Asrock 775 Dual VSTA Incompatible with Nvidia 8800 series

Discussion in 'nVidia Flavor' started by yevaud, Dec 8, 2006.

  1. androo87

    androo87 n00b

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    Thanks for the beches optimummind, interesting result.

    Were all run after applying the BIOS update?

    Maybe the P35 was trying to send PCIe x16 2.0 and the 8800GT was only having GEN1??


    Anyway - I am just happy to have my new card working!
     
  2. Commander Suzdal

    Commander Suzdal 2[H]4U

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    On another GPU compatibility related topic for the Asrock 4CoreDual-Vsta, I'm wondering if anyone can help me out. Here's my situation.

    1. My 6800GT AGP started artifacting heavily and I was up against a deadline that I needed my computer for. So I went and bought a PCI-E 8400GS locally as an emergency replacement.

    2. I had to back my CPU OC way off to get drivers to install without locking up, but then all seemed fine. Curious at to what the little 8400 could do, I began fiddling with OCing in RivaTuner and found a decent, stable overclock that gave me a little more sizzle. My benchmark scores were averaging about 2/3 the performance of my 6800GT--acceptable for such a weak card.

    3. I rebooted to BIOS and changed my 2X512 MB DDR from 333 back to its rated 400. The funky way RAM speed dividers work on the Asrock, I had to lower it to 333 to keep from seriously overclocking my RAM when OCing my CPU. Now that my CPU was much lower, I figured it was safe to bump the RAM back up and gain some performance that way.

    4. The system booted fine, but as soon as Windows started to load, the screen went black. The monitor had signal, but no desktop. I set the RAM back to 333, fiddled with dozens of BIOS settings, removed all OCs, reset the BIOS to defailts--no change. I could hear the Windows startup sound and tell by the HD activity that it was getting all the way into Windows, but no picture.

    5. Since this was my first reboot after OCing the 8400, I was afraid I might have blown something up. I took advantage of the local store's return policy and exchanged the 8400GS for an 8600GT, paying the difference. No change. I bought a new PSU, going from aging Antec Trupower 430 1.0 to Antec Earthwatts 500. No change. I swapped out memory modules, using one at a time in each DDR slot. No change.

    6. I put my 6800GT back in and it worked, with artifcting on BIOS and Windows boot screens but stable at the desktop by virtue of defaulting to VGA safety mode. The low refresh rate and unaccelerated screen updates were very painful, but it was enough to get me through my project. Any attempt to install a real driver for the AGP card locks up the system.

    7. Project done, I began fiddling again. I finally found that by having both video cards installed at once, setting the default graphics slot to PCI (plain-vanilla PCI), it will get to the Windows boot screen on the AGP card and then switch to the desktop on the 8600GT. I have a Dell 21" CRT with dual inputs, so I can switch back and forth on the fly. So, this works, but it draws extra power, pumps out extra heat, and without a real driver the 6800GT's fan runs at 100% all the time.

    Is there a setting I'm missing or a problem I'm overlooking, or am I stuck with this crazy setup until I can afford a MB/RAM upgrade? I upgraded my BIOS from 1.7 to 2.1 also, if that helps.
     
  3. Darthbart2007

    Darthbart2007 n00b

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    Thanks for all the work you did here Optimummind....but, I guess for those of us with Asrock 775dualVSTAs without another motherboard to do the BIOS flash, we're still outta luck, eh?

    Guess we'll have to wait on ASrock.
     
  4. Optimummind

    Optimummind Gawd

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    No problem, the process was kinda fun. =)

    BTW, if you don't mind the hassle, just do what I did and buy a new mobo from a store like Fry's, flash your card, confirm it works on your 775Dual-VSTA, then return the mobo for a full refund.

    -Optimummind
     
  5. Darthbart2007

    Darthbart2007 n00b

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    Yeah, that's always a possibility...but I do hope ASrock takes this up. They did work out the 8800gts issues, so that was something.

    But I'm nervous...
     
  6. Darthbart2007

    Darthbart2007 n00b

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    FYI, official response from ASrock on this issue:

    "Unfortunately, 775Dual-VSTA (VIA PT800 Pro/Ultra chipset) does not support Nvidia GEN2 mode PCIE VGA card.

