LG 48CX

shadow2761

Limp Gawd
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Mar 11, 2016
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So is Rtings getting a 48" LG to test the speed of the display?

Because @ 11ms, I don't feel like buying CX48 just yet. If future firmwires improve the lag to around 6ms I would definitely want it then.

Also wasn't last year c9 much faster input lag, from memory I think the c9 was around 6-7ms?
 

Murzilka

Gawd
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946
The CX48 (and C9) can do 1440p 120hz with current tech. Anyone compared it to a G-sync monitor? Is there a difference in smoothness and in what favor?
 

kalston

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Rtings are getting a 48" to test it as a "monitor" they said.

I find it strange that they measured 11ms at 4k and lower lag at a lower res even though the TV has to upscale it... In practice 4k120hz feels perfect and certainly doesn't make me play "worse" in competitive games.
 

elvn

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I keep having an issue where I exit a game and get a black screen. I can’t do anything but reboot the PC to get a picture back. TV still works menus and all. But nothing from the PC, till reboot. Let it sit a few minutes and still nothing.

Have you tried turning it off and back on again? (kidding).

But seriously, have you tried any of these? (Assuming that you have tried the most obvious of them since you said "can't do anything").

...unplugging the adapter or hdmi cable and plugging it back in again without rebooting the PC? (crappy workaround though even if it ended up working)
...CTRL+ALT+DEL or CTRL+SHIFT+ESC ? (obvious)
...updated gpu drivers (obvious)
.. Another thing you could try is changing the scaling for that screen in the nvidia display settings to see if that does anything (try turning scaling off if it's not already, otherwise change it just to see if it does anything next time you exit a game).
...try messing with the physics on gpu settings (unlikely to do anything though)
..try a different output on the gpu
..turn off any gpu overclocking
... could try setting up a hotkey to a resolution switch or resolution switch toggle hotkey to see if it can kick it back to a visible desktop.
...if a single monitor setup instead of an array, you could set up a hotkey to switch between which output ("screen") is active and back to see if it does anything.
..remove the gpu from device manager and reboot so it gets found again.
..hook up another monitor to see if that monitor stays usable when the other goes black screen. Then at least you could potentially mess with settings and attempt to reinitialize the blacked out monitor with some changes to nvidia display settings, etc. during the same session.
..if you are already using multiple monitors, try disconnecting the other monitor(s) in the process of elimination and see what happens next time you exit a game.
...make sure the desktop is set to run the same resolution and the same Hz, etc. as the game in the process of elimination of causes.
...run the game in fullscreen windowed mode?

Are you using the club3d displayport adapter?
 
Joined
Apr 22, 2011
Messages
717
The CX is literally an end game display. It supports 4k120hz, HDR, VRR, Freesync, and Gsync. Not to mention a host of gamer features, and it is arguably one of the best displays for watching movies on.

I honestly think it's only true downfall in terms of specs is its aggressive ABL and limited brightness. Highlights are excellent, but full screen white is very dim.

Bring on QNED, QD-OLED, and MicroLED, but I don't expect these techs to revolutionize TVs the way OLED has. For the first time in... well, ever, this is a TV where I am literally 100% satisfied with it and am not thinking about "what could I get that's better than this?" because, truthfully, I'm not sure there is something better than this currently on the market.

Agree that it is awesome/endgame, just need to get VRR to work with BFI. Before everyone gets up in arms about how it technically can't be done, I'm not saying it can, just that it would be the final thing to improve if at all possible. Will pick one up when I get a Titan A in hand.
 

Monstieur

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403
Running the game in question in Borderless Window, issue remains. Even tried using Window mode + Borderless Gaming with the same result. Now, it's quite possible that game's implementation is bugged, but that's where I'm at for the moment.
It's not actually running in Borderless Window mode if that's happening. There might be some compatibility options set on the game executable. Many installers incorrectly set these when it's not required anymore.
 
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mirkendargen

Limp Gawd
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Dec 29, 2006
Messages
366
Depends entirely on the game afaik. There is no real reason why HDR would not work in windowed mode.

Yeah I actually thought it was the opposite, games that piggyback on the Windows HDR setting only work in HDR in borderless windowed mode, NOT exclusive fullscreen. Exceptions to this are things like Assassin's Creed Odyssey that have their own HDR implementation and toggle.
 

Pr0Pain

n00b
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Mar 15, 2017
Messages
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Yeah I actually thought it was the opposite, games that piggyback on the Windows HDR setting only work in HDR in borderless windowed mode, NOT exclusive fullscreen. Exceptions to this are things like Assassin's Creed Odyssey that have their own HDR implementation and toggle.

Doom Eternal is also able to do HDR in 4k@120hz 8bit 4:2:0 on this TV for some bizzare reason. Must be some Vulcan in-engine magic. Looks dope tho.
 

sharknice

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Agree that it is awesome/endgame, just need to get VRR to work with BFI. Before everyone gets up in arms about how it technically can't be done, I'm not saying it can, just that it would be the final thing to improve if at all possible. Will pick one up when I get a Titan A in hand.

