New Samsung 4k for everyone.

[DF-1]

I looked over the thread some more, not too many mentions of the js8500.
I'm trying to decide between 48 JS8500 and 55 JU6700. looked at all of the models in bestbuy. the JS (or SUHD) line seemed the most impressive, more? better colors.

what i noticed was in the store, the bigger the screen, the better it looked, regardless of model. all the models looked really great at 65"+, the js9000s and the 6500s.

I'm wondering which is the best for pure tv.
Not sure if i want 48 8500 or 55 6700...

 

[El-Dubya]

Kinda late to the show here, but if anyone can help clarify some things for me I'd very much appreciate it.

Just got my UN55JU7100 about a week ago and have been messing around with the settings. I was wondering if setting HDMI black level to normal while not in PC mode makes any difference? Reading back a few pages I saw that normal gives you 0-255 color pallete, but was this only referring to PC mode?

I mainly watch movies and game on this screen via PC w/Titan X. PC mode looks great but I just can't give up my auto motion plus (clear), so it's now forever on input device: Game, Picture Mode: Movie. However, with HDMI black on normal, I've had to raise my back light all the way to 20 (brightness to 35) to get colors to pop. This might seem dumb, but leaving the backlight like this won't shorten life span at all will it (apart from raising electric bill)?

 

[nothinglitup]

What GPU are you using? have you try changing to a different/older driver? (don't trust Geforce experience. I had games that went from running fine to stutter using their recommended settings).

I have a gtx980 (not Ti). I haven't touched the drivers, and I'm with you, I don't trust Geforce experience, either. It's done some wonky things to me in the past.

 

[nothinglitup]

We're you running at 4k before?

I was not, no. Just find it strange that's the only one so far to have problems.

 

[nothinglitup]

cant spend my time going over 4000 posts, thanks though.

I joined this thread around page 165, and found most of my answers between now and then. It might be a good starting place for you, too

 

[nothinglitup]

Has anyone else repeatedly returned to your computer turned off, and your JS9000 you could have sworn you had turned off, only to find it on with the "HDMI1 no cable attached" blue box bouncing around the screen?

Either I am going crazy, or I think mine is turning itself on when I am not looking...

Wow, this is timely. I turned everything off this morning before work and came home 9 hours later to exactly that. I am 100% positive I shut the TV off, because I am terrified of getting burn-in on this screen and it's made me super paranoid about making sure it's off. And yet there that box was, bouncing around on my screen. You aren't crazy, I think it's definitely happening.

 

[Honeydew]

I looked over the thread some more, not too many mentions of the js8500.
I'm trying to decide between 48 JS8500 and 55 JU6700. looked at all of the models in bestbuy. the JS (or SUHD) line seemed the most impressive, more? better colors.

what i noticed was in the store, the bigger the screen, the better it looked, regardless of model. all the models looked really great at 65"+, the js9000s and the 6500s.

I'm wondering which is the best for pure tv.
Not sure if i want 48 8500 or 55 6700...

I would avoid any curved display for dedicated TV purposes (i.e., traditional family room duties). I have the JS9000, which is a wonderful curved display when viewed from a center position (e.g., PC display use), but it has awful PQ for anyone displaced away from the center of the screen - regardless of distance.

It's actually bad enough that I don't think my 9000 is suitable for family TV use after I retire it from PC duty. I would definitely recommend the 8500 for anyone who needs off-center viewing angles.

 

[Cyph]

I looked over the thread some more, not too many mentions of the js8500.
I'm trying to decide between 48 JS8500 and 55 JU6700. looked at all of the models in bestbuy. the JS (or SUHD) line seemed the most impressive, more? better colors.

what i noticed was in the store, the bigger the screen, the better it looked, regardless of model. all the models looked really great at 65"+, the js9000s and the 6500s.

I'm wondering which is the best for pure tv.
Not sure if i want 48 8500 or 55 6700...

For TV only? Go for the biggest you can get your hand on. Size > features. For PC and desktop, I'd opt for the JS8500.

Kinda late to the show here, but if anyone can help clarify some things for me I'd very much appreciate it.

