What Mouse and Keyboard Are You Using Right Now?

[Prince Valiant]

Nah. It only flashes when the computer is off. I think it is because of my weirdo setup that relies on a powered USB hub.

I can understand that my setup might result in the keyboard always staying lit, but flashing is kind of weird.

I might just set it up with one of those power strips that triggers a switch when one outlet powers on. I could hook it up to a monitor.

Worth looking into if the LEDs can't be disabled outright or you want them on. That's some setup you've got .

Picked up one of these recently - www.dygma.com Defy - after owning their original Raise split ergo keyboard which was fantastic.

View: https://imgur.com/a/vkA2EDx

This will be my first ortholinear/columnar split keyboard so it will be an adjustment, but hopefully worthwhile. My particular Defy is "full spec" which means all of the basic features are included (and there are a lot of "basic" ones like hotswap sockets; my previous Raise was Kailh Speed Silver, so this time I tried Gateron G Pro Yellow 2.0 which are apparently well regarded for linears. ) plus Wireless (both bluetooth and 2.4ghz dongle), Tenting up to 60degrees, and multi-zone Underglow (standard RGBW per key is default, the underglow is separate and more useful than you'd think both for layers and for stuff like having it monitor your system).

I backed it during the crowdfunding and ended up saving quite a bit vs the launch price. One thing that impresses me is both the desire to use open source firmware/software, and having watched them as a new company grow through fulfilling several major projects, they've always been forthcoming with exactly what's going on - even when stuff went wrong. They seem to be far more trustworthy than most and the open ethos is worth it too. I have been considering getting a columnar layout for awhile and looked into several others including various ErgoDox layouts/kits, the Moonlander, Kenesis Advantage360, Keyboardio Model100, and afew others and overall the Dygma looke like a better option. I'll have to see how it goes getting used to the layout but if anyone has questions just let me know/

It shouldn't take long for you to adjust to the columns. What do you think about the thumb cluster so far? I like the look of the Kinesis Adv. best, aside from it surely being a space hog and far from portable.

 

[RanceJustice]

It shouldn't take long for you to adjust to the columns. What do you think about the thumb cluster so far? I like the look of the Kinesis Adv. best, aside from it surely being a space hog and far from portable.

Thumb clusters are pretty great. The layout is pretty ergonomic and has good feel to it, each keycap is shaped and angled so you can know them by touch. It may not show in the pic, but some of them (the lower ones on each side) are not MX standard switches but are low profile Choc switches for height reasons, much like the "under row" keys from the Raise. As far as the Kinesis Advantage360 it seemed to have some significant limitations vs the Defy (the size you mentioned, having to choose between either a USB-C model that requires ErgoDox style connection between both halves and the use of a proprietary configurator vs a Bluetooth only ZMK model, lack of hotswap sockets for switches, single color backlighting only etc) unless you were really set on the curved keywell. If you were interested in a curved keywell and a smaller profile, I'd look at the MoErgo Glove80 which seems like an interesting project if you don't mind all low profile Choc style switches and that they're soldered / not-socketed by default.

 

[Prince Valiant]

If I did try an Advantage at some point it would probably be one of the single piece KBs; I don't want to give up the desktop space though. Low profile switches make the Glove80 a no go for me. If I could get an Ergodox for cheap I might bite but I'm content with my FS Edge in the meantime.

Edit: Agreed on lighting, it serves a useful purpose if you're setting up multiple profiles.

 

[brennok]

Picked up a used like new Keychron K10 RGB with Gateron G Pro Brown switches to try on the new build which hopefully goes together this weekend. First mechanical so we will see how I feel about it. I tried what most guides recommended by going to Best Buy and testing the floor models. BB now seems to only have a few floor models compared to what they used to. Also some of the floor models didn't seem to match up to any products in stock so it was tough to tell what I liked and didn't so that didn't really work.

I wanted full size, backlighting and shine through keys since I use a lot of indirect lighting at night, and I didn't want something super clicky. I also didn't want to really break $100 for my first.

