NCASE M1: a crowdfunded Mini-ITX case (updates in first post)

ipuoL said:
Xeons run on ITX Boards like Z87N from GB or other brands... As far as I know a b85 is enough to support Xeon CPUs
Click to expand...

So the socket "pinout" is the same for a 1150 and 2011? This is news to me for sure- I've never seen a Xeon in person to compare. Does this mean that 32gb of ECC RAM is possible on an itx board as well?
 
WiSK said:
My tracking info page show more than just "Acceptance: 30/Oct/2013 10:47". All other fields are blank. If all packages have shipped, shouldn't tracking info page show more than that?
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I'm looking at http://postserv.post.gov.tw/webpost/CSController?cmd=POS4007_1.
I got two acceptance entries at Oct/30/2013 11:58, Nov/05/2013 18:03, the office of destination and the despatch no. filled in but all the other entries are blank.
 
slabhatnik said:
So the socket "pinout" is the same for a 1150 and 2011? This is news to me for sure- I've never seen a Xeon in person to compare. Does this mean that 32gb of ECC RAM is possible on an itx board as well?
Click to expand...

No, the socket is different, but there are some Xeons that are made for LGA1150. The E3-1220v3 for instance.

cowsgomoo said:
I'm looking at http://postserv.post.gov.tw/webpost/CSController?cmd=POS4007_1.
I got two acceptance entries at Oct/30/2013 11:58, Nov/05/2013 18:03, the office of destination and the despatch no. filled in but all the other entries are blank.
Click to expand...

I'm looking at the same tracking website. I wasn't worried, because I thought the boat to the Netherlands might just be leaving later, but now W360 they are all shipped I guess there is something wrong.
 
Shipping info from USPS:

My case was accepted Oct 30, then was processed through a sort facility on Oct 31 in KEELUNG

Shipping info from post.gov.tw:

Shows acceptance on Oct 30 & 31
office of destination Jersey USA
 
WiSK said:
My tracking info page show more than just "Acceptance: 30/Oct/2013 10:47". All other fields are blank. If all packages have shipped, shouldn't tracking info page show more than that?
Click to expand...
I have the exact same info, and also from the Netherlands. If it was one of us only that had this info I could imagine that that package failed to scan or something, but since we both have nothing more than the acceptance date (and presumably the rest of us Dutchies) I'm a bit more worried about it...

Acceptance date and time are identical for our cases though :p
 
Geoffrey4283 said:
If the Bitspower variant doesn't float your boat... happened to run across this:
900x900px-LL-23a00b38_EK-FB-ASUS-M6I_2_1200.jpeg

[source: http://www.overclock.net/t/993624/ek-club/700#post_21049559]

EK is making a FC WB for the Impact, and from the pictures, it at least appears to address some of your original concerns (specifically, that the inlet is directly over the CPU; can't actually see what the water channels are like underneath, and I can't quite wrap my head around the flow pattern to the outlet.

Later post indicates that they're getting ready to make them available for purchase, Thurs-Fri of this week [source: http://www.overclock.net/t/993624/ek-club/1100#post_21188308]
Click to expand...

It addresses every concern about it, because what this picture shows is a conventional cpu-block design integrated into a fullcover block.

This is how it works. Water gets in through the middle inlet. There is a nozzle in there (just like in the EK cpu blocks... since its using their very same design) that accelerates water for maximum turbulence (and performance). Then, judging by the water channels I think I see, water passes through the cpu block, then goes to the left close to the I/O panel. Afterwards, water passes between the cpu block and the ram, goes to the daughter board then leaves.
 
Geoffrey4283 said:
If the Bitspower variant doesn't float your boat... happened to run across this:
900x900px-LL-23a00b38_EK-FB-ASUS-M6I_2_1200.jpeg

[source: http://www.overclock.net/t/993624/ek-club/700#post_21049559]

EK is making a FC WB for the Impact, and from the pictures, it at least appears to address some of your original concerns (specifically, that the inlet is directly over the CPU; can't actually see what the water channels are like underneath, and I can't quite wrap my head around the flow pattern to the outlet.

Later post indicates that they're getting ready to make them available for purchase, Thurs-Fri of this week [source: http://www.overclock.net/t/993624/ek-club/1100#post_21188308]
Click to expand...

