not central or even integral to the company's future.
 
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DPI said:
Accurate. "Off" was removed from their UX design vocabulary long ago because it has a quantitative value: Zero. None. There's no ambiguity.

The shift in language to "Minimal", "Minimum", "Basic", etc was devised and focus-grouped to create the illusion of user choice, while having no quantitative value MS can be held to. From their standpoint, "the user can decide whatever they want it to mean", while MS decides what it actually means inside the encrypted telemetry tunnel they don't document or disclose. Years ago after a critical mass of backlash, they attempted to create the illusion of transparency by publishing a partial set of datapoints for the "Basic" setting - which was hilarious for anyone that actually paid attention and read through them, because it was still thousands of datapoints being collected.

The shift from Uninstallable, to Disableable-but-not-Uninstallable is part of this bad faith UX ambiguity doctrine, since MS decides what "Disabled" actually means. This extends to updates, with "Security Updates" meaning whatever MS decides it means, evidenced by past Security Updates found to have included components unrelated to system security - almost always without disclosure.

Anyhoo, I knew rough waters were ahead for Windows when Satya Nadella began shitting himself with excitement for, yet again, co-opting and weaponizing someone else's innovation (AI/LLM) to breathe new monetization life into a platform he'd already written off as legacy, and not central or even integral to the company's future.
Click to expand...


As far as I am concerned, the only acceptable quantity of data collected for any purpose is zero, zilch, nada.

It should be justifiable under the law to defend yourself against anyone who collects any amount of data, by any means necessary.

Nothing else is acceptable.
 
Fifliffl said:
Don't even really know what that means but one of my Arsenal buds on Twitter goes by that name haha
Click to expand...
1714532679400.png

its what lead to the ban of ai in the Dune books.
 
Alright so this is bullshit.

I have had copilot disabled in the registry of my windows 10 VM, but today it showed up on the taskbar anyway.

I checked the registry, The key to disable it is still there.

Looks like it is an "App" this time. I was able to uninstall it.

Still pisses me off that I have to play whack-a-mole with this garbage I DO NOT WANT on any of my systems.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
Alright so this is bullshit.

I have had copilot disabled in the registry of my windows 10 VM, but today it showed up on the taskbar anyway.

I checked the registry, The key to disable it is still there.

Looks like it is an "App" this time. I was able to uninstall it.

Still pisses me off that I have to play whack-a-mole with this garbage I DO NOT WANT on any of my systems.
Click to expand...
when people said they want to be able to remove it they made it so you can. dont bitch about them listening.
 
pendragon1 said:
when people said they want to be able to remove it they made it so you can. dont bitch about them listening.
Click to expand...

I am just pissed that they have the ability to just fucking push stuff to MY MACHINE that I don't want.

That ought to be illegal.

I should be completely, universally and totally in control of EVERYTHING on MY MACHINE.

ABSOLUTELY EFFING NOTHING should happen on MY MACHINE without my knowledge and consent.

EVERYTHING and ANYTHING new should ALWAYS be OPT-IN, not opt-out.

And until that is the case, I am going to complain every single time a company gets heavy handed and tries to push unwanted garbage on me.

They should not be legally allowed to use the fact that they develop the OS to push other things on users. That's a blatant abuse of power. Whenever any company uses the fact that they dominate one market to try to push their products from another market they should be prosecuted under the Sherman act.
 
Last edited:
Zarathustra[H] said:
I am just pissed that they have the ability to just fucking push stuff to MY MACHINE that I don't want.

That ought to be illegal.

I should be completely, universally and totally in control of EVERYTHING on MY MACHINE.

ABSOLUTELY EFFING NOTHING should happen on MY MACHINE without my knowledge and consent.

EVERYTHING and ANYTHING new should ALWAYS be OPT-IN, not opt-out.

And until that is the case, I am going to complain every single time a company gets heavy handed and tries to push unwanted garbage on me.
Click to expand...
it would have come in through windows update or an edge update if your using it. it doesnt magically appear.
lol you should know better.
complaining when they listen is stupid.
 
pendragon1 said:
it would have come in through windows update or an edge update if your using it. it doesnt magically appear.
lol you should know better.
complaining when they listen is stupid.
Click to expand...

They are not listening.

If they were listening, they would never install anything new on my system without me asking for it.

Any operating system should come as a bare-bones minimal set of tools. No ecosystem. No programs other than basic configuration and file management utilities.