My initial thoughts after a brief use...
While I like not needing software for the RGB, I almost would rather have some since this has something like 15 settings you have to cycle through to see what each setting does. I was worried the white light version might be too bright since I am used to the softer blue on my old G510s.

Keys are noticeably lighter with less resistance than my Logitech G510s which is the rubber dome. Once I force myself to use it we will see how I feel about this. I think I may want a heavier switch.

Keycaps are also noticeably different. I don't know if it is the spacing or the shape, but for WAD I find I have to position my hand slightly differently almost with more angle on the hand like the keys are closer together and slightly smaller. I don't have anything precise to measure to double check.

Finally I am so used to my big keyboard it is weird to have a small rectangle. I definitely will need to find a palm rest I like. It looks like wanting full size puts me in the minority group for mechanical keyboards much less something more like what I am used to. It is going to look weird on my desk with such a small keyboard with how much empty space I will have since my desk is 30" x 60" before even taking into consideration the side desk. I keep looking into sensor panel desktop displays to replace my LCD from my G510s. I tried looking for larger cases, but it seems that choice of color or material is really the only option with few keyboards outsize the basic shape.

I wish there was an easy way to just mod the G15/G510s to convert it or Logitech would release a new version especially with things like sensor panels now a thing.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

Finally I am so used to my big keyboard it is weird to have a small rectangle. I definitely will need to find a palm rest I like. It looks like wanting full size puts me in the minority group for mechanical keyboards much less something more like what I am used to. It is going to look weird on my desk with such a small keyboard with how much empty space I will have since my desk is 30" x 60" before even taking into consideration the side desk. I keep looking into sensor panel desktop displays to replace my LCD from my G510s. I tried looking for larger cases, but it seems that choice of color or material is really the only option with few keyboards outsize the basic shape.

I'm with you. I can't for the life of me understand the TKL and smaller craze.

For me it's full IBM Enhanced layout or nothing.

 

[Prince Valiant]

I'm with you. I can't for the life of me understand the TKL and smaller craze.

For me it's full IBM Enhanced layout or nothing.

I prefer the latter but I accepted smaller for a split KB that fits in my desk tray.

 

[atarione]

I'm with you. I can't for the life of me understand the TKL and smaller craze.

For me it's full IBM Enhanced layout or nothing.

I will tell you, and just reaffirmed by digging my fullsize keyboard out of it's box to switch things up (mx switch pun?.. you decide). For myself and my own use a TKL is basically the perfect layout as I have all the keys except num pad... which is fine as the amount of time I spend doing numeric entry is pretty limited.. and I am left handed so honestly (and confirmed by using this full-size board again) having a separate numpad I can move to the left side of my keyboard is way better for me anyway.

The advantage is much less arm strain by having mouse moved closer to the left hand (I generally mouse right handed but will also switch to left sometimes... making having a smaller keyboard a great thing as I have room on my deskpad for mousing left or right?

Anyways, I don't like even smaller formats (although 75% would probably be fine) .. I have a GMK67 I built because it was cheap (under $60 all in) and I do not mind it too much but the F keys and Print screen requiring the use of function layer gets on my nerves.) anything smaller than the GMK67 would be a nonstarter... I probably will just stick with TKL in the future.

This is how my desk is generally configured (just much messier most of the time).

 

[mashie]

I just built my first mechanical keyboard this week, a Keychron Q8 with ISO layout:

It's quite a difference from the MS Ergonomic keyboard I had before. It will definitely take a while to get properly used to it, although it is working better than expected after 3 days already.

 

[t0eJaM]

 

[brennok]

Here is sort of a 48 hour update with my Keytron K10. No GPU yet so this is more just based on daily use.

I definitely need a palm rest. Part of the issue which may be due to the screen placement, but I sit lower than I could so my elbows are below the keyboard which results in my arms resting against the edge of the desk rather than slightly raised with the palm rest attached to the G15 and G510s. Accuracy for me is probably 90% so it has slipped some. I find I randomly hit mistypes possibly just due to the smaller spacing. The worst is occasionally I will hit some random key that does some shortcut I never use and have to figure out what I did. For example even typing this somehow I changed it so text was being marked through as I typed and no idea how I did it. Some of it may also be Win 11 since occasionally I will end up hitting F11 accidentally and going full screen randomly and the escape key doesn't exit out of it.

