Sega Genesis Mini (aka Mega Drive Mini) Announced

SeymourGore said:
I'd be up for a Saturn rerelease. With the Japanese games that never made it over to North America or the games with limited release.

Shining Force, Saturn Bomberman, Dragon Force (sp?).
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It really wouldn't be economically feasible to re-release Saturn hardware, or a hardware emulator like the recent consoles (NES/SNESmini, etc.) because the hardware is literally too complex.

The complexity of the Saturn hardware rivals a fully tricked out Genesis setup. It has three main CPUs (two SH2s and one 68EC000 for sound), two VDPs of varying capability and the optical drive has its own dedicated CPU and operating system for copy protection. The optical drive took decades to crack because it was basically a walled fortress, nobody could figure out how it worked from the limited Sega documentation.

No emulator to date can emulate a Saturn 100% accurately because the timing between all of the CPUs and video processors is too strict. The hardware is basically the perfect Dependency hell, each component depends on being fed data just as the previous bit is done processing it, there is no leeway for error. Saturn emulators work by time sharing, they'll emulate a set number of instructions from one part, then the next and so on. But even so, it still requires a pretty beefy CPU to emulate it fast enough to make the game playable, think quad cores with lots of memory.
 
GiGaBiTe said:
It really wouldn't be economically feasible to re-release Saturn hardware, or a hardware emulator like the recent consoles (NES/SNESmini, etc.) because the hardware is literally too complex.

The complexity of the Saturn hardware rivals a fully tricked out Genesis setup. It has three main CPUs (two SH2s and one 68EC000 for sound), two VDPs of varying capability and the optical drive has its own dedicated CPU and operating system for copy protection. The optical drive took decades to crack because it was basically a walled fortress, nobody could figure out how it worked from the limited Sega documentation.

No emulator to date can emulate a Saturn 100% accurately because the timing between all of the CPUs and video processors is too strict. The hardware is basically the perfect Dependency hell, each component depends on being fed data just as the previous bit is done processing it, there is no leeway for error. Saturn emulators work by time sharing, they'll emulate a set number of instructions from one part, then the next and so on. But even so, it still requires a pretty beefy CPU to emulate it fast enough to make the game playable, think quad cores with lots of memory.
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Until I believe the recently in the past 2 year that the Saturn has been cracked. It will take a few years before a good emulator to pop up.
 
Krazy925 said:
Mines coming in on 9/23.
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kirbyrj said:
Yeah, but it doesn't actually work...lol. Just cosmetic plastic pieces.
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Yes but awesome, never had a 32x so i don't care about that as much. Just want the bottom cd part, which was great. Hated the segacd that was on the side.
 
Finally got around to trying it out.

I noticed a large amount of input lag, so much so that the games I tried were unplayable. I also noticed this on my NES and SNES mini. Is there a way of correcting this?

I have a 55" TV, and I do not have any input issues with the original consoles, just on the mini's.
 
Creepin_D said:
Finally got around to trying it out.

I noticed a large amount of input lag, so much so that the games I tried were unplayable. I also noticed this on my NES and SNES mini. Is there a way of correcting this?

I have a 55" TV, and I do not have any input issues with the original consoles, just on the mini's.
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Gaming mode on the HDMI input?
 
Creepin_D said:
Finally got around to trying it out.

I noticed a large amount of input lag, so much so that the games I tried were unplayable. I also noticed this on my NES and SNES mini. Is there a way of correcting this?

I have a 55" TV, and I do not have any input issues with the original consoles, just on the mini's.
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You can't just say 55" TV, you have to tell us the make and model.

But, yes, the NES and SNES minis due have varying amounts of input lag depending on the game. I found Super Metroid fine, for example, while I found Mega Man X unplayable. I have a LG C8 with 21 ms on input lag.
 
I pretty much find HDMI input on any tv by default has TERRIBLE input lag....until you put it in Game mode and then I don't notice it.
 
Verge said:
Yes but awesome, never had a 32x so i don't care about that as much. Just want the bottom cd part, which was great. Hated the segacd that was on the side.
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I did have a 32x growing up I got it on clearance from toys r us on a whim. Star Wars was awesome.

