New Apple Ads Smack of Desperation?

The reaction of Apple fanatics out there this week has been amusing to say the least. They're trying everything to pretend Windows 7 is no good
 
I just watched like 4 of the latest ads. I thought a lot of the originals were funny, but these newest ones don't even attempt to be clever. It's all just "We're switching to Mac!!".
 
I just had a coworker work asking me how to install Win7 on his macbook. He works for a TV station down here in Miami doing graphics. Apparently the video production applications they use are not available on a Mac. Everyone watch as the Mac's little video production niche market gets worn away.
 
What pisses me off the most about the whole Apple "cult" is not Apple itself or their ads (those are annoying no doubt about that); it is the biased media that judges everything Apple does differently from any other company!

If Apple designs and creates somehting, then it is automatically accepted as a fact that the product will be the greatest thing ever. The same product could be released from Microsoft or Sony sans the Apple logo and it would be considered "good" at best and not user friendly enough!

Apple makes a mistake and nobody says anything; some other company does somehting and everybody is up in arms!

If Apple leaves out a feature then nobody absolutely needs it; if some other company doesnt add that feature they are dumb and anti-consumer!

Look I'm not saying companies shouldn't be criticized; but lets treat everyone the same and not justify Apple's actions everytime they do something wrong!

The whole tech media which is stationed primarily in San Fransisco has a strong pro Apple bias and it is quiet pathetic that how far they would go to justify and apologize for Apple's actions all the time (A lot of these so called "journalists" proudly consider themselves mac fanatics and yet somehow we must accept their judgement regarding Windows or any other product competing with Apple as objective and unbiased)

I think the tech journalism nowadays is a joke; very biased!
 
Basicly what the commercial doesn't point out (well enough) that all the same claims have been made before. All it does is repeat itself without pointing out the shortcomings that "people" don't understand either way.
There a few things more which you can obviously exploit better but details sometimes things people do not bother with.
 
niconx said:
I just had a coworker work asking me how to install Win7 on his macbook. He works for a TV station down here in Miami doing graphics. Apparently the video production applications they use are not available on a Mac. Everyone watch as the Mac's little video production niche market gets worn away.
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It's all Intel mac's these days so what's the difference :)
 
That ad is genius and will help get apple more sales.

No, I don't own a mac or an ipod.
 
Kristofff said:
That ad is genius and will help get apple more sales.

No, I don't own a mac or an ipod.
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Genius? Not really. I you read the blogs and sites that are anti-Microsoft they've pretty much been saying the same thing. "It doesn't matter that Windows 7 is awesome, its still Windows!"

This argument has been made for every Windows version forever. Nothing all that genius about it. In fact Apple has made the same type of argument for years.

In essence its an ad hominem attack. Of COURSE its will Windows! Duh! But its a Windows with no MAJOR flaws. Even has FREE AV SOFTWARE. So sure you could attack Windows on its volume of malware. But it about two minutes you can install the free and awesome Microsoft Security Essentials AV tool and pretty much solve the AV problem or at least mitigate is greatly.
 
heatlesssun said:
Genius? Not really. I you read the blogs and sites that are anti-Microsoft they've pretty much been saying the same thing. "It doesn't matter that Windows 7 is awesome, its still Windows!"

This argument has been made for every Windows version forever. Nothing all that genius about it. In fact Apple has made the same type of argument for years.

In essence its an ad hominem attack. Of COURSE its will Windows! Duh! But its a Windows with no MAJOR flaws. Even has FREE AV SOFTWARE. So sure you could attack Windows on its volume of malware. But it about two minutes you can install the free and awesome Microsoft Security Essentials AV tool and pretty much solve the AV problem or at least mitigate is greatly.
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And Apple will continue to keep clawing away at Microsofts marketshare because of it. And not the concept, but this specific ad, and the way they acted out the argument, is genius.
 
Kristofff said:
And Apple will continue to keep clawing away at Microsofts marketshare because of it. And not the concept, but this specific ad, and the way they acted out the argument, is genius.
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Not if indeed the underlying argument has no merit. Add I just saw something intresting in Best Buy today. HP is running a deal through Best Buy where you get a desktop, laptop and netbook, that's right THREE systems all running Windows 7 for $1200.

Sure the systems are the greatest but wow, that's a very nice price point and VERY convenient to have all that stuff in one deal. While I was there I saw two people actually buy that package.

I saw a LOT of people looking at the Windows 7 machines and three sales while I was there.

Apple has its work cut out for it especially in light of the fantastic quater it just had. It just got a lot harder for Apple this Christmas.
 
