Correct. They did that intentionally on the first tutorial boss fight.
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The Official Guild Wars 2 thread
- Thread starter jonneymendoza
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Correct. They did that intentionally on the first tutorial boss fight.
DAoC was awesome. Pellinor server was my home.
GvG vs RvR... GvG all the way.
If you like killing no named color invaders all day...yup, WvW sucks ass.
Superfly3176
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Whats max level?
Intel_Hydralisk
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Well that needs to be considered then. If an AOE around the boss hits everyone within a certain range... and it scaled to the point of 1 shotting everything in that range, that's poor design.
In the end, you could still probably kill the boss by zerging him through waypoints... but that goes back to a poorly designed event. How to kill boss: repeatedly res at nearest waypoint.
silent-circuit
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I'm not 100% on this, but I think it's 80?
Your assuming its playing as intended when a lot of us have experienced big boss fights with nothing close to that. It could simply just be a bug.
Yes, it's level 80.
I do agree with some of the comments saying ranged combat has much more of an advantage than melee combat, in PvE anyway (as I didn't do much WvW or structured PvP). It seems like it could be quite a simple fix though.. Add some passive armor while using a melee weapon against a PvE monster or maybe a chance to parry an attack. This could also turn into an interesting mechanic for ranged players as once the mob was near you, you could switch to a melee weapon until you got some distance again.
Are you sure? At least in up to level 10 in the Charr area (I played a Guardian) every boss I fought had a visual cue and I could time my dodge correctly. This game requires a shit-ton more paying attention than any other MMO I've played in the past 8 or so years.
That's not necessarily a design issue, it's simply a balance issue. Tone down his damage a bit, boom fixed.
What? As I understand it, structured PvP is pretty much GvG, just limited to 5v5. Get five of your guildmates to queue up and tear shit up. Did you watch any of the competitions with structured PvP? Look up G-Star Guild Wars 2 in Youtube. They're trying to make the structured PvP into an E-Sport.
Are you sure? At least in up to level 10 in the Charr area (I played a Guardian) every boss I fought had a visual cue and I could time my dodge correctly. This game requires a shit-ton more paying attention than any other MMO I've played in the past 8 or so years.
That's not necessarily a design issue, it's simply a balance issue. Tone down his damage a bit, boom fixed.
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Sell all junk button incoming. Cool. Source.
Also, Jonathan Sharp responds to PvP feedback. Official Source, and for those at work or have no access to the forums.
Also, Jonathan Sharp responds to PvP feedback. Official Source, and for those at work or have no access to the forums.
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zoobaby
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That is great feedback from the devs. Glad he took the time to do that. I also saw that skill > numbers as I won a few 2 v 1s.
Definitely one of those games that deserves your money. For me its not going to be my sole source of gaming entertainment but a compliment to my other games. I might still be playing D3 when GW2 releases.
Intel_Hydralisk
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Absolutely for $60.
I have my gripes since there's so much potential and rough spots that they can smooth over, but last weekend was honestly the most absorbed I've been in any videogame in a long time. It completely destroyed the Diablo 3 weekend for me. I had my feelings that D3 would be a tide over game until GW2 was out and that was confirmed this past weekend.
You need to play Guild Wars if you think sPVP is GvG. And no you cannot just make a premade and say you want to challenge another guild.;;;Unless you buy/rent a GW2 server and then invite the guild on to your server. This game will not become a respected esport. The game is so broken they can't even get anything else working other than conquest. The simplest game type. They plan on having conquest as their main sPVP for months.
Ocellaris
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Worst case scenario is that you drop $60 on a AAA MMO that will get years of updates and improvements, and you never need to pay for a subscription so you can always log in and check out the new stuff.
Scooty Puff Sr.
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You keep saying this, but I have read multiple times that they are going to implement being able to create private games with passwords. This will allow you to make a game and give the password to the other guild and fight them. Are you talking about not being able to fight guilds on other servers?
Ocellaris
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No.
