NEC LCD2470WNX

Im thinking of getting this LCD, the only thing that is scarying me in this input lag i keep hearing about... is it that bad? I play FPS games like Crysis, Doom 3... i had a gateway FHD 2400...(BACKLIGHT was bleeding horribly) it was rated at 5ms and i didnt notice any lag...so would 6ms be any different?
 
Racasdorph said:
Im thinking of getting this LCD, the only thing that is scarying me in this input lag i keep hearing about... is it that bad? I play FPS games like Crysis, Doom 3... i had a gateway FHD 2400...(BACKLIGHT was bleeding horribly) it was rated at 5ms and i didnt notice any lag...so would 6ms be any different?
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Input lag isn't related to response time (those 5ms / 6ms or whatever in specs), none of the developers says how big it is, but for all 24" s-pva panel it ranges from 2 - 3 pictures, which for 60hz means 33 - 49 ms (sometimes even more), and trust me, even if it can't be seen by eyes, you can notice that (have you ever worked with some of the first cordless mice?)...

This Nec together with Benq should be one of the best 24" s-pva considering input lag...

TN is much better in input lag, but also much worse in everything else, so only way is (should be) some expensive H/S-IPS panel...
 
Well, last night at 2am I pulled the trigger on the NEC LCD2470WNX :D I got the white on white one, I really hope its better than the HORRIBLE gateway TN panel I had...the colors were so bad aswell as the viewing angles! I hope i made the right choice
 
Thanks to this thread I've also decided to buy myself NEC :) Problem is that in my beautiful country no one cares if your shiny new LCD has dead pixels or not. Neither anyone is willing to unpack 24" for testing. I do not know how visible can dead pixel on S-PVA be, I've owned only TNs. I am trying to find some solution cause I need this baby badly :)
 
Racasdorph said:
Well, last night at 2am I pulled the trigger on the NEC LCD2470WNX :D I got the white on white one, I really hope its better than the HORRIBLE gateway TN panel I had...the colors were so bad aswell as the viewing angles! I hope i made the right choice
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If by better you mean in a class of it's own (2nd only to the NEC SpectraView reference) then yes, it's better.
 
IceStorm said:
Looks like Super Warehouse has it for $566.No, I didn't notice any issues. I don't have any of the advance DV mode options enabled, but I'm not sure that disables overdrive.
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I need the black one (20WMGX2-BK), not the silver one. The silver I still see around, but black I just CANNOT find for less than $700 shipped, and I'm just not going to pay that for a 20" that was $400 a couple months ago.

Anyway, thats why I'm so interested in your opinion; after a month of research, I narrowed down my choice to the 20WMGX2 or the 2470WNX. As a life-long user of 21" Trinitrons, I liked the idea of a 24" rather than going down in size, but finally decided on the 20 because its an IPS and I do alot of Photoshop work. I finally go to buy one and find that, while I was making up my mind, they disappeared forever. Then I read the PRAD review and other crap about input lag on the 24s...

So now I'm not sure if I should keep looking for a 20 in the hopes I can find some shady back-alley website to take a chance on, or just order the 2470 before it too ceases to exist, and hope I don't notice the lag...
 
Thanks guys! I should have the NEC 2470 by friday and I will tell you all what I think... I got the WHITE on WHITE one...

Just to let you all know, I love to game and i am currently in college studying graphic design so I wanted a better panel than a TN :) Cant afford the IPS panels... and I really wanted a 24inch!

Ill let you all know what I think about the 6ms and how it performs in games... im very picky :) color is also very important to me

I did alot of research before making the purchase! Seems to be a great quality LCD!
 
Well UPS just delivered my NEC 2470WNX... Of course I have work in like 10 mins.. :rolleyes: lol

I have opened the box up to pull the LCD out and wow... my first impressions of the how Nec packages thier monitors is really top notch... im already impressed :) I cant wait to get back from work to fire this bad boy up! Ill post my impressions tonight...