Apple also has a good 4Q lineup, so I'd imagine they'll do okay. The response to the new iMacs has been quite positive, and that's not even factoring how decent an upgrade the new MacBook is (and how satisfactory its price point is).

I guess we'll see what happens.
 
phide said:
Apple also has a good 4Q lineup, so I'd imagine they'll do okay. The response to the new iMacs has been quite positive, and that's not even factoring how decent an upgrade the new MacBook is (and how satisfactory its price point is).

I guess we'll see what happens.
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Sure the new Apple products are good. But you walk into a Best Buy and see 3 systems running Windows 7 for $1200, a desktop a notebook and a netbook. I mean its an attractive package. Then sitting next to those systems, you only get one Mac for about the same price. I mean really, it'll make a few Mac buyers think twice I no doubt.
 
Kind of ironic considering how Snow Leopard was introduced to thundering applause as having No new features! at WWDC last year; the whole idea being that it's a 'fixed' version of Leopard. It's pretty retarded considering that they just admitted that OS X has never been a perfect operating system in the first place.

Not that I want to diss them too much for it because I really like OS X. I've been running Snow Leopard on my PC for almost two months now and I'm inclined to say that I even prefer it to Windows 7 in many ways (in no small part because it's a new toy for me).
 
hordaktheman said:
Kind of ironic considering how Snow Leopard was introduced to thundering applause as having No new features! at WWDC last year; the whole idea being that it's a 'fixed' version of Leopard. It's pretty retarded considering that they just admitted that OS X has never been a perfect operating system in the first place.

Not that I want to diss them too much for it because I really like OS X. I've been running Snow Leopard on my PC for almost two months now and I'm inclined to say that I even prefer it to Windows 7 in many ways (in no small part because it's a new toy for me).
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So besides being a new toy, what SPECIFICALLY do you like in terms of REAL features or usability (not the tired old ad claims of better stability and security).

Thanks!
 
heatlesssun said:
So besides being a new toy, what SPECIFICALLY do you like in terms of REAL features or usability (not the tired old ad claims of better stability and security).

Thanks!
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Don't really know actually. Stability and security have never been an issue for me so that's not it.

I suppose it's just the overall mixture of things. Expose and hot corners are immensely (and surprisingly) addictive and really add to usability to the point where I never would have thought I'd become so dependent on them. The OS also feels a bit snappier amongst other things. Altogether put, the pros simply outweigh the cons for me. Being able to use my MIDI keyboard is a big plus and the built-in Cisco IPsec support means I need one less virtual machine.

That's not to say I haven't had any problems with it. I've yet to find a media player to top MPC Home Cinema, I need a third party app to get mouse movement how I want it, my MIDI keyboard needed a third party driver (unavailable for Win x64), and a number of other issues that I can't remember.

There's a lot more to it but this is off the top of my head.
 
No, Apple is not desperate to defeat a Windows operating system that has yet to take the general public by storm...No.

If Win7 becomes super popular in the next year or so, you might be able to use the word desperate. You can't have desperation in fear of an OS that many non-IT people have not even heard of (yes, thats true)

For now, you would be stupid to call their advertising desperate.
 
and for the record, I think Windows 7 is about as good as Snow Leopard...and I use both...
 
hordaktheman said:
Don't really know actually. Stability and security have never been an issue for me so that's not it.

I suppose it's just the overall mixture of things. Expose and hot corners are immensely (and surprisingly) addictive and really add to usability to the point where I never would have thought I'd become so dependent on them. The OS also feels a bit snappier amongst other things. Altogether put, the pros simply outweigh the cons for me. Being able to use my MIDI keyboard is a big plus and the built-in Cisco IPsec support means I need one less virtual machine.

That's not to say I haven't had any problems with it. I've yet to find a media player to top MPC Home Cinema, I need a third party app to get mouse movement how I want it, my MIDI keyboard needed a third party driver (unavailable for Win x64), and a number of other issues that I can't remember.

There's a lot more to it but this is off the top of my head.
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Just in the intrest of information sharing and pointing out a few things. I know you said there was a lot more to it then the specifics you mentioned but here's a couple of things may or may not be aware.

The Cisco IPSec issue shouldn't be an issue anymore, the Windows 7 driver just came out: http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/46661

Also there are some Expose clones out there. This one is free and is actually quite good but the guy seems to have disappeared and this has been touched in two years and yet it works pretty well in Windows 7. A well written piece of software to be a stable as it is and work well in an OS that it was never designed for: http://baostuff.spaces.live.com/

I wish he would do SOMETHING with this code, give it away, sell it, something! This is great tool that just needs a little work to make it a full fledged Expose clone.

