Ubi DRM: Their side of the story

[swatbat]

sounds great, but gimme an offline mode ala Steam and I'll love it. Leave out offline mode and I'll hate it.

Wait, am I missing something? This is just a worse version of Steam right? Steam already has close to 0 piracy, so what is Ubisoft aiming for?

Oh and I loved this answer: "If you're connection is lost, the game will pause and try to re-establish connection to the server. If it cannot, you will be able to later resume from the last game save." It won't even let you save your game state if the connection is lost. Not buying any Ubisoft games with this system. Thanks but no thanks..

Yea if they had some kind of offline mode this wouldn't be that bad. Personally I have refused to buy anything from them pc gaming wise since the starforce that came with splintercell fucked up my notebook. Made it so my notebook couldn't burn a cd or dvd. I was about to buy a new dvdrw for it when I noticed something about this starforce bullshit. At the time the game had been long uninstalled from my notebook as well because I had beat it. Yea fuck them, I will not install their stuff on my pc again after they sold me what amounted to a virus.

Apart from those two groups, the rest of us do have internet connections. The notion that we're somehow not going to be able to connect to the Ubisoft website to play AC 2 is just ridiculous - that's just not going to happen. That same argument was advanced when Steam was released - people said, oh but what if Steam goes down, I won't be able to play any of my games! Nope, the only thing that people had to fear in that situation was fear itself.

One they will have downtime. It may or may not affect you. I use to play my games from my notebook and when traveling so this would affect me. Even with my evdo card you have areas where you just can't get a good connection(or if you are say flying). Also steam sucked major ass when it first came out. They had a lot of issues with people connecting. I was in a gaming clan at the time and my clan tag was a flash animation of the steam error box. I missed a few clan matches because steam was too busy to verify my account for a game I payed for the right to play on servers I was paying for. Mind you they did fix these issues, it was a big problem at the time for us. Hell I had bought 2 copies of half life 2. Played HL2 on my desktop and had the second copy because that was the only way to get CS:S at the time.

I've already seen issues with my xbox connecting to uplay with ac2. As of now my verizon fios is pretty stable but I have seen glitches before. I'd be pissed if I had to replay a section of a single player game because it lost connection to the servers. Yes it is something that will happen to people. Hell let it at least save the progress locally and let you restart once it connects. Or better yet have an offline option.

and during their time off do you really think they want to spend their time playing AC2???

here's a solid clue- No

Ha!

LOL at the above debate about US military personnel not being able to play Assassin's Creed 2 because they can't connect to the internet!

The US Army can't connect to the internet. LOL! That is rich!

First off I've had multiple friends stationed overseas and most of them had a notebook with games loaded on it. Hell a few had consoles. Second the internet connection in many places sucks ass. I know a few that were stationed in areas that bought evdo cards so they could have a better internet connection. One had some pictures of being stationed in Kuwait if I remember right where they had a big cell antenna pointed towards a city as the base was a ways from it. It was the only way they could get a connection worth a shit and even then it wasn't very good.

 

[WabeWalker]

Ah well, it's just a game.

But that said, I know which game I'll be playing on the ninth of March.

 

[Q-BZ]

Ah well, it's just a game.

But that said, I know which game I'll be playing on the ninth of March.

I definitely want to be there but I tell you: This really puts a hell of a haze over the whole thing.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6195570.html

http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=19736

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/03/05/the-yarr-ts-piracy-snapshot-532008/

Thank you for providing some sources to back up all those numbers you had flying all over the place.



Here's what I'm going to be looking out for: The gaming press and especially the PC gaming press. The press can become a very interesting factor in all of this.

I'm eager to see those editorials start flying because I seriously doubt you're going to see any support for the likes of this from any outlet.

 

[polonyc2]

Here's what I'm going to be looking out for: The gaming press and especially the PC gaming press. The press can become a very interesting factor in all of this.