:D
 
Racasdorph said:
Well UPS just delivered my NEC 2470WNX... Of course I have work in like 10 mins.. :rolleyes: lol

I have opened the box up to pull the LCD out and wow... my first impressions of the how Nec packages thier monitors is really top notch... im already impressed :) I cant wait to get back from work to fire this bad boy up! Ill post my impressions tonight...

:D
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I realize you need some quality time with your new monitor, but I am very close to ordering the 2470 and would really appreciate your opinion, especially on gaming performance and input lag, and/or on any problems/dislikes. Thanks in advance, and enjoy the new LCD. :)
 
My 2470 came yesterday :) I am working on it since morning, unfortunately only analog input, as my old laptop is not equipped with DVI (I am waiting for new computer).

First impressions:

Packaging was superb, everything wrapped as it should be. I was very impressed with that.
Monitor boots up very fast, great viewing angles, nice OSD. No bad pixels. I haven't calibrated it yet but it looks great. No tearing, nice response time. I do not feel input lag in daily work. I'll be testing it in games in spare time.

Thanks to all of you. This thread made me choose this one over Benq. I do not regret penny spent on it :)
 
Well, I was up until 3:30 am this morning fooling around with this new NEC 2470WNX! and WOW! thats all I can say...

Like others before have said, the packaging was superb... I got the white on white version of the monitor and I love the style!

Firing it up using the DVI connection was the way I went... the color out of the box are great...but EVEN better if you calibrate it! :)

I tested DOOM3 first for any lag or backlight bleed... did not notice either...I have a DELL TN panel and this NEC LCD seems just as fast!

0 Backlightbleed - great viewing angles - amazing color = winner :)

After sending back 2 gateway FHD2400's due to horrible backlight bleed and color reproduction... im very happy now :D
 
Congrats, Racasdorph! Glad it worked out for you in the end. 3rd time lucky! Which, in today's LCD market, is no minor feat.
 
Manny Calavera said:
I know of exactly what you mean,I have seen it on a Gateway live and in person,this screen does not exhibit any of that crap.

Oh,connected to my Samsung 955DF,the lag was measured at 23.8 ms.In games such as Prey at native res,or UT2004 at native as well as FEAR,it displayed absolutlely ZERO lag at all(None that I could detect,and was bothered by,anyway.)Ghosting was minimal at best.
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Manny:

So no inverse ghosting? Also, what about the "Overdrive artifacts" PRAD mentioned?

Also, PRAD said 33ms (2 frames) of lag, but did not provide minimum, average, or maximum numbers. So can I assume from your numbers (23.8ms) that its not just pegged at a constant 33ms? Was 23ms your average, and if so, what was the minimum?

Thanks in advance.
 
damn nice monitor. but for hte price of 2 soyo's with adjustable arm mounts, i'd only get 1 of these, thats not worth it in my honest opinion ;) :D
 
IceStorm said:
Looks like Super Warehouse has it for $566.No, I didn't notice any issues. I don't have any of the advance DV mode options enabled, but I'm not sure that disables overdrive.

Old panels with higher latency used to make me ill, especially when interpolating (an old NEC 1760V, purchased in Nov, 2003). I haven't had any of those issues on the 2470, 20WMGX2, or 24WMCX., but I suspect I'm just not that aware of it after a certain threshold.The 2470's text is easier to read, but not quite as crisp. That may not make sense, but with the 20WMGX2, black text will sometimes have a green tinge to it on one side (over digital input). This has to do with the adjustment of "Sharpness", and it seems I couldn't quite get the 20WMGX2 to be the same as the 2470.I bought the 2470 before I bought the 20WMGX2. The 2470 replaced a Diamond Pro 900u that died. I bought the monitor on July 30th. 1920x1200 was a must. I bought the 20WMGX2 on October 18th to use as a LAN party monitor while waiting for the LCD24WMCX to arrive on the market. For $400 after rebate, it was too good a price to pass up (rebate's still pending...).

