NCASE M1 version changelog and suggestions thread

Here are some patterns I made using the available tooling

I see, thanks. Wasn't sure if the holes/slots were being punched, drilled, or whatnot.

For some reason, rectangle #2, and then rounded rectangle #3 look best to my eyes.. def prefer the finished rows (flush ends). Rounded #1 could be made flush using the hole punch from the current M1 in place of the very last slots (hole in each corner), and would look very nice.

Not sure, but I would think offset slots would be less prone to getting bent out of shape than say rectangle #1.
 
New panel ideas.
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The bottom one is way too "1950's radiator cover" for my tastes. lol ;)

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New panel ideas.
BlFVp43l.jpg

I'm really digging the look on the slotted version, it reminds me of the CaseLabs cases that use these extensively. Although I do prefer the current more as it the least "attention calling".

I hope you'd be able to use the same pattern on the bottom and rear vents for uniformity's sake.
 
The current design of alternating 3mm round holes is elegant. I also like the 'radiator' vent design (rect #1).

I'm not a fan of the 'brick' vents. To me it looks home made and reminds me of other vendor attempts at a small form factor cases made from steel.

I would go for 5 or 6mm hexagons. The Cooler Master Storm Scout 2 cases use hexagonal vents on the back and side for fans. The back uses 5mm and the sides use 6-7mm. These provide great air flow and look good too. If you go to thicker aluminum you may be okay. They may even be stronger than the 'radiator' style.

Otherwise I would suggest if possible replacing the 3mm circular holes with 3mm square holes rotated 45 degrees (diamonds). That would increase the empty area 27% over the same size circles without decreasing the minimum thickness of the metal between the holes. It would also keep the strength and 45-degree look you have going. If you can't rotate them, or you want a simpler look, then you could also just use straight 3-4mm squares. 4mm squares or diamonds would increase the area of the current holes by 126%. You could keep the current distance between holes (edge to edge) for similar strength, especially if going to thicker aluminum.
 
I'm not a fan of the 'brick' vents.

I'm not a fan of the "honeycomb" vents :p ..plus, would be impossible to have a finished edge, unless they have tooling for half hexes, which I kinda doubt.

Your 45° diamond idea might look nice (again, only if edges were finished flush w/triangles).

I'm not sure why, but I just really dislike the look of unfinished edges like the CM Scout 2 (and W360's 1st picture, that Phuncz just quoted above).. just doesn't seem right. Maybe just me?
 
Panels with mesh inserts may improve air flow and panel rigidity, and could enable further opportunities for panel customization:

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Alternatively, this thicker panel with larger holes would seem to improve functionality.

BlFVp43l.jpg
 
It's funny how almost no one really seems to be going with the two offered options but instead is recommending totally different ideas that aren't even all viable or better.

It reminds me of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgXgRKVdT2s

It's not "funny" but inevitable given that a) everyone has different tastes, b) this is the interweb and a lot of people don't read threads in their entirety or individual posts properly and, c) most important of all, the two new options look awful. I'd be happy with the panels to remain as they are, which I think is the most aesthetically pleasing option available, despite not being the most efficient option cooling-wise.
 
a) true
b) not reading isn't a valid excuse, then you're just trolling
c) see your own point a)
 
Any body thought about hexagons for the grill, I'll try and do a pattern in a bit also I really like the original case and have been trying to get my hands on one for ages
 
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Per LL, changing the style of vent won't make much difference. So we'll be staying with the current 3mm hole pattern.
 
Per LL, changing the style of vent won't make much difference. So we'll be staying with the current 3mm hole pattern.

Couldn't even remember the reasoning for considering a different style of vents (concerns of improving airflow, and one instance of "whistling" it seems), but in any case, the current 3mm vents do look quite nice and understated.
 
Couldn't even remember the reasoning for considering a different style of vents (concerns of improving airflow, and one instance of "whistling" it seems), but in any case, the current 3mm vents do look quite nice and understated.
Attempting to reduce the possibility of panel warping during manufacture was the main reason. LL has some other measures they're taking which should help, but I wanted to see if it was possible to eliminate completely.
 
^^ Ahh, yes.. I do remember that being discussed somewhere before, but just couldn't find it in this particular thread. Might've been in the main, before it branched.. thanks!
 
really looking forward to the new design. I really love the old sidepanel and toppanel design, but can understand your point :)
 
So, since all this innovating etc. is happening now once the pre-orders are up and hit the minimum amount of people. Production will be able to start right? I am extremely excited (maybe too excited) to get my case very quickly. Also would anyone recommend a cheap case to hold my parts before it arrives?