Just got my UN55JU7100 about a week ago and have been messing around with the settings. I was wondering if setting HDMI black level to normal while not in PC mode makes any difference? Reading back a few pages I saw that normal gives you 0-255 color pallete, but was this only referring to PC mode?

I mainly watch movies and game on this screen via PC w/Titan X. PC mode looks great but I just can't give up my auto motion plus (clear), so it's now forever on input device: Game, Picture Mode: Movie. However, with HDMI black on normal, I've had to raise my back light all the way to 20 (brightness to 35) to get colors to pop. This might seem dumb, but leaving the backlight like this won't shorten life span at all will it (apart from raising electric bill)?

You can use the Nvidia control panel to increase contrast which will give you the same pop as HDMI low.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

I joined this thread around page 165, and found most of my answers between now and then. It might be a good starting place for you, too

Yeah, I was going to suggest starting at about page ~170 as well. A lot of the stuff in the early pages is old information at this point.

 

[supermi]

For TV only? Go for the biggest you can get your hand on. Size > features. For PC and desktop, I'd opt for the JS8500.



You can use the Nvidia control panel to increase contrast which will give you the same pop as HDMI low.

No question 8500 over the 6700, 6700 is not a good comparison either as I could imagine the 7500 vs 8500 being a tough choice, but 8500 would still likely be the better choice! Glad to see people giving out solid advice here!

 

[rpmucha23]

lol that's the exact setup I was going to have. I even have the exact keyboard and mouse. How do the PB278Q's line up?

The stock stand wont let me raise them up enough to get the panels to line up. The size of the panels on the 48 & the 27's (on end) are within 1/8in of each other. The DPI is off, but i mainly snap a web browser in each while i'm coding in the middle. I'll grab some left over table top and cut them out to place underneath each of the 27's to raise them up enough to line up properly, then i'll get around tomoving the one connect box out of the way.

 

[Wiz33]

I would avoid any curved display for dedicated TV purposes (i.e., traditional family room duties). I have the JS9000, which is a wonderful curved display when viewed from a center position (e.g., PC display use), but it has awful PQ for anyone displaced away from the center of the screen - regardless of distance.

It's actually bad enough that I don't think my 9000 is suitable for family TV use after I retire it from PC duty. I would definitely recommend the 8500 for anyone who needs off-center viewing angles.

Yep. Goes flat if more than one person will which the TV at the same time.

 

[Mr. Neverbicker]

I think that Honeydew or Mr. Neverbicker need to revisit this because it's most likely a settings issue. There is no reason for Game mode to be called atrocious or awful or anything of that sort when so many of us have experienced the opposite when proper settings are applied.

Wasn't me.. I hadn't even tried the modes. I boxed it up once I saw the dead pixel.

 

[Lateralus]

Wasn't me.. I hadn't even tried the modes. I boxed it up once I saw the dead pixel.

Sorry - I couldn't remember which one of you it was that was appalled by Game mode and was too lazy to go back and try to find it. Carry on!

 

[Honeydew]

That's what we've been saying all along (well before the JS9000 train hit, even). PC and Game mode look virtually identical. Some people were acting like our eyes were broken or something, but I posted pictures that someone else took of PC vs. Game mode comparing the two for Pete's sake, and they are 99% identical. The proof is right there.

I think that Honeydew or Mr. Neverbicker need to revisit this because it's most likely a settings issue. There is no reason for Game mode to be called atrocious or awful or anything of that sort when so many of us have experienced the opposite when proper settings are applied.

I believe it was confirmed that Game mode runs at 4:2:2 and that's why there is a difference with text.

Just to be clear, or perhaps to refine any previous comments I've made on the matter, I don't think Game Mode produces an awful picture. It looks good, and it's definitely the most responsive, but I still feel I can distinguish a PQ difference with PC mode - particularly with text. With this in mind, I would humbly and honestly welcome any specific suggestions on how to configure Game/Game mode for optimal PQ.

