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Path of Exile vs Diablo 3
- Thread starter Maplehamwich
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chockomonkey
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chockomonkey
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Yea i shoulda just botted in D3, but that's never been my style.. i play to play, which is why i didn't play d3 that long hah!
I'm waiting until PoE gets out of beta before I play anymore, tired of character wipes, but I did play probably 30 hours or so. Honestly, I think it's kinda dry, but I realize it's still in beta and there's a lot left to be done. Now, compared to D3, it's the goddamn Mona Lisa. I've never straight up hated a game or a developer, but my fuck do I hate D3 and Blizzard. I'd sooner self immolate than ever give those bastards another dime of my money, I hope they rot.
w0rd.
Eh... the gameplay is still leaps and bounds better than D3 so I will invest my time here. I figure it will be time used to learn different classes between wipes and do some theory crafting for builds. I am still gathering feedback for them as I am a Mac user, using the WINE port of the game that one of their developers did. Seems I get the same issues everyone else does.
However, you are correct, this the GD Mona Lisa compared to the crayon drawing that is D3.
chockomonkey
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The funny thing, is that i haven't ever rubberbanded in PoE...
LeninGHOLA
Vladimir Hayt
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There was some sliding around several patches back. I haven't had an issue for a couple months, at least. Not even during heavy load open beta weekends.
Perhaps you'd prefer:
Which one of these has god-awful graphics?
Which one of these has a perspective that makes me wish I wasn't playing the game?
Which one of these has an overly-complicated skill tree with no hints or in-game documentation identifying why it's laid out the way it is?
See? I can write one-sided questions too!
As for which one is "better", I'm pretty much dead to the genre for now. PoE is unplayable for me on a 2560x1440 screen due to terrible graphics scaling, "losing clicks" when I indicate I want to move after a combat action is complete and due to the extreme perspective. Diablo 3 was fun, but has worn out it's welcome on my computer and has since been relegated to "only if other friends insist I play" status. Torchlight 2 is a no-go for me because it isn't released yet, and even then it's unlikely I'll play it even if I buy it.
MavericK
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wabbitseason
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If you have a particular objection to one of my points, why don't you raise it? Otherwise your contribution is irrelevant. I raised a list of factual questions with explicit, obvious, and unambiguous answers (excepting the 'atmosphere' question). If you disagree with one of the questions, let's hear why.
MavericK
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As for graphics, are people seriously saying that this:
Diablo 3
Looks better than this:
Path of Exile
Diablo 3
Looks better than this:
Path of Exile
LeninGHOLA
Vladimir Hayt
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The skill tree isn't overly complicated in PoE. It may (not really) have been in previous versions, but the way it is now is superb. Why would you need documentation for why it is the way it is? All you have to do is open it, see which skills connect, and go "Hmm, how do I want to build my character?". Each passive is explained in detail. You can also go to their website and plug in values to the tree and see what you get if you go a certain path. You don't have to spreadsheet this shit. You can watch the Build of the Week videos and get some ideas if you want, too.
The whole point is to get away from generic builds and experiment.
What each skill does and what each passive does is explained, the game even gives you detailed breakdowns of what each skill is modified by.
The whole point is to get away from generic builds and experiment.
What each skill does and what each passive does is explained, the game even gives you detailed breakdowns of what each skill is modified by.
I'm assuming these are the same question, since I haven't seen a "character development" feature in PoE. PoE has no character development as there are no real character storylines (or, at best, the storylines are nearly identical in nature and scope to the profile/bio for each character type in Diablo 3). Tossing a jab in regarding the "unwashed masses" doesn't really make your point any more or less relevant since I believe you are considering the spending of points in a skill tree "character development".
Oh, and those unwashed WoW gamers enjoyed skill trees over 6 years ago, so I'm not sure why the concept would be "totally alien" to WoW players...?
Diablo 3 does fine with character flexibility. I had no problems changing skills up on my Wizard and Demon Hunter. You uncheckmark a box in the options and you're done.
Is this even a "thing"? Nearly every game I've ever played has revolved around the acquisition of better items. As for modulating item drops, this was proven false by several blue posts--the AH has no relevance to in-game drops. What is "this only real mechanic"? Is this part of an English-structured sentence, or are people blindly quoting you and approving without understanding what you're saying?
All games exist to generate money, your statement has no relevance. Since Path of Exile has no franchise to disgrace your argument is also asymmetric, since PoE could never qualify as an answer to your question.
