What's the hype?

E

exe163

[H]ard|Gawd
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I don't see why everyone suddenly selling everything they have and run out to get the new 5870 video card. From the benchmarks on the net so far, it is the fastest single card available, but not the fastest card on the market. It's performance is on par with 4870x2, if not slight less in most cases. The card itself is physically larger than 4870x2, meaning it won't save you any room. As for the fan, it's just as loud if not louder, with even even less ventilation. So at the end of the day, you pay $100 extra over a used 4870x2 for energy saving and DX11. And by the time DX11 become mainstream, new generation of video card arrives.

I find no justification to upgrade. But then I might be the minority who doesn't run quad fire and $1k CPU to get the highest benchmark possible.

(if they come up with fanless 5850, that might change my mind)
 
I think the OP has a point -- I was planning on getting a 5870 but just pulled the trigger on an XFX 4890 ($210 CAD). Going to wait and see what else comes out over the next 6-9-12 months (GTX300? 5890? 6870?)
 
point taken, but i just came off an sli setup that was problematic, and decided to make a move on the fastest single gpu card available.
 
Well I can't see running out and selling things specifically to get a new card, but I can see why people want it. It is extremely fast, and does so with a low power consumption. That's what interests me. I'd like something faster than my 280, as I have more than a few games that won't do 60fps solid with FSAA on (which is my goal for all games). However my 280 already uses plenty of power, I am not interested in going with SLI or something like and doubling my heat output.

Ok well the 5870 gets performance in line with or better than a 295, but does so with about the same power usage as the 280. That has me interested.

There's also the fact that 2 GPU solutions are problems. Some games flat out don't like them and don't run any faster. Others get gains, but not the 2x they should. Others have microstuttering issues that creates an uneven look, even at higher framerates. So while it can get you more performance, it can be problematic as it does so. None of that with a faster single GPU solution. It is just faster.

I've not decided if I'll get a 5870, probably depends on if we hear anything from nVidia in the next few weeks and what we hear if we do. However I do plan on getting a fast DX11 card. I want more performance than I have now, I want DX11 support, and I don't want to have more than a single GPU.

Besides, what's wrong with a little overkill? You yourself own an HX1000. Do you have any need for that? Doesn't seem so, your system would be fine with an HX620. However a little overkill can be a nice thing (I have an HX1000 also BTW).
 
First off I think it's way to early to compare the HD5870 to an HD4870x2 in terms of raw performance. HD5870 is off to a great start and I think it will soon destroy all benchmarking records.


I'm happy with 2 HD4770s in Xfire for gaming and benchmarking.

I'm thinking about going Xfire with 2 HD5850s much later on when the prices come way down.
 
well to some energy consumption does matter, if all the gamers with highend system did actually go for performance per watt, I mean double the performance for the same wattage as 4870, why would I not do it.

1. not everyone like dual gpu, even if hd 4870x2 is the same performance and less money, why would someone not by it and use less power, it is not just your electric bill, it also helps our planet, than again you would say why does it matter, well if everyone turing off their light bulbs could save so much energy, I am sure 150watt less will add up to quite a lot of light bulbs.

2. this is the first beta driver release, I am sure the drivers will only get better, having previously had hd 4870 the drivers gave boost in lot of the games overtime.

3. dx11 does matter, may be not to you.

4. everyone do whatever the f they want, because it is their money and let them enjoy their high resolutions and eyecandy cranked up, and all with same amount of power as the last gen, they would take it everyday.
 
exe163 said:
So at the end of the day, you pay $100 extra over a used 4870x2 for energy saving and DX11.
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LOL. Why in the world would you compare the pricing on a brand new 5870 to a used 4870 X2? I think if we are being a bit more sincere in our comparison (which I'm sure was your goal), we would compare a new 4870 X2 to a new HD5870, apples-to-apples. Newegg has the 4870 X2 priced at $330. After that, Tiger Direct and Buy.com offer the next best price at $390.

But then I might be the minority who doesn't run quad fire and $1k CPU to get the highest benchmark possible.
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Heh, now this is a well thought out argument. The best part is the part where you implicitly decry the purchase of an "expensive" setup (I suppose making reference to typical 5870 buyers), while not mentioning the fact that the 4870 X2, on which you build your argument, has been more expensive at virtually every phase of its life cycle. Indeed, from most sellers, they are the same price as we speak.