Then I the OWNER OF THE GODDAMN SYSTEM should be the one to choose what I want installed. Maybe I'll choose microsoft ecosystem components. Maybe I'll choose a competitors ecosystem components. Maybe I'll choose no ecosystem components at all! It should be MY CHOICE because iut is MY COMPUTER and ONLY my computer.

Microsoft needs to fuck off and get their fingers out of my machine.

By all means, push security updates through Windows update, but never ever never push any "feature" of any kind unless I choose to install it.

Not through an update, not through any other means. Features and UI should remain static and unchanged permanently unless the user purposely chooses to change them.
 
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Zarathustra[H] said:
They are not listening.

If they were listening, they would never install anything new on my system without me asking for it.
Click to expand...
people wanted a way to remove it, now its there.
you didnt ask but you agreed when you installed updates, or left them on auto.
remove edge and set your internet connection to metered, updates should stop and copilot shouldnt come back.
 
pendragon1 said:
remove edge and set your internet connection to metered, updates should stop and copilot shouldnt come back.
Click to expand...

For a short period I used to be able to remove edge. Can't anymore. They disabled that in some recent update.

1722869438837.png


This is in Win10 Pro. I've seen the same in Win11 pro.

It is irresponsible to disable updates as they contain security patches. I'll never do that.

But security updates should be completely separate from feature changes. The latter should always require manual user input to install.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
For a short period I used to be able to remove edge. Can't anymore. They disabled that in some recent update.

View attachment 670612

This is in Win10 Pro. I've seen the same in Win11 pro.

It is irresponsible to disable updates as they contain security patches. I'll never do that.

But security updates should be completely separate from feature changes. The latter should always require manual user input to install.
Click to expand...
oh
lol do it manually then.
https://pureinfotech.com/install-updates-windows-10/#update_windows10_settings
yeah, it would be nice if it was like 7, but its not anymore....
 
The first version of Copilot wasn't half bad for what it was supposed to be. You could ask it to do system-level tasks (disable a microphone in the control panel sound settings app and such), but the new version is worthless. It's literally a link to the Bing AI search. If you ask it to do anything complicated, it just tells you more or less how to do something instead of actually doing it. Even my mom knows how to Google stuff.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
I am just pissed that they have the ability to just fucking push stuff to MY MACHINE that I don't want.

That ought to be illegal.

I should be completely, universally and totally in control of EVERYTHING on MY MACHINE.

ABSOLUTELY EFFING NOTHING should happen on MY MACHINE without my knowledge and consent.

EVERYTHING and ANYTHING new should ALWAYS be OPT-IN, not opt-out.

And until that is the case, I am going to complain every single time a company gets heavy handed and tries to push unwanted garbage on me.

They should not be legally allowed to use the fact that they develop the OS to push other things on users. That's a blatant abuse of power. Whenever any company uses the fact that they dominate one market to try to push their products from another market they should be prosecuted under the Sherman act.
Click to expand...
It's OK Zar, be a good little resource and eat their BS just like the others. mKay?

I just wished their AI was unrestricted, uncensored, and be trained like a Tamagotchi, minus the dying thing, so we can train it to AI assistant, kind of like a little Joi from Blade Runner 2049. :)

joi.jpg
 
1_rick said:
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/202...oard-as-microsoft-adds-dedicated-copilot-key/



Sounds awful, since it's not going to be reprogrammable (except probably on custom keyboards running software like QMK...although probably the number of those that add the Copilot key is probably going to hover around 0.)
Click to expand...
'Or else..' ??

If it becomes a popular feature, both keyboard manufacturers like Corsair and Razer, as well as OEM's for pc systems, will all want to start making keyboards with this key. Giving it a standard location only makes sense.

Of course it will be reprogrammable. All keys are reprogrammable even without a keyboard made to make that task easy. I wouldn't be surprised if it becomes a tickbox to disable it in Windows settings even.
 
GoodBoy said:
'Or else..' ??

If it becomes a popular feature, both keyboard manufacturers like Corsair and Razer, as well as OEM's for pc systems, will all want to start making keyboards with this key. Giving it a standard location only makes sense.

Of course it will be reprogrammable. All keys are reprogrammable even without a keyboard made to make that task easy. I wouldn't be surprised if it becomes a tickbox to disable it in Windows settings even.
Click to expand...
Maybe it can be remapped to ALT+F4 or shut down computer! :)
 
Like this is the shit I am talking about:

1723179289493.png


Where the FUCK did this "Sticky Notes (Preview)" come from?

I sure as hell didn't install it.