I'm eager to see those editorials start flying because I seriously doubt you're going to see any support for the likes of this from any outlet.

that actually might not happen...the game was officially released for consoles back in November...it got tons of amazing reviews with almost universal praise stating that it improves upon the first game in every way

4 months later there are not going to be many PC specific reviews of the game because the gameplay will be the exact same so most sites will just rehash their console reviews...so I'm afraid this will not get much publicity outside tech/gaming forums such as this

take Aliens vs Predator as an example...game came out last Tuesday for all platforms and I've yet to see 1 PC exclusive review on it

 

[Derangel]

that actually might not happen...the game was officially released for consoles back in November...it got tons of amazing reviews with almost universal praise stating that it improves upon the first game in every way

4 months later there are not going to be many PC specific reviews of the game because the gameplay will be the exact same so most sites will just rehash their console reviews...so I'm afraid this will not get much publicity outside tech/gaming forums such as this

take Aliens vs Predator as an example...game came out last Tuesday for all platforms and I've yet to see 1 PC exclusive review on it

There are a couple here: http://www.metacritic.com/games/platforms/pc/aliensvspredator?q=Aliens vs. Predator

 

[WabeWalker]

I definitely want to be there but I tell you: This really puts a hell of a haze over the whole thing.

Thank you for providing some sources to back up all those numbers you had flying all over the place.

Did you think I was just making it up?

It was well publicized that Ubisoft got creamed by PC Gamers not paying for Assassin's Creed. The ratio was 17 to 1. Hardly anybody who played the damned game actually paid for it.

And ya know.... if it had been a smaller company that had developed this game (can anybody say Iron Lore) then of course they would have gone out of business, and we wouldn't be getting AC 2, which by all accounts is everything that the first game wasn't. If this had been a smaller company, and they had been raped like that, then they never would have had the chance to get it right the second time. (The first game wasn't even that bad - it just wasn't great.)

Come on, guys, start connecting the dots here.

Also, if I were a betting man, I'd bet that you personally, Q-BZ - for all that you've written against this DRM - will have this game on your PC either on day one or two.

Way, way too much is being made of this - but again, it's pretty obvious that the most belligerent people posting in this thread are the pirates who contributed to that 17 to 1 ratio. It doesn't take much to figure it out.

 

[polonyc2]

There are a couple here: http://www.metacritic.com/games/platforms/pc/aliensvspredator?q=Aliens vs. Predator

half those reviews are from foreign countries...the rest are not PC specific reviews...if you read the Gamespot review it's the exact same review as the console versions of the game word for word...they don't mention anything about the PC exclusive DX11 features...the only legit PC review from that list is from IGN...but that just proves my point...1 PC review for a highly anticipated game?...now imagine when AC2 comes out in March, 4 months after it came out for consoles, how many reviews the PC version will get

 

[Carl]

...but again, it's pretty obvious that the most belligerent people posting in this thread are the pirates who contributed to that 17 to 1 ratio. It doesn't take much to figure it out.

I dont agree with that, honestly why would the pirates care about the drm? they are just going to get a cracked version and not have to worry about it at all. Its the consumers who pay for the product and end up getting this pita that are complaining,and angry teenagers,but they complain about everything anyway

 

[Q-BZ]

Did you think I was just making it up?

No, I just wanted to see those figures and see the stories.

It was well publicized that Ubisoft got creamed by PC Gamers not paying for Assassin's Creed. The ratio was 17 to 1. Hardly anybody who played the damned game actually paid for it.

I remember the buzz at the time but I didn't remember the figures. I knew it was a pretty bad piracy situation.

I didn't know it was THAT bad and that out of control.

And ya know.... if it had been a smaller company that had developed this game (can anybody say Iron Lore) then of course they would have gone out of business, and we wouldn't be getting AC 2, which by all accounts is everything that the first game wasn't. If this had been a smaller company, and they had been raped like that, then they never would have had the chance to get it right the second time. (The first game wasn't even that bad - it just wasn't great.)

I thought it was close to great myself. A little repetitive here and there but I really liked it. That's what the billing on AC2 really has me itching.

Come on, guys, start connecting the dots here.

It's a no brainer WHY Ubisoft went this route with the DRM. Even if I didn't know any figures obviously it's a reaction to a piracy problem. Why else would you put any DRM on anything, right?

I think that this kind of DRM really is a double edged sword that's going to cost them sales and, unfortunately, I think the pirates are going to get their way as usual anways and end up with a more convenient product vs. the legit end user. It's just a question of how long it will take them.


