I love Linux

BulletDust

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He's right you know. Someone will post about how great Linux is and the Linux crowds rushes them to congratulate, which makes sense, and secondly to say dumb shit like "way better than shit windows, eh!" And "of course it's awesome, it doesn't have garbage updates, malware, etc etc". Then when people respond to those attacks, BAM we are trolling.

Could be worse, you could get banned for no valid reason whatsoever. I only class the trolls as the ones making snide one liner digs at things they quite obviously know nothing about.
 

ManofGod

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Totally agreed, this is the exact situation.

The only thing I miss under Linux now is BF4, which I can live with now that I never plan on running any EA game on my personal systems ever again - Pay to play is a model I'm totally opposed to, especially when it involves what is effectively gambling. Nothing pisses me off more than paying for Xbox Live, especially when I pay for to months and my daughter uses her Xbox all up for about a week in that Month - It's worse than gym memberships.

Seriously, I have no idea what you are getting at? Are you saying that in Aus, your XBox live Gold account has time limits month to month? I know for a fact that here in the USA, XBox Live Gold is a good service and provides a significant amount of value. (4 free games a month alone comes to mind.) Where you referring to something else instead?
 

auntjemima

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Seriously, I have no idea what you are getting at? Are you saying that in Aus, your XBox live Gold account has time limits month to month? I know for a fact that here in the USA, XBox Live Gold is a good service and provides a significant amount of value. (4 free games a month alone comes to mind.) Where you referring to something else instead?

He means he's tired of paying for Xbox live for his kid to barely use it. This is an issue on his end, not Microsoft's, but once again, they take the brunt of his anger.
 

ManofGod

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He means he's tired of paying for Xbox live for his kid to barely use it. This is an issue on his end, not Microsoft's, but once again, they take the brunt of his anger.

Ah ok, thanks. I personally could not do full time Linux exclusively since it does not have a full blown eco system that would be useful for me everyday. That said, it has it's place and for the OP, good on him. :)
 
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i love linux. i hate installing GPU drivers. everything you can usually fix. Currently without a linux box, and am very sad. Also nothing wrong with msoft, or linux. Fuck os x.
 
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Also please dont run LTSB unless you have server 2016 and a domain controller managing it. You miss out on soooooo many security updates you might as well just not. If you dont like Msoft calling home, use GP and disable it. There is literally a setting, 1 setting, "Disable all communication to microsoft"
 

auntjemima

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Ah ok, thanks. I personally could not do full time Linux exclusively since it does not have a full blown eco system that would be useful for me everyday. That said, it has it's place and for the OP, good on him. :)

I can use Linux on certain systems and others I need Windows, meh. I won't give anyone shit for using it, that's for sure. But I'm not about to sit around and listen to the baby brigade each thread either.
 

BulletDust

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Seriously, I have no idea what you are getting at? Are you saying that in Aus, your XBox live Gold account has time limits month to month? I know for a fact that here in the USA, XBox Live Gold is a good service and provides a significant amount of value. (4 free games a month alone comes to mind.) Where you referring to something else instead?

In Aus you buy Xbox Live subscriptions based on time, ie:

- 1 Month.
- 2 Months.
- 6 Months.
- 12 Months.

How often you use the service isn't even a consideration, all that matters is the amount of time you buy. It's a subscription model that I don't agree with, in fact I don't agree with subscription models - Period. Especially when I pay $75.00 for Office 365 only to have that price increase to near on $100.00 18 months later.

I didn't say anyone had to agree with my point of view, but it's my opinion and I'm entitled to it - Furthermore, it's not going to change just because you all like bending over.

He means he's tired of paying for Xbox live for his kid to barely use it. This is an issue on his end, not Microsoft's, but once again, they take the brunt of his anger.

An example of trolling/flamebaiting.
 

ManofGod

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i love linux. i hate installing GPU drivers. everything you can usually fix. Currently without a linux box, and am very sad. Also nothing wrong with msoft, or linux. Fuck os x.

LOL to that last comment. :D I enjoy using all the OSes and each has their place, even Mac OS X . :) But, at least we have choices, unlike the cell phone OS arena. (I did pick up an Idol 4S with Windows cheap and love it but, I also have a Sony Xperia XA1 Android phone which, for me, is the only good one I have found. Camera software could be better though on the Sony.)
 
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LOL to that last comment. :D I enjoy using all the OSes and each has their place, even Mac OS X . :) But, at least we have choices, unlike the cell phone OS arena. (I did pick up an Idol 4S with Windows cheap and love it but, I also have a Sony Xperia XA1 Android phone which, for me, is the only good one I have found. Camera software could be better though on the Sony.)
i cant afford to even play with Os X save for in a virtual environment :( waiting to pick up and old macbook from a friend for cheap. Me being the pragmatic person i am, would rather have all the tools in my arsenal, and expertise with all the weapons rather than specialization in one.
 

BulletDust

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Also please dont run LTSB unless you have server 2016 and a domain controller managing it. You miss out on soooooo many security updates you might as well just not. If you dont like Msoft calling home, use GP and disable it. There is literally a setting, 1 setting, "Disable all communication to microsoft"

That doesn't disable telemetry, it's not possible to disable telemetry. 'Connected User Experience' forms the most basic telemetry setting and cannot be disabled.

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/wi...figure-windows-telemetry-in-your-organization
 

ManofGod

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Furthermore, it's not going to change just because you all like bending over.

You were all good right until this part here, then you just had to become insulting. :rolleyes: Oh well, I pay about $36 a year on average for my XBox Live Gold membership and get my monies worth. ($3 a month is far less than I spend on coffee, that is for sure.)
 