Simultaneous BFI and VRR can definitely be done and it would work much better on an OLED than it does on LCDs. The problem on LCDs is you need to worry about timing the strobe wrong and getting mixed frames in a single strobe or pixels transitioning too slowly to even be able to strobe. Those are non-issues on an OLED. Algorithms to adjust the brightness are not complicated and can be done without adding lag. It's just a matter of actually doing it.
I'm hopeful it's something they'll add in a year or two. The big upgrade this year was better BFI, maybe next year will be even better BFI that works with VRR.

The only other thing I really want to see from OLED is higher refresh rates. HDMI 2.1 has enough bandwidth for 1080p@480hz. It would be amazing to be able to switch between 4k@120hz and 1080p@480hz. On OLED 480hz would actually be a legit 480 distinct frames per second unlike LCD where the pixels can't transition fast enough to form distinct viewable frames anywhere near that framerate.
 
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Simultaneous BFI and VRR can definitely be done and it would work much better on an OLED than it does on LCDs. The problem on LCDs is you need to worry about timing the strobe wrong and getting mixed frames in a single strobe or pixels transitioning too slowly to even be able to strobe. Those are non-issues on an OLED. Algorithms to adjust the brightness are not complicated and can be done without adding lag. It's just a matter of actually doing it.
I'm hopeful it's something they'll add in a year or two. The big upgrade this year was better BFI, maybe next year will be even better BFI that works with VRR.

The only other thing I really want to see from OLED is higher refresh rates. HDMI 2.1 has enough bandwidth for 1080p@480hz. It would be amazing to be able to switch between 4k@120hz and 1080p@480hz. On OLED 480hz would actually be a legit 480 distinct frames per second unlike LCD where the pixels can't transition fast enough to form distinct viewable frames anywhere near that framerate.

Excellent info!! Thanks dude!
 

MistaSparkul

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Simultaneous BFI and VRR can definitely be done and it would work much better on an OLED than it does on LCDs. The problem on LCDs is you need to worry about timing the strobe wrong and getting mixed frames in a single strobe or pixels transitioning too slowly to even be able to strobe. Those are non-issues on an OLED. Algorithms to adjust the brightness are not complicated and can be done without adding lag. It's just a matter of actually doing it.
I'm hopeful it's something they'll add in a year or two. The big upgrade this year was better BFI, maybe next year will be even better BFI that works with VRR.

The only other thing I really want to see from OLED is higher refresh rates. HDMI 2.1 has enough bandwidth for 1080p@480hz. It would be amazing to be able to switch between 4k@120hz and 1080p@480hz. On OLED 480hz would actually be a legit 480 distinct frames per second unlike LCD where the pixels can't transition fast enough to form distinct viewable frames anywhere near that framerate.

Asus has already proven that you can have variable strobing with no brightness fluctuations so yeah I don't see why LG can't do a BFI-SYNC and maintain a consistent brightness. I love BFI and a BFI-SYNC would instantly make me upgrade.
 

elvn

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I'm all for more options for people who want that , but it probably would be inadequate for HDR color volumes. The brightness you see would have to be amplified way more than what that same perceived brightness would be when displayed without BFI flickering. For example it's been said that 75% blur reduction via BFI/strobing results in a 75% reduction in color volume ~ color brightness range, so to match that you'd have to be outputting +75% brightness on top of each scene's regular brightness. OLED are already limited in this area to begin with for HDR.

If you tried to ramp up the actual brightness 75% to compensate you'd probably run into ABL and % screen brightness protections, so it sounds pretty incompatible with real HDR color volumes and HDR's much greater detail-in-colors. It also might be impossible at the higher % blur reduction BFI settings vs % screen brightness limitations standpoint even in SDR at some higher BFI levels in large % of brightness scenes on OLED displays, at least without compromising. I'm not saying it can't be done at all for SDR, I'm saying there are challenges that might limit the % reduction vs the already lower % screen brightness and ABL limitations of OLED. There is also the concern vs eye fatigue even if you don't "see" the BFI flicker consciously but it is perhaps just out of range, and that could be more difficult combined with VRR.

sFHi9we.png


The purpose of VRR isn't to run 120fps minimum for more uniform BFI to frames, VRR is used in order to crank graphics settings up a little higher especially on demanding resolutions, where maybe a third or more of your frame rate graph (or your entire frame rate graph, depending) isn't in the higher Hz range of the high Hz monitor anymore. BFI with rolling scan on OLEDs can be independent of frame rates, so just because your frame rate fluctuated down to 70fps doesn't mean you are seeing the same amount of strobes necessarily - but from what I've read it can get worse stroboscopic artifacts so isn't optimal.


https://forums.blurbusters.com/posting.php?mode=quote&f=4&p=24880
Direct detection of flicker does diminish fairly early (e.g. usually below 120Hz).
However human indirect detection of flicker can approach 10KHz (ish) via stroboscopic side effects.

So, humans, can indeed see side effects from PWM even well into thousands of Hz, through various stroboscopic stepping edges. Here's an example of what happens when you combine PWM + motion.

pursuitcam_pwm.jpg

Moderate-speed head-turning on 4K VR can yield 8000 pixels/second. Plenty of opportunity for stroboscopic stepping effects to still be visible. Due to the difficulty of lowering persistence while avoiding strobing (1ms persistence without strobing = 1000fps). We'll be stuck with stroboscopic stepping effects for a very long time to come (during stationary gaze with motion going past). Artificial GPU motion blur can be added to avoid stroboscopic stepping effects -- but that's additional motion blur above-and-beyond natural motion blur in the human brain. Lots of fascinating reading in this thread.
 