What I’m trying to figure out is this thing is robust enough to let me load 32x and Sega CD games. OMZG if it does I’m gonna be like 12 all over again.

I preorder the stack from Japan for a lot more than I should because of my excitement
 
Krazy925 said:
I did have a 32x growing up I got it on clearance from toys r us on a whim. Star Wars was awesome.

What I’m trying to figure out is this thing is robust enough to let me load 32x and Sega CD games. OMZG if it does I’m gonna be like 12 all over again.

I preorder the stack from Japan for a lot more than I should because of my excitement
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I'm sure it can, the ps classic will do em
 
I also noticed lag on the NES mini, while no lag on other consoles... maybe something most people just don't notice, especially if they don't have the real thing (plus CRT) to test it against or are used to years and years of input lag from more modern consoles/TVs
 
Youn said:
I also noticed lag on the NES mini, while no lag on other consoles... maybe something most people just don't notice, especially if they don't have the real thing (plus CRT) to test it against or are used to years and years of input lag from more modern consoles/TVs
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Compared to the real thing they are all super laggy... it's the price you pay. I remember when that stupid Ooya thing came out, I fired up super Mario world for 10 seconds, turned it off and sent it back to amazon. With a real SNES right next to it, the difference was insane.(switch is light years better than that thing though)
 
Youn said:
I also noticed lag on the NES mini, while no lag on other consoles... maybe something most people just don't notice, especially if they don't have the real thing (plus CRT) to test it against or are used to years and years of input lag from more modern consoles/TVs
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The sad thing is most people will probably think that is just the way the game is.
 
Armenius said:
The sad thing is most people will probably think that is just the way the game is.
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Yup, kids have gotten used to crap response times. They'll never know how accurate playing OG mario could be on an old CRT
 
Is the lag from the device, or just inherited from HDMI? Remember we used to play this stuff on old CRT TVs and those things had like zero lag because it was all analog.
 
SeymourGore said:
I'd be up for a Saturn rerelease. With the Japanese games that never made it over to North America or the games with limited release.

Shining Force, Saturn Bomberman, Dragon Force (sp?).
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I have always been intrigued by the Saturn, but do we need a mini? It had such a limited release of games due to the short lifespan, most were console ports that have been redone on Dreamcast or elsewhere? Reading about Sega mgmt during the 90's reminds me a lot of the Commodore asshattery. Our retro years ruined by shitty management styles. Don't get me started on Dreamcast or Amiga. Or 3dfx.
 
can't wait for the gamecube sugar-cube-sized mini... that'll be sweet
 
defaultluser said:
I dunno, I kinda lucked out and found the greatest handheld Megadrive emulator ever, for half the price!

https://retromimi.com/products/pocketgo-retro-gaming-system

It runs Picodrive fluidly, for everything except 32X. I've been getting a lit of love out of the beautiful screen, and I'm not limited to the included games.
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That screen is way too small. I don't think I could even stand using it or make out much of what is going on in a game.
 
Derangel said:
That screen is way too small. I don't think I could even stand using it or make out much of what is going on in a game.
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It looks fine to me. But I'm the one who thinks my original 3ds is till too low DPI (wife has the XL) :D

This thing is quite crisp! And also, because it's not a touchscreen, I tend to play with it closer to my face.
 
Red Falcon said:
You need to get a real handheld console with a screen magnifier - stop playing like a game boy, and start playing like a game man. :cool: :D

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Ahh, those were the days...

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I remember those days. Sadly I didn't have an OG Gameboy for more than a few months before it got stolen. I did have a light and stuff for the GBC though.

defaultluser said:
It looks fine to me. But I'm the one who thinks my original 3ds is till too low DPI (wife has the XL) :D

This thing is quite crisp! And also, because it's not a touchscreen, I tend to play with it closer to my face.
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I dunno. If I were to do the portable emulation thing I think I'd go with one of those portable Raspberry Pie projects. Either build one myself or buy a pre-built one.
 
