One-Year Update: OLED Burn-in Test

[raz-0]

It took about 4 years for 55" OLEDS to drop from $20K to their current prices, so I would expect similar for MicroLED - unless Samsung or others come up with some manufacturing breakthrough the gives them reliability at scale faster.

I was surprised to see Samsun with modular MicroLED panels that can be stitched together at CES this year. The thought of covering a significant portion of my living room wall with a big-ass microLED display - or perhaps even growing it over time - makes my mouth water

It took OLED full color oled longer than 4 years to go from existent consumer product to mainstream TV size and pricing. However, that entire time the technology was capable of filling that role. MicroLED is not. They have not figured out how to make it small enough that the desired resolution isn't physically huge. Currently 4k is at 75 inches and a price they don't wish to disclose.

 

[aznpotpie]

Been using my 55” OLED as a monitor for the last two years and can’t wait to get the Alienware version later this year!

 

[gamerk2]

As everyone who has an OLED has said, no burn in 18+ months and counting. As long as you aren't idiotic with your usage, you won't have any real problem.

 

[Retronym]

My multi-year old OLED beat up your honor roll student.

 

[Arcygenical]

As everyone who has an OLED has said, no burn in 18+ months and counting. As long as you aren't idiotic with your usage, you won't have any real problem.

Id love to make OLED my next purchase but a large number of people in my house like to leave static images (ahem netflix "are you there" prompts) on for HOURS at a time. Fml.

 

[Staples]

Now if we could just get some OLED computer monitors, that would be nice.

It is amazing how long these things take to come to market.

 

[nilepez]

If you had CNBC on daily, wouldn't the bars just burn in?

I would think so. But I would never use my TV to watch CNBC all day. I'll just use my tablet or PC to stream it. TV = TV Shows, Movies and some games. For news, PC/iPad.

 

[nilepez]

Id love to make OLED my next purchase but a large number of people in my house like to leave static images (ahem netflix "are you there" prompts) on for HOURS at a time. Fml.

The TV dims and shows fireworks pretty quickly if you're not paying attention and eventually just shuts itself off.

 

[Supercharged_Z06]

The TV dims and shows fireworks pretty quickly if you're not paying attention and eventually just shuts itself off.

Ya, the OLED burn-in scare is way, way overblown. The tech built into the latest (2018) LG OLED TV's is even more substantial then before in preventing any and all burn-in issues. LG takes the burn-in prevention seriously. They've incorporating quite a bit of tech into the TV to address any burn-in issues:

1. There are built-in picture quality compensation algorithms that detect variances in the voltage of each sub-pixel, sensing any amount of degradation over time, and that compensate electrically for it.
2. A temporal peak luminance control which gradually lowers brightness on any still image after 2 minutes.
3. A logo extraction algorithm which detects fixed logos on the screen (network logos for example) and automatically reduces the brightness of the logo to prevent burn-in.
4. A pixel orbiter which shifts the entire image by a few pixels at preset intervals.
5. A Screen Saver which automatically engages if a static image is detected for an extended period of time.
6. A short-term built in Pixel Refresher that automatically starts operating when the TV is turned off after a viewing session of more than 4 hours (in one session or across several). It automatically runs for 10 minutes and the user isn't even aware that it’s in operation. If the TV is switched on before the 10-minute operation is complete, it then will attempt to run the next time the TV is turned off until it finally completes.
7. A long-term Pixel Refresher that operates when the TV reaches an accumulated viewing time of over 2,000 hours. At this point, when the TV is switched off, a notification appears informing the user that the Pixel Refresher will start and it runs for an hour while the TV is off. A white horizontal line displays onscreen when the process is almost finished. If a user turns on the TV before the 1 hour operation has concluded, a message is displayed that the Pixel Refresher has not completed. This notification will display each time the TV is turned off until the Pixel Refresher has run its full course. Additionally, users can manually activate/engage the Pixel Refresher via the TV’s menu whenever they choose. But it is set to do so every 2,000 hours of viewing regardless.

Bottom line, you have to really want burn-in bad in order to get it. I mean you REALLY have to try. Like doing something stupid like leaving CNN up 24/7 at max brightness for 100+ days straight. Yes, you'd then get really nice burn-in on the static CNN banners. But that's watching ONLY CNN and never varying the screen content. Hell, you'd get burn-in with a regular LCD panel doing something stupid like that.

