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Discussion in 'Small Form Factor Systems' started by Necere, Mar 6, 2014.
It will interfere with GPU height by 2mm, since the glass is 2mm thick.
Could you explain it a little more? How exactly do you attach the HDD bracket to the PSU mounts? Sorry if I'm being dense.
An SFX PSU has a 92mm fan. You'd install the PSU with the fan facing inward. Then you'd need to attach a 92-to-120mm adapter (look them up on Amazon) to the PSU fan mounts and then attach the HDD bracket (which has 120mm mounts) to the adapter. If using an SFX-L PSU you can mount the HDD cage directly to the fan mounts as SFX-L uses a 120mm fan.
It's not exactly an elegant solution as you would limit airflow to the PSU, and also accessing the cables under the PSU won't be easy and mounting/unmounting the bracket will be a pain. But it's an option nevertheless.
Thanks. Will the glass panel fit with an ATX PSU? It seems like the ATX bracket is offset by about 2mm from the edge of the frame, so it should barely fit, correct?
These are a few of my thoughts/ideas inspired by Steacomm's DA2 case (which no doubt was much inspired by the NCASE). I'm not expecting anything here, but these are a few of the design features that I have been wishing for.
With the new window kit negating the usefulness of the side bracket, I would like to see a new top bracket of sorts to perform similar functions.
This would allow for a few things:
-HDD mounting over PSU (greedily would appreciate squeezing in 3 since they could fit with a new bracket)
-Slim top 120mm fan mount (over socket)
-Slim top~80mm fan mount (over right side?)
Other perhaps less feasible thoughts with the windowed side panel in mind:
-Vertical GPU mount for the functional purpose of clearing up the bottom of the case for 240mm AIO support (Inspired by the MNPCTECH vertical gpu bracket)
Least feasible thoughts:
-Some type of NCASE "top hat"? For fans or perhaps AIO?
Funnily enough, from a design perspective, I'd imagine the top compartment expansion idea would be the most feasible. It likely wouldn't even need a new revision of the case. In addition to the toolless clips that hold the top panel on, there's also the screw holes for the psu bracket for it to screw into. It could then either come with longer screws that would go through the expansion, the frame, and the bracket and hold it all together, or have a place within itself to attach the bracket. Of course, they're never going to make one officially, it wouldn't be profitable since it'd be a a niche within a niche, but you might be able to design and make a custom one yourself.
Would it be possible to release a solid backside panel for the M1? That way, in combination with the window panel, you can have more streamlined airflow from the bottom to top/rear for a "chimney" effect of sorts.
That's probably too small of a niche to be worth adding more options/parts for, and it doesn't seem to me that it offers much value anyway. Any bottom-top laminar airflow is already going to be interrupted by the GPU.
That's true but at least you wouldn't lose most of the air from the bottom intakes by the time it reaches the CPU cooler. I think with a window panel a solid back panel makes a lot of sense. But I agree that it's a small niche, probably wouldn't be worth stocking.
How do you figure that? Air going from the bottom intakes to the rear vents requires traversing most of the case, including the CPU cooler, which is itself pretty close to the back. Have you done any tests with the rear closed off to support this idea?
Just so we're on the same page, by backside I meant the panel that covers the back of the motherboard and the PSU, not the rear 92mm exhaust.
And I haven't run tests, but I just figured, when air from the bottom intakes hits the GPU, it makes a 90 degree turn and disperses in all directions. Some of it gets lost through the front I/O gap, but that's still a relatively small amount, some of it gets lost thru the GPU/3rd slot vents (I have a solid PCIe bracket for my 3rd slot and solid grommets for the watercooling holes, so I've sealed those up), but then a significant amount gets lost though the backside vents, especially on the PSU side if you have an SFX PSU. You'd definitely get better bottom-to-top airflow with a solid back panel. Now, obviously this only applies to window panel builds, and I understand the case was not designed with a window panel in mind, but if you do have a window panel with the bottom being your main (or only) intake, then a sealed backside panel will make a lot of sense, in fact windowed M1s should ship with it by default IMO. Clearly, tests need to be run, but I think it's just common sense. I suspect a lot of M1s ship with window panels now, so this may be worth giving some consideration.
In reality, if your CPU cooler needs extra air, it will just get it from the top vent or a rear 92mm intake, but then you have to worry about dust management.
Ah, okay. The right side panel ventilation is what you're talking about. I'm actually considering adding even more ventilation to both side panels (well, both on the non-window version), to help with getting the GPU exhaust out of the system. That's something that people have requested for a long time, but early on I didn't want to do because of the greater potential for warping that punching all of those holes creates. However, sometime in the last few years LL acquired a press to flatten out the panels after the punching operation so it may be more viable now.
Of course, adding more holes to the side panels exacerbates the issue of air escaping before getting to the CPU. As you know, I designed the case around an airflow scheme that expects at least one intake fan on the side; the windowed panel was something I was never in favor of and w360 really had to do some convincing to get me to go along with, precisely because it defeats the original airflow scheme and trades performance for looks.
That said, I can appreciate giving people options. If it's any consolation, I'm working on opening up the floor of the case for more ventilation and at least semi-supporting 140mm fans there, which should help push more air up through the case.
Ok, I see. Also, I just realized some people use the right side panel vents for PSU intake, so they couldn't do that with a solid panel. IMO the case will definitely look worse with the side panels having more ventilation, but I guess it would get rid of GPU exhaust better. I guess the case was designed without much air channeling in mind, but rather with intakes providing direct air to whatever needs it and then exhaust finding its way out through whatever vent is closest.
I know you don't like the window panel, but it's what people want nowadays, and there isn't another option for a case this small that has a window. Moreover the M1 can actually do window panel pretty well despite not being designed for it, and a solid right panel would just be extra help in that, but I can see how it's a niche within a niche for not a ton of extra benefit. Unless it was another window panel...? Then you could have dual windows and better airflow, and make some extra money? I'm about 40% joking. I'd definitely buy it.
How are you going to fit 140mm fans on the bottom, I'd like to see that. Would be a great feature for future owners.
There's just enough space lengthwise for two 140mm fans, although two of the screw holes on the rearmost fan would be blocked off by the case feet.
Widthwise it's a little more problematic because of the side panel clips, which leave barely too little space at 138mm between them across the case. For most fans with open corners it's probably okay, but it could still be an issue for some. Hence why I say "semi-support."
Two of my old posts from the main M1 thread illustrate these topics:
Dual (slim) 140 mm fans on the bottom panel
Interference of the fan mounting holes with the rear case feet
Also, on the subject of solid vs. ventilation holes in the right side panel (behind the motherboard), many systems have M.2 SSDs mounted here and the nearby ventilation holes must be helping to keep the temperature of those devices down.
Right, I remember your post. Great work, I might do the same when I switch to the window panel. Those fans have super high CFM, 2 should provide enough air for the CPU cooler and PSU even with pressure escaping through the right side panel vents.
And regarding the panel, you'd get airflow from the bottom fans over those rear-mounted drives.