Win 10 Poll Kept it Or Ditched it

[Nenu]

Prove it.

 

[ccman]

Then what are you saying? All I was saying is that mobile first means at least in part that the desktop is more mobile than ever. That's the whole premise of the current Surface line.

All I was saying was Microsoft's focus is "mobile first, cloud first," as outlined in that press release I linked you to. It is too long to quote here. A small snippet is:

"When you think about the canvas itself there are three aspects that really jump out. The first one is the world in the next five years and the 10 years is not going to be defined by the form factors that we know and love today but the variety of form factors that will come to be over the coming years. If you think about the co-evolution of silicon, hardware systems and software will birth many new form factors at a pretty rapid pace, and that will just make computing ubiquitous." -Satya Nadella

I am not trying to argue just to argue. I don't think anything I am saying is controversial. It wouldn't surprise me if you agree. Microsoft is looking beyond "the form factors that we know and love today."

 

[heatlesssun]

Likewise. I've been using Windows 10 from the Insider Builds from October 1, 2014. I've shuffled a great deal of personal information though all of these builds. I've had not one breach of information that I know of since that time. Indeed, if any has ever had any breach of personal information how does one go about proving the source? Long before Windows 10 I've had issues with credit card info being swiped. And I had no idea how to prove where the leak occurred. All I could prove is that I didn't make the purchase. Even before the days of the modern Internet.

So yeah, prove it.

 

[Nenu]

Confused.
I dont see proof.

 

[heatlesssun]

I am not trying to argue just to argue. I don't think anything I am saying is controversial. It wouldn't surprise me if you agree. Microsoft is looking beyond "the form factors that we know and love today."

And the best known form factors that Microsoft has been promoting and spending a bundle on, the Surface line, are renowned for mobility with desktop prowess beyond iOS and Android. It's the reason why the line is iconic in Windows terms.

 

[heatlesssun]

Don't need proof for someone that doesn't care what I say. What's the point in that?

 

[Nenu]

Just confirming that what you say means nothing

 

[KazeoHin]

People dont like Windows 10.
It looks ugly and leaks information.

Prove it.

Confused.
I dont see proof.

 

[Nenu]

Great argument.
Did you see the DailyMail opinion?

 

[crusty_juggler]

It leaks information.

Prove it.

 

[heatlesssun]

Just confirming that what you say means nothing

Just confirming that you're far more misleading than me. Really, if you don't care what I say then by all means do that and not this nonsense.

 

[Nenu]

Prove it.

Are you saying that doesnt happen?

 

[Nenu]

Just confirming that you're far more misleading than me. Really, if you don't care what I say then by all means do that and not this nonsense.

lol, at least you admit you are misleading.

 

[heatlesssun]

lol, at least you admit you are misleading.

Sure. All because all I said was that Microsoft is making the desktop available on more mobile devices. You're the one posting PMs and talking about how you don't care what I say yet seem to care what I say at every turn. I don't care one way or the other but you're basically lying at this point.

If you don't care what I say having said it multiple times, even to the point of me posting a PM me pointing out that if you don't care what I say you should put me on ignore and then continuing caring about what I say, seriously?

At this point I don't care what you say because it's pretty much only personal attacks.

 

[Nenu]

Sure. All because all I said was that Microsoft is making the desktop available on more mobile devices. You're the one posting PMs and talking about how you don't care what I say yet seem to care what I say at every turn. I don't care one way or the other but you're basically lying at this point.

If you don't care what I say having said it multiple times, even to the point of me posting a PM me pointing out that if you don't care what I say you should put me on ignore and then continuing caring about what I say, seriously?

At this point I don't care what you say because it's pretty much only personal attacks.

You PMd me and threatened me which is why I posted your bullshit.
It seems you cant stop.

 

[ccman]

And the best known form factors that Microsoft has been promoting and spending a bundle on, the Surface line, are renowned for mobility with desktop prowess beyond iOS and Android. It's the reason why the line is iconic in Windows terms.

