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Sid Meier's Civilization VII

I watched a stream of this latest installment. While it's finely optimized it seems, judging by the early game, and has neat graphics, there are certain questionable design decisions regarding the leaders included and countries excluded. The guy on the stream complained quite a lot as a long time Civ veteran. I have only played the sixth installment, but to me such things like the absence of key bindings/hotkeys is not a thing I wish to live with, not that I would pay the elevated price either. This game needs three to six months to be considered ready in my opinion, then later on leaders and countries are going to fill up the experience properly. Also, not being able to turn off natural disasters and whatnot other locked options there might be, can turn some players off.

One important note the streamer pointed out, that matters to me in games, is that the leaders in VII do not communicate to you on screen, but to each other, your chosen leader to the AI's. In VI the civs are finely animated and visually rather striking, passing their feelings on you in an impactful manner, which I like in games where I'm the commander/leader, as well as in other games. Such design decision makes you strongly question the product, but I guess the core gameplay is mostly advanced for the better, there just are some lacking aspects around it, which could be fixed, but if the communication with the leaders is going to be fixed for example, much time is required.

I'm especially interested in opinions here from those who really enjoyed VI, how the VII compares to that. Indeed, I like both the graphics and districts of VI.

EDIT. grammar
 
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Well I solved my game errors. After trying everything, I switched from a MS admin acct win 11, to a local admin account and voila saves and transition work.
 
Anyone enjoying the humankind like mechanics? Streamer I watch was uncharacteristically negative on the game last week. At least in that he didn't recommend that anyone buy it right now, mostly the UI I think. This is a guy that usually is either pro-game or just vague about it. Rarely does he outright say hold off on buying a game.
 
MrGuvernment said:
This is why MORE people should stop buying a game on release day, tell me a single game that came out on release day, or with in the first week, that did not have significant bugs that impacted game play and wanted to make people jump out a window because of them...
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Ideally I like to wait until they're done making DLCs so I can play through the whole game in one go. Of course that doesn't really apply to strategy games live Civilization. Even then I don't like buying games on release. I'll look for this one during the Steam summer sale.

I was looking at the performance review TechPowerUp did and noticed something odd - Civ 7 has support for FSR and XeSS, but not DLSS. Is this some sort of odd AMD & Intel sponsored title? Or maybe they just decided DLSS wasn't necessary and didn't bother? The slowest cards that can use DLSS are the 3050 and 2060. The 3050 ran at 27.5fps at 4k high. TechPowerUp didn't test the 2060. That should be perfectly playable in a turn based game like this plus you can just turn down settings a bit, so what do we need DLSS for? Meanwhile FSR works on older cards and XeSS works on Intel CPUs with integrated Xe# graphics. I messed around with the integrated graphics in my Arrow Lake machine a bit before I moved my 3090 to the new machine, and sometimes XeSS/FSR makes games playable so I could see FSR and XeSS being useful particularly on machines that weren't designed for gaming.
 
zandor said:
Civ 7 has support for FSR and XeSS, but not DLSS. Is this some sort of odd AMD & Intel sponsored title?
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Nah, just out of touch devs. Nvidia is 90% of the market, yet they chose not to support it? Something is fishy...
 
GoldenTiger said:
Nah, just out of touch devs. Nvidia is 90% of the market, yet they chose not to support it? Something is fishy...
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Pcgamer did a good performance analysis on it. They said anything other than MSAA or FSR 3 Native made things look blurry, and upscaling wasn't recommended. Maybe that's why? Dunno. I don't normally get games on release, anyway, since I pay less after a couple of months, and the games usually get patched up better by then.
 
From what I’ve seen and read, I’ll just keep playing Civ5. I’ve tried multiple times to get into Civ6 and just can’t. I thought maybe it was just the base game, but nope doing a humble bundle with the expansions didn’t do it for me either. Also feels it’s going to be even worse DLC filled in the long run.
 