I do think this DRM will succeed short term at least and you will not see a runaway 17/1 piracy ratio on this title. I think it'll bring the ratio down. It won't eliminate it.

The x factor here will be: How many legit sales will UbiSoft freeze out?

Also, if I were a betting man, I'd bet that you personally, Q-BZ - for all that you've written against this DRM - will have this game on your PC either on day one or two.

I want it bad enough and I've waited...yeah, despite myself odds probably do favor me buying it pretty early and holding my breath.

I loved the first game and all signs point to me liking this one even more. I've made no bones about this being a highly anticipated title for me.

That's probably why you've seen me get as belligerent as I have because I really am displeased that this game is going to muddled down with this particular kind of nonsense.



I shouldn't be in a place where I'm going to buy a single player game and then feel lucky when it works and have to hold my breath. That's a bad feeling. I think it's wrong.

I might be tempted to wait the "2 months" or whatever that suggested time frame was to see if they patch this crap out or not.


I also think the gaming press might lean into this a bit as well and that might have an affect. I hope it does. I hope the editorials are large, loud, scathing, and all over the place. I just don't see anyone in the gaming press being in favor of this and I hardly think you'd call any of them piracy advocates.

I dont agree with that, honestly why would the pirates care about the drm? they are just going to get a cracked version and not have to worry about it at all. Its the consumers who pay for the product and end up getting this pita that are complaining,and angry teenagers,but they complain about everything anyway

That's the sad truth. What do pirates have to be angry about? They know they'll get a nice, polished product with zero inconvenience and it's just a question of when.

This DRM will slow them down. You won't see a runaway 17/1 piracy ratio on this game but it isn't going to stop them. It's as simple as that.

 

[WabeWalker]

On a completely unrelated note, I have it written down in my calender that the release date was going to be March 16, but now I'm seeing EB Games, and D2D, listing the game as March 9.

So was it bumped up a week? It must've been. Hopefully Steam will be putting this one up as well.

 

[cgrant26]

dude don't you understand what I'm saying?...maybe your military friends do in fact play games 24/7...but I'm sure the normal ones don't...they have much better things they want to do during their free time then play games...

LOL! I guess most of the guys in Mike Company, 3/3 ACR and HHC 1/35 1AD are not normal. Back in 96 I was THE FUCKING MAN in Camp LA Linda, Olovo Bosnia because I was the only sum' bitch that had the foresight to bring a Playstation on deployment with me. I didn't have a TV at first but it didn't take someone very long to "procure" one for me. Talk about accumulating friends and favors, lol.

Listen, anyone that has served in the armed forces should be an expert at playing Spades and familiar with the phrase "hurry up and wait". The number one killer of soldiers in the field is boredom induced complacency and that doesn't come from being too busy. The problem isn't that we have better things to do, it's that there isn't shit to do. It's much like being in prison on a deployment and even in garrison you're always fighting boredom.

Ha!

LOL at the above debate about US military personnel not being able to play Assassin's Creed 2 because they can't connect to the internet!

The US Army can't connect to the internet. LOL! That is rich!

Such ignorance.
Let me familiarize you on a couple of terms:
Mission critical and Not Mission Critical
For 100 points, can you guess which one of these categories "internet free time" falls under?

That said, I don't have a problem at all with companies taking steps to protect their games from piracy. I DO have a problem, however, with creating a rather large inconvienience for a segment of your paying customers. The easy solution here would be to simply offer an offline mode like Steam does. Problem solved.

 

[Intel_Hydralisk]

Way, way too much is being made of this - but again, it's pretty obvious that the most belligerent people posting in this thread are the pirates who contributed to that 17 to 1 ratio. It doesn't take much to figure it out.

Why would pirates care about the DRM? They'll have a DRM free version.

 

[polonyc2]

I didn't have a TV at first but it didn't take someone very long to "procure" one for me. Talk about accumulating friends and favors, lol.

geez a little too much information...what happened to the 'don't ask don't tell' policy?

 

[swatbat]

Way, way too much is being made of this - but again, it's pretty obvious that the most belligerent people posting in this thread are the pirates who contributed to that 17 to 1 ratio. It doesn't take much to figure it out.