As Rtings.com reported, with normal TV use where content is varied, there simply is no danger of burn-in at all.

 

[x3sphere]

It took about 4 years for 55" OLEDS to drop from $20K to their current prices, so I would expect similar for MicroLED - unless Samsung or others come up with some manufacturing breakthrough the gives them reliability at scale faster.

I was surprised to see Samsun with modular MicroLED panels that can be stitched together at CES this year. The thought of covering a significant portion of my living room wall with a big-ass microLED display - or perhaps even growing it over time - makes my mouth water

A little longer than that actually...

55EA9800 was the first consumer OLED TV from LG, it came out in 2013.

so about 6 years, though 4 years is right from when the first 4K models hit the market.

 

[Lateralus]

Ya, the OLED burn-in scare is way, way overblown. The tech built into the latest (2018) LG OLED TV's is even more substantial then before in preventing any and all burn-in issues. LG takes the burn-in prevention seriously. They've incorporating quite a bit of tech into the TV to address any burn-in issues:

1. There are built-in picture quality compensation algorithms that detect variances in the voltage of each sub-pixel, sensing any amount of degradation over time, and that compensate electrically for it.
2. A temporal peak luminance control which gradually lowers brightness on any still image after 2 minutes.
3. A logo extraction algorithm which detects fixed logos on the screen (network logos for example) and automatically reduces the brightness of the logo to prevent burn-in.
4. A pixel orbiter which shifts the entire image by a few pixels at preset intervals.
5. A Screen Saver which automatically engages if a static image is detected for an extended period of time.
6. A short-term built in Pixel Refresher that automatically starts operating when the TV is turned off after a viewing session of more than 4 hours (in one session or across several). It automatically runs for 10 minutes and the user isn't even aware that it’s in operation. If the TV is switched on before the 10-minute operation is complete, it then will attempt to run the next time the TV is turned off until it finally completes.
7. A long-term Pixel Refresher that operates when the TV reaches an accumulated viewing time of over 2,000 hours. At this point, when the TV is switched off, a notification appears informing the user that the Pixel Refresher will start and it runs for an hour while the TV is off. A white horizontal line displays onscreen when the process is almost finished. If a user turns on the TV before the 1 hour operation has concluded, a message is displayed that the Pixel Refresher has not completed. This notification will display each time the TV is turned off until the Pixel Refresher has run its full course. Additionally, users can manually activate/engage the Pixel Refresher via the TV’s menu whenever they choose. But it is set to do so every 2,000 hours of viewing regardless.

Bottom line, you have to really want burn-in bad in order to get it. I mean you REALLY have to try. Like doing something stupid like leaving CNN up 24/7 at max brightness for 100+ days straight. Yes, you'd then get really nice burn-in on the static CNN banners. But that's watching ONLY CNN and never varying the screen content. Hell, you'd get burn-in with a regular LCD panel doing something stupid like that.

As Rtings.com reported, with normal TV use where content is varied, there simply is no danger of burn-in at all.

Nuh-uh!!!

 

[Arcygenical]

The TV dims and shows fireworks pretty quickly if you're not paying attention and eventually just shuts itself off.

Even with a constant input such as a laptop? TBH im ignorant here i haven't looked at new display technologies in quite some time since my current display does 90% of what I want it to, and I see so many horror stories!

 

[HAL_404]

Photos taken at 48 weeks show only significant image retention for CNN

CNN needs a method of retention because their fake news sure doesn't do it

 

[DocNo]

so about 6 years, though 4 years is right from when the first 4K models hit the market.

My parents live near Vegas and I'm often there around Christmas which means CES at the start of the year. I just remember the first 55" 4K OLEDs at Fry's for $20K - the 75" was $100K or something ridiculous. I probably have a photo somewhere. The amount they dropped every year was staggering. A couple of times I got to talk to people from the LG factory who were there to set the displays up - that was pretty cool. Talking about how they over provision the blue pixels so they can mitigate them burning out faster than the red or green, etc.

Surprisingly, most of the stuff thrown up as reasons to not get OLED displays were already considered by the engineers designing these things

 

[nilepez]

Even with a constant input such as a laptop? TBH im ignorant here i haven't looked at new display technologies in quite some time since my current display does 90% of what I want it to, and I see so many horror stories!