For the $89 I am happy, but gaming might also change that. I don't know if I can appreciate $100 plus for a mech keyboard yet or if I ever will. I get some of the draw cosmetically, but it seems like a weird and expensive rabbit hole especially considering my complaint above that they essentially all look the same with only internal and color differences.

Edit: I also forgot I need to get a longer cable. I am still figuring out where I am going to put the Torrent so I will more than likely need a longer cable. The included cable seems pretty short and only intended as a charging cable.

 

[Prince Valiant]

I just built my first mechanical keyboard this week, a Keychron Q8 with ISO layout:

View attachment 626739

It's quite a difference from the MS Ergonomic keyboard I had before. It will definitely take a while to get properly used to it, although it is working better than expected after 3 days already.

What's up with the keys being at different angles? It doesn't seem like it would be comfortable for long term usage.

 

[Mad Maxx]

What's up with the keys being at different angles? It doesn't seem like it would be comfortable for long term usage.

That's one of those ergonomic keyboards. I've tried them and just never got the hang of it.

 

[RanceJustice]

What's up with the keys being at different angles? It doesn't seem like it would be comfortable for long term usage.

Its an "Alice" layout as I recall, one of the many layouts that add either ergonomic benefits (the inward tilt of the keys leads to positioning your wrists in less stressful positions ) and/or just a better key layouts (ie it offers dual function keys and space bars ). While its not as dramatic a change as some other layouts, some prefer it - similar to how the Microsoft ergonomic keyboard line were not truly split boards, but made some small changes for better health to avoid RSI.

That's one of those ergonomic keyboards. I've tried them and just never got the hang of it.

Admittedly any change in layout from the traditional staggered QWERTY that most of us grew up leaning to type upon will take a period of adaptation. The more dramatic the changes and the more of them "stacked". the longer it will take, attenuated by how some things are far more comfortable and quick to type on/game once you get used to them. Some changes may be easier than others of course and some final outcome benefits won't appear until you've gotten used to the new layout.

 

[dogDAbone]

Well, I am awaiting delivery of both a Keychron C2 and a Hexgears X5 (hopefully on Monday), so once I have them in hand, I will post my observations.

Note that these MIGHT be replacing my aging Logi G613's, but ONLY if they offer a superior experience all around.... my main use is typing/data entry/video processing, but I don't do gamz at all, so I won't be commenting on that aspect...

As for rodentia, I see no reason to replace my aging MX2's & 3's YET, unless I find something that offers some better features or performance than they do for the same or less $$

 

[mashie]

What's up with the keys being at different angles? It doesn't seem like it would be comfortable for long term usage.

It is as mentioned above a more egonomic layout known as Alice. I have used ergonomic keyboards for the past 4 years and I got used to them so when I decided to get a mechanical keypboard it was an obvious choice.

I'm not a big fan of regular keyboards any longer. Also I didn't want to go to the extreme end such as Ergodox EX or Dactyl on the first mechanical keyboard in 30 years either.

 

[atarione]

so this pbt double shot keycap set was 50% off on amazon ($19.99) so I decided to try it (yes it is a blue samurai clone set or whatever...I wasn't going to pay $120~ for the Drop + RedSuns GMK set.) The keycaps seem to be pretty well made are resonably thick and feel / sound good at first impression. I am trying to decide how I feel about the colors however.. and also debating swapping some of the modifiers with provided (mustard?) colored keycaps..

 

[Sumanji]

Drevo Blademaster Pro and a Logitech G502 Hero...

I don't need to change either, but I'm definitely get ideas browsing through this thread

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

so this pbt double shot keycap set was 50% off on amazon ($19.99) so I decided to try it (yes it is a blue samurai clone set or whatever...I wasn't going to pay $120~ for the Drop + RedSuns GMK set.) The keycaps seem to be pretty well made are resonably thick and feel / sound good at first impression. I am trying to decide how I feel about the colors however.. and also debating swapping some of the modifiers with provided (mustard?) colored keycaps..