While a few people in here are the ones that would pirate the game a lot of people are ones that just don't want to be treated like a pirate.

Ubisoft throwing in what amount to a virus(starforce) and companies like EA pretty much got me out of pc gaming. With EA it was battlefield 1942. Got the multiplayer demo and it was really good so I bought the game on launch day. Game ran like crap. The server and game code seemed to be months behind the demo. I felt cheated and robbed. Took them a month or so to patch the game to the level of the demo. Pretty much said fuck them after that. Watched as the vietnam version came out and had the same issues. It was like they didn't take any of the patch work that had done on 1942. It got to the point a lot of companies were just passing off shit to the pc world knowing they could patch it later. Thing about how many games you have seen with huge launch day patches over the years. While it isn't a lot of money I perfer to spend it elsewhere.

Sad thing is with the 360 and the ps3 more games are needing patches soon after being released. Darksiders for the 360 is a good example. Their is no way in hell the graphics tearing issue could have been missed in beta testing. I still game on the console but I am getting pushed back more with the crap they are starting to pull with it.

I don't mind DRM as long as it doesn't really stick out. The content management on the 360 for the most part works. Yea I'd rather not need to disk to play but that really doesn't cause that big of an issue. Also WGA for windows and office doesn't bother me. I will not however jump through the hoops that Ubi is asking for. With how DRM is going they are starting to push people to pirate. I remember when HL2 came out a few friends that ended up not buying the game because the ones that did couldn't get it to work due to steam being locked up. It took less time to download the hacked version then go through the dencryption of the retail disks(or the steam preload). They downloaded the hacked copy and were playing it. By the time value fixed the steam issues they were a good way through the game and saw no reason to buy the boxed copy to waste a few hours getting it to load.

Now Ubisoft has not completly lost me as a customer yet. I bought AC2 as well as the 2 extra maps on the 360. Thought it was a pretty good game overall. I didn't like the uplay crap they added though. I could never get my free level that was promised on the box(had a code inside). I will say their uplay will make me consider another game from them. It is an extra layer of crap that doesn't really add anything to the game that live doesn't offer.

 

[novadude]

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6195570.html

http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=19736

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2008/03/05/the-yarr-ts-piracy-snapshot-532008/

Why did the the duplication firm have the pre-release copy with bugs? They would have been pressing final retail copies of the game so those articles are more PR bullshit.

As for a real reason why more people didn't buy it: not only had it had been out for months on consoles already, it wasn't worth the $50 price tag!. I didn't buy it until it was on sale for $5.

 

[swatbat]

That said, I don't have a problem at all with companies taking steps to protect their games from piracy. I DO have a problem, however, with creating a rather large inconvienience for a segment of your paying customers. The easy solution here would be to simply offer an offline mode like Steam does. Problem solved.

Yea give us something to help offset it.

Good example of this is live. I knew so many people with modded first xboxs it wasn't funny. Most of them now have unmodded 360s. Reason was the achievement system and the online gaming. Both gave them big reasons not to mod. This along with all sorts of other things that the moding can break like netflix support. The amount of live arcade games some of us have now is nuts.

In Ubisofts case the online saving of games is a nice touch. I wish the 360's live service had a more portable way to carry your account with you. IE have it on your 360 and have a portable copy on a memory card. Putting your profile on a memory card alone just doesn't work as well as it could.

 

[cgrant26]

geez a little too much information...what happened to the 'don't ask don't tell' policy?

To fulfil your mental image, it would have had to have been a complete gayfest considering the lack of any real privacy, lol. Think the "steel workers" scene from the Simpsons.

The reality: the collection of "Lovely Girls" stickers on the inside of the plywood latrine door got to be pretty impressive. "Lovely Girls" was just like Bazooka gum but instead of a lame comic, there was a sticker of a naked girl. Bosnian kids would trade them for MREs. Those stickers wound up almost everywhere until we had a CASH unit with females move in and then we had to scrape them all off. And speaking of naked girls, the secret porn stash in an Abrams tank will always be either behind the loader's radio stack or stashed in the ammo stowage racks.

Anyways, back to our regularily scheduled debate...

 

[WabeWalker]

Why would pirates care about the DRM? They'll have a DRM free version.