I think you're referring to World of Warcraft, which has "hard mode" raid content. Diablo 3 has several game modes, which start with "Normal" and work up to "Inferno". While I do agree that Inferno is unnecessarily difficult, many people have had no difficulty completing the content, as is proven by the people completing the Inferno-level achievements. Some of those people didn't have the AH available to provide them with access to excellent, top-end gear for such completions. The AH is what it is, and spending gold on the AH is no different than trading with friends to acquire gear, so I don't see why there's so much hate for the AH.
For instances:
Diablo = 4
PoE = 6 (Cut-Throat = 12)
...not really particularly useful between the two, but I guess if you need to find something to complain about the numbers are different.
For me this isn't relevant, but I'm sure there's some people who enjoy the PvP aspect.
This makes no sense. "an appropriate atmosphere" doesn't mean anything.
-----
To be clear, I'm not "for" or "against" any particular game, but your question list is a highly cherry-picked selection of questions designed to skew perception towards one game or the other.
Perhaps you could generate your own list of questions designed to move people towards Diablo 3 to prove that you both understand the differences, and accept that Diablo 3 does some things right?
chockomonkey
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This makes me LOLOLOLOL
They have a lot of runes which cast moves in different ways, but they're all the fucking same thing!
And once you get past the 3 stages of EZ-mode, you realize there's only maybe 1 or 2 viable skill-set choices and if you're not using one of them, you're doing no damage and dying too much.
Their 'billions' of available specs is true on paper, but they did such an awful job of balancing them (not to mention how many runes are just dumb or superfluous), you're left with like 10---2 of which are any good.
/rant
robble
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As for graphics, are people seriously saying that this:
Diablo 3
Looks better than this:
Path of Exile
I don't understand that either. PoE has great graphics for the genre.
chockomonkey
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I think it's just their chosen angle of perspective that turns people off. I know it took me a bit to get used to it again after playing D3... d3's angle just seems more natural to me.
This is a simple VS for me.
Diablo 3 is out and 10+ of my friends are actively playing it.
PoE isn't out and 0 of my friends are actively playing.
D3 wins.
by the time PoE comes out it will likely have to be compared to D3+expansion.
PoE is more appealing to me than TL2 is though. Hate cartoon graphics.
Diablo 3 is out and 10+ of my friends are actively playing it.
PoE isn't out and 0 of my friends are actively playing.
D3 wins.
by the time PoE comes out it will likely have to be compared to D3+expansion.
PoE is more appealing to me than TL2 is though. Hate cartoon graphics.
I play PoE on a 2560x1440 screen and have no problems whatsoever when it comes to clicking or getting my character to move. As for "terrible graphics scaling", as per the PoE FAQ:
"Our detailed art is designed to not only look great, but also reveal additional detail as the resolution is increased to the maximum of 2560x1600."
And as I've posted elsewhere, the game looks fantastic and is highly detailed. Perhaps you'd best turn up the settings and get a new mouse or something.
robble
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LeninGHOLA
Vladimir Hayt
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Act 2 boss is pretty fun.
cageymaru
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If my D3 friend list hadn't gone from 30+ to zero I probably wouldn't have heard of PoE. I was never happy playing D3, but as long as everyone else was playing, I was willing to stick around. I'm a social person when it comes to gaming so I can understand your desire to play with your friends.
But since they all left and went to different games, I get to choose what I play next. And my choice is PoE over D3 when I want to play this genre because it's just more fun to me. My client crashed right after we killed the Act II boss so I couldn't screenshot everything that dropped. Just take my word for it I have never seen so many decent rares and stuff in a pile!
The group consisted of five of us and we had a ton of fun! The group scaling in PoE is exquisite. I really need to group up more as I had more fun than a normal person should be allowed to have.
cageymaru
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Did you solo him? He ate my Witch for lunch but I was wearing low level gear because I was a noob thinking that perfect dps stats were going to carry the day. Glass cannon isn't the best idea in PoE.
I ended up doing it in a group instead of trying again solo.I just picked up POE and I am level 8or 9 or something Witch. I am having a bit of frusration and find the skill tree daunting as well as the magnitude of stats on and items and gem affixes to items. The map overlay is also very piss poor, but, i am enjoying the game.
I have beaten D3, Titans Quest, Borderlands (looters of course) but this game seems to have A LOT more depth to it's character development and it is a bit scary for a ARPG player NOT a RPG player,imo.