View attachment 628287

Link? I'm not crazy about blue on black, but for $20 if they are solid as you say, I wouldn't mind having a backup set.

Edit:Are those opaque or shine through lettering though?

 

[atarione]

Link? I'm not crazy about blue on black, but for $20 if they are solid as you say, I wouldn't mind having a backup set.

Edit:Are those opaque or shine through lettering though?

Sure.. This is the link :: https://www.amazon.com/Happy-Balls-Doubleshot-Mechanical-Keyboards（Blue/dp/B0BLZ6M6MC?ref_=ast_sto_dp
(edit the seller chosing the name "Happy Balls" is hilarious.)

They are not shine through, but yeah the printing and overall quality seems quite good for $20 in my view. The thickness is about equal to the Vortex PBT doubleshots I have on my filco the edge / underside of these seem to be quite well finished as well... here is a couple pics.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

Sure.. This is the link :: https://www.amazon.com/Happy-Balls-Doubleshot-Mechanical-Keyboards（Blue/dp/B0BLZ6M6MC?ref_=ast_sto_dp
(edit the seller chosing the name "Happy Balls" is hilarious.)

They are not shine through, but yeah the printing and overall quality seems quite good for $20 in my view. The thickness is about equal to the Vortex PBT doubleshots I have on my filco the edge / underside of these seem to be quite well finished as well... here is a couple pics.

View attachment 628381View attachment 628382

Yeah, good price and quality, but I am really not crazy about the color scheme.

IMHO navy blue and black never go together. And beige? Just no.

I was going to, but I think I'll have to pass. Thanks for the link though.

 

[dogDAbone]

IMHO navy blue and black never go together. And beige? Just no.

yuk, puke, barf....

'nuff said

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

yuk, puke, barf....

'nuff said

Yeah, I was sort of half hoping that knowing the price and quality were good, that there would be other color combos to choose from on the store page.

No such luck.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

Picked up one of these recently - www.dygma.com Defy - after owning their original Raise split ergo keyboard which was fantastic.

View: https://imgur.com/a/vkA2EDx

This will be my first ortholinear/columnar split keyboard so it will be an adjustment, but hopefully worthwhile. My particular Defy is "full spec" which means all of the basic features are included (and there are a lot of "basic" ones like hotswap sockets; my previous Raise was Kailh Speed Silver, so this time I tried Gateron G Pro Yellow 2.0 which are apparently well regarded for linears. ) plus Wireless (both bluetooth and 2.4ghz dongle), Tenting up to 60degrees, and multi-zone Underglow (standard RGBW per key is default, the underglow is separate and more useful than you'd think both for layers and for stuff like having it monitor your system).

I backed it during the crowdfunding and ended up saving quite a bit vs the launch price. One thing that impresses me is both the desire to use open source firmware/software, and having watched them as a new company grow through fulfilling several major projects, they've always been forthcoming with exactly what's going on - even when stuff went wrong. They seem to be far more trustworthy than most and the open ethos is worth it too. I have been considering getting a columnar layout for awhile and looked into several others including various ErgoDox layouts/kits, the Moonlander, Kenesis Advantage360, Keyboardio Model100, and afew others and overall the Dygma looke like a better option. I'll have to see how it goes getting used to the layout but if anyone has questions just let me know/

That name. It reminds me of Ligma...