A suggestion that i saw earlier that i liked was larger feet - could you make removable/changable feet and give us 2 sizes or have the option of feet size and the ability to order bigger feet :D
 
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So, since all this innovating etc. is happening now once the pre-orders are up and hit the minimum amount of people. Production will be able to start right? I am extremely excited (maybe too excited) to get my case very quickly. Also would anyone recommend a cheap case to hold my parts before it arrives?

A suggestion that i saw earlier that i liked was larger feet - could you make removable/changable feet and give us 2 sizes or have the option of feet size and the ability to order bigger feet :D
I think overall the SG05 or something similar from Silverstone would be great. Only reason I say that is because Silverstone seems to be the only company that really builds cases around the SFX PSU.

I really would like slightly taller feet as well. Even just 2-3mm would be great.
 
What is "won't make much of a difference"? 5% more airflow? Could be a big deal in a tightly packed case like this.

To me, the lines on the rectangular vents work with rectangular shape of the case more than the round holes.
 
5% more airflow won't matter much in a tightly packed case, as you'd need static pressure for that.
 
A suggestion that i saw earlier that i liked was larger feet - could you make removable/changable feet and give us 2 sizes or have the option of feet size and the ability to order bigger feet :D
The feet are attached via a single screw. It's no problem to replace them (and a few people have).

What is "won't make much of a difference"?
I didn't specify, but I meant in regards to my primary reason for considering the change, which was panel uniformity.

The greater open area of a slotted design may improve airflow somewhat, but that doesn't mean it's worth doing. I say that because it's already possible to get good temps in the case, while configurations that don't perform as well (e.g., non-blower GPUs) likely wouldn't benefit since the vents are all in the upper part of the case. Plus, nobody seems to have much issue with the look of the current vent holes, while the slotted designs are much more polarizing. Personally, I prefer the current design.

Honestly, the alternate designs should not have been posted until I had received feedback from LL (looking at you w360 :p ).
 
Necere, I'm reading the tentative list of changes in the first post and while I'm pro on a lot of them, I'm curious you went with this one: No top panel screw

There was discussion "back then" that you didn't want people to pop off the panel by accident, bending the panel or dropping the case because of the lack of a sturdy mount, so what made you change ? I personally see the screw as a sensible choice, so I'm not unhappy about it being there.

Wouldn't a solution be to shorten the overhang of the panel to the rear, so you can't grip the top panel by accident ? Maybe with the edges angled, inverse to the front of the top panel ?
 
Wouldn't a solution be to shorten the overhang of the panel to the rear, so you can't grip the top panel by accident ?

I agree with shortening the overhang in general. More overhanging means a greater chance of the panels popping out if you hit the back of the case against something. Bending it inwards also helps but maybe shortening is enough. No opinion about the top screw, but I personally feel safe with it.
 
I like that screw is being removed. It is an eye sore on a beautiful case. Just don't blindly pick up your case without thinking, there is enough a gap with the case feet to slide your fingers under the case and lift.
 
Maybe the top rear of the frame can get a "lip" users can grab onto that will take the strain off the top panel?
 
I just want to reiterate the excitement others have mentioned about a second run of the M1 - I stumbled on the original only after the remaining cases were sold, and was bummed that I missed the opportunity to purchase. Now, I'm already considering the possibilities of my next build, using the case. Can't wait to order! :D

Looking at the tentative list of changes, everything seems to be well thought-out already. I suppose the experience of v1 users was quite useful in addressing the "little things" that are hard to see/consider until the unit is at hand... In any case, my only suggestion beyond those may be a bit far-fetched, but I'll mention it anyway.

Basically, I'm wondering if it would be possible to have a removable plate or bracket in the place of the opening at the front of the case (for long GPUs) that could support mounting a 2.5'' drive horizontally (using the free space in the front of the case). Admittedly, my thinking here is fairly specific to a setup that has a CD/DVD drive, uses a dual-rad (for the CPU presumably), and has a GPU that isn't quite long enough to need the extra room afforded by the front cutout. That said, for those of us who would just have a 2.5'' drive or SSD for storage, it would be fantastic to have both the dual-rad on the side, and dual 120mm fans on the bottom, from a cooling perspective. Currently you have to choose between the two since storage has to be mounted in either location.

I'd probably fashion something to replicate this anyway, but I'm curious as to if anyone else would be interested in such a configuration? If not to increase the number of possible drives for a given setup by one? Obviously, it would be silly to suggest a change that almost nobody would use :rolleyes:
 
Bottom fans aren't strictly needed in this case. I ran my case without any case fans (just CPU and GPU cooler's fans) without any problems. I'm running my watercooled setup (see my signature) with just the two 120mm fans on the sidepanel. The performance and noise is good in my opinion, not enough to justify adding fans that are blocked 80-90% anyways, but they will be adding more noise.
 