Oh no they won't.

 

[WabeWalker]

Yea give us something to help offset it.

Good example of this is live. I knew so many people with modded first xboxs it wasn't funny. Most of them now have unmodded 360s. Reason was the achievement system and the online gaming. Both gave them big reasons not to mod. This along with all sorts of other things that the moding can break like netflix support. The amount of live arcade games some of us have now is nuts.

In Ubisofts case the online saving of games is a nice touch. I wish the 360's live service had a more portable way to carry your account with you. IE have it on your 360 and have a portable copy on a memory card. Putting your profile on a memory card alone just doesn't work as well as it could.

Not to mention that Microsoft finally started to crack down on people who had modded their 360's. It's great when these jerks wake up in the morning and find out that their modded 360 no longer works on Live.

 

[Intel_Hydralisk]

Oh no they won't.

Seriously? You seriously think that Ubi's DRM can't be cracked?

As a consumer the ONLY reason this DRM rubs me the wrong way is because paying customers are getting an inferior product like I've stated before.

If you're incredibly happy for this DRM because you seriously think it'll stop pirates, then more power to you.

 

[mas]

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2010/02/ubisoft-details-drm.ars

People can look the likes of that over carefully and decide for themselves. I feel like that has a few new little details in it. I stand by everything I wrote in every thread about this subject. I think THIS kind of copy protection implementation done this way is garbage.

so the gist of it is, from the methods they described for ac2 and settlers7, ubi is treating a lost connection just like if you get killed or lose the game. only reload/quickload is now useless until you get back online.

just one of those things that sound good on paper, but will see massive failure in actual gaming. tho we got to admit it's not really much different than what they already have now, they have actually been doing this for years. every single one of their releases constantly bangs on their servers the whole time you play, only now they're going to kill the game if you ever get cut off. that's probably what made them think it's ok, they have years and years of data mining to justify it. those of you who let them keep doing it, thinking "who cares as long as they don't do anything bad with it", well this is what you get.

 

[Dion]

Seriously? You seriously think that Ubi's DRM can't be cracked?

As a consumer the ONLY reason this DRM rubs me the wrong way is because paying customers are getting an inferior product like I've stated before.

If you're incredibly happy for this DRM because you seriously think it'll stop pirates, then more power to you.

It worked on Splinter Cell Chaos Theory. It took the pirates months to pirate it.. By then the game had already sold everything it was gonna sell.. So there is a good chance it can work. And lets not forget. Some of ubisoft's last big games didn't have any DRM on PC. POP and SCA. It amazes me how people can turn on you in a split second. But can never see the good they do.

 

[WabeWalker]

Seriously? You seriously think that Ubi's DRM can't be cracked?

As a consumer the ONLY reason this DRM rubs me the wrong way is because paying customers are getting an inferior product like I've stated before.

If you're incredibly happy for this DRM because you seriously think it'll stop pirates, then more power to you.

Ubisoft sounds pretty content with what they've come up with.

This isn't some ridiculous Securom coding that can simply be bypassed. This is constant checking. Based on what I've read (the links are all posted in this thread) Ubisoft seems to have created hundreds of check points throughout the game. If your copy ain't legit, then you ain't gonna progress.

 

[Derangel]

Ubisoft sounds pretty content with what they've come up with.

This isn't some ridiculous Securom coding that can simply be bypassed. This is constant checking. Based on what I've read (the links are all posted in this thread) Ubisoft seems to have created hundreds of check points throughout the game. If your copy ain't legit, then you ain't gonna progress.

It took nearly two weeks for SecuRom 7 to be bypassed when Bioshock 1 came out. This will be cracked within that amount of time most likely. There are no unbreakable DRM methods, period.

 

[WabeWalker]

It took nearly two weeks for SecuRom 7 to be bypassed when Bioshock 1 came out. This will be cracked within that amount of time most likely. There are no unbreakable DRM methods, period.

You don't get it. This has nothing whatsoever to do with Securom or any other type of ridiculous DRM that's aimed at preventing the copying of the disc.

The pirates will be able to copy the disc right away - no question about it. They'll get past that in a matter of days if not hours.