 

[dogDAbone]

Update #1:

For anyone who cares, I received my Hexgears X5 yesterday, and here are my thoughts on it:

The GOOD:

A) Reasonably priced
B) Very well packaged, with both a VERY STURDY cardboard inner box and a plastic insert that is form-molded to match & protect the entire KB surface and frame
C) Very solid feeling, but somewhat heavy, probably because of the metal top plate & frame
D) The USB-C cable port and 3 routing channels are recessed into the bottom frame, which will allow your cable to run out to the left, right or from the center as needed - A NICE TOUCH (a sturdy, braided cable is included, as is a cap puller & a set of red WASD & spacebar keys)
E) A smooth, firm and mildly-clicky typing experience, which I liked, even though I only used it for about 30 mins

The BAD:

A) The key caps appear well made, however, the upper 1/8 of them are solid instead of clear/opaque/shine thru, making the backlighting mostly useless, unless you're typing in a dim/dark setting, which aint me
B) Most of the backlighting seems to point towards the upper part of the KB & the keys themselves, which is fine if you are the type that hovers yourself directly over it, but if you sit back from it like I do, it's mostly useless

The UGLY:

A) Almost every function beyond the basics requires use of the "FN" key + another key, which I don't care for, perhaps because I'm so used to my G613 that has single use keys for everything, especially media controls, which I use extensively...but there are duplicates for that function too, which is redundant IMO
B) The backlighting options are very limited, at least without using any additional software. There are 4 presets for OFF, DIM, a little BRIGHTER, AND BRIGHTEST settings, which again, requires the FN key + the another key to activate. I did not even fiddle with trying to turn on any colors, since I don't do the rainbow circus puke thingy anyways

So, back to da Zon it goes, but hopefully my KeyChron will arrive Monday and will provide a better experience..TBD

 

[atarione]

So ... I decided to try to the alternate color options of a few keys... trying to decide it this is better or not.... in fairness if they just had a WOB version of this very set I would have been more pleased really.... tried to try something different...because I have always just mostly used White on Black keycaps... With the alt colors I think I like this better now.

 

[RanceJustice]

That name. It reminds me of Ligma...

The developers' HQ is in Spain, so they may or may not have been up on the meme reference at the time of their first campaign, though one of their reps for a time used "Dygma Balls" as a chat username so safe to say they know all they can do is lean into it at this point, at lest unofficially. The official rationale for the name seems to be a reference to paradigm being "paradigma" in Spanish and possibly something to do with "dynamic" as well. The company seem to be of good humor in general, as evidenced by thier videos

 

[mashie]

So ... I decided to try to the alternate color options of a few keys... trying to decide it this is better or not.... in fairness if they just had a WOB version of this very set I would have been more pleased really.... tried to try something different...because I have always just mostly used White on Black keycaps... With the alt colors I think I like this better now.

View attachment 628912

That is looking nice.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

That is looking nice.

Those yellowish ones looked beige in the previous pics.

They look much better in the last one.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

I did some casual poking around on Amazon, and I kind of like these. I think they might look good on my anodized black WASD keyboard.

I haven't actually bought a whole lot of keycaps, so I don't really know where $36 falls on the price scale, or what level of quality to expect at that price, but they seem to review pretty well. None of the reviews are very detailed though. Don't exactly come across as keyboard enthusiasts. I might order a set to have as a backup.

Not crazy about their sample keyboard, and I might skip the red escape (that has been so overdone over the years) but I think they'd look really good on my more recessed board.

They are a little traditional/conservative, but yeah, so are my tastes most of the time.

Not quite sure what layout they had in mind for some of those alternate keycaps though...

The WASD keyboard came with ABS caps, and with my typing, they probably won't last long before being worn shiny. My understanding is that PBT is more resilient, at the dost of maybe slightly less sharply defined, and less translucent double-shots. That's a tradeoff I am OK with.

I like subtle and understated. You know, like European premium performance sedans used to be like. I still consider the E39 M5 the best BMW. Maybe even the E34. Back before they got too racy.

 

[Prince Valiant]

Looks alright aside from escape.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

Looks alright aside from escape.

It comes with an alternate black escape key, which is good.

I don't like the "vpro" board they demo the keycaps on. I bet it will look much better on my anodized WASD.

I personally can't stand the keyboards with non-recessed keys.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

The developers' HQ is in Spain, so they may or may not have been up on the meme reference at the time of their first campaign, though one of their reps for a time used "Dygma Balls" as a chat username so safe to say they know all they can do is lean into it at this point, at lest unofficially. The official rationale for the name seems to be a reference to paradigm being "paradigma" in Spanish and possibly something to do with "dynamic" as well. The company seem to be of good humor in general, as evidenced by thier videos

Hah, I'm glad I'm not the only person whose brain migrated in that direction

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

View attachment 629334

Not quite sure what layout they had in mind for some of those alternate keycaps though...

