HardOCP News
[H] News
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Whether or not you are a fan of Linux, this article has some very valid points and is certainly worth checking out.
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Linux Is Not A "Second String" Operating System
- Thread starter HardOCP News
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DustMite
Limp Gawd
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If Linux had support for gaming, I wonder if more people would make the switch.
DocFaustus
2[H]4U
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That was the worst written article on a relevant topic I have seen in a long time. It offers no supporting facts to bolster its case. It offers no ideas or concepts to help achieve the stated goal. A random dump of non-cohesive thoughts cobbled together without regard to the title. Intentional misspellings that are meant to look cool but don't. gamerz gamerz gamerz...
I think what you meant to say was "If developers and publishers thought they could make money on Linux ports, they would do it already."
Something isn't better just because it's open source.
"Now, apparently, PC gaming is cool. Who can keep up with what's cool anymore? I had a friend who collected vintage game consoles--his favorites were from Japan. Not sure why I told you that--I guess I thought I'd throw it in for free. (Josh, if you're reading this, save me.)"
I agree... not sure exactly what points were considered noteworthy.
I'm sure there are lots of people that would in the enthusiast community. Several people have indicated in the linux forums that the only thing holding them back from using it full full support for gaming.
DeathPrincess
Fully [H]
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Linux supporters don't want it to be popular. If it gets simple to use, and user friendly, it gets hatred (Ubuntu), if it isn't user friendly, only 3 people are going to use it.
Somethings "mainstreamness" is very important when considering cost effectiveness. Make something for Windows and if 1 out of a million buy, you've got over a million sold. One out of a million buy it on Linux and you are probably out of buisness. Linux is way more risky for mainstream software, especially big budget software like AAA games. It would be like Shenmue, they ended up needing every DC owner to buy it several times to turn a profit.
Somethings "mainstreamness" is very important when considering cost effectiveness. Make something for Windows and if 1 out of a million buy, you've got over a million sold. One out of a million buy it on Linux and you are probably out of buisness. Linux is way more risky for mainstream software, especially big budget software like AAA games. It would be like Shenmue, they ended up needing every DC owner to buy it several times to turn a profit.
Whoah, now that is an interesting article..
Every time someone posts the terms "linux" and "gaming" in one sentence I dismiss the post/article as troll.
Also, in reply to the "BIG three", there are no BIG three, there's Windows and some fringe elements of the industry are porting their games to Mac but that doesn't turn Mac OS into a BIG operating system.
Games run on Windows, consoles, and iOS/Android (different quality of games for mobile ofc).
Also, in reply to the "BIG three", there are no BIG three, there's Windows and some fringe elements of the industry are porting their games to Mac but that doesn't turn Mac OS into a BIG operating system.
Games run on Windows, consoles, and iOS/Android (different quality of games for mobile ofc).
DeathPrincess
Fully [H]
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Thats an old game based off a modified OpenGL engine (ID tech 2) which uses dated DX9 (not 11), that they spent months and months optimizing back to OpenGL. Developers aren't going to bother spending months and months one each title, to sell to 5 people.
Valve have Steam propping up their asses so they can spend time doing non buisness sense things, other developers, not so much.
Ubuntu got hatred for choices they made in regards to the OS, and a lot of it from the change to Unity, not for being user friendly, and it's why mint is so popular now as the newbies desktop of choice... they took ubuntu and reversed the decisions people hated.
tho on the flip side myself i could never use a "user friendly" version of linux, but that's mostly because I tinker to much and enjoy the off beaten path like e17 for my window manager instead of the big boys kde or gnome.
thewooster
Gawd
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This is true. I use both windows and Linux, but I can never seeing a true linux distribution being used by the main populous, if for no other reason than most people are and always will be, computer illiterate.
The only thing that holds developers back from doing Linux ports is DirectX. Bring DirectX support to Linux, and it would be super easy to compile it to run on Linux and Windows with very little change in code.
The video card drivers would have to take it up a notch though before this was feasable.
The video card drivers would have to take it up a notch though before this was feasable.
How is an old API on Linux any different than the majority of equivalently crappy old API DX9-based games released on Windows?
The point is that the performance is there and actually better than the Windows performance on an API that works on both platforms. It's to encourage use of openGL rather than a proprietary DX9, bypassing the need to port anything.
Tried a distro recently? Actually they are... My personal impression was that there is no middle ground. It's either extremely simple if you don't venture outside of what is bundled in the distro or available through the repository. If you need to do anything outside of that, well that's where it gets complicated and more advanced (ie anything command line or getting software to work that isn't in the repository)
Unreal engine is directx/opengl, source is directx/opengl, cryengine is directx/opengl .... the PS3 uses opengl for all it's games already so the developers have it down pat just like directx, and it is not as much work as people think to port them to linux, the developers just chose not to.
dgingeri
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The big problem with gaming on Linux is that there are so many different distros that do so many things differently that game developers would have to have several different builds to get them to work with "Linux". Keeping up with bugs on a Windows build alone is trouble enough. Trying to work out the bugs on 5 different Linux builds on top of it? That would cost a fortune.
ballistic90
2[H]4U
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Linux is exciting in its own right, but definitely not because of its capacity for gaming.
I'm really not sure linux gaming would really take off anyways. Not everyone running Linux wants to spend money on games for it in the first place. The same could be said of Windows users, but there's many, many more Windows users than Linux users.
I'm really not sure linux gaming would really take off anyways. Not everyone running Linux wants to spend money on games for it in the first place. The same could be said of Windows users, but there's many, many more Windows users than Linux users.