And most importantly . . . who cares? :D
 
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exe163 said:
I don't see why everyone suddenly selling everything they have and run out to get the new 5870 video card. From the benchmarks on the net so far, it is the fastest single card available, but not the fastest card on the market. It's performance is on par with 4870x2, if not slight less in most cases. The card itself is physically larger than 4870x2, meaning it won't save you any room. As for the fan, it's just as loud if not louder, with even even less ventilation. So at the end of the day, you pay $100 extra over a used 4870x2 for energy saving and DX11. And by the time DX11 become mainstream, new generation of video card arrives.

I find no justification to upgrade. But then I might be the minority who doesn't run quad fire and $1k CPU to get the highest benchmark possible.

(if they come up with fanless 5850, that might change my mind)
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Here's da hype:

1. It is not just the fastest single-GPU card available, but in most cases, it renders multi-GPU irrelevant (consider that it is faster than any currently extant AMD X2 card, and trades blows with nVidia's GTX295).

2. The cost is around that of the GTX260 (in some cases, it's less).

3. It is not just easier on the electric bill than a dual-GPU setup, it is easier on the electric bill than quite a number of single-GPU setups, including a single HD4850.

The HD5850 (the card I have in mind, instead of the HD4850) does, admittedly, cost more than an HD4850 (and the gap will only go up when the discounts kick in once the 5850 actually launches); however, it will vastly outperform it *and* save serious money on the electric bill. (I live in the US, and this is currently the battleground over cap-and-trade, which, if passed, will have major impact on future electric bills. However, even if cap-and-trade goes nowhere, as long as there is heavy resistance to nuclear power, electric bills will increase regardless.)

It's rare that you can increase performance and simultaneously lower your electric bill; but HD58xx enables just that. And even with the PSU change, CPU change (Q9550) and the HD5850, I'm not spending even $750 total.
 
I think lower power consumption, DX11, no dealing with CF, and performance that is the same at times better at times not on drivers that are so immature that they're not even worthy of having a catalyst version number is plenty of reason for people to opt for a 5870 over a 4870x2. Infact I see zero reason to go with the X2 over the 5870.

You have an X2 and you're happy with it, that's great. Technology moves forward, the 5870 is the newer and IMO better card for the reasons I mentioned. You aren't going to be able to keep older technology current by trying to convince people it's better.
 
PGHammer said:
Here's da hype:

2. The cost is around that of the GTX260 (in some cases, it's less).

.
Click to expand...


?!?!?!?!?!?!?

WTF are you buying your GTX260s? I haven't seen one priced at 270 bucks in almsot a year now. Most if not all can be had for around 160.
 
Opinion? Yes, after all it's the source of discussions. If we all agree upon each other there's no point to have a forum. I wanted a new video card just as much as everyone else. I just cannot find enough justification to jump onto the bandwagon. And for those with money, by all mean spend them as you please, it helps the circulation of currency.
NKD said:
1. not everyone like dual gpu, even if hd 4870x2 is the same performance and less money, why would someone not by it and use less power, it is not just your electric bill, it also helps our planet, than again you would say why does it matter, well if everyone turing off their light bulbs could save so much energy, I am sure 150watt less will add up to quite a lot of light bulbs.

2. this is the first beta driver release, I am sure the drivers will only get better, having previously had hd 4870 the drivers gave boost in lot of the games overtime.

3. dx11 does matter, may be not to you.

4. everyone do whatever the f they want, because it is their money and let them enjoy their high resolutions and eyecandy cranked up, and all with same amount of power as the last gen, they would take it everyday.
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Maybe turning off the computer when it's not in use helps the electric bill and environment also. From what I know, most people don't have the habbit of doing so. Plus, the energy required to produce the card might just cancel the saving all together. Nevertheless, I can't deny that this is an advantage of newer cards.

Driver release will not dramatically increase performance, at most within 5fps. Having such idea is just an psychological comfort.