    The only solution is to set 8800GT GEN2 mode PCIE VGA card to GEN1 mode. Please refer to the video card manufacture to have further information on how to flash the VGA card Bios to GEN1 mode.

    ASRock America Technical Support
    Email: supportjt@asrockamerica.com"

    Pretty much what I expected, but not so good news for those of us who don't want to go out and buy a new motherboard just to flash the card. I wonder if we could boot up the PC with the old AGP card in (and the 8800gt) and then flash the BIOS ?

    Thoughts, anyone?
     
  7. wizzard0003

    wizzard0003 Limp Gawd

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    Can you post in "Safe Mode"...?

    I would assume if you could that's how you'd do it...

    Your G'Card manufacturer should have instructions on
    how its done... ;)
     
  8. biggles

    biggles [H]ard|Gawd

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    http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1239103
    According to this thread some video card manufacturers are issuing new bioses for their cards. I don't know what the new bioses do but if we could persuade a company like EVGA to do this then the 8800gt would work out of the box with the asrock motherboard.

    If I end up having to buy another motherboard and install it, I would not go back to the asrock because of the amount of time involved.
     
  9. Commander Suzdal

    Commander Suzdal 2[H]4U

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    There's an outside chance it would, since a similar shell game is what keeps me going with my (supposedly compatible) 8600GT. Now that I have a PCI-E card (the 8800GT was going to be my first), I think I'll just make my planned mobo upgrade before I step-up to the 8800, thus avoiding all the drama. MSI 650i SLI board is $85 now after MIR.
     
  10. yevaud

    yevaud Gawd

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    +1:eek: for having the guts to flash the GT with another manufacturer's bios. Hats off to you

    If only the [H] forum deities would grant the power to do so....

    Yeah, the professional reviewers have got to be a little off to do that for a profession. :D
    I bet "sanity" is not listed anywhere on the resume.:p
    Thanks for your contribution to this thread Optimummind. Us incremental upgraders have to stick together....
     
  11. wizzard0003

    wizzard0003 Limp Gawd

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    As I understand it, it's not a MB problem... It's the VIA PT800 Pro/Ultra chipset
    that can't recognize the PCI-E 2.0 signature...

    No other chipsets are effected... ;)
     
  12. biggles

    biggles [H]ard|Gawd

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    Where did you see the MSI 650i for that price? How is the overclocking on that board?
     
  13. yevaud

    yevaud Gawd

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    When something is supposed to be "backward compatible" as Pcie 2.0 purports to be, then the board shouldn't have to "detect" anything. The card should start off in PCIe 1.0 mode, then only move to PCIe 2.0 if that capability is detected. Much like any card will boot into VGA mode even though there is not card specific driver.

    The AMD 2xxx pcie cards are pcie 2.0, and appear to work fine on the VIA PT880/pro chipset.
     
  14. wizzard0003

    wizzard0003 Limp Gawd

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    I may be wrong but, the 2xxx series cards are not PCI-E 2.0...

    From what I see, the 8800GT is the ONLY
    PCI-E 2.0 card that I'm aware of... :confused:

    Correct me if I'm wrong... ;)
     
  15. Optimummind

    Optimummind Gawd

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    No, you're correct. 8800GT is FIRST PCIE 2.0 GPU. ATI's first PCIE 2.0 card is their RV670 GPU.

    -Optimummind
     
  16. androo87

    androo87 n00b

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    Before finding another motherboard to flash on, I tried leaving my 6800GT in the AGP with monitor plugged in, 8800GT in the PCIe and motherboard to to use AGP first.

    Unfortunately it just didnt seem to turn on at all with the GEN2 8800GT sitting in the PCIe slot. Its worth a try tho!
     
  17. Commander Suzdal

    Commander Suzdal 2[H]4U

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    Here ya go:

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130082

    There's a long and very active thread about the board here on [H], it overclocks very well and is one of the few modern Conroe boards with excellent legacy support. The thread's first few posts are updated often with info about memory compatibility and links to useful info, etc.

    http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1164174

    I know the thread title says it's about the Platinum version, but almost all the info applies to both. The Platinum is now $119 after MIR at the Egg, which is also a great deal. It started out at around $160.
     
  18. honestjohn

    honestjohn Gawd

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    I believe the confusion lies in the power connector. The HD 2900 Series has a single 6-pin pci-e connector and a 8-pin PCI-E 2.0 style power connector.
     