As far as responsiveness I'll take you word for it as I've not used a Mac in quite some time. The only time that I would say that 7 seems to drag for me is when its hitting the hard drive. For my next rig, I want at least 1TB of SSD. The OCZ has a 1 TB device out now, at least on paper but I've yet to find anywhere to buy it. I'll be getting a 250 device for my tx2 when I can find the one I want in stock at a reasonable price. That should take care of responsiveness though for a price.

Please as you think of things pass them along. It's actually a great way to learn. I learned about Switcher years ago when I had as discussion about Expose from a Mac fan.
 
budafied said:
and for the record, I think Windows 7 is about as good as Snow Leopard...and I use both...
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But if SL= Win7 I think Win 7 wins simply because the whole point that Apple is trying to make is that Macs are better, not just as good.
 
heatlesssun said:
But if SL= Win7 I think Win 7 wins simply because the whole point that Apple is trying to make is that Macs are better, not just as good.
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You mean Win7 won the advertising wars? IDK...

I personally prefer SL. The general population will most likely have less problems with SL than they will with Win7. This is just because SL is generally less prone to viruses and such. People are stupid. They will mess up their computers. When they do, Apple's ad will pull them in...
 
budafied said:
You mean Win7 won the advertising wars? IDK...

I personally prefer SL. The general population will most likely have less problems with SL than they will with Win7. This is just because SL is generally less prone to viruses and such. People are stupid. They will mess up their computers. When they do, Apple's ad will pull them in...
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There's truth to this but at the same time there a LOT of good Windows guys out there that become IT support for friends and family. When I setup a system those problems you talk about pretty much go away. I'll setup non-admin accounts for XP and for Vista/7 full UAC. Now I'm installing Microsoft Security Essentials. And I tell people not do download and install programs unless they know EXACTLY what they are doing and if they have quick question they'll shot me an email.

Years later, no viruses, no malware, no issues unless a hard drive has gone bad. Microsoft has an ARMY of people that give them free support unlike any other OS.
 
phide said:
Incidentally, I already answered this question today. Right here. I think the main thing, though, is that people don't want to blow a grand or two (or three) on an Apple machine that may not even be a good fit for them when they can get a better 'fit' with a Dell or HP rig for a fair bit less. Since OS X is attached to Macs, and Macs are cost-prohibitive compared to PCs, OS X just isn't in a position to gain much traction. It doesn't have much to do with the OS itself.
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If Mac OS X is so great, then why was OpenDarwin shut down? Why isn't PureDarwin gaining traction against Linux or the BSDs? Where is there room for [H]ard users in the Mac "ecosystem"? And Mac OS is not Linux. It has pieces of the Mach and BSD Unix kernels. It has the Unix 03 certification.

Apple just isn't equipped for the kind of demand implied in their commercials. If a solid amount of users in the market to upgrade to Windows 7 switched to Mac, there would be shortages.

I like the commercials because John Hodgman and Justin Long play likable characters (Hodgman more than Long, IMO), but the biggest joke is that in both the broader sense and the reasonable sense, Mac IS A PC! It is a Personal Computer (as opposed to a workstation, a terminal, a server, etc). It uses the same components as HP, Dell, Sony, Acer, etc (Intel x86 CPU, Intel chipset, nVidia or Intel graphics, etc). Only if you define PCs as Windows do Macs constitute something other than PCs. Then, Free/Net/Open/PC/DragonflyBSD, Linux, and Solaris are not PCs either.
 
Steve said:
I bitch, piss and moan about Apple all the time just for this reason.

No one has a problem with OS X, we’ve tested it and liked it. The problem people have isn’t the hardware tie in where the average person has to BUY A MAC to run OS X. The problem people have is the arrogance, attitude of the Apple elitists. The constant douchebaggery that really, really, really puts people off.

Their own arguments don’t even make sense. You can shut the zealots up right away by asking them a common sense question:

Apple is better! Microsoft stole everything from us! Windows sucks! Windows is inferior!!!

Well, let’s just say all those points are 100% true… why then, after 20 years, is Apple still only a fraction of the U.S. computer market and almost non-existent in the world market? Is everyone THAT stupid? The world is so ignorant that they would constantly be fooled into buying an inferior product from a band of thieves that steals their ideas from their competitor? Are we all truly that ignorant?

If Microsoft is so bad and its OS so weak....why can't you beat them?

Apple needs to give people a little more credit than that.

(just my $0.02...ymmv)
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Well put man, well put.

Apples ads have always smelled of arrogance & elitist musk.
My g/f has a macbook, I hate the look, i hate the OS, but most of all I hate what it stands for. Apple users in general have made that happen for me, most(not all) I meet that are anti windows Apple fanboys are douches.
 