Also, let's not forgot about that whole steam box console we were hearing of a while ago.
What does the sudden interest in Linux / Open GL from Valve say between the lines. Honestly when I first heard about a steam box, I figured no way Microsoft is going to license a trimmed down version of their OS so that Valve can use DirectX games and compete with their own console (xbox).
Seriously, consider the possibility here. Valve could develop their own distro, to use on their own hardware, that comes bundled with steam, to play PC games.
What does the sudden interest in Linux / Open GL from Valve say between the lines. Honestly when I first heard about a steam box, I figured no way Microsoft is going to license a trimmed down version of their OS so that Valve can use DirectX games and compete with their own console (xbox).
Seriously, consider the possibility here. Valve could develop their own distro, to use on their own hardware, that comes bundled with steam, to play PC games.
Pick one. That easy.
You're also exaggerating the issues. Linux, all of Linux, is based off of one kernel. That's what defines a Linux OS. The difference is mainly in the package management and GUI, which really don't affect game developers much at all.
"Porting" would be something like Windows desktop to Windows Metro. That would require a complete port, recompile, and a whole lot of work because they're essentially two different OSes. Linux, regardless of the distro, all runs off the same kernel and is very similar for game developers.
false... no matter how many "distros" there are, they all come down to needing the same 2-3 libraries...the mesa libraries for opengl, and either alsa or oss sound libraries... and if a distro is missing it, installing these days is as easy as clicking a button. Games could even come with it pre-packaged just like directx.
DarkStar_WNY
2[H]4U
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Exactly!
The last numbers I saw had Windows, of one flavor or another, holding just over 92% of the desktop OS market share, Mac OS having just under 7% and Linux having less then 1% (some reports claim they finally broke 1% with others claiming the numbers showing that were "tweaked.")
It's only been recently that Mac has recieved any significant love from the PC gaming industry, although even this support is very limited is it truely realistic to expect an OS with 1/7 the share of the Mac platform to get widespread gaming support?
I like the idea of Linux and see it as a good thing.
It's just then when you need support and have to ask for help...like throwing yourself to the wolves. Not nice.
We always get told to "come on in the linux water is great!" and then when you do, you tend to get treated with disdain and contempt. Linux support material or tutorials always seem to not bother to include what would be the first two pages because they assume you have been using it for at least a year.
The worst thing about Linux is the user/support base. Just not a friendly place to be.
I now expect a ream of posts exactly proving my point.
It's just then when you need support and have to ask for help...like throwing yourself to the wolves. Not nice.
We always get told to "come on in the linux water is great!" and then when you do, you tend to get treated with disdain and contempt. Linux support material or tutorials always seem to not bother to include what would be the first two pages because they assume you have been using it for at least a year.
The worst thing about Linux is the user/support base. Just not a friendly place to be.
I now expect a ream of posts exactly proving my point.
Because there's no money to be made. As a sweeping generalization open source zealots are not going to fork out $60 for a closed source game even if it runs on their beloved LOLnix flavor.
Have you tried any of the newer Ubuntu releases?
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Most likely. I would certainly consider it (unless gaming performance was less than on Windows).
most likely right, but not so sure on it... just going by myself I happily pay $60 for closed source games once I know for sure they'll run fine under wine... and i'd be even more happy to pay if I knew it would run natively... but I can't speak for all linux users, and i'm sure some would boycott the idea of paying for anything just like some windows users.
Indie bundles do extremely well on Linux. And when they had the "pay what you want" for a package of games it turned out the Linux users paid disproportionately higher than anyone else.
It's the stigma that's the issue. And the idiotic comments based on false info... like this, for example:
That's 3 stupid uneducated baseless remarks in only a portion of a sentence. See what I mean?
It's a perpetual chicken vs egg debate. Developers/publishers haven't traditionally supported Linux because there aren't enough gamers on Linux, and gamers haven't switched to Linux because there isn't enough support from developers/publishers.
I'll probably never move away from Windows, personally. Windows has always been my primary OS. I used to dual boot but nowadays I run Ubuntu under a VM for the times I need it.
wonderfield
Supreme [H]ardness
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No, it's more work than people think.
And in other news regarding Valve / Steambox / and Linux...
http://www.theverge.com/2012/5/1/2990867/steam-box-linux
http://www.theverge.com/2012/5/1/2990867/steam-box-linux
The stigma didn't create itself out of thin air, it's based on perceived reality.
Selling a couple thousand indie bundles doesn't compare to millions of copies of AAA PC titles sold.
This. I use Windows and Linux and Linux is still years away from mainstream. After you install Windows, everything usually works fine and you can navigate the internet, play games, use software. Now, with Linux, well not so easy. Not even in Ubuntu.
I'll just give an example why Linux need to go a long way before it can become mainstream:
When I installed the last version of Ubuntu on my workstation (as I could not stand working with Win XP anymore - and I won't get a new Win 7 machine for a couple of months), things did not work at start. For the software repository to work I had to manually configure apt-get files, ntlmaps and a couple of other things. I can not imagine a non-tech-literate user doing this so he can have access to the internet, software or other features (and I haven't even touched things like configuring peripherals that are not pre-configured in the install). Can anyone here imagine an average user having to manually editing files in /etc so he can run Steam if he encounters issues?
Also, you won't see Dell, HP, Acer, Lenovo selling Linux machines (with the exception of Enterprise contracts). Linux support is much more expensive than Windows.