I'm quite happy with PC mode. The input lag and responsiveness are acceptable to me, and I prefer the color depth and text clarity. The latter matters in games like Eve Online, Kerbal Space Program, and many flight simulations, where small text can be difficult to read outside of PC mode. If someone else prefers Game mode, that's fine too. Enjoy your display in whatever mode you prefer.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

That's what we've been saying all along (well before the JS9000 train hit, even). PC and Game mode look virtually identical. Some people were acting like our eyes were broken or something, but I posted pictures that someone else took of PC vs. Game mode comparing the two for Pete's sake, and they are 99% identical. The proof is right there.

I think that Honeydew or Mr. Neverbicker need to revisit this because it's most likely a settings issue. There is no reason for Game mode to be called atrocious or awful or anything of that sort when so many of us have experienced the opposite when proper settings are applied.

I believe it was confirmed that Game mode runs at 4:2:2 and that's why there is a difference with text.

Agreed. Of course everything changes when it comes to text. I still consider game mode annoying to read text on. The colors are maybe a smidge less great too, but not noticeable unless doing a side by side IMHO. Text is the big difference between the two.

 

[Nitemare3219]

Agreed. Of course everything changes when it comes to text. I still consider game mode annoying to read text on. The colors are maybe a smidge less great too, but not noticeable unless doing a side by side IMHO. Text is the big difference between the two.

I still don't even notice a difference when it comes to text. In firmware prior to 1207, yes, but 1207+, no - they're practically the same. Is there a difference? Sure. But is it noticeable? Shouldn't be, unless you somehow have hawk eyes. Again, make sure sharpness is set to 0... only thing I can think of.

 

[Lateralus]

I'm quite happy with PC mode. The input lag and responsiveness are acceptable to me, and I prefer the color depth and text clarity. The latter matters in games like Eve Online, Kerbal Space Program, and many flight simulations, where small text can be difficult to read outside of PC mode. If someone else prefers Game mode, that's fine too. Enjoy your display in whatever mode you prefer.

Absolutely. No one is telling anyone else how to use their display, and like you and I have said, it's great that they offer so many different modes and options so that we can tailor the experience to what we prefer.

I didn't think about games with tiny text - that's a good point. I need to try out some older games where the text shrinks with the UI as resolution increases and see how that looks.

 

[Mr. Neverbicker]

My second 48" JS9000 arrived from Crutchfield in exchange. It does have a very tiny dust spot in the upper left corner and a dead pixel on the upper right corner. This time the pixel is not in the center, and it's not lit up with black background, so I can be happy with it. This one I can live with.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

I still don't even notice a difference when it comes to text. In firmware prior to 1207, yes, but 1207+, no - they're practically the same. Is there a difference? Sure. But is it noticeable? Shouldn't be, unless you somehow have hawk eyes. Again, make sure sharpness is set to 0... only thing I can think of.

Ah. To me it's a rather big difference. I find that Game mode (now that I've made the adjustments) looks every bit as good as PC mode, until anything with text opens up, and it is a pretty bad experience.

I couldn't use game mode for any desktop tasks for that reason.

 

[Lateralus]

Ah. To me it's a rather big difference. I find that Game mode (now that I've made the adjustments) looks every bit as good as PC mode, until anything with text opens up, and it is a pretty bad experience.

I couldn't use game mode for any desktop tasks for that reason.

How would you describe it? To me, text did look a bit off until I turned the sharpness down to 0 (the equivalent of 50 in PC mode). Now it looks virtually identical except for slightly fuzzy red text.

Prior to firmware 1207, text did look pretty bad with lots of fringing and artifacting. I think it was running at 4:2:0 vs. the current 4:2:2.

Some of the lines of text in the 4:4:4 test image do look slightly worse in Game mode, but black text on a white background or white text on a black background (like on this forum) looks perfect to me, and that's largely the text that I encounter during general use and web surfing. Colored text other than on the test image looks fine too (with the aforementioned exception of red) so I'm curious what you're experiencing.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

How would you describe it? To me, text did look a bit off until I turned the sharpness down to 0 (the equivalent of 50 in PC mode). Now it looks virtually identical except for slightly fuzzy red text.

Prior to firmware 1207, text did look pretty bad with lots of fringing and artifacting. I think it was running at 4:2:0 vs. the current 4:2:2.