Its very cool, but there sure is a lot of gasket surface area.
 
slabhatnik said:
Is there an itx MB that accepts a Xeon cpu?! I always thought that Xeon cpus are only usable on ATX or EATX motherboards.... Does this mean that you also have a MB in mind that supports more than 16 GB of RAM, and also fits the M1?
Click to expand...
most of the higher end 1150 skt boards will accept the the v3 E3 Xeon chips, some of which have no GPU others now do.
And as i have no intention of overclocking, the Xeon for me makes sense considering the costs



chx said:
Skott said:
IIRC there are no mitx mobos that accept Xeons. You need something bigger like a workstation mobo or a server mobo I think.
Click to expand...

Fruergaard from overclock.net took the small (two slot, FlexATX, isn't it?) LGA 2011 motherboard from a Shuttle SX79R5 and built it into a Bitfenix Prodigy. http://www.overclock.net/t/1304413/...x79-and-crossfire-in-a-white-bitfenix-prodigy
Click to expand...

That was one hell of a build i have to admit i was impressed, full 2011 socket setup, and dual loop, hats off to the guy, he did well.
But not all Xeon's are 2011 skt, the E3 range follow the i5/i7 socket protocol/format



ipuoL said:
Xeons run on ITX Boards like Z87N from GB or other brands... As far as I know a b85 is enough to support Xeon CPUs
Click to expand...

yup, that sounds about right, although i would not go down as low in the range as B series chipsets



slabhatnik said:
So the socket "pinout" is the same for a 1150 and 2011? This is news to me for sure- I've never seen a Xeon in person to compare. Does this mean that 32gb of ECC RAM is possible on an itx board as well?
Click to expand...

No, the E3 Xeon range shares the same socket as Haswell, Current Xeon E3 range, v3 release table is the image below
Not sure about the ECC Ram, in theory i think the z87 chipsets are capable of it, but it's down to specific vendor choices. some might have and not had it certified, much in the same way as 99% of the 1150 boards will support the Xeon, but the manufacturers see no need in the home desktop market to pay Intel for the certification ;)
The question of 32GB of RAM is again a bit up in the air, my laptop for example, according to Dell, you can fit only 16GB of DDR3 - it currently has 32GB of Corsair Vengeance DDR3 in it, the reason Dell wont say yes or no, is because at the time they got all their specifications, and certifications sorted, 8GB Sodimm modules either didn't exist, or were stoooopidly expensive, so, it was a gamble when they became available and at a manageable price, and as mITX boards only carry 2 Dimm slots, you either pray someone makes a DTX board with 4 slots, or we start getting 16GB modules soon, but, i think those for the home market are likely to be not so profitable, because windows basic versions are limited in the amount of RAM they can carry, and if you have 4 modules at 16GB, that 64GB will exceed what most copies of windows can handle due to restrictions imposed on it by M$ (EDIT: although i hear now that Windows8 can handle 128GB vs the 32GB Win7 Home Premium was restricted to)

Click the image to go to the Intel page regarding the range

​



WiSK said:
No, the socket is different, but there are some Xeons that are made for LGA1150. The E3-1220v3 for instance.
Click to expand...

:D Beat me to it, WiSK is of course correct, and the 1230 is the one i am likely to end up with, because after that there is a pretty steep price hike, not to mention an availability issue here in the uk, although if i had the choice i'd probably take either the 1240 or 1245
To give you some idea, i can buy a Xeon E3 1230 v3 right now for £189.59 whereas the i7-4770 would set me back £221.99 so that equates to a nice little saving for me, for pretty much the same chip.
They also do some pretty low power consuming versions too, but i never really pay much attention to them, i wanna save power, i'll turn the PC off !!



adamantium said:
Geoffrey4283 said:
If the Bitspower variant doesn't float your boat... happened to run across this:
900x900px-LL-23a00b38_EK-FB-ASUS-M6I_2_1200.jpeg

[source: http://www.overclock.net/t/993624/ek-club/700#post_21049559]

EK is making a FC WB for the Impact, and from the pictures, it at least appears to address some of your original concerns (specifically, that the inlet is directly over the CPU; can't actually see what the water channels are like underneath, and I can't quite wrap my head around the flow pattern to the outlet.