The 2470 is different than the 20WMGX2. For one, the 2470 has a matte finish. That impacts vibrancy a bit. The Prad review of the 2470 is accurate. Colors are good and subtle shades work, but they're not overpoweringly bright. The 20WMGX has a bit more "pop", but a dark screen is blueish-tinged instead of neutral. That seems to be a characteristic of IPS panels. Viewable angle seems to be about the same for both the 2470 and 20WMGX2. It's the 24WMCX where viewable angle is noticeable.
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Thanks. Now let's pretend you to had to choose either the 20WMGX2 or 2470 to be your only monitor for "all around" use (gaming, Photoshop, etc.)...which would you keep and why?
 
EW27 said:
Thanks. Now let's pretend you to had to choose either the 20WMGX2 or 2470 to be your only monitor for "all around" use (gaming, Photoshop, etc.)...which would you keep and why?
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Seeing as how the 20WMGX2 has been in its GearGrip case for the past month and a half, I'm gonna go with the 2470WNX.

I prefer the text on the 2470WNX to the 20WMGX2, viewable angle is fine, it's 1920x1200 vs the 20WMGX2's lower 1680x1050, and it has quite a nice stand. The only areas it's less capable than the 20WMGX2 in is inputs, but I don't care much about s-video/composite and Component's not necessary on today's consoles (other than a Wii, but I'm not playing Wii on a 24" display).

P.S. If someone has a specific game that can show off the "inverse ghosting" that people complain about, please let me know and I'll try to test it. So far, I've seen no evidence of this behavior on the 2470WNX.
 
EW27 said:
Thanks. Now let's pretend you to had to choose either the 20WMGX2 or 2470 to be your only monitor for "all around" use (gaming, Photoshop, etc.)...which would you keep and why?
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the 2470. 20wmgx2 is a gaming monitor, not really suited for photoshop work with its glossy tinted cover.
 
IceStorm said:
If someone has a specific game that can show off the "inverse ghosting" that people complain about, please let me know and I'll try to test it. So far, I've seen no evidence of this behavior on the 2470WNX.
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I think you'd be more likely to see inverse ghosting on your desktop than in a game. The videos show a dark "shadow" trailing bright objects (windows, files, etc.) as the user drags them around the desktop.

Here's what I think the deal is: inverse ghosting is a problem on the Dell 2407 HC, not on the original 2407. The NEC 2470 uses the same panel as the 2407 (LTM240M2), not the "special" panel the HC uses (LTM240CS01). Therefore, people who assume the NEC has the problem because "it uses the same panel as the Dell" have their panels confused. Please correct me if I'm wrong...but otherwise, you NEC 2470 owners have never seen the problem because it doesn't exist on the non-HC panel.

EDIT: I think the other monitor that has the infamous inverse ghosting is the Samsung 245T, which of course uses the same wide gamut panel as the Dell HC...so more evidence the problem is inherent in the Samsung S-PVA panel used in the 24" wide gamut LCDs.
 
IceStorm said:
Seeing as how the 20WMGX2 has been in its GearGrip case for the past month and a half, I'm gonna go with the 2470WNX.

I prefer the text on the 2470WNX to the 20WMGX2, viewable angle is fine, it's 1920x1200 vs the 20WMGX2's lower 1680x1050, and it has quite a nice stand. The only areas it's less capable than the 20WMGX2 in is inputs, but I don't care much about s-video/composite and Component's not necessary on today's consoles (other than a Wii, but I'm not playing Wii on a 24" display).
Click to expand...

OK, that settles it. I'm on my way to NewEgg to buy a 2470WNX. :D

I spent the Christmas holiday trying to decide between it and a 20WMGX2, and the following 2 weeks trying to find a black 20WMGX2. I decided I had to have an IPS even though its much smaller than what I'm used to (21" Trinitron), and I don't need the tuner and A/V inputs (I have a Samsung 50" DLP for that). What I really wanted was a 24", but I found this forum and read all the "PVA sucks" stuff and was afraid to buy one.