Some of the lines of text in the 4:4:4 test image do look slightly worse in Game mode, but black text on a white background or white text on a black background (like on this forum) looks perfect to me, and that's largely the text that I encounter during general use and web surfing. Colored text other than on the test image looks fine too (with the aforementioned exception of red) so I'm curious what you're experiencing.

I'll try to remember to look at it and tell you what I think when I get home, its tough to do an adequate description from memory.

I did turn sharpness down to 0, but I still found the text to be fuzzy and full of artifacts. not enough that it was difficult to read, but enough to be annoying, and possibly hurt my eyes if I did it for long.

 

[Wiz33]

I have a gtx980 (not Ti). I haven't touched the drivers, and I'm with you, I don't trust Geforce experience, either. It's done some wonky things to me in the past.

I have a 970. I'll give DAI a try tonight. I have not run it on the new system yet. Will let you know how it turns out.

 

[TDSlam720]

FWIW I run full time in Game mode and never noticed or had an issue with text not being crispy. Check DPI scaling maybe? I think I'm at 100%

 

[Nitemare3219]

How would you describe it? To me, text did look a bit off until I turned the sharpness down to 0 (the equivalent of 50 in PC mode). Now it looks virtually identical except for slightly fuzzy red text.

Prior to firmware 1207, text did look pretty bad with lots of fringing and artifacting. I think it was running at 4:2:0 vs. the current 4:2:2.

Some of the lines of text in the 4:4:4 test image do look slightly worse in Game mode, but black text on a white background or white text on a black background (like on this forum) looks perfect to me, and that's largely the text that I encounter during general use and web surfing. Colored text other than on the test image looks fine too (with the aforementioned exception of red) so I'm curious what you're experiencing.

I experience exactly what you're saying... red text can be fuzzy, but regular ol' browsing is as good as gold.

 

[nothinglitup]

I have a 970. I'll give DAI a try tonight. I have not run it on the new system yet. Will let you know how it turns out.

Thanks, Wiz. Looking forward to what you find out.

 

[WorldExclusive]

My second 48" JS9000 arrived from Crutchfield in exchange. It does have a very tiny dust spot in the upper left corner and a dead pixel on the upper right corner. This time the pixel is not in the center, and it's not lit up with black background, so I can be happy with it. This one I can live with.

I'm assuming you can't buy these TVs locally, otherwise I'm sure you would check them before you buy.

I just received an flyer from my local tech store saying they have JS9000s in stock.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

I'm assuming you can't buy these TVs locally, otherwise I'm sure you would check them before you buy.

I just received an flyer from my local tech store saying they have JS9000s in stock.

My local BJ's has a bunch of these Samsung 4K tvs, but not the JS9000

 

[Wiz33]

Thanks, Wiz. Looking forward to what you find out.

Did you see this video of DAI running in 4K on a TitanX with pretty much everything maxed. Might want to try his settings and see. Even with only a 980 you should still get over 20fps, not what you're experiencing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6YYaJnQ2bw

OK. I just tried DAI on my home system. All settings under Graphic Options are Ultra or High with Vegetation Quantity at Medium and both Anti-aliasing option turned off and I'm running OK. I don't have a fps counter but it was fairly smooth running around the keep and shooting some arrows. Have not venture out as I have totally forgotten all the key binds so it may drop a bit more in combat and such. BTW, I'm using 353.30 driver.

 

[Mr. Neverbicker]

I'm assuming you can't buy these TVs locally, otherwise I'm sure you would check them before you buy.

I just received an flyer from my local tech store saying they have JS9000s in stock.

I have Best Buy nearby but they only stock the JS9000 larger than 48".

 

[XxDaRkReAp3rxXdOtCoM]

Just put in an order for the 40" JU6700. What are the optimal settings for gaming and text clarity and is upgrading the firmware to the latest revision not recommended? If someone could link the post for the optimal settings that'd be great.

 

[Nitemare3219]

Just put in an order for the 40" JU6700. What are the optimal settings for gaming and text clarity and is upgrading the firmware to the latest revision not recommended? If someone could link the post for the optimal settings that'd be great.