I still do not understand where you are getting this from. I think you are just trying to argue just to argue and are still putting words in my mouth. Please point to me where I have said the contrary.

 

[heatlesssun]

I said put me on ignore if you don't care what I say. That's the only bullshit involved here. Really, go on and on and on and on and on and on about that and then go on and on and on and on and on and on and on with the complete opposite?

 

[heatlesssun]

I still do not understand where you are getting this from. I think you are just trying to argue just to argue. Please point to me where I have said the contrary.

You obviously forgot what you said earlier about Microsoft not caring about the desktop in the context of a mobile first world. You should reread your own posts.

 

[ccman]

You obviously forgot what you said earlier about Microsoft not caring about the desktop in the context of a mobile first world. You should reread your own posts.

Citation needed.

I just keep pointing out that Satya Nadella said Microsoft's strategy is "mobile first, cloud first"

 

[Nenu]

I said put me on ignore if you don't care what I say. That's the only bullshit involved here. Really, go on and on and on and on and on and on about that and then go on and on and on and on and on and on and on with the complete opposite?

Its funny that was why you pm'd me, to try and get me to do that.
And even threatened me in the process.
You are weak and so is your stance.

 

[Nenu]

I said put me on ignore if you don't care what I say. That's the only bullshit involved here. Really, go on and on and on and on and on and on about that and then go on and on and on and on and on and on and on with the complete opposite?

Not going to happen, you are too much fun

Oops, replied twice, more fun.

 

[ccman]

You obviously forgot what you said earlier about Microsoft not caring about the desktop in the context of a mobile first world. You should reread your own posts.

I thought Satya Nadella's Press Briefing explained it better than I ever could. This is why I keep referring to what he said and pointing to it. Anything I say will fall short and have room for errors. However, let me see if this helps you understand. I think there was a time when we thought of "computing" and of "the desktop" in reference to a single device of choice and a beige box that sits on the desk or floor as a tower or a box on a desk for example. We thought of syncing devices to this box (old BlackBerry, Palm, Windows CE, etc). I think Microsoft views computing as more than that. I think Microsoft views computing as being on anything from a smartphone to a tablet to a 2-in-1, laptop, NUC, compute stick, mini, USFF, SFF, mini-tower, tower, to even a boardroom screen. This includes sensors, smart appliances, smart watches, fitness monitors, etc. I think Microsoft even includes the Android and iOS devices as part of this, if properly set up. In this view, my computing experience will follow me (be mobile and cloud connected) and the applications ("Apps") I use will scale to the experience in front of me. I believe this is a paradigm shift from thinking of my work laptop, my personal laptop, my gaming desktop, my entertainment tablet, etc. and of thinking of needing to forward the document I need, bringing along my thumb drive, having to have an external drive, having to have my own media server or NAS, etc. I think this is a change, and I think it will take time for people to adjust to it. I think this puts the emphasis on the converged experience and not the single overclocked, SLI'd/CrossFire'd, maybe watercooled, RAID-0 SSD box "form factors that we know and love today" except in its proper context.

 

[flu!d]

And the best known form factors that Microsoft has been promoting and spending a bundle on, the Surface line, are renowned for mobility with desktop prowess beyond iOS and Android. It's the reason why the line is iconic in Windows terms.

I wouldn't go that far.

iOS is horrendously limiting, but literally everything I can do on my laptop I can do on my Nexus 9, without the annoyance of a stylus.

Hence the reason I hardly ever use my laptop anymore (in fact the last time I turned it on it was to format and install Linux Mint). The surface isn't quite a tablet, it isn't quite a laptop, it's even less expandable than a laptop and you need a stylus as navigating Windows with your finger downright sucks.

IMO it's an odd product that suffers from all the annoyances of the Windows platform. Due to the fact people are jumping ship to portable devices in order to get away from the Windows platform, it's like a product with a very niche and limited market.

 

[B00nie]

How old are you? Ten?

I could say the same to you. Garbage OS? ROFL!

 

[B00nie]

Yes indeed.

