More DLSS...

lopoetve

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TBH, a few games (Control for example) actually looked better at 4k with quality DLSS vs. Native resolution. If it comes down to DLSS vs. TAA, I pick DLSS anyday for both image quality and performance.
This was my experience. I don’t know about looked better, but on a 3080, I was up near my 120hz refresh with DLSS... and I’m good with that.
 

reaper12

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I don't know why some people lose their minds when the phrase "better than Native" is used about DLSS. Yes the original DLSS was bad, but DLSS 2.0 is much better. And surely when people say "better than Native" you have to ask what they mean by Native.

For me DLSS 2.0 has been better than Native in every game that I have tried. And by Native I mean Native with no AA applied or Native with TAA/FXAA applied.

Native without any AA applied, no can't stand the jaggies.
Native with TAA - TAA can be terrible but some implementations are ok.
Native with FXAA - Blurry mess.

DLSS 2.0 solves the first problem without the limitations of the second two solutions. So it looks better and has better performance.

Does it look better than Native with better forms of AA applied, nope, but it was never meant to.
 

Furious Nerd

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TBH, a few games (Control for example) actually looked better at 4k with quality DLSS vs. Native resolution. If it comes down to DLSS vs. TAA, I pick DLSS anyday for both image quality and performance.
I just bought Control a couple days ago. How do you selected "quality" DLSS? There is only a simple binary checkbox for DLSS on/off for me in the game
 

Aireoth

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TBH, a few games (Control for example) actually looked better at 4k with quality DLSS vs. Native resolution. If it comes down to DLSS vs. TAA, I pick DLSS anyday for both image quality and performance.
IIRC you can pick aliasing in control, which means you can get superior image quality than both taa or dlss.
 

Aireoth

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I don't know why some people lose their minds when the phrase "better than Native" is used about DLSS. Yes the original DLSS was bad, but DLSS 2.0 is much better. And surely when people say "better than Native" you have to ask what they mean by Native.

For me DLSS 2.0 has been better than Native in every game that I have tried. And by Native I mean Native with no AA applied or Native with TAA/FXAA applied.

Native without any AA applied, no can't stand the jaggies.
Native with TAA - TAA can be terrible but some implementations are ok.
Native with FXAA - Blurry mess.

DLSS 2.0 solves the first problem without the limitations of the second two solutions. So it looks better and has better performance.

Does it look better than Native with better forms of AA applied, nope, but it was never meant to.

Because the phrase is marketing junk thrown out to sell a product, there is no qualifier, no follow up, no better than TAA/FXAA, just better than native and a staunch insistence from some that it is universally true regardless of other options (MSAA).
 

oldmanbal

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I just bought Control a couple days ago. How do you selected "quality" DLSS? There is only a simple binary checkbox for DLSS on/off for me in the game
wasn't control an early release of DLSS before they had more options for how much of a sacrifice you were willing to make for visuals in the quest for more frames? It might only have limited DLSS options, but you can modify the resolution scaling which will also significantly impact both fps and image quality.
 

Viper87227

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wasn't control an early release of DLSS before they had more options for how much of a sacrifice you were willing to make for visuals in the quest for more frames? It might only have limited DLSS options, but you can modify the resolution scaling which will also significantly impact both fps and image quality.
Control released with the original DLSS, but it was updated to DLSS 2.0. I guess they never actually updated it fully to have quality, balanced, and performance mods. My guess is it just defaults to one of those. It's still DLSS 2.0 though.
 

LukeTbk

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I don't know why some people lose their minds when the phrase "better than Native" is used about DLSS. Yes the original DLSS was bad, but DLSS 2.0 is much better. And surely when people say "better than Native" you have to ask what they mean by Native.
I think some think/have a mental imagine that DLSS was trained with the 4K native footage of the very game DLSS is currently running and trying is best to reproduce that from a lower resolution source, making it possible to ever be has good and certainly not better.