I would say that depends on what firmware version yours comes with. If it comes with 1204 or earlier, I probably wouldn't. My testing showed that firmware 1004 and 1006 (factory firmwares) were still faster than today's. Granted that was on a JU7500, but I feel like the same may apply with the 6700. I believe the extra processing lag came to be in game mode and somehow PC mode after 1207 since they increased chroma levels in game mode. It's really not easy to say for certain though since I haven't tested firmware 1201, 1202, 1203, 1204. But that is my guess... Things could always get better, and they certainly weren't "bad" by any means. But when I had updated my JU7500 to 1215 and compared it directly to my JS9000 running the latest, the JU7500 got slower than what it was on the stock firmware by about 1-2 frames depending on the settings.

Optimal settings... backlight, contrast, brightness are all dependent on you. I run mine a backlight 20 and it doesn't bother me. Brightness is at 45 and contrast 100. You may want to turn the color setting up about 10 points or so to increase saturation since its a bit lacking on the 6000 and 7000 series TV's compared to the quantom dot ones. Game mode is identical to PC mode for actual gaming. Text is the only place that fuzziness can appear, and on the latest firmwares, it's only on certain colored text. To turn on game mode, goto SYSTEM and GENERAL. For PC mode, you select it under device options of your source selection. You can turn on/off whatever else you like. I run with Smart LED and black levels set to dark for a bit more contrast and better blacks - this has never added processing time for me. HDMI black level should be set to NORMAL, not auto/low - be weary of it resetting sometimes because you may prefer the look of low/auto, but it is meant for TV/movies since it kills dark detail levels by making everything black and oversaturating colors big time.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

I would say that depends on what firmware version yours comes with. If it comes with 1204 or earlier, I probably wouldn't. My testing showed that firmware 1004 and 1006 (factory firmwares) were still faster than today's.

I'm not sure if lessons learned on one model apply to all of them,

On my JS9000 moving from shipping firmware (10xx something) to latest (1217) PC Mode lag went WAY down without quality sacrifice, and Game Mode quality went way up without any noticeable lag increase.

the JU7500 got slower than what it was on the stock firmware by about 1-2 frames depending on the settings.

One to two frames? Really? That's (at 60fps) 17-32ms That is a pretty huge increase, especially considering these panels are 22ms in game mode to begin with in most early reviews.

Granted, I'm not the most sensitive to input lag, but I think I would notice an ~doubling of it. Then again, as mentioned before, there may be different impacts on different screens.

For the JS9000 I would enthusiastically encourage everyone to update it to the most recent ASAP. It was a huge improvement.

 

[Cyph]

If Game mode is 20.7 (Leo Bodnar tested) and 1007 is faster by 1-2 frames, then previously it had an input lag of 4 to -12ms? Does this even make sense?

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

If Game mode is 20.7 (Leo Bodnar tested) and 1007 is faster by 1-2 frames, then previously it had an input lag of 4 to -12ms? Does this even make sense?

Ahh, so the Leo Bodnar test was on newer firmware.

Yeah, I agree. Whatever testing methodology showed a 1-2 frame increase going from 10xx to 12xx is likely somehow flawed.

No way it was ever 4-12ms, and even if it were and it went from 4-12ms to 20.7ms that would not be a humanly perceivable difference.

You have to get to a total ~100ms pipeline latency before it is humanly perceivable. This includes the entire pipeline from mouse input through GPU rendering and monitor output, and there is no way either of those low numbers are going to drive the total over 100ms (or likely even close to it)

 

[Nitemare3219]

I'm not sure if lessons learned on one model apply to all of them,

On my JS9000 moving from shipping firmware (10xx something) to latest (1217) PC Mode lag went WAY down without quality sacrifice, and Game Mode quality went way up without any noticeable lag increase.



One to two frames? Really? That's (at 60fps) 17-32ms That is a pretty huge increase, especially considering these panels are 22ms in game mode to begin with in most early reviews.

Granted, I'm not the most sensitive to input lag, but I think I would notice an ~doubling of it. Then again, as mentioned before, there may be different impacts on different screens.

For the JS9000 I would enthusiastically encourage everyone to update it to the most recent ASAP. It was a huge improvement.