Come to think of it. I don't even know what a 122 key layout is.... The modern version of the IBM Enhanced layout with the windows keys is what, 104 key, right?

They have a 108 key version which is 5 bucks cheaper. I'll probably just get that.

I think that means it comes with the four media keys (which I don't need) but no black escape key which is a bummer.

But for the $5 I'll just use a PBT escape key I have kicking around from an old dead Ducky Shine 6. It's an OEM keycap. It ought to blend in...

 

[brennok]

Come to think of it. I don't even know what a 122 key layout is.... The modern version of the IBM Enhanced layout with the windows keys is what, 104 key, right?

They have a 108 key version which is 5 bucks cheaper. I'll probably just get that.

I think that means it comes with the four media keys (which I don't need) but no black escape key which is a bummer.

But for the $5 I'll just use a PBT escape key I have kicking around from an old dead Ducky Shine 6. It's an OEM keycap. It ought to blend in...

Looks like it is more 122 keys and not 122 key layout. For example in the one pic they show Fn vs FN on the keyboard so I think they are just showing the alternate keys they include. The pic you linked is 122 keys.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

I did some casual poking around on Amazon, and I kind of like these. I think they might look good on my anodized black WASD keyboard.

I haven't actually bought a whole lot of keycaps, so I don't really know where $36 falls on the price scale, or what level of quality to expect at that price, but they seem to review pretty well. None of the reviews are very detailed though. Don't exactly come across as keyboard enthusiasts. I might order a set to have as a backup.

View attachment 629334

Not crazy about their sample keyboard, and I might skip the red escape (that has been so overdone over the years) but I think they'd look really good on my more recessed board.

They are a little traditional/conservative, but yeah, so are my tastes most of the time.

Not quite sure what layout they had in mind for some of those alternate keycaps though...

The WASD keyboard came with ABS caps, and with my typing, they probably won't last long before being worn shiny. My understanding is that PBT is more resilient, at the dost of maybe slightly less sharply defined, and less translucent double-shots. That's a tradeoff I am OK with.

I like subtle and understated. You know, like European premium performance sedans used to be like. I still consider the E39 M5 the best BMW. Maybe even the E34. Back before they got too racy.

So, I got the 108 key version of these YMDK caps, and installed them today. Believe it or not, the ABS caps that WASD included were already starting to become a little shiny after only about 2 weeks of use. (I do type a lot though)

It takes a lot more time to install 104 keycaps than one would expect.

So I am not a keycap expert (up until now I have always just used what was included with my keyboards, but this is my take on these YMDK caps.

The keycaps are of similar thickness and quality as the OEM caps but they are different. The pictures really don't convey what I am seeing. The OEM caps on the WASD Keyboard are very crisp, and the lettering is small, neat and dense, the way I like it

The lettering on these keycaps is comically large. Playschool style. To say I am not a fan would probably be an understatement.

Also worth noting is that in all pictures, even my own, the darker of the keycaps in the pattern appear black-like, and the lighter of the keycaps in the pattern appear dark grey. In person the darker caps are much lighter in color than the black OEM ones I removed, looking more like a dark grey, and the lighter of the caps are much lighter grey than they appear in the pictures (even in my pictures)

This of course means that the black Esc key I was planning on using will not be a match.

Also worth noting that the color difference in the keycaps is not just in the base material. The lighter of the two YMDK caps have a neutral color that shines through in the same color as the LED's underneath. The darker of the two caps in the pattern have a beige tint to the shine through material which alters that color, and limits the shine through beyond what the PBT material already does.

The lettering is less crisp on them too, but this is probably just a PBT thing. I have noticed that when you go to PBT, you get better wear resistance, but the price you pay is less crispness on the shine-through.