TheGardenTool said:
From what I’ve seen and read, I’ll just keep playing Civ5.
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If you haven't already, since you like V, get Beyond Earth.

And it's clear that VII is an incomplete game just from the missing leaders and nations. They are holding back to force people to pay for DLCs.
 
Axman said:
If you haven't already, since you like V, get Beyond Earth.

And it's clear that VII is an incomplete game just from the missing leaders and nations. They are holding back to force people to pay for DLCs.
Click to expand...

I do have it. Don’t think I’ve done more than a few turns. I’ll sit down for a full game this week. May have to chicken out from Deity back down to whatever the Prince difficulty would be for it though. :)
 
Axman said:
They are holding back to force people to pay for DLCs.
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They always do that.

If you look at the game generation over generation, there are some "must have" civs that are always built into the vanilla game (like the US), but other than that, many of the vanilla civs are from countries that have lower median incomes, and thus are less likely to afford additional DLC's.

Civs from other relatively higher income nations tend to be DLC's.

It's almost as if they have a plan to make money :p
 
GoldenTiger said:
I received civ v with my Intel 2600k as a promotion.
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I don't know how much Intel was involved, I was just at the AMD Mantle launch event. They were real serious about how cool the hair and cloth was (and it was).

Civ V was their showcase game, but I can't remember if iIntel was involved with Civ IV. Honestly, I wasn't a fan of the series at that point. Alpha Centauri was my gateway, and other Civ games didn't do anything for me.

I was a huge fan of Dark Reign and Alpha Centauri, and that's why I love Beyond Earth so much. I know it's not exactly complete, as it has UI bugs, and some of the victory conditions are easy mode, but it's a real synergy between Alpha Centauri and Rise of the Shadowhand.

It's absolutely one of the last games made by this class of devs, and everyone who is a fan of any of its predecessors should give it a go.
 
Has anyone tried playing relatively-shorter multiplayer games (with a few friends, for example)? If so, any tips for settings to use that are actually still fun?
And how does it compare for that purpose with Civ6, so far?
 
shleepy said:
Has anyone tried playing relatively-shorter multiplayer games (with a few friends, for example)? If so, any tips for settings to use that are actually still fun?
And how does it compare for that purpose with Civ6, so far?
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it came out today, not sure anyone has had time to play it yet.
 
pendragon1 said:
ok. so where are the people playing it (here)?
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Honestly, it seems like reception across the board is lukewarm of this release. I'm a huge Civilization fan, and have been ever since the first. I have previously considered this one of my "will buy at launch and buy all expansions" franchises, but I may just pass on this installment.
 
GoldenTiger said:
Nah, just out of touch devs. Nvidia is 90% of the market, yet they chose not to support it? Something is fishy...
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Eh, not this again. You have a clearly not finished game rushed out given the many reviews and yet it must somehow be another AMD sponsorship scandal for upscaling. Not lazy/incompetent/rushed devs and technically, fsr and xess will benefit most of their customers. Look at the min gpu specs: 1050, arc a380, rx 460.
 
Ranulfo said:
Eh, not this again. You have a clearly not finished game rushed out given the many reviews and yet it must somehow be another AMD sponsorship scandal for upscaling. Not lazy/incompetent/rushed devs and technically, fsr and xess will benefit most of their customers. Look at the min gpu specs: 1050, arc a380, rx 460.
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I was saying the opposite actually, that it wasn't a scandal.
 
GoldenTiger said:
I was saying the opposite actually, that it wasn't a scandal.
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I don't think it's a scandal at all. DLSS is the least useful upscaling tech for Civ 7. You need an RTX GPU to run it, so the slowest GPUs that can use DLSS are the 2060 and 3050. TechPowerUp didn't test the 2060, but the 3050 can run 4k native at high settings at ~27fps. That's quite playable in a turn based game like Civ 7, and how many people are running 4k on a 3050 or 2060? Meanwhile FSR works on just about anything that's not too ancient and XeSS works on recent Intel Integrated graphics. So no DLSS capable GPU really needs it but there are lots of far weaker GPUs out there that could make use FSR or XeSS just to get to playable.
 
