IPS a fuss?

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The best IPS display I've used is my iPad 3 monitor (the panel with eDP controller). Blows away my Dell U2211M, which has terrible AG coating that blurs everything, temporal dither from the 6 bit FRC. My old 2005 NEC 20WMGX2 also blows it away - glossy screen, deep blacks (for an IPS), and better viewing angles (purple glow though but pretty minor).

Not all IPS monitors are the same. Ditto for TN monitors.
 
So basically you did absolutely zero research and bought a monitor with a grainy matte coating. Your Note 3 is extremely oversatured and inaccurate for that matter, and your TV potentially covers less of the sRGB gamut than your monitor; therefore, I'm going to assume you're put off by the U2412M's aggressive matte coating.
 
Zero Research? No! I simply asked you experienced users, and more or less everyone said U2412M is the unit I should aim for, at least in my budget.

PS: Oh, and you could not be more wrong about the phone's display.
 
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ithehappy said:
Zero Research? No! I simply asked you experienced users, and more or less everyone said U2412M is the unit I should aim for, at least in my budget.

PS: Oh, and you could not be more wrong about the phone's display.
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The Note 3, like nearly every OLED phone, is highly oversatured:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7376/samsung-galaxy-note-3-review/5

The Note 3's white point is also extremely high out of the box.

If people actually recommended you that u2412m in 2014, then that's unfortunate; however, even a small amount of research/searching the forums would lead you to the conclusion that it's a pretty awful monitor these days.
 
ithehappy said:
Darn, I forgot to mention it, I did calibrate the unit, well just by applying the ICC profile which was available on, well where was it, tftcentral or something? Yes, it did make difference on that profile , the colours were better saturated definitely (now I'm on factory settings, because of formatting the OS) but still what I'm asking is, I expected to see a major difference, and I mean totally from the perspective of colour reproduction (viewing angle doesn't matter to me, I don't move at all). Like I expected reds to come out as red, like my phone shows, but nah, it's still somewhat orange mixed, almost same as it was on my previous TN!
I mean I paid 17k ₹ for this thing, honestly I expected better results, much better.
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Glossy coating makes a big difference to colours, they look quite dull on matte screens and vibrant on glossy screens.
 
ithehappy said:
No, I don't like that, but that's exactly what I'm getting from my U2412M ;)
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Then I must conclude that your calibration is incorrect, because the U2412m is a standard gamut monitor. If your calibration is so wrong that the red oversaturation is that obvious, then getting a proper calibration may make a big difference.

There is some advice on calibration settings on this page of the TFTcentral review, with links to some ICC profiles. You may want to ditch your current calibration and go back to default settings, and try both the ICC profiles and the manual Custom Color Mode settings there. As EdZ notes, it won't be ideal like a real hardware calibration but it probably won't be worse than what you have now and may be better.

Note that fixing the calibration should work for your photos, but most games will ignore calibration entirely and reset video card LUT.
 
Richard Jones said:
It was the best... in 2011.
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was it though? it's a 6bit+frc e-IPS panel, so maybe best for a low-ish budget.
I have tested other Dell's 6b e-ips displays from that time at work and even calibrated (i1 display pro) they look like turds next to today's AH-IPS (also calibrated).
So I'd suggest trying those before bashing IPS as a whole.
 
Basically you are trading decent black levels and contrast of your tn for better viewing angles and gray blacks.
If your tn was decently calibrated you wont see much in terms of color reproduction either.

IPS is a new marketing gimmink in the pc monitors.

Why do you think almost all TV's have high contrast glossy VA panels? :D
 
ithehappy said:
Darn, I forgot to mention it, I did calibrate the unit, well just by applying the ICC profile
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That's not how you calibrate a monitor. ICC profiles that come with monitors are useless, since each unit will vary in factory calibration to some degree.

Instead, use the CLtest app I've posted recently to set gamma and video levels properly. Then adjust the gray scale with an RGB balance settings in the OSD.
 
very good colour saturation
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the fact is... a good display isn't a display that going to "wow" you when you just look at it. for pretty much the same reason a clean glass of water isn't going to taste amazing. as you may know bottled water often has minerals added to enhance the taste. by the same logic you phone's display may look better to you but actually it's (very probably) further from the srgb standard than your dell monitor. now we could go on and on about how shitty srgb is as a standard but unfortunately it's what most pc content assumes
 
toto42 said:
was it though?
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Sure it was, there weren't many options in 16:10 format at the time and the U2412M stayed on top until the BenQ BL2411PT entered the market in 2013 with flicker-free, better overdrive, better default colors, contrast, lighter coating etc.
Now there are even better options but that's it for the story.