Yes you are right. But the 9000 series is very different from the 6000 and 7000. There shouldn't be any issues with new firmware, but if I were keeping my JU7500, it would have stayed on the 1006 stock firmware - it got slower after I updated it to 1215.

I will say that PC mode did improve. Game mode has always been great on the 9000, but I have noticed at times it slowed down slightly and felt like PC mode where I had to reset the source input to fix it. Only noticed it since 1217, it rarely happens, so it could have on 1215 as well - I only ran that FW for a short time.

If Game mode is 20.7 (Leo Bodnar tested) and 1007 is faster by 1-2 frames, then previously it had an input lag of 4 to -12ms? Does this even make sense?

You either missed my previous post awhile back or fail to realize that the Leo Bodnar TESTS IN 1080P ONLY!!! It was a significant difference that I felt along with someone else. If you set the display to 1080p, the lag was gone. In 4K, it was atrocious. RTINGS confirmed this when I emailed them about the issue and the misleading lag figures presented in their review. Want me to show you the email? I gladly will later when I get home.

 

[Cyph]

You either missed my previous post awhile back or fail to realize that the Leo Bodnar TESTS IN 1080P ONLY!!! It was a significant difference that I felt along with someone else. If you set the display to 1080p, the lag was gone. In 4K, it was atrocious. RTINGS confirmed this when I emailed them about the issue and the misleading lag figures presented in their review. Want me to show you the email? I gladly will later when I get home.

Why hasn't RTING update its review with this finding? You're sensitive to lag, and I believe that you felt it. However, I question the 1-2 frames difference.

What was the firmware that you experienced the lag on? I've noticed it too, the GUI, everything was sluggish. The latest firmwares have since fixed that issue. Whatever bug that caused it was squashed. If the 1217 has improved response on the JS9000, then what makes you think the 1217 firmware hasn't done the same to the 6 and 7 series?

I believe there were issues with the previous firmwares as I've noticed it too, but it's since been fixed. I don't think encouraging new buyers to not upgrade their firmware is sound advice. Spending 700-2000, then leave off quality improvement for fear of input lag, is like cutting your nose to spite your face.

 

[Zarathustra[H]]

So, my replacement JS9000 from Critchfield should be arriving tomorrow.

I figure to save myself the hassle of rebuilding the old box and packing all the accessories, I'll just take the screen out of the new box, and replace it with the old one and give it back to UPS Freight.

Does anyone know how I can reset the Bluetooth pairing on the existing remote, so it works with the replacement screen?

 

[Mr. Neverbicker]

So, my replacement JS9000 from Critchfield should be arriving tomorrow.

I figure to save myself the hassle of rebuilding the old box and packing all the accessories, I'll just take the screen out of the new box, and replace it with the old one and give it back to UPS Freight.

Does anyone know how I can reset the Bluetooth pairing on the existing remote, so it works with the replacement screen?

The freight driver swaps them in one stop. I'm not sure the freight driver would wait for the packaging to be opened, swapped and boxed up. They're on a schedule and lose money by the minute. Let us know how it goes.

 

[Wiz33]

Just put in an order for the 40" JU6700. What are the optimal settings for gaming and text clarity and is upgrading the firmware to the latest revision not recommended? If someone could link the post for the optimal settings that'd be great.

FWIW. Checklist of things to do.

click source on remote. go to HDMI 1, push down arrow on remote. select "edit device type" and scroll down and select PC.

Click menu on remote, select"menu" then"picture" then scroll down to "picture option" and turn "HDMI UHD color" to "on".

Also under "picture option" scroll to "hdmi black level" and select "normal"

Go back to menu, select "smart hub" then turn "smart hub auto start" to "off"

Go back to menu, select "system", scroll down to "general" and turn"instant on" to "off"

My current picture setting in PC mode:

Backlight 12
Contrast 85
Brightness 30-35
Sharpness 50

I also went into "menu" "system" "eco solution" and turned "eco sensor" to "on" and set min backlight at 6

Unless you're extremely sensitive to lag, I would update the firmware to the latest version. There are a lot of improvements made since first release.