Finally! Civilization, the way it was always meant to be played… with a controller.
 
Hershy said:
Finally! Civilization, the way it was always meant to be played… with a controller.
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51YlrPs2zhL._AC_SL1500_.jpg

(Not my picture) although the box says you can use the mouse if you have it.
 
zandor said:
I don't think it's a scandal at all. DLSS is the least useful upscaling tech for Civ 7. You need an RTX GPU to run it, so the slowest GPUs that can use DLSS are the 2060 and 3050. TechPowerUp didn't test the 2060, but the 3050 can run 4k native at high settings at ~27fps. That's quite playable in a turn based game like Civ 7, and how many people are running 4k on a 3050 or 2060? Meanwhile FSR works on just about anything that's not too ancient and XeSS works on recent Intel Integrated graphics. So no DLSS capable GPU really needs it but there are lots of far weaker GPUs out there that could make use FSR or XeSS just to get to playable.
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RTX video cards were introduced more than 6 years ago. That is ancient in tech and PC gaming terms. You can buy a RTX 2060 on the used market for $150-200.
 
GoldenTiger said:
Nah, just out of touch devs. Nvidia is 90% of the market, yet they chose not to support it? Something is fishy...
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As far as I'm aware, for a game to use DLSS nvidia need to train their expensive super computers on it. I don't know how nvidia manages it, but I'd be surprised if they just offer devs a free option to do this work without some kind of deal (don't add in an Intel Xe option, and we'll let you use DLSS for free for example).
 
spine said:
As far as I'm aware, for a game to use DLSS nvidia need to train their expensive super computers on it. I don't know how nvidia manages it, but I'd be surprised if they just offer devs a free option to do this work without some kind of deal (don't add in an Intel Xe option, and we'll let you use DLSS for free for example).
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This was DLSS 1.0 era, now it is generalized, there is a big issue with using game to train something like DLSS, they are not usually made to make super high quality-resolution image and game are not usually made to be able to make twice the exact same image due to randomness, so if they do not have a build in way to generate both the low and high quality at the exact time with a special build, you cannot have perfect training data.

DLSS sdk depending on your build environnement could be in some way a bit more of a pain (I do not know...) and considering how MSAA seem to do the work here for that type of game they could have thought, not even creating a Nvidia dev account to download it....
 
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toast0 said:
View attachment 710184

(Not my picture) although the box says you can use the mouse if you have it.
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I didn't know this existed 😂

I did try "Civ Revolution" 15 years ago, and found it to be a dumbed down console game nowhere near the level of actual Civilization.

I guess the combination of a clunky console interface and the "lowest common denominator" intended audience will have that effect.
 
GoldenTiger said:
Nah, just out of touch devs. Nvidia is 90% of the market, yet they chose not to support it? Something is fishy...
Click to expand...

Nah, not fishy at all.

Implementing these things takes developer time, and time is money.

If you implement FSR or XeSS it works on every GPU out there, including Nvidia GPU's.

If you implement DLSS it only works on Nvidia GPU's.

That right there is the justification for doing DLSS last or not at all. And it is a pretty common choice/priority. Many titles don't get DLSS until later after launch when there is spare time.

Interestingly though, a Civ-type game is one of the few titles where frame generation might actually be useful, as they are not particularly input lag dependent.
 
Hmm... it's kind of sus to complain about an upscaler available to a wide audience if the quality is satisfactory in a game like Civ. I don't claim it is, I don't even own a copy of Civ VII, but I would understand the complains better if they started as: "I tried FSR and XeSS and their image quality disappointed me, so I wish for a DLSS implementation...". So try the upscalers first and judge yourself if anything better is necessary, their results are in the end quite game (content) and implementation dependent.

...