It's been said already but 16:9 models also received several welcome improvements these past years (again; flicker-free, better overdrive, better default colors, contrast, lighter coating etc) and one certainly cannot judge about current IPS after seeing only an outdated 2011 model.
It's not like the technology has changed much in a few years, but it's handled better in some areas, some which can make a big difference.
 
ithehappy said:
Here, my topic on Anand, http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2376230&highlight=

All right. So as of this date, if one is looking for a good IPS monitor (or any monitor which will have very good colour saturation etc., honestly I don't care about panel type any more), say at around 400 USD, which one should he get?
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I say ditch the IPS and go VA if you like the picture your TV is outputting. Now the response time is bit slower (blurrier motion) but not too bad. Or if you get the Eizo 120HZ monitor with VA panel then the even the response time is not a problem.
 
toto42 said:
was it though? it's a 6bit+frc e-IPS panel, so maybe best for a low-ish budget.
I have tested other Dell's 6b e-ips displays from that time at work and even calibrated (i1 display pro) they look like turds next to today's AH-IPS (also calibrated).
So I'd suggest trying those before bashing IPS as a whole.
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The monitor TS got is eIPS? Hah, no wonder he is underwhelmed. Literally only good thing that panel has over TN is viewing angles, even colors are equally shit. Just like TN its not full 16.7 million color screen, both are just faking it with dithering.
 
ithehappy said:
All right. So as of this date, if one is looking for a good IPS monitor (or any monitor which will have very good colour saturation etc., honestly I don't care about panel type any more), say at around 400 USD, which one should he get?
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Nothing, because no one knows specifically why you're unsatisfied. It appears you like oversatured colors (phone), but it may be that just enjoy the superior blacks (Phone + TV) or you may have issues with your monitor's matte coating. Despite clearly liking your phone, for that matter, you claim you don't want oversatured colors. What the hell do you want?

All in all this thread is a giant waste of everyone's time because you can't articulate what you actually want and most likely have unrealistic expectations/like oversaturated colors.
 
Curiousity: Could you use that OLED phone as a computer display without huge amounts of input lag?
 
True VA panels will produce a nice image, but they can be smeary and there's a weird vertical off-axis color shift.

I really do not like LCD tech. I wish plasma wasn't so finicky. Hopefully quantum dot displays suck less than OLEDs. I have a few 1440p IPS displays and while they're great for LCDs, I'm always sort of depressed when I switch to plasma to watch video content.

Basically, everything LCD has noticeable drawbacks that you can either live with or they'll drive you nuts. CRT is ancient/dead and doesn't provide enough res. We need new display tech.
 
InternationalHat said:
Hopefully quantum dot displays suck less than OLEDs.
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Quantum Dot is just an improved backlight for LCD panels. Remember when LCD backlights switched from CCFL to LED, and manufacturers started selling them as 'LED TVs'? Same thing.
It's a cool technology for getting a wider gamut by illuminating flourescent particles of almost arbitrary with a single wavelength of light (e.g. use a far blue illuminator with red and green provided by quantum dots), but is still has all the disadvantages of an LCD panel (of whatever technology panel is placed over the backlight).
If you're familiar with how GB-r LED backlighting works, Quantum Dot is an extension of that.
 
Nikyo said:
Nothing, because no one knows specifically why you're unsatisfied. It appears you like oversatured colors (phone), but it may be that just enjoy the superior blacks (Phone + TV) or you may have issues with your monitor's matte coating. Despite clearly liking your phone, for that matter, you claim you don't want oversatured colors. What the hell do you want?

All in all this thread is a giant waste of everyone's time because you can't articulate what you actually want and most likely have unrealistic expectations/like oversaturated colors.
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I can see what he means as most IPS have a stupid coating on them which makes the colors under saturated, the only way to get fully saturated colors on an IPS is to get one with glossy coating. Its not a glossy coating that oversaturates the colors, its a matte coating that makes them undersaturated and worse than they should look compared to a panel with no coating dulling the colors. I have no idea WHY manufacturers keep putting matte AG coatings on everything, glossy looks so much better and the reflections are not a big problem for most people, would be nice to see at least some glossy screens other than the Korean ones, literally EVERY IPS 1440p screen from mainstream manufacturers has an AG coating on it :(
 
SSDs are a bit like what the OP suggested.

Upgrade to them, and nothing really seems to change, at least on a desktop (laptops... may see more of a difference, at least for me, since I tend to use my laptop like a tablet, despite hating the Surface Pro 3 work is now deploying).

However, use one for a month or so, then try going back. Hell, no.
 
InternationalHat said:
True VA panels will produce a nice image, but they can be smeary and there's a weird vertical off-axis color shift.

I really do not like LCD tech. I wish plasma wasn't so finicky. Hopefully quantum dot displays suck less than OLEDs. I have a few 1440p IPS displays and while they're great for LCDs, I'm always sort of depressed when I switch to plasma to watch video content.