So thanks IceStorm, Manny, Dunan, Racasdorph, Funghi, and everybody but HeadHunter, who made my dilemma worse with all the "input lag" posts. :p Seriously, thanks for answering all my stupid questions. I'll be back with a user review of the 2470...
 
One NEC LCD2470WNX-BK on the way from NewEgg. Its big, its black, and its coming to my house in 2 days.

Keep your fingers crossed for no dead pixels...;)
 
EW27 said:
One NEC LCD2470WNX-BK on the way from NewEgg. Its big, its black, and its coming to my house in 2 days.

Keep your fingers crossed for no dead pixels...;)
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These are pro or semi-pro panels. You will probably be VERY hard pressed to find them shipping with dead pixels. More specifically on the xx90 series.
 
Well, I have to admit, you guys were right. My 2470 came today and its beautiful. There are ZERO dead or stuck pixels. There is NO backlight bleeding. There is NO perceptible input lag. The viewing angles are incredible. And now thats its sitting here in front of me, I see that the 20" would have been way too small.

Thanks for all the advice... ;)
 
pls tell us about the brigtness/contrast settings and how does it feel when working with white-background documents/webpages and playing darker games? do you have to adjust settings every time or you have one setting to rule them all? thx
 
eugene.b said:
pls tell us about the brigtness/contrast settings and how does it feel when working with white-background documents/webpages and playing darker games? do you have to adjust settings every time or you have one setting to rule them all? thx
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Well I just ran the PassMark Monitor Test and Pixel Persistance Analyzer from PRAD, and the 2470 passed with flying colors. I was almost afraid to do it, but I was pleasantly surprised by the results. Absolutely NO dead or stuck pixels, panel is uniform with no backlight bleeding, no visible ghosting or smearing, and no perceptible input lag. White backgrounds are fine (bright white with razor-sharp text) and I can see all steps in the test scales.

Contrast is at 50; if I go much higher, extreme whites start to blow out. I'm still experimenting with brightness; my room has one window with a blind, and today it looked OK between about 50-75, but now that its dark, I'm getting the best results between say 25-50.

As for games, I've tried Call of Duty 4, FEAR, FarCry, Rome Total War, and America's Army. FarCry looks better than ever, but America's Army doesn't look right (colors, blacks/shadows seem off), so with it I have indeed been adjusting settings like crazy...
 
Also, I was right about the panels. I asked NEC what panel the 2470 uses; their response:

"Dear xxxxx xxxxxx,

The LCD2470WNX currently has the Samsung LTM240M2-L02 panel.

Sincerely,

Justin Pendleton
NEC Display Solutions Service & Support
Telephone: 1-800-632-4662
E-mail: [email protected]"

So it uses the updated revision of the panel in the Dell 2407 non-HC (LTM240M2), which means NO inverse ghosting, plus all the fixes for the problems reported on the original Dell version (blurry text, banding, etc.). That explains why none of you 2470 owners (including myself) have seen any of these issues.
 
have you managed to find one best setting for the monitor? this is very important for me because i'm about to order one. the only thing that stops me is the fact that i've had benq 24" and had to change settings every time i saw a white background. it was really bright and my eyes started to hurt. if i set brightness to 0, i could work with white, but dark colors/shadows in games weren't visible. so i got my money back. now i want to get this nec and am wondering can you adjust it so that it will be perfect to use in every situation without turning the settings. thx.
 
eugene.b said:
have you managed to find one best setting for the monitor? this is very important for me because i'm about to order one. the only thing that stops me is the fact that i've had benq 24" and had to change settings every time i saw a white background. it was really bright and my eyes started to hurt. if i set brightness to 0, i could work with white, but dark colors/shadows in games weren't visible. so i got my money back. now i want to get this nec and am wondering can you adjust it so that it will be perfect to use in every situation without turning the settings. thx.
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No problems with white backgrounds if you turn the brightness down below about 75 (default was 100). I'm generally using about 50 contrast/25-50 brightness in Windows, and I've been experimenting in games to see what looks best. I don't have a hardware calibrator, so using the PRAD setup from native (http://www.prad.de/en/monitore/review/2007/review-nec-lcd2470wnx-part8.html), DCP tests, NEC NaviSet, and figuring percentages of max. 500 cd/m2, I'm shooting for 2.2 gamma and 140ish cd/m2 by eye, which means I'm probably a bit off...but it looks fantastic.