The youtuber I posted a video from in my earlier post made an early review video, which is simply an hour and a half long marathon of this thoughts, but he certainly argued very well about the positives and negatives of the game. I must too warn about the negatives, that they indeed are quite remarkable, like gaining experience on a leader by playing as him, so in further rounds they may possess bonuses. Sounds like a role-playing mechanic right, perhaps not suitable for a strategy game with very long rounds like Civ, given the grinding necessary? To me the shifts between eras sound too harsh for how they try to even the odds between civilizations, but more importantly, they can abrubtly cease warfare and other major plans you have worked towards. For a cultural victory having to build wonders is slightly lame also, even if it basically was a necessity in Civ VI too, at least on my skill level.

The youtuber said that there are no hotkeys, but there actually are, but they are limited. This is one of a couple of aspects that reeks consolization, as well as not always having proper information laid for you, but I guess just a glance at the fonts and the size of the UI elements tell out enough for everyone: this is not an honest PC experience, but it can become such if tweaked. The last major thing he pointed out is that the eras do not actually help making the game more fun to play till the end, when a round of Civ is so long, because actually evening the odds simply semi-restarts the race against others, rather than make the later phases more competitive. I agree with him, that being able to end the game more early, if you truly dominate, would be great, because the only reason to play till the end would be if the situation is tight and uncertain, you not being sure about your triumph.

I might forget something right now, but some aspects of the game are so conspicuously questionable, that it really makes a Civ fan think twice before purchasing. Adjustment and refinement are definitely needed and would be appreciated.

Do others agree about these points laid out, or am I reading too much into opinions of another person? To me these sound problematic design choices. Though most importantly, are you having fun with the game?
 
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First CIV i can remember skipping. At least until a big sale.
 
New patch.

https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/1295660/view/537719838344216630

Stability​

Windows PC/Mac/Linux/Steam Deck​

  • General Stability Improvements and fixes.

Gameplay​

Windows PC/Mac/Linux/Steam Deck​

  • Bombers can now deploy Nuclear Weapons when packed into an Aerodrome, Carrier, or Squadron Commander (previously only Heavy Bombers could do so).
  • Addressed an issue where some users reported experiencing Specialists being removed from Settlements when confirming the Legacy Cards from Age Transition.
  • Addressed an issue that some users reported experiencing where the 300 Gold from discovering a Natural Wonder while playing as Isabella was not being granted.
  • Addressed an issue that some users reported experiencing where the Factory was unavailable when a Distant Lands Settlement was connected to a Homelands Settlement in the Modern Age.
  • Addressed an issue that some users reported experiencing where Sea Trade and Rail connections sometimes failed in Settlements where the City Center was not adjacent to the coast.

UI​

Windows PC/Mac/Linux/Steam Deck​

  • Continued to address alignment issues some users reported when playing in Simplified Chinese. We will continue to make improvements here in future patches.
  • Improved Font Scaling in the Civilization and Tech Tree screens.
  • Improved Image and Font alignment in the City details menu.
  • Improved spacing and alignment on the War Declaration screen.
  • Addressed an issue that some players reported experiencing with navigating the Civilopedia search results with a controller.
  • Addressed an issue that some players reported experiencing where the Unique Quarter description appears cut off when viewing in Building Breakdown screen.
  • Addressed an issue that some players reported experiencing where unlocalized text appears when viewing the "Nuclear Weapons Available" warning pop-up in Modern Age.
  • Improvements to the Age Transition Spend Points screen.
  • Added a notification for when an enemy attacks a player's Unit in single-player.
  • Improved the performance of City Details screen when viewing a large City.
  • Improved Progress Bar information consistency (HUD Progress wheels go the right way now).
  • The Esc key can be used to back out of the Independent Power screen.
  • Added Building icons to the plot tooltip with their status. Added Wonder icons to the plot tooltip with the gameplay effect. Made resource icons larger on improved tiles, and smaller on unimproved tiles. "Thank you for the inspiration Sukritact!"

Miscellaneous​

Windows PC/Mac/Linux/Steam Deck​

  • The correct citizen character set is now being displayed for Korean Independent Powers.
 
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