Winnoobs.

 

[heatlesssun]

I would argue that "trying to do too many things for too many people" is something Microsoft has clearly set in policy to avoid. It is old news that Microsoft's explicitly stated policy through the leadership of Satya Nadella is "Mobile first, Cloud first." In other words, the desktop and stationary laptop experience in Windows 10 is an afterthought (secondary to "mobile first, cloud first").

Satya Nadella: Mobile First, Cloud First Press Briefing: https://news.microsoft.com/2014/03/27/satya-nadella-mobile-first-cloud-first-press-briefing/

I think this is a change, and I think it will take time for people to adjust to it. I think this puts the emphasis on the converged experience and not the single overclocked, SLI'd/CrossFire'd, maybe watercooled, RAID-0 SSD box "form factors that we know and love today" except in its proper context.

Computers have constantly evolved in the direction of smaller, cheaper and more portable. The #1 PC form factor is the laptop and has been so for many years now, well before this era of convergence. Large desktop water-cooled, multiple GPU systems have always been niche. However Windows 10 still supports these types of systems and there's much anticipation over what DX 12 will bring to the table. But Windows 10 now runs on much smaller, portable and cheaper hardware which is simply where the market is.

Microsoft has invested a lot in the Surface line and launched what many consider one of the most innovative laptop class devices ever in the Surface Book. The keyboard, track pad and display are among the best in the business. The dock that allows for desktop use has been well received. That hardly seems like not caring about the desktop/laptop.

So sure, Microsoft isn't concentrating on large desktops. Not sure why they would when the market is clearly looking for more and more portable solutions.

 

[heatlesssun]

iOS is horrendously limiting, but literally everything I can do on my laptop I can do on my Nexus 9, without the annoyance of a stylus.

A Nexus 9 can't do many of things that can be done on a desktop OS based laptop. Compiling code, multiple displays, full Officer (Microsoft or Libre), etc.

Hence the reason I hardly ever use my laptop anymore (in fact the last time I turned it on it was to format and install Linux Mint). The surface isn't quite a tablet, it isn't quite a laptop, it's even less expandable than a laptop and you need a stylus as navigating Windows with your finger downright sucks.

I have no idea what you mean. I navigate Windows tablets from 7" screens on up with no trouble using touch only. Sure, not all desktop applications are touch friendly but web surfing, Office, eBook, video and audio playback, games, etc.

IMO it's an odd product that suffers from all the annoyances of the Windows platform. Due to the fact people are jumping ship to portable devices in order to get away from the Windows platform, it's like a product with a very niche and limited market.

These form factors are currently the fastest growing in the x86 world. Even Apple is trying to get in on the act with the iPad Pro. So the market seems to disagree with this assessment.

 

[B00nie]

These form factors are currently the fastest growing in the x86 world. Even Apple is trying to get in on the act with the iPad Pro. So the market seems to disagree with this assessment.

You misread a bit. He said they're jumping to mobile form to get away from Windows. Only people who do silly things like wear their ties upside down have a tablet AND windows

 

[ccman]

Computers have constantly evolved in the direction of smaller, cheaper and more portable. The #1 PC form factor is the laptop and has been so for many years now, well before this era of convergence. Large desktop water-cooled, multiple GPU systems have always been niche. However Windows 10 still supports these types of systems and there's much anticipation over what DX 12 will bring to the table. But Windows 10 now runs on much smaller, portable and cheaper hardware which is simply where the market is.

Microsoft has invested a lot in the Surface line and launched what many consider one of the most innovative laptop class devices ever in the Surface Book. The keyboard, track pad and display are among the best in the business. The dock that allows for desktop use has been well received. That hardly seems like not caring about the desktop/laptop.

So sure, Microsoft isn't concentrating on large desktops. Not sure why they would when the market is clearly looking for more and more portable solutions.

I did not say that support for desktops was dropped in Windows 10. I have spent post after post on this thread trying to make that clear and telling you to stop putting words in my mouth. Yet you persist.