MistaSparkul

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I'm all for more options for people who want that , but it probably would be inadequate for HDR color volumes. The brightness you see would have to be amplified way more than what that same perceived brightness would be when displayed without BFI flickering. For example it's been said that 75% blur reduction via BFI/strobing results in a 75% reduction in color volume ~ color brightness range, so to match that you'd have to be outputting +75% brightness on top of each scene's regular brightness. OLED are already limited in this area to begin with for HDR.

If you tried to ramp up the actual brightness 75% to compensate you'd probably run into ABL and % screen brightness protections, so it sounds pretty incompatible with real HDR color volumes and HDR's much greater detail-in-colors. It also might be impossible at the higher % blur reduction BFI settings vs % screen brightness limitations standpoint even in SDR at some higher BFI levels in large % of brightness scenes on OLED displays, at least without compromising. I'm not saying it can't be done at all for SDR, I'm saying there are challenges that might limit the % reduction vs the already lower % screen brightness and ABL limitations of OLED. There is also the concern vs eye fatigue even if you don't "see" the BFI flicker consciously but it is perhaps just out of range, and that could be more difficult combined with VRR.

The purpose of VRR isn't to run 120fps minimum for more uniform BFI to frames, VRR is used in order to crank graphics settings up a little higher especially on demanding resolutions, where maybe a third or more of your frame rate graph (or your entire frame rate graph, depending) isn't in the higher Hz range of the high Hz monitor anymore. BFI with rolling scan on OLEDs can be independent of frame rates, so just because your frame rate fluctuated down to 70fps doesn't mean you are seeing the same amount of strobes necessarily - but from what I've read it can get worse stroboscopic artifacts so isn't optimal.


https://forums.blurbusters.com/posting.php?mode=quote&f=4&p=24880

Let's not forget about the thousands upon thousands of game that already exist and don't even have HDR support because they are too old or just simply don't have it at all. BFI will always be a wonder for those kind of games. Basically, there are WAY more games that would benefit from a BFI-SYNC tech vs games that would not because "muh HDR brightness".
 
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improwise

Weaksauce
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106
So is Rtings getting a 48" LG to test the speed of the display?

Because @ 11ms, I don't feel like buying CX48 just yet. If future firmwires improve the lag to around 6ms I would definitely want it then.

Also wasn't last year c9 much faster input lag, from memory I think the c9 was around 6-7ms?

Lets not forget that frequency affects the measured input lag. For what it's worth, I am using my GX to play CS GO (in a lower resolution with scaling disabled) and I have a hard time distinguish it from my 240 hz TN panel, at least not to a point where I am noticeable better on one or the other. The OLED is only 120 hz but also has a much quicker pixel response time than even a TN. I am in no way a pro or anything in CS GO but am quite ok. Have yet to run them side by side though.
 

SoCali

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Is input lag under 8ms even possible at 60hz? Rtings has not measured a single display under like 8.6ms @ 4K/60hz. I wonder why the 4K/120hz input lag of the CX is so high. Hopefully something they can update to match it's 1440p/120hz lag.
 

mirkendargen

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Messages
366
Is input lag under 8ms even possible at 60hz? Rtings has not measured a single display under like 8.6ms @ 4K/60hz. I wonder why the 4K/120hz input lag of the CX is so high. Hopefully something they can update to match it's 1440p/120hz lag.

No. 60hz = 16.67ms framepacing. If you had absolutely instant display response time, you'd measure average input lag as half that, ~8.33ms.
 

kalston

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Yea but some sites like Tftcentral actually make an estimate of the processing lag alone. Rtings seems to measure only "total" lag though so their numbers are higher.
 

mirkendargen

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Yea but some sites like Tftcentral actually make an estimate of the processing lag alone. Rtings seems to measure only "total" lag though so their numbers are higher.

Well yeah, you just take a sufficiently large number of input lag samples, average them, and subtract 8.33ms (at 60hz) and that's the processing time, heh.
 

gamerk2

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It's not actually running in Borderless Window mode if that's happening. There might be some compatibility options set on the game executable. Many installers incorrectly set these when it's not required anymore.

Well, post-restart it looks like 2004 handles this situation better. The OSD still brings back SDR, but it does it without losing the display, so it's "acceptable". Especially since I play a ton of old games that don't have a concept of borderless fullscreen. I'm also wondering if disabling fullscreen optimizations would work (via killing the OSD for those titles) in a pinch.

Regardless, it looks like 2004 makes the situation manageable now.
 

mirkendargen

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Messages
366
I finally got the 03.10.41 update offered, and it's also available to download on LG's site now with ridiculously boring release notes:

[03.10.41]
1. To improve RF channel subtitles of Sling TV application
 

elvn

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If you run 120fps solid (not average) you'd see new game world data on a local game every 8.3ms.
Or 8.54ms at 117ms capped.
However most people on a 4k screen will be using VRR with lower bottom end frame rate ranges to get better graphics settings, outside of a few very high frame rate and/or older games so they would be seeing 14ms (70fps) through 8.5ms (117fps) per frame ranges at 90 or 100fpsHz average, if they can even hit that average.