I can't say about with a laptop, since I don't use it for that, but presumably you could set your laptop up to turn on a screen saver, blank the screen and/or turn off, which are all things my PC does now (and I'm using a desktop).

 

[nilepez]

My parents live near Vegas and I'm often there around Christmas which means CES at the start of the year. I just remember the first 55" 4K OLEDs at Fry's for $20K - the 75" was $100K or something ridiculous. I probably have a photo somewhere. The amount they dropped every year was staggering. A couple of times I got to talk to people from the LG factory who were there to set the displays up - that was pretty cool. Talking about how they over provision the blue pixels so they can mitigate them burning out faster than the red or green, etc.

Surprisingly, most of the stuff thrown up as reasons to not get OLED displays were already considered by the engineers designing these things

that's a pretty typical starting price. As I recall, the first plasma I saw (and I don't think it was HD) was 15 grand. First consumer 4k that I was aware of was the Sony and it was 25k. It's more than an LCD, but I like the picture a hell of a lot more. I think the 65C8 was worth the 2 grand I paid

 

[Tiburon1186]

My Samsung plasma is going on 8 years now and no burn in that I can see. And it's been used with game consoles, television, dvd/bd, etc.

Only problem that remains with plasma is that the color/brightness fades over time. Can't change that.

 

[Tiburon1186]

OLED is the technology that has come down in price the fastest while LCD was the slowest. Plasma was somewhere in between.

I'm also looking forward to go down the MicroLED route once they become cost effective, until then the OLED in the cinema room will do.

I haven't heard about MicroLED. I'm going to have to do some research on what it is and what the benefits are vs OLED.

 

[Tiburon1186]

demoed at CES 2017 was estimated to cost $720000...

And that is because of the Vantablack. That stuff is 1) Toxic, 2) Expensive to apply, 3) Patented by one single greedy artist. I'm sure half that cost was licensing and application of the vanta.

 

[zamardii12]

It IS an issue, only effects a small % of TVs and it is caused by static content under certain usage environments.

LG doesn't cover IR/BI under their warranty, so that is the biggest issue.

No way I would put 5k+ down on a TV to have some IR/BI kill the TV or have diminished quality due to some other defect over time.

OLED is walking the plasma Green Mile, Micro Led is here.

This. Until 55"+ OLEDs come down to the $1000s I am not biting.

 

[DocNo]

This. Until 55"+ OLEDs come down to the $1000s I am not biting.

They aren't far from that now. The 65" went UP by $250 or so at Costco and stayed there last year. I chalked it up to supply or something but didn't think much more of it. The other day I was wandering around in the TV area waiting for a prescription to get filled and one of the employees walks up and ask if I have questions. We start to chat and it turns out he was the store manager. I mentioned the price increase and he smiled and said they had to bundle the squaretrade warranty otherwise they didn't sell - people were worried about burn in and stuff. Sigh. On the flip side the squartrade warranty at Costco is a pretty good deal, kind of crazy to not get it and normally I'm pretty anti-extended warranty. He did point out some of the first gen panels they sold did have retention issues and LG was replacing panels, so I have to check my folks set when I get out there.

Once you have gone plasma or OLED you can't go back if you watch movies in a darkened room.

 

[NoOther]

It IS an issue, only effects a small % of TVs and it is caused by static content under certain usage environments.

LG doesn't cover IR/BI under their warranty, so that is the biggest issue.

No way I would put 5k+ down on a TV to have some IR/BI kill the TV or have diminished quality due to some other defect over time.

OLED is walking the plasma Green Mile, Micro Led is here.

It's almost like you didn't actually read the study and have no idea what you are talking about.

For reference I guess you missed this point:

To see how the results at this 5000 hour point compares to your usage, divide 5000 by the number of hours you watch each type of content per day to find the number of days. For example, someone who plays call of duty or another video game without bright static areas for 2 hours per day may expect similar results after about 2500 days of usage. This corresponds to about 7 years.

or this point:

This test alone only demonstrates the effect of one of the use cases described above. It does not show the effect of changing between multiple sources (such as watching football 20% of the time, playing high-risk video games 50% of the time, and playing low risk video games 30% of the time).