I've never played with the BenQ so I can't really give you a comparison, but to be honest there is one game (America's Army) where I've had to fiddle with the brightness and contrast in dark maps. COD 4, FEAR, FarCry, and Rome Total War look great at 50 contrast and 25-50 brightness. When the lights are down, I'm stunned by how good they all look, but when I have sunlight pouring in, a couple of the darker maps in America's Army are a gray mess. I'll report back when I figure it out.
 
so just to check - 50 contrast and 25 brightness is the setting you use for all your work unless some external things start to happen, like bright sunlight in the room etc. If you have normal conditions, you use 50 contrast and 25 brightness and can see all the colors, white isn't blinding for you to work with etc?

the reason i ask is because you always write 25-50 brightness. is it because you change it every time because something's bothering you?
 
eugene.b said:
so just to check - 50 contrast and 25 brightness is the setting you use for all your work unless some external things start to happen, like bright sunlight in the room etc. If you have normal conditions, you use 50 contrast and 25 brightness and can see all the colors, white isn't blinding for you to work with etc?

the reason i ask is because you always write 25-50 brightness. is it because you change it every time because something's bothering you?
Click to expand...

I said 25-50 because I'm still playing with the brightness. Here's as precise as I can be:

- Contrast: If I'm looking at say the NaviSet or DCP scales, I can clearly see the last step before pure white disappear above about 52/53%. So contrast is at 50 and is staying there.

- Brightness: 25-28 should be around 140 cd/m2 if my calculations are correct, and everything looks great there...except large white backgrounds which appear to need just a little bump, so 30-35 looks about right (I tend to like lower brightness). Between 50-75, they are brilliant pristine bright white but not blinding, and colors are still not washed-out; but the DCP luminance and other tests do visibly better at 50 and below, so I settled on that as my high point.

So like I said, I'm stuck on 50 contrast and still fluctuating between 25-50 brightness as I try different games and tests...but around 35 is looking good for general use. Hope that helps.
 
thx. just ordered one for 660 euro + 20 euro delivery. should be here friday/monday. hope it will stay with me. gonna write my opinion and impressions when i get it=) thx to everyone for support and help.
 
Just so you folks know, this LCD is incredible for running at non-native resolutions. If you stick to the same aspect ratio you shouldn't lose any texture quality at all.

prad.de has a really good article up showing off the amazing scaling this screen does.
 
I just ordered one (Oups ! It's a 2490WUXI, not 2470) Yesterday, it should be here in the next 2 weeks. (Canada)
 
Purchased a unit in October. After a couple of months of use I noticed the corners were bleeding light through. They may have been there from the start but I didn't notice it until I began using a dark desktop wallpaper.

So I decided to use the NEC MRA process.

It's easy to get an MRA. Just dial the 800 #, tell them your problem, answer a few questions about it, and wait for them to ship a replacement. And it will ship same day if calling before 1:00 EST but only if you are willing to supply a credit card # and pay for return shipping of the old unit within 3 weeks. Don't forget to send the old one back because they'll charge you $614.00 (actually a pretty good deal). For me, the item arrived in one day (shipped in same state, OH). If the original unit was purchased over 30 days ago, NEC will ship a refurbished, Uh Oh, otherwise they ship a new replacement at their expense both ways. The first arrived with slight damage to the box. Inside the monitor was safe but smelled heavily of smoke, the front bezel was overly scratched, and the unit was a bit dusty. But I powered it up and it worked perfectly. Not a flaw in the picture, including the lack of corner light bleeding. However, what bothered me was their "like new" reconditioned monitor looked used except for the picture. I was fine with that but I thought NEC needed to know this. So I called. And again, a few little questions and another monitor in one day. I didn't call to get another, but they offered. Now this time the unit looked fine and again the picture was perfect, some slight corner bleed, but only when cold. It showed some dust. The verdict: Don't expect to feel as though you've received a new monitor but expect it to view like one. Both units were 2-3 months older than my June build original so expect the same model, just older.