SilverSliver
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Sorry. I played Warhammer quite a bit and this is nothing like it. Number one, Warhammer had a monthly fee, this does not. Second, 3 realms, not 2. Third, rotating worlds in WvW, so you will get new opponents if you ever end up against servers that just steamroll you. Fourth, WvW does not lag unto being unplayable like Warhammer did. I can keep on going. I guess the only thing they have in common is that they are MMOs. And, they have similar public quest systems.
Night and day difference between those two. I played Warhammer Online for almost three months and the public quests were a chore to play, the classes were unbalanced, the world was dead and the art style was atrocious. I wish I could get those three months of my life back
Did you read the dev's PvP response?
Really? For a moment there I was actually engaged in your response but you lost me here. This is where your credibility went downhill.
Did you look into it enough or just watch one thing and convince yourself it's basically Warhammer? I suggest checking out this massive post of information if you'd like to read more into it before completely dismissing it. There is also this video by Mike B aka Fony who did a great job going over the game during the first press beta weekend.
zoobaby
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Yes, I feel I got about ~$10+ worth just on the post 3 hour downtime of the beta weekend. If I can get a $1/hour of entertainment, it will be worth it. So for me, it will have been worth it after I hit /played = 60 hours. Betting that happens in 4 to 6 weeks after release.
No, but rumored June. Enough issues in the beta that need addressed that a late June early July time frame seems reasonable.
Warhammer is different, Warhammer only had 2 sides and zergs ruled. GW2 has 3 sides, and while zergs will rule to an extent, the dynamics of 3 sides means the zerg can't be everywhere at once. Guild alliances in GW2 will have huge impact on how W v W v W plays out.
zoobaby
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Not sure, I heard some people talking about PvE dungeons. Honestly, PvE will likely be treated more of an afterthought. Though I have not followed development closely enough to consider this post to be of great value.
Overall I love the world, and the PVE alone is worth the money/time. (And that's saying something - I am all about PVP in my MMOs, it's rare for PVE to grab me.)
The combat needs some work, I'm not going to lie. I have to echo what everyone else is saying, melee blows compared to ranged.
It's not about level 10, or even level 20. If you didn't get to try the dungeon (Ascalonian Catacombs), you didn't experience the problems that melee will face at higher levels. Maybe you got to fight a champion event boss (Shaman in Norn area, Giant in Charr area?). Yea, the very first miniboss in Catacombs is basically one of those, and it goes up from there. Even trash will 2-3 shot you with their auto attacks.
The random AOE and poorly synched auto attacks (or even worse, 360 cleave auto attacks - I'm fairly sure I saw at least one of those) make playing melee a chore, and not rewarding. I switched my Thief to purely ranged after the first 3 mobs, and never went back into melee.
I'd love to play melee in GW2, but the dodge system needs work. Maybe auto attack damage needs to go down and special ability damage upped to compensate. Maybe they need to reduce the cost of dodge when you have a melee weapon equipped. Maybe they need to increase the "invulnerable frames" on dodge so you can't be hit midroll. It doesn't have to be all of these fixes, but at least some of them need to be implemented.
PVP was alright, but was basically just a button mashing spamfest where it took forever to kill someone. Less lag would help it a lot. It was impossible to fight tactically with the ability lag present over the weekend.
But again, the world was amazing. I had a lot of fun leveling and played a lot. I was just disappointed in melee (especially since I want to play what is currently the squishiest melee class that would be most dependent on dodging). Definitely has potential.
PVE is going to be a big part of this game. However, challenging PVE will be 5 man groups, not large raids.
The raids will be 10-100 man outdoor bosses that anyone can join in. That means they probably won't be all that challenging.
There will be 8 dungeons in release (some of them are level 80 only), each with a story mode and explorable (hard) mode. Explorable mode unlocks more bosses and changes the path that you take in the dungeon, as well as increasing the difficulty through damage done/health of enemies. The first dungeon in the game has 3 new, different paths for explorable mode alone. I doubt you'll finish them easily.
The combat needs some work, I'm not going to lie. I have to echo what everyone else is saying, melee blows compared to ranged.