I'm super excited :D

When will we know when the campaign starts? are there approximations of shipping dates? will there be early shipping available as an extra?

too many questions...:eek:
 
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Bottom fans aren't strictly needed in this case. I ran my case without any case fans (just CPU and GPU cooler's fans) without any problems. I'm running my watercooled setup (see my signature) with just the two 120mm fans on the sidepanel. The performance and noise is good in my opinion, not enough to justify adding fans that are blocked 80-90% anyways, but they will be adding more noise.

Interesting... And nice rig!

Gleaning off of what I've read online, though, overall experiences are a bit more mixed (with the variance mostly explained by GPU choices, I think). And I can't say that I'll be putting a custom water loop in to cool everything, probably just a sealed one for the CPU. So I suppose I just want to ensure that there is adequate airflow for everything else. And in this size of case, two bottom fans ought to do that very well, even if the GPU blocks direct airflow.

Are your fans installed in a push or pull config?

I'm super excited :D

When will we know when the campaign starts? are there approximations of shipping dates? will there be early shipping available as an extra?

too many questions...:eek:

Peter, if you go to the main website for the case (google "ncases"), you can provide an email so as to be notified about pre-ordering. And according to the original HF thread, pre-orders are in the neighborhood of late-April to early-May. Anything beyond that is TBD AFAIK.
 
hey Necere, I have some thoughts/feedback after having recently rebuilding my system. These are just some observations/wishful thinking on my part. I realize none will probably make it into the revision, since you are trying to keep the changes minimal. but maybe if you ever decide to make a rev 3 or something later down the road you can keep some in mind.

#1 observation:
There seems to be a need for more room for sata cables on the front 2.5 plate area.

I had so much frustration not in attaching the 2.5 drive, but rather with the cables. I have about 10 sata cables, and every one has been the same. One end always has an L shape connector on one side. I can't use the L shape on the motherboard side b/c then the L would block the lower sata ports. At first I was trying to attach both 2.5 drives in this configuration with the L sata cables going inward (as in this example picture)

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But nothing I tried would work. There just was not enough of the metal cut away for them to fit going inward. Having the L sata cables facing outward also did not work b/c the front case panel could not snap back on to the chasis. It was only after seeing that example picture above I realized the problem. There is not enough room for people using L shaped cables and stacking two in that manner :(

Ultimately I had to settle for attaching one on the inside (back against the atx psu) and one on the outside on the front. The one on the front BARELY had room to fit. Maybe 1mm or less leeway.

I had to try 4 or 5 different combinations before i stumbled upon the 'right' way to attach a second 2.5 drive on the front and have the L sata cables actually fit as well. The only solution I can think of to make things less of a headache and easier to manage is to cut out more space in the front.

Vg4e5a3.jpg


you'll notice in the pink areas two areas of the front are cut (top and bottom). I didn't do exact measurements but I'm thinking if the bottom is also cut out a little more there might be some room to put the 2.5 drive in either direction (up or down) with cables coming out the top slotted area or through the slot below. Originally I really wanted to install them facing down. but there just was not enough metal cut away for that to work.

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#2 wishful thinking idea:
I know this won't work b/c you'd have to add probably 1/4 of an inch horizontal width to the entire case to accommodate 2 side by side. Since this is just a fantasy, It would also be nice to have the option of mounting 2.5 drives in either direction (cables threaded through the top or bottom slots). this picture isnt drawn to scale but you get the idea.

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And my number 1 wish:
Having a more homogenized kit. Right now theres all kinds of different types of screws, and screw holes. to make matters worse, since there is such a tight design, there is hardly any room for error. An example of what i mean is after spending several hours trying to get everything assembled (half of which was probably due to the L sata cable issues), I attempted to pop the side panels back on... only to discover the case panels would not fit. For the life of me i could not figure out why. It took quite some time to figure out what had happened.

Basically some screws that I used were not suppose to be used in those areas. Some screws I had used were too tall, and protruding out too much. Only specific screws had to be used in specific places, otherwise I could not pop the panels back on.

However, to make matters worse, some screws were different size/shapes, but the screw holes were identical and could fit more than 1 type of screw that was included.. So i ended up spending probably another hour or two mixing and matching screws, trying to figure out what screws were suppose to go where, and what screws worked and did not work.

My proposal is to try to homogenize the screw requirements. Have most(if possible) G and H screws eliminated and replaced with the F type. Using a more universal kit would lessen time, and frustrations, while also making it easier to replace if required. What happens if a person loses some of those more 'exotic' H screws that were specifically needed for a specific area? well.. he is screwed so to speak lol. On a related note, after spending so many hours screwing and unscrewing, i have come to LOATH those tiny, "H" m3 countersunk screws. There was a point where I wanted to throw the thing out the window due to those H screws.