Basically, everything LCD has noticeable drawbacks that you can either live with or they'll drive you nuts. CRT is ancient/dead and doesn't provide enough res. We need new display tech.
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Totally agree with you on plasma. I still have my Panasonic 46 inch 1080p plasma to this day for watching things. It's a shame Panasonic no longer makes any as they were so good:(
 
jeremyshaw said:
SSDs are a bit like what the OP suggested.

Upgrade to them, and nothing really seems to change, at least on a desktop (laptops... may see more of a difference, at least for me, since I tend to use my laptop like a tablet, despite hating the Surface Pro 3 work is now deploying).

However, use one for a month or so, then try going back. Hell, no.
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Hmm when I changed from mechanical hard drive to SSD I instantly noticed everything was about 10x faster..
 
Nicholars said:
Hmm when I changed from mechanical hard drive to SSD I instantly noticed everything was about 10x faster..
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Heh, not on my desktop. Though it was a relatively clean build with a fresh install of Windows 7... and I still had patience from Win 2000 running on laptops back then (it was a big jump up for me, almost bypassing XP alltogether). :D

So I didn't notice a difference until I went back. However, my desktop did come with a HDD to begin with, and I didn't get the SSD until months later, so the jump back to the HDD was quite an eye-opener. I went SSD-only from then on out.

EDIT: honestly, I still have an old XP laptop (the one that allowed me to experience XP... woohoo). I pulled it out of the closet last night (nostalgia? My old IBM thinkpad [600? from the Win 95 era] wasn't working well), and it was painfully slow, despite containing an awesome Athlon 64 from back then. The same Athlon 64 family that pushed Intel over the edge. Yet, I remember thinking it was very fast, back when I bought it.
 
jeremyshaw said:
However, use one for a month or so, then try going back. Hell, no.
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yup thats what i experienced after trying my lcd after using a crt for a while

but ssd/hdd... there was a period in 2013 where i was switching between w7 on my hdd and w8 on my ssd almost weekly, and i never felt my hdd as being much slower, except for boot times, copying large files, and opening photoshop or some other large application
 
Nicholars said:
Hmm when I changed from mechanical hard drive to SSD I instantly noticed everything was about 10x faster..
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+1, even opening FF was drastically faster.


jeremyshaw said:
EDIT: honestly, I still have an old XP laptop (the one that allowed me to experience XP... woohoo). I pulled it out of the closet last night (nostalgia? My old IBM thinkpad [600? from the Win 95 era] wasn't working well), and it was painfully slow, despite containing an awesome Athlon 64 from back then. The same Athlon 64 family that pushed Intel over the edge. Yet, I remember thinking it was very fast, back when I bought it.
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And dishonestly?
 
Nikyo said:
Nothing, because no one knows specifically why you're unsatisfied. It appears you like oversatured colors (phone), but it may be that just enjoy the superior blacks (Phone + TV) or you may have issues with your monitor's matte coating. Despite clearly liking your phone, for that matter, you claim you don't want oversatured colors. What the hell do you want?

All in all this thread is a giant waste of everyone's time because you can't articulate what you actually want and most likely have unrealistic expectations/like oversaturated colors.
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Then maybe you speak something else but English. My want is extremely clear, only if could read the OP!

My phone doesn't provide oversaturated colours, do you even have a Note 3? I never said I need super blacks, everyone loves it, but as I said, I was prepared to make the compromise.

If this topic is wasting your time then it's maybe you who need to get the hell (borrowing your word, excuse me) out of here.
icor1031 said:
27QW
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Crossover? Never heard about this brand before.
MaZa said:
I say ditch the IPS and go VA if you like the picture your TV is outputting. Now the response time is bit slower (blurrier motion) but not too bad. Or if you get the Eizo 120HZ monitor with VA panel then the even the response time is not a problem.
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I like my TV's picture, but it's still pretty oversaturated. I will look into this Eizo 120 Hz monitors with VA panel.

Is there any Dell or BenQ or Asus or Samsung? Cause these brands are much easier to get, at least where I live.
 
ithehappy said:
Then maybe you speak something else but English. My want is extremely clear, only if could read the OP!

My phone doesn't provide oversaturated colours, do you even have a Note 3? I never said I need super blacks, everyone loves it, but as I said, I was prepared to make the compromise.
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http://www.anandtech.com/show/7376/samsung-galaxy-note-3-review/5

Clearly you are incapable of reading the review/interpreting the information out of it. Your phone, like every other OLED phone on the market, is highly oversatured.

You want one thing, but what you're saying clearly contradicts that.

Buy one of the displays on this list and please stop posting if you're unable to read/interpret the information given to you.
 
Nikyo said:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7376/samsung-galaxy-note-3-review/5

Clearly you are incapable of reading the review/interpreting the information out of it. Your phone, like every other OLED phone on the market, is highly oversatured.