The thickness and shape is very similar, but for some reason, there is more resonance in the vibration of the YMDK caps than the stock WASD ones. I don't think there is anything loose inside them. Maybe they are just not as tight on the stems of the switches. The biggest issue I have with them though is that I find myself not hitting them straight on on occasion, and thus the keystrokes occasionally don't register.

In summary, there are a lot of things I like about these caps, primarily their greater wear resistance and the more textured feel than the WASD OEM's, the issue above pretty much kills them for me.

I am going to leave them installed for now, but I am going to be shopping around for something else.


For stock comparison, here is what that looks like:

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

So, I got the 108 key version of these YMDK caps, and installed them today. Believe it or not, the ABS caps that WASD included were already starting to become a little shiny after only about 2 weeks of use. (I do type a lot though)

View attachment 629763
It takes a lot more time to install 104 keycaps than one would expect.

So I am not a keycap expert (up until now I have always just used what was included with my keyboards, but this is my take on these YMDK caps.

The keycaps are of similar thickness and quality as the OEM caps but they are different. The pictures really don't convey what I am seeing. The OEM caps on the WASD Keyboard are very crisp, and the lettering is small, neat and dense, the way I like it

View attachment 629761

The lettering on these keycaps is comically large. Playschool style. To say I am not a fan would probably be an understatement.

View attachment 629734 View attachment 629735

Also worth noting is that in all pictures, even my own, the darker of the keycaps in the pattern appear black-like, and the lighter of the keycaps in the pattern appear dark grey. In person the darker caps are much lighter in color than the black OEM ones I removed, looking more like a dark grey, and the lighter of the caps are much lighter grey than they appear in the pictures (even in my pictures)

View attachment 629737

This of course means that the black Esc key I was planning on using will not be a match.

Also worth noting that the color difference in the keycaps is not just in the base material. The lighter of the two YMDK caps have a neutral color that shines through in the same color as the LED's underneath. The darker of the two caps in the pattern have a beige tint to the shine through material which alters that color, and limits the shine through beyond what the PBT material already does.

The lettering is less crisp on them too, but this is probably just a PBT thing. I have noticed that when you go to PBT, you get better wear resistance, but the price you pay is less crispness on the shine-through.


View attachment 629736

The thickness and shape is very similar, but for some reason, there is more resonance in the vibration of the YMDK caps than the stock WASD ones. I don't think there is anything loose inside them. Maybe they are just not as tight on the stems of the switches. The biggest issue I have with them though is that I find myself not hitting them straight on on occasion, and thus the keystrokes occasionally don't register.

View attachment 629738

In summary, there are a lot of things I like about these caps, primarily their greater wear resistance and the more textured feel than the WASD OEM's, the issue above pretty much kills them for me.

I am going to leave them installed for now, but I am going to be shopping around for something else.

The caps are growing on me a little bit. I haven't had any failures to register key-presses in day2, so maybe that was just a matter of getting used to them.

The texture is still more satisfying than the ABS keys, the "thock" is slightly more satisfying than OEM, and I am hopeful these PBT caps - unlike the OEM ABS caps they replaced - will take much longer than two weeks before they start to wear shiny.

Still not entirely thrilled with the color. They photograph very well, but in person they look rather chintzy.

I am low key shopping around for another dark (black/grey) themed PBT keycap set with lettering shine-through.

I have started doing my research, and I have noticed that premium caps are a lot more expensive than I had expected for just a few pieces of plastic. I guess the molds - especially for the for the double-shot varieties - are complex, and the volumes just don't wind up being high enough for the type of pricing we associate with "plastic parts".

GMK seems widely regarded as one of the highest quality keycap makers, but their caps are both VERY expensive ($160-$225 for a set) and they seem to not make shine-through caps, which is a must have feature for me. (If I didn't want shine-through caps, I'd just go back to using an old IBM Model M.)

To those of you with keycap experience, any recommendations for brands to check out that have GMK-like quality, but also are double shot with a material that supports shine-through?

I'm not sure I am ready to spend $200 on a keycap set, but if the reviews are positive enough and I get the sense that they won't wear out on me, I might be convinced.