Online games aren't sending you new world/action states to react to for a much longer time - based on (15ms and usually much longer for most games) tick rates combined with the ping time of every player (usually 20ms - 40ms when possible). You don't want a long reaction time locally after the server state is sent back to you and you don't want to feel like your lip-sync is off so to speak, but considering the whole chain (time to send your action to server, server calculation, interpolation, time to send back) and the margins on both ends between multiple players I think there's a limit on the low end to how small in ms it really matters after a point - for online games in particular since you can't really react on what hasn't processed yet or what you haven't seen happen yet and neither can anyone else playing on the server.

So you can't see new world/action states (new unique pages in an animation flip book) until every 8.5ms at 117fps on a 120hz monitor locally.
Then in an online game the whole loop of your action, the server processing it, and sending that new server action state back to you (including everyone else's actions, ping+interpolation factored) is magnitudes longer.

--------------

For example a good server game with 128 tick servers and using interp ratio 2 (to avoid huge 250 ms hits on missed packets) would have 15.6ms interpolation + 25ms to 40ms (your ping). So say 41ms to 56ms just for your own actions not counting lag compensation between other players. Lets say 56ms for now on the higher 128tick servers (though most games are much longer tick). 56ms is 6.6 frames of time on a 120hz monitor at 117fps solid (8.5ms per frame). So you aren't seeing new world updates for every 6 or 7 frames, maybe worse in relation to syncing with your next local (8.5ms) frame draw.

On a more traditional 64tick , 22tick, or 12 tick online game the numbers go up by a lot:

128tick at interp_2 = 15ms + (25 - 40ms) ping = 40ms to 55ms ~~~~~~~~~> 5 to 7 frames before new action/world state data is show (at 117fps solid)
64 tick at interp_2 = 31.2ms + (25 - 40ms) ping = 56ms to 71ms ~~~~~~~~> 7 to 8 frames
22 tick at interp_2 = 90ms + (20 - 40ms) ping = 110ms to 130ms ~~~~~~~~> 13 to 15 frames
12 tick at interp_2 = 166ms + (20 - 40ms)ping = 186ms to 206ms ~~~~~~~> 22 to 24 frames

If you set interp_1 then the tick interpolation time would be halved (minus 1 frame, 2 frames, 5 frames, 10 frames respectively) - but any lost packet at all would hit you with a 250ms delay /8.5ms per frame = 29 frames.

Command Execution Time = Current Server Time – (Packet Latency + Client View Interpolation)

For reference, tick rates of some common online games:

Valorant: 128tick
Specific paid matchmaking services like ESEA: 128tick
CSGO ("normal" servers): 64tick
Overwatch: 63
Fortnite: 60 (I think, used to be 20 or 30)
COD Modern Warfare mp lobbies: 22tick
COD Modern Warfare custom lobbies: 12tick


Some have guessed that League of Legends tick rate is around 30.
ESO PvE / PvP: ??
WoW PvE / PvP ?? .. World of warcraft processes spells at a lower 'tick rate' so is a bit more complicated, but overall the tick rate probably isn't that great.
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/is-classic-getting-dedicated-physical-servers/167546/81




https://happygamer.com/modern-warfa...or-a-game-that-wants-to-be-competitive-50270/
For ease of mathematics, let’s say you’re playing on a 22 tick server, and there’s a weapon that fires 44 rounds per second. The weapon only actually fires (in the eyes of the server) 22 times, and each bullet does double damage since it can’t update the server at the speed that the firearm is discharging.

The situation becomes a bit more absurd on custom lobbies, with a tick rate of 12; anything with a fire rate past 12 is essentially increasing their weapons damage. It’s a system that is fundamentally broken, and the community is frustrated with being melted by uber-bullets while their shots aren’t even registering.




==========================================

Quoting my post again about tick rates in games for more detailed info and referenced links:
If you read through what I quoted about tick rates on servers you'd see that you'll still likely be getting 15.6 ms per tick on a 128tick server unless you had pristine ping and were willing to risk 250ms delays whenever your 2nd package is lost. For most game's 64 tick , 22, tick and 12 tick games your ms from the server would be much longer.

" Put into English this means that once you pull the trigger and this information package gets sent to the server, it then goes back from the current server time (the time the pulling the trigger package was received) by your ping plus your interpolation time. Only then it is determined if the client hit the shot or not. "

Then consider that everyone else in an online game is subject to the same lag compensation formulas.

I really think the response time considering extreme hz and mouse usage is overblown considering all of that, unless you are playing LAN games only (or single player local games) and at very high frame rates rather than using VRR to ride a roller coaster of frame rates that are moderate or low on the middle and low end of a frame rate graph. I'm guessing most people buying a HDR capable 4k OLED are buying it for some serious eye candy, not playing a very high frame rate competitive game at low settings or that is low graphics by design. What I do agree with is that at very high frame rates on very high frame rate monitors, the sample and hold blur would be reduced (without suffering the tradeoffs of BFI). That is not only advantageous for image clarity while moving for targeting purposes, but also aesthetically.