It's not about level 10, or even level 20. If you didn't get to try the dungeon (Ascalonian Catacombs), you didn't experience the problems that melee will face at higher levels. Maybe you got to fight a champion event boss (Shaman in Norn area, Giant in Charr area?). Yea, the very first miniboss in Catacombs is basically one of those, and it goes up from there. Even trash will 2-3 shot you with their auto attacks.
The random AOE and poorly synched auto attacks (or even worse, 360 cleave auto attacks - I'm fairly sure I saw at least one of those) make playing melee a chore, and not rewarding. I switched my Thief to purely ranged after the first 3 mobs, and never went back into melee.
I'd love to play melee in GW2, but the dodge system needs work. Maybe auto attack damage needs to go down and special ability damage upped to compensate. Maybe they need to reduce the cost of dodge when you have a melee weapon equipped. Maybe they need to increase the "invulnerable frames" on dodge so you can't be hit midroll. It doesn't have to be all of these fixes, but at least some of them need to be implemented.
PVP was alright, but was basically just a button mashing spamfest where it took forever to kill someone. Less lag would help it a lot. It was impossible to fight tactically with the ability lag present over the weekend.
But again, the world was amazing. I had a lot of fun leveling and played a lot. I was just disappointed in melee (especially since I want to play what is currently the squishiest melee class that would be most dependent on dodging). Definitely has potential.
PVE is going to be a big part of this game. However, challenging PVE will be 5 man groups, not large raids.
The raids will be 10-100 man outdoor bosses that anyone can join in. That means they probably won't be all that challenging.
There will be 8 dungeons in release (some of them are level 80 only), each with a story mode and explorable (hard) mode. Explorable mode unlocks more bosses and changes the path that you take in the dungeon, as well as increasing the difficulty through damage done/health of enemies. The first dungeon in the game has 3 new, different paths for explorable mode alone. I doubt you'll finish them easily.
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Killing people isn't really the objective though.
elvn
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Like I said in previous posts, personally I'm disappointed in the lack of engine refinement after having played WoW for a few years (a few years ago now I think), and Rift (I've played others in the past like DAoC but I'm comparing to modern mmos). To me it seems several steps backward on the interface and interface interactivity, command lexicon, customization, keymapping, camera control, targeting options, minions etc.. nearly console/indie in several facets.
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The fighting can be fun, though spammy. It reminds me of TF2 in some ways.. some sort of mmo-lite TF2 type of thing. Not necessarily a bad thing, Overall I wouldn't consider it any kind of refined mmo killer, but it could be fun to play especially with no monthly fee.
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The fighting can be fun, though spammy. It reminds me of TF2 in some ways.. some sort of mmo-lite TF2 type of thing. Not necessarily a bad thing, Overall I wouldn't consider it any kind of refined mmo killer, but it could be fun to play especially with no monthly fee.
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its better than everquest.
I found eq1 back in 99 and never found any MMO close to it until GW2.
they did things right.
had more fun during the beta weekend than I had in any other mmo except eq1.
its simply things done right.
sure some things as pvp and w vs w are fun, same is pve also, its a good game.
jonneymendoza
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Its going to be similar to gw1 i.e will probably take u 200/300hours to do stock PvE/story stuff and then begining of next year/Q2 yex year they will release a new expansion pack with 200 more hours to complete, new classes possiblly, new skills new maps etc etc.
4 manned Ascalon Catacombs through the first boss and the ranger boss. It was like the hardest DE's I ran into out in the world on crack. Granted, we were short a person and we only had one level 30 (recommended for the dungeon I believe?) although I hit 30 a couple packs before the first boss. There was a twin caster boss that we almost had down on the first shot before we all wiped. The ranger NPC's pet wolf bugged and wouldn't respawn with her, and subsequent attempts were just miserably pathetic. We tried to go for the 3rd boss option, but that was just a giant clusterfuck of adds swarming everything.