I really don't see many instances (if at all) with microstuttering for last generation hardware. Most (if not all) recent games take advantage of multi GPU processing, also efficient enough to be cost effective.
 
ok when the 8800gtx the 7950gx2 fans didnt like it because it didnt surpass their cards. Then the gtx280 came out and people with dual 8800gtx or 9800 gtx didnt like it for the same reason. Now the 5870 is out and yet again another thread on the same thing. ill just stop there , u get the point.
 
exe163 said:
Driver release will not dramatically increase performance, at most within 5fps. Having such idea is just an psychological comfort.
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I could say the same thing about your claim. We'll see what happens when drivers do mature. It's always funny when new tech comes out, a few with the high end older stuff that paid top dollar for it try so hard to devalue the new.
 
The 5870 is a very young card and it's already incredibly impressive and It will only get better with driver updates. It is also very energy efficient.

I would be willing to bet that after a few driver updates it should have no problem out performing the GTX295, 4870x2 and quite possibly 285 SLi.

40nm, DX11, lots of oc'ing headroom and the fastest single card solution available that will only get better with time, what is not to like?
 
TheBlueChanell said:
40nm, DX11, lots of oc'ing headroom and the fastest single card solution available that will only get better with time, what is not to like?
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Just a disgruntled 4870x2 owner who wants someone to buy his used card for $279 so he can buy the 5870 :D
 
well I turn of all my computers before I get to bed, I really think this thread is pointless, just be happy with what you have and let others be, this is one reason I buy a graphic card once every generation and don't go for dual chip cards because there will always be a single chip next gen card that will beat it. I am happy upgrading every year and a half or whatever it is and live with it.

anyways this thread is going no where, I would rather have it closed because the topic is pointless, just let it be, whoever wants to buy can buy it and whoever doesn't, doesn't. Monday is the day I overclock the hell out of my hd 5870 and let the asus voltage tweak be the best solution to my overclock.
 
To be honest, it all depends on several different variables.

Fact is 5870 is definitely the better card, even if it is a bit slower than 4870x2 in some tests or the same. Personally, I bought a used 4870x2 for 200$ a month ago, and even though the price was perfect, I do plan to upgrade either to 5870 or 5870x2 down the line.

It's just that I currently have a strong enough card, so I can wait and play my games the way I want them. If I had a lesser one, I would already have bought a 5870.
 
Think hype is the wrong word :)

Enthusiastically is the better expression. In a way where this card shines where other cards were so so.
You have a decent card in your system that is more or less one of the fastest around still but the new card has it all,

If you skipped last couple of OEM cycles this is a great buy. If i look at the launch of the GTX 260/280 those cards were really expensive and didnt offer that much new things as 5870 offers now.
 
Are we really talking about our electric bill? Does the 4870x2 really draw that much power to justify selling it and buying the 5870? I do have a rediculously high elec. bill(over $400). If someone can prove to me the cost effectiveness of buying a 5870 based on my electric bill post it so I can show it to my wife and get an upgrade. I'm all in!
 
According to the [H] review the 4870x2 requires 104 watts while the 5870 requires around 30. So if I'm not mistaken you just take .074 x (price per kill o watt hour) x (number of hours you have your computer on in a day). I'm sure any capable person could calculate out the yearly savings from there.


Throwing any load on the gpu changes things for both cards so this is assuming you are not gaming whenever you are on your computer.
 
madcap magician said:
Are we really talking about our electric bill? Does the 4870x2 really draw that much power to justify selling it and buying the 5870? I do have a rediculously high elec. bill(over $400). If someone can prove to me the cost effectiveness of buying a 5870 based on my electric bill post it so I can show it to my wife and get an upgrade. I'm all in!
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It's not just electric bill, it's heat, stress on the PSU as well as the electric bill. Look, I fully agree that for someone that owns a 4870x2, there is little reason to get a 5870, but for someone like myself who had a 4850, there is really no reason to buy a "used" 4870x2 over a 5870.
 
I had my 4870X2 for a year now, just bought a 5870. Reason? I found that some games did not scale that well, and a 4890 was better than the X2. I borrowed a 4890 for a few weeks and realized that a single GPU would be the way to go. Playing L4D for a few days winth my 5870, and it's a lot smoother than the 4870X2.
 
i usually buy these things on day 1, but not this time. cant afford 2, and my 4890 cf is as good. i had good experience with 4850x2, so i will wait and see if/when the 5850x2 comes out.
 