Now they have to deal with the authentication check at constant intervals. I wish them all the luck with that. I'll watch in great glee as they fail. I'm willing to bet that on day one, when I play this game, it will be the first game in years I'll be playing before the pirates.

 

[Derangel]

You don't get it. This has nothing whatsoever to do with Securom or any other type of ridiculous DRM that's aimed at preventing the copying of the disc.

The pirates will be able to copy the disc right away - no question about it. They'll get past that in a matter of days if not hours.

Now they have to deal with the authentication check at constant intervals. I wish them all the luck with that. I'll watch in great glee as they fail. I'm willing to bet that on day one, when I play this game, it will be the first game in years I'll be playing before the pirates.

Are you dense? SC7 dealt with online activation, not disc copying.

 

[WabeWalker]

Are you dense? SC7 dealt with online activation, not disc copying.

Okay, let's just wait two weeks then. Christ this is really becoming a stupid thread.

 

[Derangel]

Okay, let's just wait two weeks then. Christ this is really becoming a stupid thread.

Only because you're posting in it.

 

[WabeWalker]

Only because you're posting in it.

Are you going to keep this up, Derangel?

You have your views, and I have mine. There's no need to resort to that sort of thing. If you want to put me on your ignore list then please do so. You don't have to read anything that I've written.

 

[Spewn]

Did you think I was just making it up?

It was well publicized that Ubisoft got creamed by PC Gamers not paying for Assassin's Creed. The ratio was 17 to 1. Hardly anybody who played the damned game actually paid for it.

And ya know.... if it had been a smaller company that had developed this game (can anybody say Iron Lore) then of course they would have gone out of business, and we wouldn't be getting AC 2

Totally. Remember when the piracy ratio for World of Goo was 10:1, and shortly thereafter 2DBoy closed its doors on account of them being a small developer who couldn't handle that kind of piracy?

Oh wait, that didn't actually happen.

 

[WabeWalker]

Totally. Remember when the piracy ratio for World of Goo was 10:1, and shortly thereafter 2DBoy closed its doors on account of them being a small developer who couldn't handle that kind of piracy?

Oh wait, that didn't actually happen.

Ah, clever.

 

[Derangel]

Are you going to keep this up, Derangel?

You have your views, and I have mine. There's no need to resort to that sort of thing. If you want to put me on your ignore list then please do so. You don't have to read anything that I've written.

Sorry, I wasn't being entirely serious with that post. I do, however, think you are bit too hard headed to even remotely accept other beliefs beyond your own and you resort to calling everyone who disagrees with this DRM method a pirate. Your attitude does not promote kind discussion. The fact that you bring up the same exact arguments time and again, without change, doesn't help. You refuse to back down one step and accept that maybe some other ideas have merit and your blind reliance on the "piracy" angle doesn't let you see the other problems with this.

I'm going to equate that to the people who wish to remove any and all sense of freedom and privacy just to protect the rights of safety of children and call anyone who disagrees with them a child molester. Obviously you aren't that extreme, but your arguments come pretty close to it at times.

 

[swatbat]

Now they have to deal with the authentication check at constant intervals. I wish them all the luck with that. I'll watch in great glee as they fail. I'm willing to bet that on day one, when I play this game, it will be the first game in years I'll be playing before the pirates.

I still don't think it will take the pirates that long to crack. They have managed to bypass this type of stuff before.

I can't remember what game it was that had a hidden check in it where the hacked version would let people play to a certian point and then it would be like a bug wouldn't let them do something. Turned out to be trick by the developer. What got me was how many calls/email to tech support they got on it. I mean it is one thing to pirate something, it is another to then call their support to find out why it isn't working right.

Anyway I remember some of the weird tricks that were done in the past. With the dreamcast I remember reading about how a lot of the pirate copies of games had the audio converted to mono to save space since they had to cut them down to fit on a cdr. Some of the games then had random checks in them to verify the audio was stero. Pirates were able to modify the games to figure that out.

Pirates are also the reason that demos will have the securerom and other types of copy protection on them. The software pirates were using the demo exe's to find ways around the disk check software.

 

[Shalafi]

MW 2 required Steam, yet the pirates hacked it

 

[WabeWalker]

Time will tell.