Later post indicates that they're getting ready to make them available for purchase, Thurs-Fri of this week [source: http://www.overclock.net/t/993624/ek-club/1100#post_21188308]
Click to expand...

Its very cool, but there sure is a lot of gasket surface area.
Click to expand...

Not to mention just how you would get the RAM in and out, if the clips engage on pushing the modules in, then your gonna have fun releasing them, likewise if you have to latch them into place :p
or are those a different type of latch at the VRM board end ?
 
prava said:
It addresses every concern about it, because what this picture shows is a conventional cpu-block design integrated into a fullcover block.

This is how it works. Water gets in through the middle inlet. There is a nozzle in there (just like in the EK cpu blocks... since its using their very same design) that accelerates water for maximum turbulence (and performance). Then, judging by the water channels I think I see, water passes through the cpu block, then goes to the left close to the I/O panel. Afterwards, water passes between the cpu block and the ram, goes to the daughter board then leaves.
Click to expand...



So, I'm pretty much with you on all of the above (red is down/toward the MB, green is up/away, blues are horizontal waterflow, with darker being lower, lighter being higher). What I can't quite figure out is whether or not the channels allow flow through the orange/yellow box. It seems like it shouldn't, but I don't see anything preventing it (and that would seem bad to me). I have to assume that either my assumption is wrong that allowing flow through there would be bad, or I'm just not seeing how the block prevents it from doing so. I should probably direct my question to the source forum, but I don't have an account over there, and speculation is so much more entertaining (read: time-wasting)!

And adamantium, I count 4 different seals! Quite a few potential points of failure, no?
 
The_Gunslinger said:
Not to mention just how you would get the RAM in and out, if the clips engage on pushing the modules in, then your gonna have fun releasing them, likewise if you have to latch them into place :p
or are those a different type of latch at the VRM board end ?
Click to expand...

I had never noticed that before when looking at the M6I, thinking it was almost like they popped off part of the clip to make the block install. But, I went to find stock images of the board, and they have the same deal. The block seems to hang over the clips a little bit more than the stock heatsink, but the clips themselves are that way to begin with.
 
Geoffrey4283 said:
What I can't quite figure out is whether or not the channels allow flow through the orange/yellow box. It seems like it shouldn't, but I don't see anything preventing it (and that would seem bad to me). I have to assume that either my assumption is wrong that allowing flow through there would be bad, or I'm just not seeing how the block prevents it from doing so. I should probably direct my question to the source forum, but I don't have an account over there, and speculation is so much more entertaining (read: time-wasting)!
Click to expand...

It could be a parallel flow. Seen this done by Swiftech in the past. CPU block had 1 inlet, and 3 outlets, one going back to GPU(s)/main loop, one to chipset, one to VRMs, all meeting back at the reservoir. It allows the chipset and VRM channels to be high restriction without seriously impeding overall flow.
 
TurpoUrpo said:
Hmh. Where u would fit that pump in M1?
Click to expand...

Adamantium's suggestion when discussing the bitspower block: mount a DDC to the inside of the radiator

I'd think you'd just have to be wary of fan thickness + rad thickness + DDC height + Waterblock height + space for fittings and tubing, and making sure that all fit within the M1's constraints. This EK FCWB seems taller to me than the Bitspower one did, and taller than the average CPU WB, so I'm not to the point of making an educated guess of whether that configuration would fit.
 
wonder how that water block copes with the extra modules the impact board has, i'm guessing it'll all be a bit of a snug fit, and cable connections are all good ??
 
i can't seem to find my tracking number on ncases.com when i log into my account. does this mean my case hasn't been shipped yet or just that the status of my order hasn't been updated?
 
The_Gunslinger said:
Not to mention just how you would get the RAM in and out, if the clips engage on pushing the modules in, then your gonna have fun releasing them, likewise if you have to latch them into place :p
or are those a different type of latch at the VRM board end ?
Click to expand...
The right latches aren't latches but just retainers, they don't flip open. These are one-sided-latching RAM slots.
 
The_Gunslinger said:
wonder how that water block copes with the extra modules the impact board has, i'm guessing it'll all be a bit of a snug fit, and cable connections are all good ??
Click to expand...