RamonGTP said:
It's not just electric bill, it's heat, stress on the PSU as well as the electric bill. Look, I fully agree that for someone that owns a 4870x2, there is little reason to get a 5870, but for someone like myself who had a 4850, there is really no reason to buy a "used" 4870x2 over a 5870.
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well said, to me its not all about the bill either, its about the usage of energy, and I am done overusing it, I don't game all the time, but 27 watt vs 90watt on idle power usage is a big difference to me. I also agree if you have hd 4870 x2 and you are happy with it, there is no one telling you to sell it, because if you don't care about the power usage or heat or whatever, and if you are happy with the performance just keep it if you like, it is still a good card, but for me who has had the hd 4870 512mb which I got a good deal on, there is no poing in getting another hd 4870 because first my power supply won't be able to handle two in crossfire, I got only 600watt, and I am not planning on upgrading that unless I absolutely had to, lets say it burns out tomorrow, than yea probably I might get something bigger, but I don't think I would need anything bigger.
 
exe163 said:
I don't see why everyone suddenly selling everything they have and run out to get the new 5870 video card.
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I'm sorry you missed this thread.
You too get to be shot at by forumers.

"You can burn in hell. Everything before it is slow, old, worthless, requires a nuclear power plant, and isn't new. This card is the only answer now, you do not dare compare anything else. All other cards are pointless, this is the only one you may look at. You're so wrong, how can you be this way? You need to be correct like everyone else, otherwise fuck you."
 
It's funny that 5870 owners or prospective owners aren't the ones creating threads asking everyone to upgrade, however owners of older cards like the 4870x2 are practically begging people not to buy the 5870, like somehow your efforts will make it vanish and your 4870x2 will be the best forever.
 
RamonGTP said:
It's funny that 5870 owners or prospective owners aren't the ones creating threads asking everyone to upgrade, however owners of older cards like the 4870x2 are practically begging people not to buy the 5870, like somehow your efforts will make it vanish and your 4870x2 will be the best forever.
Click to expand...

+1 Exactly!

To OP


Whats the hype?

1.SLI/Crossfire issues free.

2.Alot smoother gameplay then any older card (already reproted by manu users till now)

3.Fast as GTX295 or 5% slower generally and faster on some games also,alot and ill say alot smoother gameplay then GTX295/4870x2/GTX285sli.

4.Great oc potenial,easy 950 and very low load temps even with oc & and default cooler speed

5.Fastest single card,and very low drop in performance with AA, great, improved AF algoritham Insanely smooth 2560x1600 gameplay was reported also!



Chek out this thread,and if your lazy focus on post #33

http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1454827&page=2
 
ati-eyefinity-02.jpg
 
RamonGTP said:
It's funny that 5870 owners or prospective owners aren't the ones creating threads asking everyone to upgrade, however owners of older cards like the 4870x2 are practically begging people not to buy the 5870, like somehow your efforts will make it vanish and your 4870x2 will be the best forever.
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QFT. + LOL.
 
5870 is the best card for people who wouldn't touch a multi GPU solution with a ten foot stick.
 
Just wait for 5890 if you are so "DISSAPOINTED" by 5870 performance.

BTW judging from peoples responses to the cards release I think AMD completely fucked up by releasing this card with completely immature drivers. Theoretically this card should walk all over both 4870x2 and GTX 295 (b/c of the specs) but in most benchies it only matches 4870x2 as well as in [H] review.

Just keep checking [H] reviews...I am sure that within 1-2 months this cards performance will improve considerably.

psyside said:
4.Great oc potenial,easy 950 and very low load temps even with oc & and default cooler speed
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Huh? Where do you see easy 950 core overclocks? I checked XS and I didnt see any.
 
Can't remember where i read it i'm sure the user name was GoldenTiger or something will post later if i find the link ;)
 
It's the fastest single GPU card available at the moment. That fact alone means there will be a lot of hype, just every other time a company releases a new fastest card. But whats sets this apart from those cards is the fact that it's being released at an extremely friendly price point. Generally, the flagship cards are released costing a bit more. The features like Eyefinity and DX11 support are just the icing on the cake.
 
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