Anyone testing would have to make sure that they are running 120fps (115 or 117fps capped) as a minimum , no averages, in order to get 8.3ms per frame at 120fps (or 8.6ms at 115fps) for the upper limit of what the monitor can do. However a more realistic test would be 90 to 100fps average where people are using higher graphics settings on demanding games, relying on VRR to ride a roller coaster of frame rates.

-------------------------------------------
If someone is doing graphics settings overboard or has a modest gpu and cranks up the graphics at 4k resolution on a game so that they are getting say 75fps average, they would then be frame durations something in the ranges of:

......25ms / 16.6ms <<< 13.3ms >>>> 11.1ms / 9.52ms

at...40fps / 60fps <<< 75fps >>> 90fps / 105fps

------------------------------------------
https://win.gg/news/4379/explaining-tick-rates-in-fps-games-difference-between-64-and-128-tick
  • CSGO official matchmaking: 64-tick
  • CSGO on FACEIT: 128-tick
  • CSGO on ESEA: 128-tick

Valorant tick rates:
  • Valorant official matchmaking: 128-tick

Call of Duty: Modern Warfare tick rates:
  • COD multiplayer lobbies: 22-tick
  • COD custom games: 12-tick
While that sounds fast, many CSGO players have monitors capable of running at 144Hz. In simple terms, the monitor can show a player 144 updates per second, but Valve's servers only give the computer 64 frames total in that time. This mismatch in the server's information getting to the computer and leaving the server can result in more than a few issues. These can include screen tearing, a feeling like the player is being shot when protected behind cover, and general lag effects.
---------------------------------------------------

You'd think that a tick of 128 would be 7.8ms and a tick of 64 would be 15.6ms , but it's not that simple... (see the quotes below)

----------------------------------------------------


http://team-dignitas.net/articles/b...-not-the-reason-why-you-just-missed-that-shot

interpolation. When your game client receives a package from the server, it doesn’t simply show you the updated game world right away. This would result in everyone breakdancing in 128 or 64 tick intervals across the map. Rather, it waits a set interpolation time called “lerp”, whose name probably originated by a network engineer stepping on a frog.

During this time, a set number of further packages arrived on the client’s side containing more updated ticks from the server. Through these ticks, the client is able to interpolate what has happened between these two points in time and display this assumption to the player (don’t get mad yet). Interpolation time is determined by the simple equation

cl_interp = cl_interp_ratio / cl_updaterate
So in our 128 tick server example from above, on otherwise default settings this would mean: You receive a new packet every 7.8 Milliseconds (cl_updaterate 128) but the server waits until you received a third packet (cl_interp_ratio 2) before displaying the information, making the interpolation time is 15.6 Milliseconds for this example. On the other hand, a client running cl_interp_ratio 1 is presented with a renewed state of the game every 7.8 Milliseconds – assuming all other hardware and software variable are optimal.



Of course, from everything we’ve learned in our long online gaming history we assume that a lower number in front of the ms sign is always preferable. But, you already guessed it, things aren’t so easy this time around as bad connections and lag compensation come into the picture.

Again, the people with unreliable connections are better off to accept higher interp times, as the game client requires a new package of information from the server precisely at the interpolation time to update your game. If the second package is lost, the client waits 250ms on another package before flashing that red warning message in the top right corner of the screen.


For someone who tends to experience any package loss pretty much ever, it is safer to set cl_interp_ratio to 2, especially since you regain the “lost” time in the lag compensation.

Lag Compensation


The inevitable conclusion from the preceding segment and also the fact that all players on the server have a ping is, that everything you see on your screen has happened on the server already a few Milliseconds in the past.


Let’s leave any philosophical and Einsteinian implications of this to the side for the moment to focus on how a playable game is produced from this situation in which you don’t have to pre-aim your crosshair in front of the enemy.


The process responsible for this is lag compensation in which the server accounts for both ping and interpolation timings through the formula:


Command Execution Time = Current Server Time – (Packet Latency + Client View Interpolation)


Put into English this means that once you pull the trigger and this information package gets sent to the server, it then goes back from the current server time (the time the pulling the trigger package was received) by your ping plus your interpolation time. Only then it is determined if the client hit the shot or not.


Combining all of these factors - these tiny ms differences on the LG are really moot and especially if arguing latency regarding online (rather than LAN) gameplay and without using solid frame rates that don't dip below the max Hz of the monitor.
 
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justin_43

Limp Gawd
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Jan 27, 2012
Messages
452
Is anyone using their LG CX 48 in a multi-monitor setup with other HDMI monitors? I am having issues with windows being shuffled around when the monitors go to sleep. It's the same problem that displayport has called hot-plug detect. It's a huge reason I have avoided disaplyport monitors and now my CX 48 is acting like a displayport monitor in that regard. I have been using these monitrs for years without this ever happening but now that I added the CX 48 to my setup about half the time when I come back after being away long enough for the display to turn off I come back to open windows being resized and shuffled around. Even if I have nothing on the CX 48 at all. Everything is on the other monitors but it happens anyway. It's annoying when you have lots of stuff open and I like to keep things in certain places and it all just moves. Has anyone else experienced this? Is there a way to disable the behavior in the settings some how? I know some DP moniotors actually have a setting to disable it, but HDMI isn't supposed to act this way to begin with.
 

lunchtime

n00b
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Apr 21, 2017
Messages
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Is anyone using their LG CX 48 in a multi-monitor setup with other HDMI monitors? I am having issues with windows being shuffled around when the monitors go to sleep. It's the same problem that displayport has called hot-plug detect.