Asked the guy that designed it about a couple potential pain points; he confirmed that it is made to support the SupremeFX daughterboard, and that an M.2/NGFF should fit (as the stock heatsink and the PCH/SB portion of the waterblock are essentially the same height). The only thing he isn't certain about is whether the audio headers on the daughtercard clear the top of the block; he's going to check when he's back to work tomorrow.
 
Geoffrey4283 said:
Asked the guy that designed it about a couple potential pain points; he confirmed that it is made to support the SupremeFX daughterboard, and that an M.2/NGFF should fit (as the stock heatsink and the PCH/SB portion of the waterblock are essentially the same height). The only thing he isn't certain about is whether the audio headers on the daughtercard clear the top of the block; he's going to check when he's back to work tomorrow.
Click to expand...

I don't think it will fit without modification of the audio pins or the use of a very low profile plug. The reason is that the audio plug extends above the highest sata port plug, and in the picture we can see that the block comes down to the top of that sata port. Now it might fit if the block thickness is lower than the audio plug distance from the motherboard, but that also looks to be not the case. The water block height appears to be a hair less than the top of the power board sink and that appears to be nearly the same height as the display port/hdmi/spdif-out box which is higher than the network box.

If you could find a 90 degree 10-pin IDC cable (and maybe cut/shorten the pins) then it would probably fit great. Here are some examples:

http://www.cablestogo.com/product/02140
http://www.topmicrousa.com/idc-10-connector.html
http://asia-atom.en.alibaba.com/product/431588654-209981690/IDC_CABLE_2_54mm_10P_FD_L_399mm.html

No matter what you may have to install the audio plug before installing the daughter board. Maybe you can get the designer to include the correct cable as part of the product.
 
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WiSK said:
It could be a parallel flow. Seen this done by Swiftech in the past. CPU block had 1 inlet, and 3 outlets, one going back to GPU(s)/main loop, one to chipset, one to VRMs, all meeting back at the reservoir. It allows the chipset and VRM channels to be high restriction without seriously impeding overall flow.
Click to expand...

Geoffrey4283 said:
Asked the guy that designed it ...
Click to expand...

He also confirmed the parallel flow :)

Tiborr said:
Yes, you have guessed it correctly - the flow gets paralleled, majority goes directly to the outlet while some of the water is diverted through SB (PCH) and MOSFETs.
Click to expand...
 
darxider said:
i can't seem to find my tracking number on ncases.com when i log into my account. does this mean my case hasn't been shipped yet or just that the status of my order hasn't been updated?
Click to expand...

Wahaha said all cases shipped now. Could be it just hasnt updated yet. Maybe because of the weekend? I'd check again on Monday before getting concerned.
 
Skott said:
Wahaha said all cases shipped now. Could be it just hasnt updated yet. Maybe because of the weekend? I'd check again on Monday before getting concerned.
Click to expand...

shipped also could mean, that they are for several weeks in a container shipping through an ocean ;)
 
Ok guys, all the cases were shipped at the same time. Whether you have your tracking number or not has NOTHING to do with how far along your package is. Also the tracking status is quite out of date anyways, so even if you have your tracking number, there isn't much use of it at this point anyways. USPS will probably have SOME updates once it gets into the basic domestic mail system, but until then we just have to wait.
 
milkcow said:
shipped also could mean, that they are for several weeks in a container shipping through an ocean ;)
Click to expand...

okwchin said:
At least their moving in somewhat the right direction
Click to expand...

extide said:
Ok guys, all the cases were shipped at the same time. Whether you have your tracking number or not has NOTHING to do with how far along your package is. Also the tracking status is quite out of date anyways, so even if you have your tracking number, there isn't much use of it at this point anyways. USPS will probably have SOME updates once it gets into the basic domestic mail system, but until then we just have to wait.
Click to expand...

Our cases are on the proverbial "slow boat from China". There will be no updates until they arrive in the US (or wherever)- if then - that is if one of the postal workers isn't too lazy to scan the packages into the system.

Many of us still have a while to wait.