  19. lugies15

    lugies15 n00b

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    I just flashed my video bios with the ASUS one posted here in this forum. The card still works so it I think it was a success. Have to wait till I try it in my 4CoreDual-VSTA to make sure.
     
  20. lugies15

    lugies15 n00b

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    I just flashed my video bios with the ASUS one posted here in this forum. The card still works so it I think it was a success. Have to wait till I try it in my 4CoreDual-VSTA to make sure.

    *************************************************************************************

    It works great! No problems at all. Games run at highest settings fine. Not as good as I was hoping but I guess that is what I get for getting a cheap processor and memory.

    3dmark 2005 - 7800
    3dmark 2006 - 5600

    Pentium D 2.8
    2Gb DDR2 667
    MSI 8800GT:cool:
    Vista x64 Ultimate
     
  21. Optimummind

    Optimummind Gawd

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    I think your memory is fine but your CPU is definitely holding you back. That score is even lower than my old 1900XT 512MB running with a E6600 2.4GHz on an old VIA PT880Pro chipset (ASRock 775Dual-VSTA).

    Since you can reuse most of your parts, I say just buy a new motherboard and a Core 2 CPU. You'll see your score go beyond 10,000.

    -Optimummind
     
  22. coldpower27

    coldpower27 [H]ard|Gawd

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    Well since he already has the 4Core-VSTA he can just up the processors a notch to say a E2180 or E4600 and that would bring his processing power up to speed. He can even get a Q6600 if he really wanted.
     
  23. coldpower27

    coldpower27 [H]ard|Gawd

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    So, umm which driver set works then with the AsRock without flashing because if it worked with 1 set then a another set breaking it means, you can still use the old set right?
     
  24. Optimummind

    Optimummind Gawd

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    I believe the problem is different from the 8800GTS problem. AFAIK, the 8800GTS allowed one to boot their PC and enter Safe Mode. When the user reached the normal desktop, the 8800GTS would crash the system before the nVIDIA driver update.

    With the 8800GT, the PC won't even boot up at all and you get a blank, dark screen. That's why we had to flash the BIOS on the 8800GT on a different mobo and reinstall the 8800GT onto the 775Dual-VSTA.

    -Optimummind
     
  25. water1

    water1 Gawd

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  26. Optimummind

    Optimummind Gawd

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    You might want to give a call to eVGA tech support. They pick up the phone pretty fast based on my experience.

    -Optimummind
     
  27. wizzard0003

    wizzard0003 Limp Gawd

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    If it means anything, I emailed Asrock asking about compatability
    with mine (939Dual-SATA2)...

    Here's what they said:

    From: ASRock America Technical Support

    Hope that helps.. :)
     
  28. jewwe

    jewwe n00b

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    I just recieved my Inno3D 8800GT today and guess what? Yep, it didn't work either. :(

    I tried plugging in a AGP card along with the 8800GT but seems the Asrock mobo isnt too happy about that - Would be nice to be able to flash the card from my own computer, by just having the card in and using another card as primary. Now I have to go out and find another computer that can actually handle the card and flash from there. Either that, or upgrade to the notorious Gigabyte P35 motherboard :)

    I'm glad that I found this thread - [H]ardOCP has always been a fav. :D
     
  29. LycosV

    LycosV n00b

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    Can somebody post a copy of the unmodified ASUS 8800gt bios? I'd like to see if I can track down the changes they made so I can modify my MSI bios instead of flashing it with the ASUS one. Thanks.
     
  30. androo87

    androo87 n00b

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  31. Darthbart2007

    Darthbart2007 n00b

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    Hello all...well, I went ahead and bought an EVGA 8800GT card because Optimummind who posted here earlier said he received a flash update from them, and I have an ASrock 775DUAL-VSTA which is not compatible. However--I just contacted EVGA support and they say, nope, we don't have that?? :mad:

    Optimumind, if you're still monitoring this forum, can you let me know who you contacted at EVGA?

    -Darthbart
     
  32. Optimummind

    Optimummind Gawd

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    Sure, he's a product manager from the motherboard division, not the GPU division. His name is Everardo Parra. When you call eVGA, ask the GPU guy to transfer to the mobo division and ask for him.

    =Optimummind
     
  33. Darthbart2007

    Darthbart2007 n00b

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    Why thank you sir! I will do that.
     