Derangel said:
I remember those days. Sadly I didn't have an OG Gameboy for more than a few months before it got stolen. I did have a light and stuff for the GBC though.



I dunno. If I were to do the portable emulation thing I think I'd go with one of those portable Raspberry Pie projects. Either build one myself or buy a pre-built one.
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But why do that,when those controls all feel clunky? It's hard to hack together that part of your project, and not eave you a little disappointed: you still have to tweak the SDL layer to map the inputs,, just like the prebuilt consoles do.

And the battery life will be lower s well, even if you go with Pi Zero.

This is why there is a market for prebuilts that is massively larger than the Adafruit stuff. IT costs more to build it yourself, and it's not as satisfying to use.

These prebuilt emulation consoles all use thew same open source Linux that Pi does, so it's not like you're compromising things (you can even dig into the code and change things, if you so desire. There's also Custom Firmware releases from the community.). And because they're mass-produced, you get decent build quality at a vastly-lower price (and things you won't usually find in kits, like glass-coated IPS screen)
 
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Burticus said:
Is the lag from the device, or just inherited from HDMI? Remember we used to play this stuff on old CRT TVs and those things had like zero lag because it was all analog.
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Yeah, input lag was in the realm of microseconds. However much time it took the CPU to read the controller and write to the VDP registers to fire the cathode gun on the CRT.

Even if the emulator on these devices was heavily optimized to have a similar amount of response time, the modern LCD/LED TVs are the limiting factor. They always do processing on the incoming video source and not all TVs have game mode.

I still keep a 32" Sony Trinitron CRT around for all of my old game consoles, I've tried playing them all on several modern TVs and the experience is just awful. Also, I can't use my light guns on a modern TV because the timing is to far off that the game always thinks you miss.

The Sega Mini will never beat my overclocked Genesis, it can run at 10-12 MHz depending on the game, which really speeds up complex games like Sonic 1-3 when you get a lot of sprites on the screen.
 
GiGaBiTe said:
Yeah, input lag was in the realm of microseconds. However much time it took the CPU to read the controller and write to the VDP registers to fire the cathode gun on the CRT.

Even if the emulator on these devices was heavily optimized to have a similar amount of response time, the modern LCD/LED TVs are the limiting factor. They always do processing on the incoming video source and not all TVs have game mode.

I still keep a 32" Sony Trinitron CRT around for all of my old game consoles, I've tried playing them all on several modern TVs and the experience is just awful. Also, I can't use my light guns on a modern TV because the timing is to far off that the game always thinks you miss.

The Sega Mini will never beat my overclocked Genesis, it can run at 10-12 MHz depending on the game, which really speeds up complex games like Sonic 1-3 when you get a lot of sprites on the screen.
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I wish had the room to keep a nice CRT and a bunch of old consoles around. Oldest console I own is a Saturn. Be nice to have a collection of older games again.
 
Derangel said:
I wish had the room to keep a nice CRT and a bunch of old consoles around. Oldest console I own is a Saturn. Be nice to have a collection of older games again.
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You don't need to have a massive CRT to have a good experience, I used to play on small portable CRTs when I was a kid and still have one B&W unit that I use every so often.

I'd recommend a Sony PVM if you're tight on space. They come in all different sizes, but there are small 8" models available like this one:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/312776076629
 
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Krazy925 said:
Just got an email that my tower is shipping from Japan
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I have a jealousy.

Ordered a Genesis Mini from Amazon last Monday with at least an expectation they would ship on launch day, while hoping for a launch day delivery. Nah, similar scenario to Armenius with delivery on Monday. Said fuck it, went to the Walmart a block from my house and picked one up before work Thursday night for 99 cents cheaper.

Pretty good experience with mine so far, but I'm wishing there were some rubber feet or something on the bottom so it would stop sliding off my coffee table. I also didn't recall how spongy the D-pad was, or how light the controllers were. I'll have to dig out my Genesis 2 (mold damage...) and compare.

Edit: Typo. WTF is "swishing"? lol
 
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