Dungeon was fun overall, trash isn't too bad if you focus the right mobs (healers!) and we honestly had a lot more trouble with the trap rooms one shotting people. It felt like WoW:Burning Crusade heroic dungeons at release, and I loved the difficulty curve on those before the nerf. Can't wait to get my hands on the other PVE dungeons in this game, if this is just a taste of what to expect.
Intel_Hydralisk
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4 manned Ascalon Catacombs through the first boss and the ranger boss. It was like the hardest DE's I ran into out in the world on crack. Granted, we were short a person and we only had one level 30 (recommended for the dungeon I believe?) although I hit 30 a couple packs before the first boss. There was a twin caster boss that we almost had down on the first shot before we all wiped. The ranger NPC's pet wolf bugged and wouldn't respawn with her, and subsequent attempts were just miserably pathetic. We tried to go for the 3rd boss option, but that was just a giant clusterfuck of adds swarming everything.
Dungeon was fun overall, trash isn't too bad if you focus the right mobs (healers!) and we honestly had a lot more trouble with the trap rooms one shotting people. It felt like WoW:Burning Crusade heroic dungeons at release, and I loved the difficulty curve on those before the nerf. Can't wait to get my hands on the other PVE dungeons in this game, if this is just a taste of what to expect.
I did Ascalon Catacombs with two buddies when we were all level 28. I noticed there was no reliable way to form a party. LFG is a blanket status. It's also impossible to tell what level people are when they're all de-leveled.
It was "tough", but we ended up waypoint zerging a ton. You can even warp outside to repair if you break your gear. We ended up reaching the necro boss after the boss fight in the center but decided to call it quits after we realized three level 28's probably isn't going to cut it in a 5 man level 30 instance. AC is really where the bullshit AOE and other less than amusing design decisions really stand out. NPC's are far more tanky than you and clearly in a 5 man group, the best option is to probably chain res the NPC's / each other.
Scooty Puff Sr.
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So you tried 3 manning at level 28 a 5 man level 30 dungeon and were able to kill at least one of the bosses on your first run, yet you are still acting like it's bad design that you died a lot?
Even though there is no official "Trinity" there are still support roles that need to be filled to have an effective group. Just having 2 more people that understand how to support the other three can have a big impact on the combat. http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Combat
Once people have longer than 3 days to play the game I think we will start understanding the ways to support each other in groups better.
Intel_Hydralisk
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No I'm not saying it's poorly designed because we couldn't beat it with 3 level 28's. That's precisely why I said we decided to call it quits.
Some facts remain:
- The best option is to res the NPC's after they die. They have something like 10x your HP pool. The main advantage of 5 players is the ability to res others safely. For reference, there are 3 NPC's after you reach a certain point (one before that). NPC tanking simply because player characters get 2-3 shot from random AOE is not good design.
- You can still waypoint zerg. The main advantage of a 5 man party is the ability to keep the enemies in combat while your deceased allies run back. Poor design again.
To summarize, they wanted to make it appear challenging due to the fact that players die so easily. To rectify this, they give you very tanky NPC's and the ability to infinitely res (you can port out to repair like I said earlier). This is not good design. Far from it.
Scooty Puff Sr.
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You're acting like they intended "waypoint zerging" to be the best way to do the dungeon, I doubt that's the case. Also, I would think having 2 more people means you would actually be able to kill the mobs instead of just run from them.
Pretty much this. With only having one more person than your group, we only had to waypoint zerg the first pull after the doors opened at the start. Once we got our shit together (and one of our two eles stopped trying to play "healer") it became much easier. With an actual fifth, and everyone being 30 I imagine it becomes still easier. I will admit tho, there are some things in there that hit very hard even on my warrior, but honestly that's just numbers, which are relatively easy to tune. I'm guessing that they're going to wipe everyone's characters for the next BWE, but if not you'd probably be more readily able to find a full group of people at level who'd be willing to go play around in there.
Was this story mode or exploration mode of the dungeon that you guys were doing?
Intel_Hydralisk
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Not sure if exploration mode was available, didn't check. I did story mode. Exploration is for 35+ apparently.