Any tips at all for a Witch lvl9, i think (need to log in)?
** Also as I have stated the overlay map and the on screen map (top right) seem very crappy and I cant really tell what the landscape is doing or where exactly I should be going.
Thanks.
I have beaten D3, Titans Quest, Borderlands (looters of course) but this game seems to have A LOT more depth to it's character development and it is a bit scary for a ARPG player NOT a RPG player,imo.
Any tips at all for a Witch lvl9, i think (need to log in)?
** Also as I have stated the overlay map and the on screen map (top right) seem very crappy and I cant really tell what the landscape is doing or where exactly I should be going.
Thanks.
cageymaru
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To navigate the skill tree I'd zoom out as far as possible. Look for the skills in the largest circles. Analyze which you think would suit your play style the best and put points into the tree to get there. I'm somewhat trying to build an frost energy shield witch with lots of zombies but not sure if that's what I really want to do I already made Witch #2 in case Witch #1 fails lol.
I already made Witch #2 in case Witch #1 fails lol.
robble
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Killed Brutus solo tonight and he gave 5 rares plus a shitload of magic items.
How often you find rares in d3?
How often you find rares in d3?
I'm on my first character still (a Witch) and she has turned out really well. Although I did have the benefit of the recent passive tree reset, I only changed a few points to help streamline the overall theme (and I've used the respec points here and there as I've realized that I may not need a particular buff anymore, etc.).
My current build at lvl 59 looks like this.
- Because it was my first character I had no skills or weapons already lined up, so I picked some passives that helped my Witch in a broad sense (no pun intended), like the increased mana regen, energy shield, life, etc.
- Later on, once I had settled on wands as my weapon of choice I spent some points into those passives. I found "Power Syphon" as one of my early skills, and since it adds power charged (+50% crit chance each), I chose to focus on crit chance and crit multi passives as well. I also found Fire Trap and Bear Trap skill gems early on and they are a huge part of my build still (Bear Trap is my elite-finisher).
- As I learned even more about the game, I discovered that crits on fire damage induce a burning effect (DoT), and crits on lightning damage induce a "shocked" effect (40% more damage taken while shocked). These clearly synergized well so now I'm choosing passives that enhance those aspects, and also using Added Fire Damage on my main attack (which is in addition to all the added crit damage and any elemental damage from my gear - including lightning for that shock effect).
From there I splashed in some utility passives like the "Hex Master" and "Powerful Blast" keystones and basically just built on my theme wherever I could. With the respec point quest rewards and the ability to both purchase and find Orbs of Regret I think there's plenty of room for testing things out without ruining your character.
Sorry for the wall-o-text!
cageymaru
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Usable rares in D3? I find more needles in a haystack than I find rares that are usable in D3. For kicks I just cleared part of Act II and got (1) level 61 item. From the start to Belial 1 rare above level 60. In PoE I'm starting at whites I can make into rares, magicals that I can make into rares in addition to the rares and legendary items that drop.
It's just a comparison in developer's logic. Blizzard says cut out the good drops so we can funnel them to the AH and RMAH for gear that way we can make a cut off the sales. GGG says let's drop enough gear so the person can have fun finding it, comparing it, and seeing how it fits into their build. Let's let them feel a little stronger with each upgrade.
Just different design philosophies.
I play PoE on a 2560x1440 screen and have no problems whatsoever when it comes to clicking or getting my character to move. As for "terrible graphics scaling", as per the PoE FAQ:
"Our detailed art is designed to not only look great, but also reveal additional detail as the resolution is increased to the maximum of 2560x1600."
And as I've posted elsewhere, the game looks fantastic and is highly detailed. Perhaps you'd best turn up the settings and get a new mouse or something.
I don't care what their justification is for the graphics, I'm unimpressed with their chosen art style and I'm voicing my opinion on the matter.
Regarding clicking to move, begin casting a spell then click somewhere to move while the spell is channeling. When the spell is done channeling have they changed it so you will move? If not then I have a problem with this, as I like to queue up my next action while the current action is being performed. The idea that a "next action" can't be queued up is rediculous--D2 was fine with it, D3 was fine with it, Torchlight supported it, Dungeon Siege 2 and 3 had it so why can't I do it in PoE? At a bare minimum an acknowledgement that your click-to-move action is neither queued nor accepted would even be sufficient. Perhaps a "you can't do that while channeling a spell" message? Or a noise? Maybe a different animation on the ground indicating the click was rejected because you're mid-cast? I don't know what solution they could provide (other than implementing a click queue like all the other games in this genre) but if they fix this it'd go a long way towards resolving the complaint I've made.