You want one thing, but what you're saying clearly contradicts that.

Buy one of the displays on this list and please stop posting if you're unable to read/interpret the information given to you.
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As I said, stay out of this topic, if this is giving you a problem. Or unless I am reporting your previous post. This is not a threat, just saying what I am going to do. If you can't keep things civilised, then be it, I am game.

I have read Anand's review several times, before buying, after buying, but the thing people don't understand is that there are different display modes in this phone. Also I have never said the Note 3 is perfectly saturated, heck far from it, but once again I am saying this, in Movie mode Note 3 is significantly better saturated than Dell U2412M, period. I can take a photo of anything at this instant comparing a photo in the phone and on the monitor, but darn, I don't have a camera. I would not have done it anyway to disprove an otherwise childish statement.

Also it's entirely up to me what I am going to post, what not, I don't need anyone telling me what to do, except admins/ mods.

Thank you very much :rolleyes:
 
there's also the issue of gamma, which i mentioned here:
flod said:
note that since in actual images colors are not as saturated as the primaries, a display with higher gamma will appear more saturated, except when looking at test patterns with only red green blue yellow magenta cyan
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also if you're working in the dark, images tend to appear to have less contrast than if there is some ambient light behind the monitor
 
flod said:
movie mode is not "highly" oversaturated by any measure...
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Albeit the Note 3 is probably the closest to "accurate" that an OLED phone has come, but it's still oversatured and is wildly inaccurate vs any desktop displays he's going to buy. Stating that his phone is displaying accurate colors is just plain wrong.

ithehappy said:
As I said, stay out of this topic, if this is giving you a problem. Or unless I am reporting your previous post. This is not a threat, just saying what I am going to do. If you can't keep things civilised, then be it, I am game.

I have read Anand's review several times, before buying, after buying, but the thing people don't understand is that there are different display modes in this phone. Also I have never said the Note 3 is perfectly saturated, heck far from it, but once again I am saying this, in Movie mode Note 3 is significantly better saturated than Dell U2412M, period. I can take a photo of anything at this instant comparing a photo in the phone and on the monitor, but darn, I don't have a camera. I would not have done it anyway to disprove an otherwise childish statement.

Also it's entirely up to me what I am going to post, what not, I don't need anyone telling me what to do, except admins/ mods.

Thank you very much :rolleyes:
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Let's be clear: I can post where ever I please.

I'm telling you what you're saying if wrong, but clearly you do not know what accurate colors are and cannot interpret the information in the review. Either way, there's a list of recommendations; do what you will.
 
Nikyo said:
Albeit the Note 3 is probably the closest to "accurate" that an OLED phone has come, but it's still oversatured and is wildly inaccurate vs any desktop displays he's going to buy. Stating that his phone is displaying accurate colors is just plain wrong.
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newer samsungs (note4, note edge, s5) are even better... see displaymate
 
Here's Anandtech's reviews of the color accuracy of the Dell U2412m and the Galaxy Note 3 Movie mode. This is of interest because that site is using the same Gretag Macbeth patch test to get average Delta E readings for both screens; if you go to other sites, they will have different Delta E color accuracy results because they do different tests.

The Dell u2412m scored 7.41 average Delta E when uncalibrated, and 1.71 when calibrated. The Galaxy Note 3 in Movie Mode scored 4.62. The lower the Delta E is, the better. A value of 3 is considered good because most humans won't notice color differences below that, and 5 is the upper acceptable limit.

The Galaxy Note 3 in Movie Mode pushes pretty close to the limit, but does pretty well for a phone by being under the limit at all. An uncalibrated U2412m goes way beyond the limit; but a properly calibrated U2412m is far, far better than the Galaxy Note 3. Note that this implies that pictures will probably look different either way on your U2412m compared to the Note 3, whether the U2412m is calibrated ( much more accurate) or uncalibrated (much less accurate).

We have no way of knowing how well or how badly your u2412m is calibrated since you report that you are using some ICC profile you downloaded from somewhere.

Most monitors that you buy will probably have worse color accuracy out of the box than your Galaxy Note 3 in Movie Mode until you calibrate them.
 
Nikyo said:
Albeit the Note 3 is probably the closest to "accurate" that an OLED phone has come, but it's still oversatured and is wildly inaccurate vs any desktop displays he's going to buy. Stating that his phone is displaying accurate colors is just plain wrong.



Let's be clear: I can post where ever I please.

I'm telling you what you're saying if wrong, but clearly you do not know what accurate colors are and cannot interpret the information in the review. Either way, there's a list of recommendations; do what you will.
Click to expand...


I also think you should stop posting here (because you're wasting your time.)
Ironic that he tells you where to not post, after asserting that he can post where he wants. :D
 
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