I'm using the CX with DisplayPort monitors and had the same issue. I resolved it by using a tiny app called MonitorKeeper. Has worked great for me.
 

elvn

Supreme [H]ardness
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Messages
4,190
Monitorkeeper sounds decent. I'm a little more obsessive than that though.... :cool:

I use DisplayFusion Pro for multiple monitors. While it has some window placement memorization of each app's launch by default, it's pretty easy to assign a hotkey to a window placement location or set a trigger to place an app window at a specific location on a specific monitor more reliably. I've cobbled together some bits of scripts from the online library of scripts in the displayfusion app interface and edited them myself for a little more control. I tie those hotkeys to buttons on my streamdeck:

------

As it is now, I can hit any one of my core app buttons that I made in streamdeck and it wil toggle between opening the app if it isn't already open, restoring it if it is minimized, or otherwise minimizing it. Any of those operations will move the app to the "home" or "tile" location (x, y, height, width) I specified in the function.

So I can hit each app's button a few times and deal out my most used apps like playing cards to their home tile positions. Exact positions and sizes with no overlaps or mouse dragging needed. I also have some generic window placement buttons that move whatever window is active to a quad of a monitor or to a large panel for a video, 60%/40% of the screen at full height, max width toggle, max height toggle, etc. I really like using toggles or several actions across multiple presses of the same button where possible. What's nice about the max width and max height toggle buttons is that on the 2nd press it restores the window to the previous location exactly, where when you do the same by clicking a window border with your mouse, the window is always snapped to an edge when it is restored.

My next function edit will probably be combining all of the core app launch/min/restore functions into one master launch + placement toggle button (with a delay between each launch and placement to make sure it does it cleanly). Hopefully I can pull that off. I could alternately use a trigger for that on an event like booting the pc or perhaps even screen wakeup but I prefer to do that it manually.

Among other actions I've also made a steam big picture toggle key, keys to open specific folders, screen capture, game capture, mute mic, open/min/max/focus/place audio apps with other nearby buttons controlling play/pause, fwd, fwd +10 sec, etc. I can also use script snippets, buttons, etc to place my mouse pointer anywhere I set the script to put it. Useful for things like a home mouse position (middle of screen for example) or jumping between a home mouse position per monitor across multiple key presses for example. You can also for example have a script hit the windows key to break you out of a windowed+fullscreen game and automatically move the mouse to another monitor. There are triggers you can set up as well as I hinted at. Displayfusion can also do text input so can do hotkeys or macros itself, and in a streamdeck there are 3rd party function buttons that can do macros , toggles of different macros on 2nd keypress, or repeated actions as long as the button is pressed.

There is a lot you can do with either displayfusion or streamdeck alone, or both. It doesn't have to be as involved as I've done. If you'd like an example displayfusion script for an app open-to-location/restore-to-location/minimize via a single hotkey let me know. You'd just have to substitute your app's location and exe name and hit a hotkey (or streamdeck button) per app. My next experiment will be a button to do all of my core apps with one button/hotkey. A function to launch each app if not already open or restore to each individual location (with a delay between each action, which should work, or on multiple presses of the same button if I have to).
 
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justin_43

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 27, 2012
Messages
452
Thanks for the ideas guys. I will look into each and see what works for me. I hate that this is supposedly a "feature" and not a bug to fix.
 

lunchtime

n00b
Joined
Apr 21, 2017
Messages
18
Monitorkeeper sounds decent. I'm a little more obsessive than that though.... :cool:

Obsessive in what way? Like wanting more control over things monitor related? That's understandable.

Personally I like to use the minimal amount of stuff/resources to do what I want. I always read about DisplayFusion, but then when I would dig into the reviews, I found that it was either quite buggy, bloated, or just had a lot of "stuff" I would never use.

MonitorKeeper is literally a 100kb app that does nothing more than remember window positions without the need of any shortcuts of scripts. It just sits in your tray and there are zero options. To me, that's ideal, but I can understand if you need a lot of features for multi-monitor usage, an all-in-one solution like DisplayFusion could be a better bet.
 
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Monstieur

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jun 10, 2011
Messages
403
Is anyone using their LG CX 48 in a multi-monitor setup with other HDMI monitors? I am having issues with windows being shuffled around when the monitors go to sleep. It's the same problem that displayport has called hot-plug detect. It's a huge reason I have avoided disaplyport monitors and now my CX 48 is acting like a displayport monitor in that regard. I have been using these monitrs for years without this ever happening but now that I added the CX 48 to my setup about half the time when I come back after being away long enough for the display to turn off I come back to open windows being resized and shuffled around. Even if I have nothing on the CX 48 at all. Everything is on the other monitors but it happens anyway. It's annoying when you have lots of stuff open and I like to keep things in certain places and it all just moves. Has anyone else experienced this? Is there a way to disable the behavior in the settings some how? I know some DP moniotors actually have a setting to disable it, but HDMI isn't supposed to act this way to begin with.
That's not what hot plug is - the TV can choose to switch off the HDMI input even without hot plug. I've never seen a DisplayPort monitor that switched off the input in standby mode either - you had to press the power button.