I don't care that you have a hard-on for the Microsoft Surface line. It is not germane to the discussion "Win 10 Poll Kept It Or Ditched It."

 

[heatlesssun]

I did not say that support for desktops was dropped in Windows 10. I have spent post after post on this thread trying to make that clear and telling you to stop putting words in my mouth. Yet you persist.

I don't care that you have a hard-on for the Microsoft Surface line. It is not germane to the discussion "Win 10 Poll Kept It Or Ditched It."

I was just trying to figure out what you were saying. My point is that convergence and mobility don't necessarily take away from the desktop but they make the desktop more mobile and accessible to more devices. And these devices are the fastest growing segment in x86 market now. 22 million this year, up around ten fold from just three years ago.

 

[ccman]

I was just trying to figure out what you were saying. My point is that convergence and mobility don't necessarily take away from the desktop but they make the desktop more mobile and accessible to more devices. And these devices are the fastest growing segment in x86 market now. 22 million this year, up around ten fold from just three years ago.

And then you again quoted what I said and said "Large desktop water-cooled, multiple GPU systems have always been niche. However Windows 10 still supports these types of systems and there's much anticipation over what DX 12 will bring to the table."

In doing so, you imply I was saying otherwise or I had previously said otherwise. It had not. I do not appreciate you doing this.

Do you think that Windows 10 (especially from the perspective of Windows 7 but even from the perspective of Windows 8 and 8.1) is a change? Do you think some people are resistant to change or struggle with change?

I think Windows 10 is a change in both concrete ways and in abstract ways. One can ignore the aims of Microsoft and use Windows 10 similar to how Windows 7 was used. I think design decisions were made based on long term goals that pervade the operating system that are concrete and visual changes that take some getting used to.

My main point is Windows 10 takes a little getting used to. I can hardly fault someone for staying on Windows 7 or Windows 8 or 8.1 for a little bit longer. Microsoft will continue to improve Windows 10, which will be born out as time goes on. There is still time to take advantage of the free upgrade offer, and if the person in question has already taken the offer and activated Windows 10, then they have a valid activation and could conceivably continue to run Windows 7, 8, or 8.1 while improvements incubate.

If we are talking specifically about Windows gamers, there are indications in the Steam numbers that Windows 10 uptake in this population meets or exceeds the general population. This makes sense to me. Windows 10 performance and compatibility seems to be in general as good or better than Windows 7, 8, or 8.1. Like they may try to squeeze extra performance out of processors, they may do the same with Windows. Many games immediately go full screen and Steam hasn't changed dramatically.

 

[YeuEmMaiMai]

Seriously dude? Have you even USED Windows 10?


I run 4 screens, a 48 inch TV, a 40" 4K monitor and two 1080p screens in portrait. I primarily use the PC for productivity/artwork and casual browsing, gaming as well. All of this on W10.

Windows 10 is GREAT for desktop use.

no it's not, it is touch UI which is FINE for my tablet and windows mobile 10. It is a major step back from Windows 7 as a desktop UI....

Windows 7
start -> programs = everything in a nice neat orderly fashion not broken down by A B C etc

Windows 10
start all apps convoluted list broken down by A B C = list much longer than it needs to be.

unwanted advertisements for "try ms orifice free for a month" popping up in the lower corner... YAY! I ALREADY HAVE OFFICE 2K10 INSTALLED.

Icons for apps that I have placed on my desktop from the new app menu turn white after a while and no way to fix it.

 

[heatlesssun]

And then you again quoted what I said and said "Large desktop water-cooled, multiple GPU systems have always been niche. However Windows 10 still supports these types of systems and there's much anticipation over what DX 12 will bring to the table."

In doing so, you imply I was saying otherwise or I had previously said otherwise. It had not. I do not appreciate you doing this.