I'm going to keep these keycaps installed until I order something else.

 

[RanceJustice]

The caps are growing on me a little bit. I haven't had any failures to register key-presses in day2, so maybe that was just a matter of getting used to them.

The texture is still more satisfying than the ABS keys, the "thock" is slightly more satisfying than OEM, and I am hopeful these PBT caps - unlike the OEM ABS caps they replaced - will take much longer than two weeks before they start to wear shiny.

Still not entirely thrilled with the color. They photograph very well, but in person they look rather chintzy.

I am low key shopping around for another dark (black/grey) themed PBT keycap set with lettering shine-through.

I have started doing my research, and I have noticed that premium caps are a lot more expensive than I had expected for just a few pieces of plastic. I guess the molds - especially for the for the double-shot varieties - are complex, and the volumes just don't wind up being high enough for the type of pricing we associate with "plastic parts".

GMK seems widely regarded as one of the highest quality keycap makers, but their caps are both VERY expensive ($160-$225 for a set) and they seem to not make shine-through caps, which is a must have feature for me. (If I didn't want shine-through caps, I'd just go back to using an old IBM Model M.)

To those of you with keycap experience, any recommendations for brands to check out that have GMK-like quality, but also are double shot with a material that supports shine-through?

I'm not sure I am ready to spend $200 on a keycap set, but if the reviews are positive enough and I get the sense that they won't wear out on me, I might be convinced.

I'm going to keep these keycaps installed until I order something else.

GMK is almost all ABS, double shot, but not always shine through. Their price is pretty much because they're very good at that, and they're also willing to take orders for group buys provided you can wait long enough in the future. Finding double shot, shine through, PBT is very difficult. Hell, just finding double shot PBT at all is hard as compared to dye-sub/reverse dye-sub. There are some occasional one offs from different manufacturers , with different profiles etc. There are also a bunch of knockoffs on Taobao/Aliexpress etc.

If you want doubleshot, PBT shine-through your best option is Tai-Hao. The vast majority of big keyboard projects (Moonlander etc) that have doubleshot shinethrough PBT are using these - they make a lot of off-the-shelf colors and solutions too and I hear they're pretty solid. Also if you'd like to look into more about custom keyboard basics, youmay want to check out something like - https://www.keyboard.university/ .

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

GMK is almost all ABS, double shot, but not always shine through. Their price is pretty much because they're very good at that, and they're also willing to take orders for group buys provided you can wait long enough in the future. Finding double shot, shine through, PBT is very difficult. Hell, just finding double shot PBT at all is hard as compared to dye-sub/reverse dye-sub. There are some occasional one offs from different manufacturers , with different profiles etc. There are also a bunch of knockoffs on Taobao/Aliexpress etc.

If you want doubleshot, PBT shine-through your best option is Tai-Hao. The vast majority of big keyboard projects (Moonlander etc) that have doubleshot shinethrough PBT are using these - they make a lot of off-the-shelf colors and solutions too and I hear they're pretty solid. Also if you'd like to look into more about custom keyboard basics, youmay want to check out something like - https://www.keyboard.university/ .

Appreciate the references/suggestions!

I did not realize GMK caps were ABS. Seems nuts to spend that much money on caps that are going to be worn shiny and ugly so fast.

 

[doubletake]

I did not realize GMK caps were ABS. Seems nuts to spend that much money on caps that are going to be worn shiny and ugly so fast.

GMK caps aren't cheap raw ABS like the noname chinese brands you'll find all over the place. While I also agree that their pricing is wild and wouldn't pay for caps that cost as much as a whole decent keyboard, I wouldn't compare their quality and durability to the cheap stuff. I've only ever had one of their sets because someone gifted it to me, but they were pretty nice, and definitely felt closer in feel and sound to midrange PBT caps than to cheaper ABS sets.

 

[NyxNightGoddess]

Here is my finished project. RK RK-S87 with Kailh Speed Silver tape modded the PCB, and added painters' tape to the bigger keys. Its thocky and I love it.