What's all this say? Well, although I'm not happy with their refurbished replacement policy, I was happy with their warranty process and at least the picture quality of the replacement units. Now if your thinking of buying a new unit, this certainly should persuade some to think NEC.

Some other thoughts:

1. All 3 units had identically the same picture at the same settings.
2. All 3 units had no dead or stuck pixels.
3. The contrast is the best I've seen on any unit
4. The brightness is not quite as bright as others I've seen. However 100% is still pretty bright but not overly. I use 70%. 50% or lower looks too dull for my liking.
5. The stand is as good as it gets. Believe me, this unit can be maneuvered with ease. Perfect.
6. OSD buttons and layout are perfect. Very simple, in the front, easy to navigate.
7. OSD mode change notifiers are annoying. These are the little pop-up windows that appear every time the monitor changes state, i.e. resolution, wake-up, shut down, etc. Need to able to turn these off.
8. Modes: Only two that don't look washed out: Photo and Standard. I use Photo, it has the most contrast.
9. Lag: I must really stink at gaming because I really don't see it. I've been playing COD4 and have no problem aiming sites, zeroing in quickly and triggering where I pointed. If it's there, it's not affecting my gameplay. Maybe I don't notice because of this:

After using a 22" Mit Diamond Pro, I was a bit worried about game lag. Quite frankly, the picture quality is so incredibily detailed, crisp, brilliant, and contrasted with games and photos on this monitor that I've felt cheated all these years using my once $1500 CRT. If there's lag, maybe I'm too shocked over the picture quality that I don't notice.

Most other things on this board I agree with so I won't repeat.

Oh, and if your thinking of chosing the less expensive WVX, don't. I have it. And as you know it's a TN panel and looks inferior as most others with a TN. Colors are more faded, contrast is lower, and the viewing angle is worse (although not as bad as I would have thought). It's nice for a TN but not for the $200 savings. Also, my WVX arrived DOA. But so what, I got another new one.

If I think of anything else, I'll post. Please ask questions if you have any.
 
romeo2180 said:
Purchased a unit in October. After a couple of months of use I noticed the corners were bleeding light through. They may have been there from the start but I didn't notice it until I began using a dark desktop wallpaper.

So I decided to use the NEC MRA process.
Click to expand...
I think you can upgrade your warranty so you get a new unit in RMA, but I'm not positive. I know the box includes several warranty extension/upgrade options, I've just not bothered to read them all yet. I really should...
7. OSD mode change notifiers are annoying. These are the little pop-up windows that appear every time the monitor changes state, i.e. resolution, wake-up, shut down, etc. Need to able to turn these off.
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You can, at least on mine. Go to Menu Tools and then choose Resolution Notifier. That at least disables the resolution notifications. It won't turn off the input notification, though.
 
I asked NEC support if there was any way to receive a new unit in place of the old. They clearly stated NO.

I do have the res notifier off, but as you stated, the input notifiers remain on. They are less annoying because I'm getting used to it.
 
romeo2180 said:
I asked NEC support if there was any way to receive a new unit in place of the old. They clearly stated NO.

I do have the res notifier off, but as you stated, the input notifiers remain on. They are less annoying because I'm getting used to it.
Click to expand...

I had to RMA an NEC LCD multiple times (4? 5? Memory is a bit hazy right now). The first few times I got refurbs, but once it was clear that I wasn't going to get a refurb that worked properly in all aspects they finally sent me a new one. There probably isn't way to get a new one through RMA on your first try. This is why I always prefer to get exchanges through the retailer I buy from if I'm still within the return/exchange period--a lot of manufacturers send out refurbs as RMA replacements.
 
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