And not that it is train from rendering that have 16 time more pixel than 4K and trying to reach that, making it possible/probable to have things that it know well and "easily" to predict like text and building lines look better when the image is stable at least and that the numbers of things that will look better than native will growth over time.
 

III_Slyflyer_III

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I just bought Control a couple days ago. How do you selected "quality" DLSS? There is only a simple binary checkbox for DLSS on/off for me in the game
What resolution do you game at? For me at 4k with DLSS on, I had 3 render resolution choices for DLSS under my base resolution (monitor), which were essentially Quality, Balanced and Performance.

Make sure your game is updated, as DLSS 2.0 is supported on it now, not that 1.9 garbage it had before.
 

Furious Nerd

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What resolution do you game at? For me at 4k with DLSS on, I had 3 render resolution choices for DLSS under my base resolution (monitor), which were essentially Quality, Balanced and Performance.

Make sure your game is updated, as DLSS 2.0 is supported on it now, not that 1.9 garbage it had before.
Ah! You could look at the render resolutions in that way, I suppose. Not sure what differentiates quality/balanced/performance otherwise (am new to the world)
 

III_Slyflyer_III

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Ah! You could look at the render resolutions in that way, I suppose. Not sure what differentiates quality/balanced/performance otherwise (am new to the world)
They typically list it with those names, but in control its a little more transparent and you can see the resolutions DLSS uses. So the higher the DLSS resolution, the higher the quality.
 

Sycraft

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And remember- static images are not motion. I notice DLSS standing there. Most games, you don’t stand there the entire time. You are doing things.::
For sure. For me TAA is like that but the opposite. You look at screen shots and say "Man, that looks good with TAA. Little blurring maybe, kinda like FXAA, but smooth overall. Probably a good tradeoff." However then in a game, in motion, it becomes so much more noticeable, and I don't like it and disable it. While screenshots are useful for doing comparisons because, let's face it, with the compression on videos they just aren't that useful we do need to remember that a game in motion is really where it matters. I don't mind something that looks impressive when you are snooping around, zooming in on textures and standing still, but that isn't how we play games. The important part is how it looks during gameplay.
 

Furious Nerd

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I think I developed an easy system to find what graphical settings work best for you:
turn everything down except resolution to lowest settings, then play around with the texture related settings first, see if the performance/quality tradeoffs are for you and pick the highest you can settle on
then just play with the rest of the settings one by one and see if you even like the addition of things like motion blur, blooms, AA methods, etc.

It's a lot easier and more productive doing lowest->highest, then going in reverse, I find.
 

noko

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My first take with DLSS:

In Control version 1.13, at 1440p, Max settings, no film grain or motion blur, RT max, system in sig:
  • Performance, FPS goes up around 120fps with DLSS at max rendering resolution, presume Quality mode, without DLSS FPS is around 80fps -> this is with max RT quality
  • Finding DLSS a mixed bag, particularly specular highlights has gross constant moving noise which is distracting
  • Hair is rendered better with DLSS, cleaner
  • Text is worst with DLSS, which is interesting, text can be blurry until motion and then it cleans up, delayed action but more noticeable than rendering at native resolution or 1440p
  • Game uses MSAA unless DLSS is selected. By turning MSAA down you get some performance back. Not sure if game has some other form of AA since aliasing is not bad even with MSAA turned off. Anyways about 10fps increase with MSAA off, 90fps.
  • There can be flickering lines or objects that are vertical which when DLSS is turned off goes away
  • Mostly the added noise or artifacts using DLSS I find distracting enough to not use DLSS in this game, I am sure others would not even notice this but maybe something else. Since performance is fine without it for this title at this resolution, I just leave it off
I will be testing Control at 4K as well since I have a 4K monitor hooked up to the 3090 as well, just have not gotten around to it.

In Metro Exodos, 1440p, Ultra settings, Ultra RT, DLSS causes a performance loss??? Just using the benchmark tool which makes no sense to me what is going on in this case. Have not tried it in the game. Save that for later.
 
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