Heck, it's not even listed in the "add or remove programs" list, so as much as it pisses me of that it is there without me asking for it, I can't even fucking get rid of it!

Like seriously WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK!?

Don't mess with my machine! If I want to add or remove features or programs I WILL DO SO MYSELF. IT'S MY MACHINE! Only I should be in 100% control of every aspect of it. NOTHING should be outside of my abilities to change it and NOTHING should change unless I am the one to intentionally change it.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
Like this is the shit I am talking about:

View attachment 671538

Where the FUCK did this "Sticky Notes (Preview)" come from?

I sure as hell didn't install it.

Heck, it's not even listed in the "add or remove programs" list, so as much as it pisses me of that it is there without me asking for it, I can't even fucking get rid of it!

Like seriously WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK!?

Don't mess with my machine! If I want to add or remove features or programs I WILL DO SO MYSELF. IT'S MY MACHINE! Only I should be in 100% control of every aspect of it. NOTHING should be outside of my abilities to change it and NOTHING should change unless I am the one to intentionally change it.
Click to expand...
probably came in on windows update. its built in on my insider ed.
1723179867332.png

1723179901506.png
 
pendragon1 said:
probably came in on windows update. its built in on my insider ed.
View attachment 671540
View attachment 671541
Click to expand...

They should not be allowed to add (or remove) anything during a windows update.

Just patch shit that is broken and fix vulnerabilities. That's all a Windows update should ever do!

The way my machine is the day I install it is how it should stay in perpetuity unless I intentionally change it, regardless of how many times Windows update runs.
 
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Zarathustra[H] said:
They should not be allowed to add (or remove) anything during a windows update.

Just patch shit that is broken and fix vulnerabilities. That's all a Windows update should ever do!

The way my machine is the day I install it is how it should stay in perpetuity unless I intentionally change it, regardless of how many times Windows update runs.
Click to expand...
weve been through this. do them manually then.
 
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pendragon1 said:
when weve been through this. do them manually then.
Click to expand...

No, I should not have to disable security patches to have my system stay the same at all times. That is unacceptable.

The only reason for Windows Update to exist is big fixes a d security patches. Any other use of it should be completely illegal.

Microsoft should have no capability to push out functionality changes to me or anyone else, and they should not have the legal right to do so.

I mean, sure, add OPTIONS in the form of programs that users can manually install and enable if they want them, but that should be it.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
No, I should not have to disable security patches to have my system stay the same at all times. That is unacceptable.

The only reason for Windows Update to exist is big fixes a d security patches. Any other use of it should be completely illegal.

Microsoft should have no capability to push out functionality changes to me or anyone else, and they should not have the legal right to do so.
Click to expand...
yeah yeah
not anymore and clearly its not.
 
Zarathustra[H] said:
Like this is the shit I am talking about:

View attachment 671538

Where the FUCK did this "Sticky Notes (Preview)" come from?

I sure as hell didn't install it.

Heck, it's not even listed in the "add or remove programs" list, so as much as it pisses me of that it is there without me asking for it, I can't even fucking get rid of it!

Like seriously WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK!?

Don't mess with my machine! If I want to add or remove features or programs I WILL DO SO MYSELF. IT'S MY MACHINE! Only I should be in 100% control of every aspect of it. NOTHING should be outside of my abilities to change it and NOTHING should change unless I am the one to intentionally change it.
Click to expand...
I got this too, and I found it - inside OneNote as new function...
So if you use OneNote this is now part of it :D
 
Sticky Notes has been part of Windows 11 as a default app since 2021, but in one of the recent Cumulative Updates they updated the app and changed the icon.
 
Teams shows up by default too. And it starts automatically. It's basically malware at that point. ;-)
It's basically Windows life at this point.
All this can be stripped out fortunately.
But I hear you and agree. It should not be allowed to surreptitiously install on its own.
This is where ALL software needs to change, i.e. the opt out option. Should be opt in by default. In this way the shit only comes if you really want it!
 
This is pretty clearly where Windows is going. It's one of the main reasons the OS is still free for people that bought a license for Windows 7 like 15 years ago. If you don't like it, it's probably time to move to some form of Linux.
 
pendragon1 said:
yeah yeah
not anymore and clearly its not.
Click to expand...

And that is why Louis Rossman is right.

This is rape mentality on the part of the tech companies.

A complete and total disregard for user consent.

Can you imagine if other products operated this way? What if your furniture manufacturer decided to break into your home and update the function of your couch? You'd be livid.
 
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