1) These LG OLED TVs were not even $3k when they first came out. In fact they usually retail for about $2600, far cry from $5k.
2) In order to even get it to burn in, they had to leave it on the same channel the entire time. As in not changing the channel and running it consecutively for at least 20 hours a day. Who does that besides businesses? Even businesses tend to turn the TVs off at night or at some point.
3) Have had an LG OLED C7 for 2 years now, not even a hint of burn-in.

So yeah, burn in isn't a real issue for normal use, or even abnormal use. You would have to go to extreme use cases like in this test.

In the meantime, I will continue to enjoy the awesomeness of my display.

 

[Supercharged_Z06]

They aren't far from that now. The 65" went UP by $250 or so at Costco and stayed there last year. I chalked it up to supply or something but didn't think much more of it. The other day I was wandering around in the TV area waiting for a prescription to get filled and one of the employees walks up and ask if I have questions. We start to chat and it turns out he was the store manager. I mentioned the price increase and he smiled and said they had to bundle the squaretrade warranty otherwise they didn't sell - people were worried about burn in and stuff. Sigh. On the flip side the squartrade warranty at Costco is a pretty good deal, kind of crazy to not get it and normally I'm pretty anti-extended warranty. He did point out some of the first gen panels they sold did have retention issues and LG was replacing panels, so I have to check my folks set when I get out there.

Once you have gone plasma or OLED you can't go back if you watch movies in a darkened room.

Ya, I picked up a 65" LG OLED (C8) right before that price hike hit. Got it with the full 5 year extended warranty coverage at no extra cost at Costco. Odds are they'll just continue getting cheaper though... Really love this TV. It has the best picture I've ever owned. As it's in the man-cave/entertainment room, it only gets ~3-4 hours of use every other day or so and that's primarily streaming content. Burn-in is certainly a non-issue for me. I figure that after 6-8 years of use I'll start looking into upgrading again... and by then 8K and micro leds may be a thing. For now, the picture on the OLED is incredible and I'll simply enjoy it.

 

[nilepez]

They aren't far from that now. The 65" went UP by $250 or so at Costco and stayed there last year. I chalked it up to supply or something but didn't think much more of it. The other day I was wandering around in the TV area waiting for a prescription to get filled and one of the employees walks up and ask if I have questions. We start to chat and it turns out he was the store manager. I mentioned the price increase and he smiled and said they had to bundle the squaretrade warranty otherwise they didn't sell - people were worried about burn in and stuff. Sigh. On the flip side the squartrade warranty at Costco is a pretty good deal, kind of crazy to not get it and normally I'm pretty anti-extended warranty. He did point out some of the first gen panels they sold did have retention issues and LG was replacing panels, so I have to check my folks set when I get out there.

Once you have gone plasma or OLED you can't go back if you watch movies in a darkened room.

Love OLED, but aside from really REALLY expensive Plasmas, I never liked them (mostly because I could see individual pixels and it drove me crazy). I don't know when OLED will hit 1k, but I suppose it could happen. Honestly, I'd probably look on AVSFORUM for someone local that was trading up. Some of those guys are buying a new set every year and most of them are likely to take care of their sets.

 

[Snowdog]

The first one to demonstrate the MicroLED concept was Sony at CES 2017 with their CLEDIS wall.

You can see a video about the technology here. What the video didn't mention is that the black area of the pixels are painted in Vantablack.

Samsung has since then announced both The Wall and The Window, however neither of them are as advanced as the Sony version, they did however manage to produce smaller pixels.

I really hope the Sony version will make it into consumer screens one day once they reduced the pixel size as their current target is office video walls at an extreme cost as the 8000x2000 pixel one demoed at CES 2017 was estimated to cost $720000...

Sony first showed MicroLED (Crystal LED) at 2012 CES with a 55" 4K set:

 

[Brian_B]

This. Until 55"+ OLEDs come down to the $1000s I am not biting.

I see the 55” B8 for $1299-1499 right now. I have seen Massdrop deals occasionally that are even better.

I think I paid $1400 for my C7 a year ago, and my brother got a 65” for under $2k

 

[Brian_B]

My only issue with plasma:

They put off a good deal of heat. Maybe I’ve just gotten used to lcd, but we have a 55” pana plasma in our conference room at work. It’s not a large room by any means, but it’s also not a closet. Have the plasma going for a presentation and you have to turn on the AC with it.

Apart from that though - the way plasma still looks and works great.

 

[DocNo]

They put off a good deal of heat.

Just try picking one up too!