Usable rares in D3? I find more needles in a haystack than I find rares that are usable in D3. For kicks I just cleared part of Act II and got (1) level 61 item. From the start to Belial 1 rare above level 60. In PoE I'm starting at whites I can make into rares, magicals that I can make into rares in addition to the rares and legendary items that drop.
It's just a comparison in developer's logic. Blizzard says cut out the good drops so we can funnel them to the AH and RMAH for gear that way we can make a cut off the sales. GGG says let's drop enough gear so the person can have fun finding it, comparing it, and seeing how it fits into their build. Let's let them feel a little stronger with each upgrade.
Just different design philosophies.
What's the point of calling it "Rare" if you can create them on-the-fly and they are exactly what you want/need with increasing frequency? I want a rare item to be rare!
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LeninGHOLA
Vladimir Hayt
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Because they are much less common than magic and common items. You can make rares out of whites with orbs of alchemy, which are also quite rare. Do you have a problem with what they call it, or the drop rate? Getting the right sockets, links, stats and ratio for your build is the goal. That's not terribly easy.
You said yourself you never made it past the starting area. How do you even know the drop rate doesn't suit you?
chockomonkey
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I really want to start a hunter.... but am confused as to which direction to build him.
Should i go spellcasting and use a bunch of moves? or should i go attack speed and such and focus on auto attacking?
What other options might there be?
Should i go spellcasting and use a bunch of moves? or should i go attack speed and such and focus on auto attacking?
What other options might there be?
wabbitseason
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To begin, I don't believe you're a Diablo or Blizzard fanboy. In fact, I think you're either a compulsive contrarian or someone with a personal dislike for PoE, which is fine. But you are ignoring objective facts if you really think I'm being that one-sided.
It doesn't seem like you understand what character development is. It is the process by which you customize and advance your character in the directions of your own choosing. In Diablo 3, this is ostensibly achieved through skill, rune, and item choice. But you must choose from half a handful of skills for each slot, half a handful of runes for each skill, AND most skills and runes are quite useless! This leaves item choice, the least personal and satisfying, as the primary avenue of character development. This is also absolutely no accident.
Path of Exile, by contrast, allows character development and character building through the skill tree, through skill gems, through support gems, and through items. No undue emphasis is placed on any of these methods, and the result is a system with potential for a tremendous number of unique--and effective--options. I can build a melee witch that leeches life, summons minions, and uses a shield. I can make a battlemage out of a marauder. This is not only possible, but effective.
Building something from your own imagination and seeing it come together, THAT is character development. Being corralled down a handful of paths with hardly even the illusion of choice is not, especially if all those paths arrive at the same destination: Items are my choice. Items are what makes me different from the other player. I must acquire better items because this is the overwhelmingly primary means to develop my character.
Certainly no game in modern history revolves around items to such an extent as does Diablo 3. Item drops are modulated on a continuous basis according to their distributions in the AH--get your facts straight.
I'm sorry you didn't understand my simple sentence. "This only real mechanic" is the acquisition of better items, as should be obvious from the structure of my plain English sentence.
Some games exist to delight players, and through that delight generate a following of loyal players and fans. Video games are art, and true developers are artists, not businessmen. They create because they have the talent and the means and they wish to share it with the world. The money is secondary. This was the case with Blizzard long ago. It is the case no longer. That is the disgrace.
No, I was contemptuously referring to Inferno. My point is simply that progress in Inferno cannot be achieved through means other than the brute force of item upgrades, especially given the pathetically small impact any other choices in the game can have on your character. I'm discounting useless skills and useless runes, and without them your choices in D3 are less than irrelevant.
If you really think that isn't a vast difference you've completely undermined your own credibility.
Yes. It's quite a big deal. Whether or not it's relevant to you is, undeniably, completely, irrelevant.
My subjective point is that I think D3 looks like a watercolor painting. It is an objective fact, however, that this style is completely at odds with earlier entries in the series.
cageymaru
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You have to save enough materials up to make it. This puts it on a frequency of "when my old gear becomes obsolete I have enough materials to make new gear". Not all rare gear is perfect stats mind you; but can be altered to be pretty decent.