I am going to wait 'til at least December 1 to start hitting "refresh" every ten minutes on the USPS Tracking page, lol.:)
 
GBH2 said:
I am going to wait 'til at least December 1 to start hitting "refresh" every ten minutes on the USPS Tracking page, lol.:)
Click to expand...

Nah. Just once in the morning and once at night for both USPS & the iPOST site, until I see a change in status.. then back to every 10 minutes ;)
 
Thanks for the info regarding Xeon and ECC RAM WiSK and Gunslinger. It's an interesting idea to go with Xeon and have the potential to use server ram at 32GB- If it were easy and sure to work I might consider parting with my current 'mothership' build and use my Ncase M1 as the new 'mothership'....

I like my 32gig rig a lot and even though I'll be replacing it on my main desktop with the M1 build, I want to keep the system in house as my [H]ard process rig for those times when a mixdown, vid conversion or batch process is going to need all the power that I couldn't cram into the M1/ITX form. Seems like an expensive maybe to try the Xeon and ECC RAM, so I'll wait it out awhile; hopefully we see a few 16 gig modules come online within the year.

I thought Windows 7 Home supported only 16GB RAM, and Ultimate is where it recognized 32GB.... This was my experience- but I've only really owned Ultimate and use it exclusively for gaming, OSX is my primary os.

What MB are you thinking of using with the Xeon?
 
commander_ said:
Woah... that's unreal... :eek:
Click to expand...
I'm not surprised actually. This case has generated true excitement and the opportunity to buy it was just a small window.... all the while this discussion has continued, and anyone reading any part of it without a M1 order placed really has the potential to want it to the point where 4 or 5 times the original price is still reasonable. I mean this thing is so freakin nifty and nothing like it exists nor may for some time to come!

If I had a second, say silver, to go with my ordered black, I'd keep it. If I had a third M1, black or silver, to just put up on ebay, I'd be tempted to start at 800- even though it's gouging- we've just seen it happen.... and that'd pay for a nice new 780ti no prob.
 
zyler said:
I don't know how people get themselves to do this...
Sell others work for profit. Douchebags.
Click to expand...
Necere and W360 didn't object to people buying multiple copies of the case in order to sell the extras later. I don't think they mind, though I can't speak for them directly.

In other news, work on my M1 has come to a halt since I got a new job and now have to move from Florida to California. The M1 went back into the box with a PSU, Blu-ray drive and package of ram inside it. I'll probably finish it up later next year when I get some spare money to burn. Moving across the entire country is kinda expensive. :X
 
M4rk said:
In other news, work on my M1 has come to a halt since I got a new job and now have to move from Florida to California. The M1 went back into the box with a PSU, Blu-ray drive and package of ram inside it. I'll probably finish it up later next year when I get some spare money to burn. Moving across the entire country is kinda expensive. :X
Click to expand...

Bring her with you. :(
 
xbeater said:
I have the exact same info, and also from the Netherlands. If it was one of us only that had this info I could imagine that that package failed to scan or something, but since we both have nothing more than the acceptance date (and presumably the rest of us Dutchies) I'm a bit more worried about it...

Acceptance date and time are identical for our cases though :p
Click to expand...

Same here, but i'm from germany. "Acceptance Oct/30/2013 10:32" and nothing else on the ipost page.

The tracking information on the german DHL page says, that the package arrived in the start-packet center at the above mentioned date and time. Since then, no updates.

The DHL info package about china / taiwan shipments says, it should normally only take about 8 - 12 working days (with saturday?) to arrive (without customs) - and that was something like the 12th last week...
 
at0m33 said:
Same here, but i'm from germany. "Acceptance Oct/30/2013 10:32" and nothing else on the ipost page.

The tracking information on the german DHL page says, that the package arrived in the start-packet center at the above mentioned date and time. Since then, no updates.

The DHL info package about china / taiwan shipments says, it should normally only take about 8 - 12 working days (with saturday?) to arrive (without customs) - and that was something like the 12th last week...
Click to expand...
Wouldn't be surprised if somebody stole it. My experiences with German DHL are one disappeared 1.2K € mountain bike and one DSLR camera equipment delivered to totally different person in other country... :(

Let's hope this is not similar case.
 
mine hasn't arrived either, so i wouldn't worry that is has been stolen. i'd rather suspect that the cases were literally shipped :D
 
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