Kristofff said:
And Apple will continue to keep clawing away at Microsofts marketshare because of it.
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Every little fraction of a percent helps I suppose. :D

Apple won't make respectable market share as long as a) they lock down their hardware and b) tie their OS into that hardware.

If Apple really wanted to make waves and start taking a chunk out of Microsoft's OS marketshare, they'd release OS X for x86. They won't, just like they're not releasing iWork in the hopes of taking marketshare from Microsoft Office. They release their products as niche products, and the problem is - their niche is not gaining a lot of new converts, no matter what FUD Apple puts into their ads.

They can say they have a superior OS, however, convincing people to plop $1k+ down for a new computer to run that OS is not going to win them the battle. :cool:
 
Yeah... but that OS is cheap...

oh wait... that's a service pack?

Well, that's what I thought last time,

Still loved my mac (white).
 
Don't get me wrong, I think OS X is a good OS, just like I think Windows is a good OS.
Anyone who has used both for an extended period of time would admit this unabashedly. I have a G5 at work running Tiger, and I replaced it with the E2200 in my sig because it didn't cut it anymore. (G5 1.8single, 1256 ram) Using CS2 on that Mac had become an exercise in futility because it didn't have enough power.

The bottom line is that the cheapest Mac (the Mini) pales in comparison in both power and expandability to the cheapest Dell Vostro you can buy; that fact does not help Apple at all, whatsoever.

And trust me - I don't think Apple gives a damn, because clearly they don't. They've ran with this business model for many years now and they've basically been in the same spot they are now. :D i don't expect to see Apple selling any fully featured $299 systems anytime soon. However I also don't expect Apple to do anything except the same thing they're doing now...FUD ads attacking 10 year old Windows issues, meanwhile Justin Long continues being a douche on TV and their computers remain 2 or more times the price of any other premanufactured Dell, HP, Gateway, Compaq, Lenovo etc.
 
...and they continue around the same % market share that they have now. :D
 
bmwphysics said:
Well put man, well put.

Apples ads have always smelled of arrogance & elitist musk.
My g/f has a macbook, I hate the look, i hate the OS, but most of all I hate what it stands for. Apple users in general have made that happen for me, most(not all) I meet that are anti windows Apple fanboys are douches.
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Most people who buy Macs buy them because they think they are getting a higher quality product that doesn't have Windows' issues. And to some extent I'll grant them that. Mac users for the most part DON'T have to worry about malware, though I think that too many think they are totally immune.

Macs do, or at least to, have a certain flair and pizazz, though I think Windows 7 has a bit of that now.The hardware and software tends to better integrated than with a typical retail PC and Macs don't have crapware loaded on them. IMHO, crapware is the bane of the retail PC. Why can't OEMs just put clean installs of Windows on a machine without all of the half-wit shit they put on them? I guess for marketing and other purposes but it really hurts Windows' rep when all that junk slows a system down and causes problems.

But man on man do you give up a lot with a Mac, starting with your money. Windows functionality and support are just so rich and mature that most people don't even have a clue about just how powerful Windows truly is.
 
heatlesssun said:
Most people who buy Macs buy them because they think they are getting a higher quality product that doesn't have Windows' issues. And to some extent I'll grant them that. Mac users for the most part DON'T have to worry about malware, though I think that too many think they are totally immune.

Macs do, or at least to, have a certain flair and pizazz, though I think Windows 7 has a bit of that now.The hardware and software tends to better integrated than with a typical retail PC and Macs don't have crapware loaded on them. IMHO, crapware is the bane of the retail PC. Why can't OEMs just put clean installs of Windows on a machine without all of the half-wit shit they put on them? I guess for marketing and other purposes but it really hurts Windows' rep when all that junk slows a system down and causes problems.

But man on man do you give up a lot with a Mac, starting with your money. Windows functionality and support are just so rich and mature that most people don't even have a clue about just how powerful Windows truly is.
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And in general, the average mac user, doesn't know jack shit about any computer in the first place. They just bought it because it looks cool and some dumbass fanboy told them it was better, so they actually think the extra money is worth it and not just an Apple tax.
 
phide said:
Heh. You should pay more attention to the kind of stuff fans on the other side pump out. Hell, it was only a couple weeks ago or so that some rabid Microsoft zealot practically made a death threat against Apple and its entire user base in one of your news threads. He actually wished for Mac owners to kick the proverbial bucket and expressed his belief that anyone who owns a Mac should relocate six feet under as soon as possible.
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Probably an over reaction by a guy. Now if he went to a keynote and started shooting, then we would know he really meant it. Steve Jobs has his own Security Service called the SS so he should be fine right? :D j/k
 
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