I wasn't trying to put words into your mouth. It's just that I hear people talk about how Windows 10 isn't well suited for the desktop and things like "Fisher Price" tiles and useless store apps. There's a lot of bunk in these topics. Tiles allow for a LOT more shortcuts than Windows 7. Some of the included store apps are pretty useful it one takes some time looking into them like the Photos app. That's WAY better than the old Windows Photo Viewer. The Maps app is nice. The Mail app is serviceable for basic email needs. Calendar is solid. The Alarms & Clock app is something that Windows should have had long before Windows 8. And all of these apps work well with both touch and keyboard and mice, resize well and scale well to high DPI monitors.

And sure there's things that aren't great about them. I understand why some would be upset at not being able to uninstall them easily. But I think total they take up about half a gig and you don't have to use them.

Do you think that Windows 10 (especially from the perspective of Windows 7 but even from the perspective of Windows 8 and 8.1) is a change? Do you think some people are resistant to change or struggle with change?

I think Windows 10 is a change in both concrete ways and in abstract ways. One can ignore the aims of Microsoft and use Windows 10 similar to how Windows 7 was used. I think design decisions were made based on long term goals that pervade the operating system that are concrete and visual changes that take some getting used to.

My main point is Windows 10 takes a little getting used to. I can hardly fault someone for staying on Windows 7 or Windows 8 or 8.1 for a little bit longer. Microsoft will continue to improve Windows 10, which will be born out as time goes on. There is still time to take advantage of the free upgrade offer, and if the person in question has already taken the offer and activated Windows 10, then they have a valid activation and could conceivably continue to run Windows 7, 8, or 8.1 while improvements incubate.

If we are talking specifically about Windows gamers, there are indications in the Steam numbers that Windows 10 uptake in this population meets or exceeds the general population. This makes sense to me. Windows 10 performance and compatibility seems to be in general as good or better than Windows 7, 8, or 8.1. Like they may try to squeeze extra performance out of processors, they may do the same with Windows. Many games immediately go full screen and Steam hasn't changed dramatically.

Is Windows 10 a change from 7 and 8.x? Of course. Is it a major change from the perspective of the average desktop user that's launching and running web browsers, office automation applications, games, etc? Not really. Of course there's the debate over the new Start Menu, store apps, Settings vs. Control Panel, aesthetics and privacy.

Does it take some getting used to versus 7? That depends a great deal of the person. I've not really seen the any issues with people getting up to speed of the half-dozen people I've helped with the upgrade. I did spend about 10 to 15 minutes going over Settings vs. Control Panel, some of the new features like Cortana and showing the Getting Started app.

 

[ccman]

I wasn't trying to put words into your mouth. It's just that I hear people talk about how Windows 10 isn't well suited for the desktop and things like "Fisher Price" tiles and useless store apps. There's a lot of bunk in these topics. Tiles allow for a LOT more shortcuts than Windows 7. Some of the included store apps are pretty useful it one takes some time looking into them like the Photos app. That's WAY better than the old Windows Photo Viewer. The Maps app is nice. The Mail app is serviceable for basic email needs. Calendar is solid. The Alarms & Clock app is something that Windows should have had long before Windows 8. And all of these apps work well with both touch and keyboard and mice, resize well and scale well to high DPI monitors.

And sure there's things that aren't great about them. I understand why some would be upset at not being able to uninstall them easily. But I think total they take up about half a gig and you don't have to use them.



Is Windows 10 a change from 7 and 8.x? Of course. Is it a major change from the perspective of the average desktop user that's launching and running web browsers, office automation applications, games, etc? Not really. Of course there's the debate over the new Start Menu, store apps, Settings vs. Control Panel, aesthetics and privacy.

Does it take some getting used to versus 7? That depends a great deal of the person. I've not really seen the any issues with people getting up to speed of the half-dozen people I've helped with the upgrade. I did spend about 10 to 15 minutes going over Settings vs. Control Panel, some of the new features like Cortana and showing the Getting Started app.

Why is it so hard to try to discuss anything with you?! You started out talking about something I didn't mention. You paid attention to one of my questions, disregarded another, then went on a third different direction. You are clearly pushing an agenda and viewpoint and not having discussions.

 

[odoe]

This thread has run its course.