It's just two weeks until AC 2's release. It's obvious that Ubisoft is trying to avoid the situation that happened to them with the first game.

We'll see what happens. Personally, I've been expecting this sort of thing for a couple of years now, and the only thing that really surprises me is that another company hasn't implemented this same scheme already.

But the one thing we can all agree on is that pirating is for losers, right? And also that we're all mad passionate about computer gaming - right?

 

[Derangel]

Time will tell.

It's just two weeks until AC 2's release. It's obvious that Ubisoft is trying to avoid the situation that happened to them with the first game.

We'll see what happens. Personally, I've been expecting this sort of thing for a couple of years now, and the only thing that really surprises me is that another company hasn't implemented this same scheme already.

But the one thing we can all agree on is that pirating is for losers, right? And also that we're all mad passionate about computer gaming - right?

If, if Ubisoft can prove to me that this works perfectly and if the checkpoints for saving are all within a few minutes of each other then I'll reconsider my position, but I'm still not buying a $60 PC game.

I just thought of something. Isn't this tied to their UPlay or whatever its called service that tracks game achievements and gives you points for them that you can spend on some in-game stuff?

 

[Climber]

Time will tell.

It's just two weeks until AC 2's release. It's obvious that Ubisoft is trying to avoid the situation that happened to them with the first game.

Not make a shitty game? AC2 is considerably better than the first so I think we'll see less pirating of this game overall due to that. Look at the numbers of pirated games in 2007 when AC came out. Shitty mc shit games got pirated more. Fallout 3 was downloaded 600k times compared to over a million each for spore and AC. FC2 was so bad though it only got downloaded 500k times so I guess that may put a hole in my theory.

We'll see what happens. Personally, I've been expecting this sort of thing for a couple of years now, and the only thing that really surprises me is that another company hasn't implemented this same scheme already.

No one is that dumb maybe? Maybe dumb is too harsh, maybe no one wanted to take the chance on such draconian measures in risk of shooting themselves in the foot. Steam is about as much DRM as I want, anything more becomes a hindrance.

But the one thing we can all agree on is that pirating is for losers, right? And also that we're all mad passionate about computer gaming - right?

100% correctamundo.

 

[refraxion]

I still don't think it will take the pirates that long to crack. They have managed to bypass this type of stuff before.

I can't remember what game it was that had a hidden check in it where the hacked version would let people play to a certian point and then it would be like a bug wouldn't let them do something. Turned out to be trick by the developer. What got me was how many calls/email to tech support they got on it. I mean it is one thing to pirate something, it is another to then call their support to find out why it isn't working right.

Anyway I remember some of the weird tricks that were done in the past. With the dreamcast I remember reading about how a lot of the pirate copies of games had the audio converted to mono to save space since they had to cut them down to fit on a cdr. Some of the games then had random checks in them to verify the audio was stero. Pirates were able to modify the games to figure that out.

Pirates are also the reason that demos will have the securerom and other types of copy protection on them. The software pirates were using the demo exe's to find ways around the disk check software.

GTA IV I think right? Or was it batman? Might have been batman with the hook or something, haha.

 

[Spewn]

But the one thing we can all agree on is that pirating is for losers, right? And also that we're all mad passionate about computer gaming - right?

Some of us seem to be a little more concerned with "beating" the pirates than playing games, but sure, I think deep down that's how we all feel. The problem is that some of us just don't agree with the ideology behind Ubi's methods. It's not about beating the pirates, it's about providing a good experience to your paying customers and coming out on top while you do it. As soon as you shift the focus to beating the pirates, you leave me wondering "Why should I buy your software? I care about playing games, not beating pirates to the shelves."

 

[Spewn]

GTA IV I think right? Or was it batman? Might have been batman with the hook or something, haha.

Yeah I remember that, something about the grappling hook.

In the end though, things like that probably hurt sales more than anything else. If you're some layperson on the internet and hear a rumor that Batman AA has a glitch that doesn't let you use the Grappling hook, you might not buy the game. You *might* go through the trouble of finding out what causes that issue, but really, most people are going to seriously consider whether they're willing to gamble $50 on that. If you could get a refund on non-working software, it would be a different ball-game, but you can't(most of the time).