The only proper solution to this is an EDID emulator. The best one was an Apantac HDMI 2.0 model for around $80. I used it for several years to prevent the secondary display & audio from dropping out whenever the AVR switched inputs or powered on.
 
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justin_43

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 27, 2012
Messages
452
I'm using the CX with DisplayPort monitors and had the same issue. I resolved it by using a tiny app called MonitorKeeper. Has worked great for me.

This sounds like it's worth a shot but when I download it I don't see an execuatble file to install it. I have not used github before. How do I install it? Sorry for the noob question.

The only proper solution to this is an EDID emulator. The best HDMI 2.0 model was by Apantac for around $80 which I used for several years with my AVR to prevent the display from dropping out whenever the AVR switched inputs or powered on.

Oh nice. I'd prefer a hardware solution if it fixes the problem reliably. I don't mind spending money to fix this issue. So then I guess we are waiting for them to produce an HDMI 2.1 model? Are there any issues with the one you have been using, like G-Sync not working or not being able to set 4:4:4 or anything else?
 

elvn

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
May 5, 2006
Messages
4,190
Obsessive in what way? Like wanting more control over things monitor related? That's understandable.

Personally I like to use the minimal amount of stuff/resources to do what I want. I always read about DisplayFusion, but then when I would dig into the reviews, I found that it was either quite buggy, bloated, or just had a lot of "stuff" I would never use.

MonitorKeeper is literally a 100kb app that does nothing more than remember window positions without the need of any shortcuts of scripts. It just sits in your tray and there are zero options. To me, that's ideal, but I can understand if you need a lot of features for multi-monitor usage, an all-in-one solution like DisplayFusion could be a better bet.

It's really not a bad footprint compared to a lot of other apps, and considering what it is capable of. I have a 10-core/20-thread cpu so as long as I don't run out of memory I should be good.

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Not going to post my firefox memory usage lol..

Displayfusion has it's own window memorization tool so you don't have to rely on scripting (though the scripting does a lot more stuff).
Quote from the displayfusion site:
https://www.displayfusion.com/Discu...iles/?ID=a9e84956-db3d-4f2c-b7e2-e3499f7570e4
Window Position Profiles
Easily save and load your window size and positions using DisplayFusion's Window Position Profile feature. Loading a previously saved Window Position Profile is an easy way to quickly organize your windows into preset arrangements.

The Window Position Profiles feature is a great choice for people who like an organized desktop. Arrange your desktop windows how you like them, save the layout as a Window Position Profile, then load this profile any time you're using these windows. Quickly load a Window Position Profile using a key combination, TitleBar Button, the DisplayFusion system tray menu, or from the command line using DFCommand. You can even assign a Window Position Profile to a Monitor Profile so that when your monitor layout changes, DisplayFusion will automatically arrange your desktop windows to a preset layout.

Script version:
(I wrote this, I just put it in quotes to keep the reply cleaner)
--------------------
If you wanted to do a simple displayfusion script, they already have a bunch built in that work on the active window. To make it operate on specific apps rather than whatever window is currently active, you'd have to modify a few lines with the directory location and name of your app. Your hotkey could be as simple as a function key. It's a little more setup but the results are perfect.

The function I've cobbled together does the following on hotkey activation (or streamdeck button/hotkey):
-checks to see if the app is already running, if not, it launches the app to a specific x, y, width, height assigned to that app.. (and waits a few moments for it to launch)
-if it has determined that the app is already running, it checks to see if it is minimized. If it is minimized, it restores it to the specific x, y, width, height assigned to that app.
-if the app is already running and is not minimized, it minimizes it.

Once the apps are launched, when you press the hotkey/button for a particular app again it will just minimize or restore it to the set "tile" location I assigned it on a specific monitor each time you press it..

It should be possible to combine my handful of core apps -moving them all to their set locations and sizes - into a single hotkey/button or triggered event, which I'll mess with when I get a chance. I'll probably name the button "Layout-1". I could set up other layouts similarly if I really wanted to spend the time. I could just hotkey the window positions to a profile made with the displayfusion window position profiler but that wouldn't check to see if it's open or not or launch the ones that aren't open, min/restore, etc.

The scripts are relatively short and commented where the app directory and exe locations are in quotes very clearly so it's really not hard to modify them to target different apps. I realize this isn't for everyone and goes a bit beyond just memorizing your window locations with a tray tool but it would definitely work, even if just launching apps if not launched already and then placing your app windows to their "home" tile locations on a single button press. Displayfusion also has a really good wallpaper manager, separate screen saver per monitor functionality, and it's own taskbars for use on the non-primary monitor among other things.
 

lunchtime

n00b
Joined
Apr 21, 2017
Messages
18
This sounds like it's worth a shot but when I download it I don't see an execuatble file to install it. I have not used github before. How do I install it? Sorry for the noob question.