  34. Darthbart2007

    Darthbart2007 n00b

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    Optimummind:

    With a week or so under your belt with the 8800GT and the ASrock, how are you enjoying it?

    Still holding up OK?
     
  35. LycosV

    LycosV n00b

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    Sounds good. I hope they release the new version before my card gets here. *crosses fingers*
     
  36. Darthbart2007

    Darthbart2007 n00b

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    Well, so much for the vaunted EVGA support.

    I called and they said, "We have no official BIOS for the 8800GT at this time." Even though I said someone had spoken to Mr. Parra in product management, all they could say was, "We don't have it."

    So, I may just flash with the ASUS bios published here on an earlier page (the same one Optimummind used) and simply be sure to keep a backup of the EVGA 8800GT native BIOS just in case.

    ...or should I wait for Makve to update Nibitor? Same difference??

    ...or should I call this guy directly?

    ugh :(
     
  37. Optimummind

    Optimummind Gawd

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    If you PM me your email address, i'll send you my eVGA modified BIOS. I also sent my original and modified GEN1 BIOS to mvktech 2 weeks ago and he said he'll make the feature available soon after studying the files. So if you have the same eVGA 8800GT KO, then he has the same file as he got it from me.

    -Optimummind
     
  38. Optimummind

    Optimummind Gawd

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    Yes, it's running great and stable. I've tested it out on these games: Crysis retail, The Witcher, Vampire The Masquerade Bloodlines, Stalker, and Hellgate London. I can play Crysis at "High" settings for everything except for Shaders (Medium) and Shadows (Medium) at 1280x1024 and there is no stutters or jerkiness. :D

    I thought I would have a problem with my 480W Antec NeoPower PSU, but it keeps the voltages within 3% on all rails and the entire system is stable (mobo + CPU + 2GB DDR2-800 + 4 HDD's + 1 PCI audio card + 1 DVD burner + 3 case fans + Koolance Exos 1 watercooling system).

    I was even able to overclock the card stably at 700MHz core, 2000MHz GDDR3, and 1688MHz shader (I didn't try shader overclocking yet). The only downside is that the stock cooler doesn't do an adequate job at cooling. My room is kind of warm even during winter (southern California) and my idle temperature is 52 C for the core and up to 82 C on load during Crysis (measured using Rivatuner v2.06 and ForceWare 169.02).

    My plan is to remove the Koolance GPU waterblock off my old 1900XT 512MB and put it on the eVGA 8800GT with some copper heatsinks. I'm also going to place my PCI slot GPU fans as it dropped down the temperature of the PWM modules on the 1900XT by 20 C!!!

    BTW, I went to Fry's tonight and I saw about 10 boxes of the regular eVGA 8800GT for $269.00.

    -Optimummind
     
  39. Darthbart2007

    Darthbart2007 n00b

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    Optimummind:

    I appreciate your offer, however I have the straight 8800GT from EVGA...decided to save a few bucks for the flashing that I would have to do with a computer place around here (~$30).

    So I may be out of luck there...not sure that they'll be compatible...but I do appreciate it!!

    You used the ASUS 8800gt GEN1 BIOS that were posted by androo earlier, right? If you had success, I'm pretty comfortable using them for my own...and of course, I'll back up the existing BIOS, just in case.

    -darthbart
     
  40. Commander Suzdal

    Commander Suzdal 2[H]4U

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    I've been in communication with Asrock tech support and I still can't get a normal PCI-E card to work on my 4CoreDual-Vsta without having an AGP card installed at the same time. I had it working, then because I had to lower my CPU OC to get the PCI-E card going, I decided to bump my DDR from 333 back up to 400 in the BIOS. That's when the PCI-E card started booting to a blank screen, and changing the BIOS back to DDR333 didn't fix it.

    From that point on, the only thing of the many I've tried that works is to set the default graphics slot to PCI and have an AGP and PCI-E card both installed. Then I set the PCI-E card to primary in the control panel and disable extending the desktop to the AGP card. In that setup, it POSTs on the AGP card and loads Windows, then the PCI-E card becomes active once it reaches the desktop.

    They gave me one list of steps to follow and I tried it without success. I reported my results and I'm still waiting for a second reply from them. So it looks like I'm going to need to change out my RAM and my motherboard before I can get PCI-E working properly at all, let alone an 8800GT. :mad: