Windows 11 leak reveals new UI, Start menu, and more (UPDATE - added source for Windows 10 retirement date)

Smoblikat

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Wow, looks like some combination of crapples garbage UI paired with a driverless video card, considering theres MAYBE 8 colors total on that screenshot, and theyre all washed out pastels. I might lose it if they move the start button from the lower left corner, opening start and showing the desktop are some of the most convenient operations as you dont really need to be accurate. Opening the start menu just means moving the mouse as low and left as it goes, and showing the desktop is doing the same on the right side, pretty easy.
 

auntjemima

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After reading the comments about vista xp 7 8 here.

MS really should move to a Linux base... and offer 2 or 3 official microsoft DEs. lol

Windows Classic DE.... can look just like 7
Windows X DE... can look just like 10
Windows Touch... can be whatever they are cooking now.

Really even if they are not going with a Linux base... nothing stopping Microsoft from doing that anyway. I never understood why Microsoft didn't just add a couple UI choices. Classic(slim) Modern and touch. I mean it would shut everyone up about their UI.
The word you are looking for is "choice" and they don't offer that.
 

Lakados

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I added a source for the date of retirement of Windows 10 in the OP, direct from Microsoft.
Just like they no longer support Windows 10 1903 and older, 20H2 and 21H1 had to have an end date as well. I mean there very well could be some serious under the hood changes that warrant calling it 11, but until MS releases some solid info on core changes at the bottom end that it does I am thinking the name is a reaction to Apple who is no longer using an OSX moniker and install have transitioned to OS11.
 

Lakados

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They were very lenient on the requirements tho. New computer still come with a boatload of shit like McAfee. I just ordered a new laptop from dell and the first thing I am going to do is do a clean install of windows.
But at least the new McAfee stuff is way lighter than the old stuff. It forced many of the AV providers to seriously up their game because the agreements basically cut them off completely, a number of them actually sued the OEM's and Microsoft over those requirements because they felt unfairly targeted. Then when Microsoft stepped up their Windows Defender software they got sued even more mostly from Norton who felt they could no longer compete at all, which really I mean good riddance... But I agree a clean install is step 1, followed by licensing it off of Home and onto anything else because sweet Jesus... I can only handle so many variants of Candy Crush.
 

Armenius

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Just like they no longer support Windows 10 1903 and older, 20H2 and 21H1 had to have an end date as well. I mean there very well could be some serious under the hood changes that warrant calling it 11, but until MS releases some solid info on core changes at the bottom end that it does I am thinking the name is a reaction to Apple who is no longer using an OSX moniker and install have transitioned to OS11.
Did you look at the link and the screenshot? The retirement date for 21H1 is listed as 12/13/2022. The top section explicitly says "Windows 10 Home and Pro" instead of the feature version and even lists the start date as the retail date for the OS. Windows 10 itself is being retired, not some future feature version.
 

OFaceSIG

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I wish my kids didn't play fortnite or Roblox.. both of those are the only things keeping me on windows.

I mean, how the hell does fortnite not work in Linux? It works across cell phones, consoles and PC's all together.... But no Linux. Crazy.
Linux on the desktop for consumers has a smaller user base than Mac. It's too niche. It'll never be mainstream unless Microsoft abandons windows. Servers/appliances/etc I get it. Not on the desktop.
 

auntjemima

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Linux on the desktop for consumers has a smaller user base than Mac. It's too niche. It'll never be mainstream unless Microsoft abandons windows. Servers/appliances/etc I get it. Not on the desktop.
Oh, I get why. I just don't like it lol
 

MaZa

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Why the gate keeping? Just because something is simpler and accesible to more people does not make it worse. It brings more people into the ecosystem and puts more things in a single place (for the average user, not anyone on this forum obviously).

Because when something is "simplified" it just matters to people who use their PC's just for browsing the web and launching games. But for power users or even just enthusiasts who are not on power user level but do occasionally need to go deeper into the Windows settings such "simplification" just means things you need are more hidden away. Good example of this is the Sound Control Panel in Windows 10. Previously I could just right click the Speaker icon in bottom right and open it. Now I have to right click it, open a DIFFERENT Sound Settings window (which is absolutely useless for anything else but switch output device), STRETCH THE BLOODY WINDOW BIGGER until I see the blue hotlink for the good old Sound Control Panel on the right.

So much for the "simplification", FFS.
 

Lakados

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Did you look at the link and the screenshot? The retirement date for 21H1 is listed as 12/13/2022. The top section explicitly says "Windows 10 Home and Pro" instead of the feature version and even lists the start date as the retail date for the OS. Windows 10 itself is being retired, not some future feature version.
Well, I didn't see that part initially, so yeah YAY perhaps a real new version. But there is still a 3-year gap between the end of support for 21H1 and Windows 10 Home and Pro so I guess the real question is what are the versions that are filling in that gap.
 

Eulogy

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Because when something is "simplified" it just matters to people who use their PC's just for browsing the web and launching games. But for power users or even just enthusiasts who are not on power user level but do occasionally need to go deeper into the Windows settings such "simplification" just means things you need are more hidden away. Good example of this is the Sound Control Panel in Windows 10. Previously I could just right click the Speaker icon in bottom right and open it. Now I have to right click it, open a DIFFERENT Sound Settings window (which is absolutely useless for anything else but switch output device), STRETCH THE BLOODY WINDOW BIGGER until I see the blue hotlink for the good old Sound Control Panel on the right.

So much for the "simplification", FFS.
I would expect, by now (6 years in the wild), that "power users" would know the shortcuts to where they need to go. It's really simple - most advanced settings get to just by hitting the windows key and start typing what you want (i.e. the setting you're complaining about, literally press win key, type "sound" and it's the 2nd item).
 

Lakados

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Bleeping Computer has a decent rundown on the leaks
https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/ne...-what-we-know-so-far-about-microsofts-new-os/
https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/ne...may-be-unveiled-next-week-heres-what-we-know/

The control panel does look a lot better, so hopefully, they are properly unifying the "Settings" and "Control Panel" Interfaces because having to bounce between them depending on the task was a PITA that should never have been a thing.

There is also a strong chance that the leaked Win 11 ISO that is out in the wild currently has been modified by the Chinese Leakers so it's recommended that if you are going to play with it you do so in a clean and isolated environment.

EDIT:
Supposedly many of the features that are in 11, are currently in the new builds posted to the insider channel, including improved settings panels, improvements to the audio interface, and better GPU control, (hope it fixes my Optimus problems on my laptop)
 
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pendragon1

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I would expect, by now (6 years in the wild), that "power users" would know the shortcuts to where they need to go. It's really simple - most advanced settings get to just by hitting the windows key and start typing what you want (i.e. the setting you're complaining about, literally press win key, type "sound" and it's the 2nd item).
or he could pin it but i think he'd rather bitch about it.
 

pendragon1

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Bleeping Computer has a decent rundown on the leaks
https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/ne...-what-we-know-so-far-about-microsofts-new-os/
https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/ne...may-be-unveiled-next-week-heres-what-we-know/

The control panel does look a lot better, so hopefully, they are properly unifying the "Settings" and "Control Panel" Interfaces because having to bounce between them depending on the task was a PITA that should never have been a thing.

There is also a strong chance that the leaked Win 11 ISO that is out in the wild currently has been modified by the Chinese Leakers so it's recommended that if you are going to play with it you do so in a clean and isolated environment.
the screenshots in that second link do look like what my system looks like. but that centered taskbar thing isnt present, yet?, and windows/folders are not rounded like macos.

somethings not right with the screen shots in the first link:
rounded corners
1623786852790.png


not rounded corners
1623786895479.png


ms isnt going to jump back and forth like that and non of the pic in the second link have them. the second link looks pretty accurate based on my insider version....
 

Lakados

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the screenshots in that second link do look like what my system looks like. but that centered taskbar thing isnt present, yet?, and windows/folders are not rounded like macos.

somethings not right with the screen shots in the first link:
rounded corners
View attachment 366443

not rounded corners
View attachment 366444

ms isnt going to jump back and forth like that and non of the pic in the second link have them. the second link looks pretty accurate based on my insider version....
In one of the hundreds of articles popping up, I saw a screenshot that lets you choose between left and center-aligned for the task bar I just cant find it now.

The Verge article has the following notes though:

"If you don’t want the app icons and Start menu centered, there’s an option to move them all back to the left-hand side"

"Microsoft is also using rounded corners throughout Windows 11. These are visible in context menus, and around apps and the File Explorer. The Start menu itself also includes rounded corners. This is still an early version of Windows 11 that has leaked, so not everything is included yet."

so the rounded and nonrounded screenshots may be less of a problem and more a delineation between the new 11 interfaces (rounded) and the stuff ported over from 10 they haven't yet updated for the new interface (nonrounded). After all these screenshots are from a version of 11 leaked out through China, there is no ability to know what stage that leak is in or how old of a version it actually is. Lots of unknowns there and Microsoft isn't saying much so probably just have to wait for the actual press release.
 
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Aurelius

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The irony of folks complaining "this looks like a Mac:" macOS has the benefit of two decades of refinement, not to mention just... well, more taste. You'd probably enjoy a Mac using Big Sur or Monterey more than Windows 11 (or whatever it's called), provided this is how Microsoft's OS ships.

Also, now is definitely not the time for Microsoft to live up to its "every other version of Windows sucks" reputation. Not that everyone will be using a Mac, but Apple definitely enjoyed the influxes of people during the Vista and Windows 8 days.
 

Smoblikat

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classy choice, bit retarded though....
View attachment 366446

LOL, im going to hope this isnt the video ive sent to some work people, because I certainly never bothered to check the description before, just find a link and send it off :p

I havent had a chance to sub to Poppas channel yet, but based on this introduction, I am expecting nothing but highly intellectual content, with a specific focus on deep introspective and the ability to communicate your thoughts effectively to others.
 

Lakados

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Windows needs to decide if it's a tablet os or a computer os.

Apple's figured it out.
Apple figured out how to build a store than wrap an OS around it, Microsoft doesn't have that luxury. They tried and got roasted for it, Microsoft doesn't have the necessary control over the developers out there to pull it off so even their new OS's are hampered by software from 15 years earlier and until they can find a solution for that, this is the sorts of UI's we're going to get.
 

pendragon1

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In one of the hundreds of articles popping up, I saw a screenshot that lets you choose between left and center-aligned for the task bar I just cant find it now.

The Verge article has the following notes though:

"If you don’t want the app icons and Start menu centered, there’s an option to move them all back to the left-hand side"

"Microsoft is also using rounded corners throughout Windows 11. These are visible in context menus, and around apps and the File Explorer. The Start menu itself also includes rounded corners. This is still an early version of Windows 11 that has leaked, so not everything is included yet."

so the rounded and nonrounded screenshots may be less of a problem and more a delineation between the new 11 interfaces (rounded) and the stuff ported over from 10 they haven't yet updated for the new interface (nonrounded). After all these screenshots are from a version of 11 leaked out through China, there is no ability to know what stage that leak is in or how old of a version it actually is. Lots of unknowns there and Microsoft isn't saying much so probably just have to wait for the actual press release.
yeah its in one of the links you posted, i dont have that option(yet?).
maybe, but not yet in the version im on, although i did put off an update this morning until overnight tonight...
 

Smoblikat

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Apple figured out how to build a store than wrap an OS around it, Microsoft doesn't have that luxury. They tried and got roasted for it, Microsoft doesn't have the necessary control over the developers out there to pull it off so even their new OS's are hampered by software from 15 years earlier and until they can find a solution for that, this is the sorts of UI's we're going to get.

Well, to be fair all the store stuff is "fairly" new. IIRC, the app store wasnt released until the final update for Snow Leopard, which is 10.6.8 (2010ish). Before that, apple made (in their own appley way) pretty decent desktop operating systems. While I have MANY MANY problems with almost all of apples equipment (Being the sole network and system admin for an all apple organization opens your eyes to more than just daily use of a personal device), I would still say that Tiger*/Snow Leopard (get outta here with that 10.5 nonsense) is unquestionably the single best GUI for a Unix/Linux OS ever produced. Period.

EDIT - Got my big kitties mixed up.
 
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Armenius

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The irony of folks complaining "this looks like a Mac:" macOS has the benefit of two decades of refinement, not to mention just... well, more taste. You'd probably enjoy a Mac using Big Sur or Monterey more than Windows 11 (or whatever it's called), provided this is how Microsoft's OS ships.

Also, now is definitely not the time for Microsoft to live up to its "every other version of Windows sucks" reputation. Not that everyone will be using a Mac, but Apple definitely enjoyed the influxes of people during the Vista and Windows 8 days.
I have used several different iterations of MacOS over the years and I hated every version of it. It keeps getting worse by the looks of it. Taste is subjective. I, for one, hate the floaty bubbly look of it and always despised the M/R/C buttons being in the top-left even before I was introduced to Windows.
 

Lakados

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Well, to be fair all the store stuff is "fairly" new. IIRC, the app store wasnt released until the final update for Snow Leopard, which is 10.6.8 (2010ish). Before that, apple made (in their own appley way) pretty decent desktop operating systems. While I have MANY MANY problems with almost all of apples equipment (Being the sole network and system admin for an all apple organization opens your eyes to more than just daily use of a personal device), I would still say that Lion/Snow Leopard (get outta here with that 10.5 nonsense) is unquestionably the single best GUI for a Unix/Linux OS ever produced. Period.
Yeah the only thing that keeps managing the Apple devices here bearable is my Jamf subscription and my apple caching servers. I really wish Apple would learn how to implement a decent print management setup, every printer I have here hates Mac's and it seems to get worse every year.
 

Smoblikat

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Yeah the only thing that keeps managing the Apple devices here bearable is my Jamf subscription and my apple caching servers. I really wish Apple would learn how to implement a decent print management setup, every printer I have here hates Mac's and it seems to get worse every year.

Just wait until the new OS breaks the ability to request DHCP over wifi (good thing apple hasnt produced a laptop with a NIC in almost a decade!!) on the latest firmware for the wifi controller, you can choose to downgrade your entire setup across all sites (In my case, Aruba OS V6.5 works fine with all crapple devices, but anything newer than that doesnt), you can statically assign the IP of thousands of devices by hand (ipads too, fun!), or you can find some bastardized workaround that makes my skin crawl, but technically works!

I have an Xserve that I decomissioned that has a 10.6 server unlimited license, I just wish they still produced a server OS instead of the "server app" :/
 

Lakados

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Just wait until the new OS breaks the ability to request DHCP over wifi (good thing apple hasnt produced a laptop with a NIC in almost a decade!!) on the latest firmware for the wifi controller, you can choose to downgrade your entire setup across all sites (In my case, Aruba OS V6.5 works fine with all crapple devices, but anything newer than that doesnt), you can statically assign the IP of thousands of devices by hand (ipads too, fun!), or you can find some bastardized workaround that makes my skin crawl, but technically works!

I have an Xserve that I decomissioned that has a 10.6 server unlimited license, I just wish they still produced a server OS instead of the "server app" :/
Android already did, you can no longer get DHCP from an enterprise network (radius enabled) without a valid 3'rd party security certificate, it won't accept the self-signed one so I need to learn how to do that fast. I don't really care if my two Android users have to use the guest wifi for their phones, Android is a security mess, and that's a better place for them to begin with but if all my iOS devices lose connectivity I am in for a really bad day. I need to get on it faster than not because if they roll that "feature" out to ChromeOS I am just done.
 

hity645

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I'll hold back a lot of venom here and just try to go with what is contrary to UI design stuffs.


"The new Xbox app is now integrated into Windows 11"
No. Should be optional anyway and not in memory, not everyone games.
This was very annoying in Windows 10. I had issues for weeks with my ADID at work. I kept getting "account locked" messages or my password simply would not take. Our Windows dev team looked into the issue and saw that I had tens of thousands of bad password attempts causing my account to temporarily get locked. I had used a workstation in a remote building and used my ADID to get through our proxy clicking "remember password". That workstation, even though I was not using it, was using that password through Xbox gaming service. When I changed my password a few weeks later it kept using the saved one to try and query the MS servers through that Xbox service, thus causing timeouts on my account due to failed password attempts.

If I want Xbox...I'll get Xbox and anything else related with it.
 

Ur_Mom

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Love/Hate it. I like the rounded corners, center icons, etc.. However, I like other versions of Windows for their simplicity, their function over form, etc.. I like eye candy in my OS (Vista, Aero Glass), but the artsy look over the functional look just bugs me. Sometimes, I like the raw functionality there instead of the pretty package it comes in. The same reason why I like the CLI over a GUI for a lot of things. Just give me the tool and let me use it.

It still looks great, though. I just don't know how I'll like it from a usability standpoint.

What I'd like to see is some options. Give me the ability to go this route, or go to a standard Win10 look, or a Win7 look, Or (God help me) a beautiful Vista look. Just give me some control. Home PC? I'll keep it like it is. Looks nice. Work PC? Give me the bare minimum, easy to use, easy to access what I need, and fast and slim.
 

Lakados

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This was very annoying in Windows 10. I had issues for weeks with my ADID at work. I kept getting "account locked" messages or my password simply would not take. Our Windows dev team looked into the issue and saw that I had tens of thousands of bad password attempts causing my account to temporarily get locked. I had used a workstation in a remote building and used my ADID to get through our proxy clicking "remember password". That workstation, even though I was not using it, was using that password through Xbox gaming service. When I changed my password a few weeks later it kept using the saved one to try and query the MS servers through that Xbox service, thus causing timeouts on my account due to failed password attempts.

If I want Xbox...I'll get Xbox and anything else related with it.
Though if it let me buy a game for Xbox, pop the disk into the tower, download that day 1 patch that makes me second guess my life choices and wonder why I didn't just buy the digital copy to begin with, then play said Xbox game with an Xbox controller on my PC then I would be OK with it. But if all it's going to do is the boring crap that I couldn't be bothered to do on an Xbox if I did, in fact, own an Xbox then no thank you.
 

KarsusTG

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Let me spell this out to you microsoft:
N - O - B - O - D - Y wants touchscreen tailored UI on a desktop OS, Nobody. Have you learned nothing from 8?
I think this used to be true, but really just is not anymore. FAR more laptops get sold than desktops and touch screens are awesome on laptops. I have absolutely loved my surface pro once I got used to it. I think they are probably following down apples path and pushing integration. A mid range surface pro has more computing power than is needed for about 95% of users. When you combine that with a docking station for the office / desk and integrate the xbox platform and streaming services for gaming and other intensive tasks, etc. In the end I think this will work for most people, including gamers.
 

Delicieuxz

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Rounded corners on their own don't make Windows look good. And those look a bit too rounded. Give us the Windows Vista look back.

Who knew Win10 wouldn't be the last iteration of Windows?
I said so when they first claimed it would be. Pretty obvious that MS' claim could've only been marketing BS. Unless Win 10 was somehow the pinnacle of all software coding that would ever be - which it obviously was and is not.
 

ChadD

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Apple figured out how to build a store than wrap an OS around it, Microsoft doesn't have that luxury. They tried and got roasted for it, Microsoft doesn't have the necessary control over the developers out there to pull it off so even their new OS's are hampered by software from 15 years earlier and until they can find a solution for that, this is the sorts of UI's we're going to get.
Apples store although I'm not a fan is at least based on solid tech. Having a package manager is what sets *nix OSs of all flavors apart from Windows. People got used to willy nilly just installing stuff and letting it copy stuff where ever it liked.... and updating software by hand ect.

Another reason why I say MS would be 1000% better off moving to Linux. They could introduce the Microsoft Package Manager and actually call it that and people wouldn't be upset. In fact it would be look at this wonderful new thing. lol
 

Zarathustra[H]

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Here's the thing though. Change is always painful. You really don't know if it's better or not until you're looking back and analyzing it in retrospect. Many hated the UI changes after XP, yet going back and using XP today is downright painful. Would we all be better off if they had just "stuck with" the XP UI and never moved on?
I would disagree that XP is painful.

The only thing I'd miss if using XP gold release would be the start menu "Instant Search". Granted, that's pretty big, but everything else I liked better in XP than in Win10.

Strictly from a UI perspective that is. Apart from the UI, Cloud Integration, Cortana, spyware/keylogger and forced ecosystem, Win10 - under the hood - is the best OS they have ever made.
 
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