They are just so small, hard to work with, and overall a pain in the butt. Especially after I had to disassemble a lot of work b/c I only realized later specific areas required specific screws. They're just a pain to work with and one of the most frustrating aspects. It is also my personal, unscientific opinion that due to their tiny size and limited thread, they are not ideal to hold a lot of weight, especially when it comes to holding up and stabilizing a 5lb atx psu. I honestly don't have much confidence in them at all.
 
If you have absolutely no straight SATA cables, you can pick those up from eBay, Amazon, NewEgg or a local computer store for a few dollars or euros.
If you have a hard time keeping the screws apart, I recommend you get a sorting tray or ziplock bags with labels to keep them seperated.
If you hate small screws, you are in the wrong section of the forum ;)
The case already has so many SSD mounting points on the bottom, front and behind the front panel. That your ATX PSU is in the way for some of them is a limitation when you choose an ATX PSU.
 
Necere, I'm reading the tentative list of changes in the first post and while I'm pro on a lot of them, I'm curious you went with this one: No top panel screw
Because a few people have requested it, and on reflection the supposed benefit as a safety feature seems dubious. It was actually something I included because LL suggested it - but for the first concept design we sent them (vertical type), not the M1.

Wouldn't a solution be to shorten the overhang of the panel to the rear, so you can't grip the top panel by accident ?

I agree with shortening the overhang in general.
The overhang is there to let you remove the panel. How exactly are you guys getting yours off, if not pulling from the overhang?

Basically, I'm wondering if it would be possible to have a removable plate or bracket in the place of the opening at the front of the case (for long GPUs) that could support mounting a 2.5'' drive horizontally (using the free space in the front of the case).
Not really. That space is used by cables. Are you aware that you can mount a 2.5" drive to the inside front, on the opposite side from the optical drive? You can do this even with a dual radiator mounted.

#1 observation:
There seems to be a need for more room for sata cables on the front 2.5 plate area.

I had so much frustration not in attaching the 2.5 drive, but rather with the cables. I have about 10 sata cables, and every one has been the same. One end always has an L shape connector on one side. I can't use the L shape on the motherboard side b/c then the L would block the lower sata ports.
SATA cables with straight connectors at both ends are readily available, so that shouldn't really be a problem. The cutout might be that can be done anyway, though.

If you want two SSDs on the outside front using the stacking bracket, they need to be 7mm thick, and you should mount them face-to-face (with the current v1 bracket anyway. v2 changes the bracket design slightly to fix this). In addition to face-to-face mounting, you can try flipping them so the cables are at opposite ends.


And my number 1 wish:
Having a more homogenized kit. Right now theres all kinds of different types of screws, and screw holes.
Well, yeah. Every screw type serves a purpose.

The flat head M3s ('H' type on the screw guide) are for stacking 2.5" drives. The drives are threaded for M3, so obviously can't be replaced with #6-32 ('F' type). As for the chassis parts that are secured using the same screws (fan bracket, PSU brackets mainly), they need to be small in order to sit flush with the surface when countersunk. The head height needs to be less than the aluminum thickness (1.5mm), and on a cursory search, flat head 6-32s seem to be 2mm+.

It sounds like your issue is mainly with flat head M3s vs the dome head M3s. Since the flat head M3s are required by the design, the only real possibility for reducing the number of screw types is to replace the dome head M3s ('G') with the flat heads. Which doesn't sound like what you'd prefer.

Losing the M3s isn't much of an issue; there are (if I'm counting right) 18 in the chassis, and only half of those are ever likely to be removed. Even if a few are lost, there are 19 included in the accessory box to make full use of both sets of 2.5" stacking brackets (4 drives total). And in the event you were to lose a few and still wanted to use both sets of stacking brackets, flat head M3 isn't required for the brackets, so any old M3 screws will do.
 
Are you aware that you can mount a 2.5" drive to the inside front, on the opposite side from the optical drive? You can do this even with a dual radiator mounted.

I had NO IDEA you could do that. :eek: I had presumed that a dual radiator would have prevented use of that space... and indeed, a simple reading of the specs of the case on the Indiegogo page present a mention of the fact that you can mount a 2.5" drive there!

That, combined with the recent pictures of the Hackintosh build (in the main thread) which have both the dual-rad and the mounted SSD clearly visible. I feel quite silly for having missed those :rolleyes:

Thanks for the clarification Necere!
 
The overhang is there to let you remove the panel. How exactly are you guys getting yours off, if not pulling from the overhang?
Yeah I guess it's easy to forget about it but indeed, we need it for pulling the top panel off.
 
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