Lots of time you might come up something that you really can't use for your build so you start advertising and trade for more materials, another piece of gear, etc. Or you can reroll it's stats until you get what you want. These require materials that drop maybe once every 15 levels so don't count on that.
If you can get over color on gear, wearing magical (blue) gear is completely viable. Materials to alter those come pretty easily from farming, but once again you probably won't roll perfect stats without outside help. And if you get close you can use really even lower drop rate items to make it into a rare.
So rare is truly rare as not all rares come with what you want on it, but in general are beneficial to someone. Random is random in PoE, but seems to err on the side of giving you something for your hard work. There are some head scratching such as the time I rolled a flask that healed my minions for almost 60% of the amount I was healed. I was stoked! The second enchant on it cut the amount of healing I would receive by 60% and made it occur 30% slower.
I rerolled that flask many times and never got what I wanted so I gave up and found one playing that healed my minions and me by an extra 47%. In short, PoE has a system where you can get good enchants on items if you're willing to put in the time to reroll that item enough times. But random is random even if it errs on the side of boosts instead of just mindless junk like in D3.
cageymaru
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Melee hunter, spell caster hunter, trap hunter, auras hunter. frenzy hunter, evasion hunter, mana shield hunter, blood magic hunter, armor stacking hunter, board and shield hunter, etc. Oh and you can of course combine any one of the above for a hybrid build.
From what I've heard they all seem to be viable. My hunter is less than 20 but so deadly as a n evasion / cast speed hunter. I have a suspicion that the Waterfall Cave is going to destroy me as if I blink I'm in trouble. Evasion seems to work like Dodge in WoW so I know that all good things come to an end eventually.
So I stopped playing it as it's at the crossroads in the trees where i really need to commit to something. I'm not married in real life because I have commitment issues that seem to carry over to the game ha ha. Right now everything is dead so fast I don't get to read the affixes on it.
chockomonkey
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man on man so many options. At least i'm only lvl 5, but i have points saved up because i don't know where to go LOL.Melee hunter, spell caster hunter, trap hunter, auras hunter. frenzy hunter, evasion hunter, mana shield hunter, blood magic hunter, armor stacking hunter, board and shield hunter, etc. Oh and you can of course combine any one of the above for a hybrid build.
From what I've heard they all seem to be viable. My hunter is less than 20 but so deadly as a n evasion / cast speed hunter. I have a suspicion that the Waterfall Cave is going to destroy me as if I blink I'm in trouble. Evasion seems to work like Dodge in WoW so I know that all good things come to an end eventually.
So I stopped playing it as it's at the crossroads in the trees where i really need to commit to something. I'm not married in real life because I have commitment issues that seem to carry over to the game ha ha. Right now everything is dead so fast I don't get to read the affixes on it.
You called the graphics "god-awful", you didn't say the art style sucked. I have high standards when it comes to graphical quality (see sig rig) and these just don't qualify for the tag "god-awful".
I didn't realize you meant action queuing when you said "missed clicks" before, and I agree that would help the action become more fluid. On the flip side, I never get stuck performing additional actions that I've queued up by accident when I really just wanted to move (i.e. throwing a trap when I wanted to move away). Luckily this doesn't make the game unplayable for me because I'm not trying to force it to do something that I know it currently cannot.
"Rare" is a staple term of the ARPG genre for those multi-mod items that don't drop so often, and since you're big on this game adhering to standards of previous ARPG franchises you shouldn't have a problem in that regard. Arguing the subjective value of "rare" makes you look foolish, just like arguing that there is no character development in the literary sense was foolish when that was clearly not what wabbitseason was talking about.
Lvl 20 know with my witch, not sure what you call it but I am building in the infinte cast/ cast speed/ cold damage way, and it is fun as hell.
I almost never run out of mana and I constanly rain down Firestorm and Freezing Pulse ( way OP imo w/ crit damage gem linked) and freeze lock most things while melting them with fire.
This game is a blast. I do wish they would fix the image quality of the overlay map and mini-map, as they look horrendous.
/now back to looting in a game with good loot diversity (looking at you D3).
** we need to get some H peeps doing some quests and farm run throughs.
I almost never run out of mana and I constanly rain down Firestorm and Freezing Pulse ( way OP imo w/ crit damage gem linked) and freeze lock most things while melting them with fire.
This game is a blast. I do wish they would fix the image quality of the overlay map and mini-map, as they look horrendous.
/now back to looting in a game with good loot diversity (looking at you D3).
** we need to get some H peeps doing some quests and farm run throughs.