No need to apologize! It's confusing from that page for sure.. Go to this link:

https://github.com/hunkydoryrepair/MonitorKeeper/releases

From there you can download the executable directly by expanding the 'Assets' dropdown.
 

shadow2761

Limp Gawd
Joined
Mar 11, 2016
Messages
311
So the 48" won't be available in Australia ;(

Been tickling the idea of importing one from the states.

But US is 120V / 50-60Hz.

Will i have issues using this TV here in Australia 230V 50Hz even if I use an adaptor?

On 2nd though it probably is still not a good idea, because the Warranty will only be for inside US. :(

Looks like I won't get the glory of 48" Oled as a gaming monitor.
 

undertaker2k8

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jul 25, 2012
Messages
1,301
Have the strangest issue when on my work laptop, H yellow on Gray text is not fuzzy at all but it is on my desktop with the same settings for ISF dark , other websites are fine. Tried clear type calibration as well. Since I have pixel shift and logo burn prevention to high I have now decided to not have the task bar auto hide anymore. Here are my settings:

ISF dark, OLED Light 40, Contrast 90, Color 52, Sharpness 0, Brightness 50, Color Gamut Auto

2-Point WB Low RGB 0 ,-4,0 High -13,-17,-21

Using 110 cd/m2 luminance , and generic light source, my i1D pro shows it right at 6500k.

Anyone with CALMAN care to share their values to see what they got for SDR calibration values?
 

mirkendargen

Limp Gawd
Joined
Dec 29, 2006
Messages
366
Have the strangest issue when on my work laptop, H yellow on Gray text is not fuzzy at all but it is on my desktop with the same settings for ISF dark , other websites are fine. Tried clear type calibration as well. Since I have pixel shift and logo burn prevention to high I have now decided to not have the task bar auto hide anymore. Here are my settings:

ISF dark, OLED Light 40, Contrast 90, Color 52, Sharpness 0, Brightness 50, Color Gamut Auto

2-Point WB Low RGB 0 ,-4,0 High -13,-17,-21

Using 110 cd/m2 luminance , and generic light source, my i1D pro shows it right at 6500k.

Anyone with CALMAN care to share their values to see what they got for SDR calibration values?

I let CalMan auto calibrate, no way that I can see to see the LUT it generates when doing that. It's way bigger than what you can put in the settings manually on the TV.
 

undertaker2k8

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jul 25, 2012
Messages
1,301
I let CalMan auto calibrate, no way that I can see to see the LUT it generates when doing that. It's way bigger than what you can put in the settings manually on the TV.
Thanks, may get CALMAN home (assuming that's what you got) soon but am happy with these settings for now. One quirky thing I noticed is that sometimes the i1D pro would pick up a black level of 0.03 but may have been some ambient light.
 

undertaker2k8

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jul 25, 2012
Messages
1,301
Found a dead pixel smack in the center top, running a refresher to see if it fixes it otherwise going back. Sucks because I sold my 3818dw yesterday...remind me never to swap monitors again.
 

GameLifter

Gawd
Joined
Sep 4, 2014
Messages
672
Found a dead pixel smack in the center top, running a refresher to see if it fixes it otherwise going back. Sucks because I sold my 3818dw yesterday...remind me never to swap monitors again.
Uh-oh, hope this isn't too common. I've had the worst luck with monitors and dead pixels.
 

SoCali

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jun 29, 2020
Messages
325
So the 48" won't be available in Australia ;(

Been tickling the idea of importing one from the states.

But US is 120V / 50-60Hz.

Will i have issues using this TV here in Australia 230V 50Hz even if I use an adaptor?

On 2nd though it probably is still not a good idea, because the Warranty will only be for inside US. :(

Looks like I won't get the glory of 48" Oled as a gaming monitor.

I think every TV's manufacturer warranty is pretty worthless here in the US since they are just 1 year. If an issue doesn't crop up within the retailers 30-90 day return window, chances of something failing are pretty rare so I buy TV's as if they don't even have warranties.

Monitors are a different story since many carry 3 year warranties (X27, PG27UQ) and those being LCD/FALD/Fan equipped have many more failure points.
 

mirkendargen

Limp Gawd
Joined
Dec 29, 2006
Messages
366
So the 48" won't be available in Australia ;(

Been tickling the idea of importing one from the states.

But US is 120V / 50-60Hz.

Will i have issues using this TV here in Australia 230V 50Hz even if I use an adaptor?

On 2nd though it probably is still not a good idea, because the Warranty will only be for inside US. :(

Looks like I won't get the glory of 48" Oled as a gaming monitor.

Why not import a European one instead?
 

undertaker2k8

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jul 25, 2012
Messages
1,301
Returned , end of the OLED journey for me, been a fun three weeks but not going to bother with a replacement given the time it takes to setup.Prolly gonna get the 38 " Acer from Costco that has HDR and FreeSync (but no KVM :( ) to replace my Dell. Plus 3 months to try out/return and may be get another 48 CX around Thanksgiving time... GLTA
 
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