BulletDust

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LOL to that last comment. :D I enjoy using all the OSes and each has their place, even Mac OS X . :) But, at least we have choices, unlike the cell phone OS arena. (I did pick up an Idol 4S with Windows cheap and love it but, I also have a Sony Xperia XA1 Android phone which, for me, is the only good one I have found. Camera software could be better though on the Sony.)

I just got an Oppo R11, awesome handset.
 

BulletDust

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You were all good right until this part here, then you just had to become insulting. :rolleyes: Oh well, I pay about $36 a year on average for my XBox Live Gold membership and get my monies worth. ($3 a month is far less than I spend on coffee, that is for sure.)

I'm a realist, I'm not being insulting.

I pay ~$40.00/month and get ~$5.00/month worth of value for a service that should be free (simple online connectivity).
 

KarsusTG

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You can tweak trackpad drivers under many distro's, I run kbuntu on my laptop and my trackpad works as well as it does on the many Mac's I work on - However, while the whole process is GUI based it did take me quite a bit of time to get things working exactly as I wanted them to.

ehh, sorta. Palm rejection and things like that just work like shit no matter what you do. It's a weakness of the linux driver. I could be fixed, but then again a lot of things could be fixed.

What sort of cad? I have a Ubuntu box at work with a quadro card which is mainly used for large simulations of matlab,modelsim etc and is used for some design: mentor, NX,

Very similar to you. I have been doing a lot of matlab stuff, coding which can mostly be done on anything. The problem I run into is Autocad electrical, and Solidworks. I cannot get them to run acceptably on linux. Not even in a virtual machine for some reason, although you really wouldn't want to run solidworks on a vm...

I have also had consistent driver problems with thunderbolt 3 pushing an EGpu on linux side.
 

ManofGod

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that is easily blocked through DNS. my fear with LTSB is the forced malware engine updates dont happen.

LTSB does have it's place for a system that you need to remain on the same OS version for the life of the machine. Same thing with LTSB versions of Linux or Server OSes.
 

cybereality

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So, what did you end up having to do to get it working at 4K 60hz? Inquiring minds want to know. :D :)
I mentioned this in a subsequent post. Basically, I used an 4K60 compatible DisplayPort-to-HDMI adapter, connected the cable directly to the TV (switch was giving issues), and enabled UHD Color on my Samsung TV. Working well now, except I have to have display scaling at 200%, so everything is kind of big. I tried the experimental fractional scaling but it was blurry and caused glitching.
 

BulletDust

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I thought LTSB still got security updates but not feature updates?
 

ManofGod

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I mentioned this in a subsequent post. Basically, I used an 4K60 compatible DisplayPort-to-HDMI adapter, connected the cable directly to the TV (switch was giving issues), and enabled UHD Color on my Samsung TV. Working well now, except I have to have display scaling at 200%, so everything is kind of big. I tried the experimental fractional scaling but it was blurry and caused glitching.

What size of Samsung did you get? I have a Samsung UN43MU6290FXZA that I use as my primary and only monitor on the computer at home. Surprisingly, I still needed to set scaling to 125% to make everything comfortable.
 

Crosshairs

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Could be worse, you could get banned for no valid reason whatsoever.

There is always a reason, the fact that you dont know that reason may be why you get banned so often . Perhaps you can take the next week and work on your attitude , that may help
 

cybereality

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ManofGod It's a 40". Ideally, I'd like to set to 150% (this is what I have in Windows) as 100% is way too small. 200% is kind of big, but usable.
 

ManofGod

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It won't.

This is meant not as a dig but as a complement to BD, he really does know his stuff, at least as far as working on computers and enjoying the previous OSes like Amiga. I just wish he would stick to that and expand from there because as far as Desktop OSes go, I loved my Amiga back in the day. Too bad an Amiga subsection could not be done but that is because there are just too few of us around anymore. Loved that Amiga user group I used to go to back in the 90's, it was fun. :)
 

cybereality

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Sometimes I wonder. If all the people complaining about Windows 10 forced updates and spying just installed Linux, what would happen?
 

infinity9

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VR's lagging a bit, that's about all.

Personally I see the fact that we have a struggling technology such as VR at all as a positive.

Are you living in a bubble? Go install Linux (any flavor) on 6 variations of new hardware and I guarantee you won't get them installed without significant efforts. Don't forget to turn off Secure Boot which doesn't really work. I use Linux all the time for data recovery and other useful software. I recently tried installing it on my laptop with dedicated GPU. Of course it doesn't boot after the install. I've been using Linux since the beginning and SCO System V before that. I truly do appreciate the usefulness of Linux but it is not a replacement for Windows for quite a majority of users no matter how good "your" experience has been.
 

infinity9

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Sometimes I wonder. If all the people complaining about Windows 10 forced updates and spying just installed Linux, what would happen?

Without billions in support and R&D, no where. If everyone were to start using Linux the problems would just move with it. Personally I do not see much stable software of any kind anymore. Too much push to get stuff out with very little QA.
 

octane

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Are you living in a bubble? Go install Linux (any flavor) on 6 variations of new hardware and I guarantee you won't get them installed without significant efforts. Don't forget to turn off Secure Boot which doesn't really work. I use Linux all the time for data recovery and other useful software. I recently tried installing it on my laptop with dedicated GPU. Of course it doesn't boot after the install. I've been using Linux since the beginning and SCO System V before that. I truly do appreciate the usefulness of Linux but it is not a replacement for Windows for quite a majority of users no matter how good "your" experience has been.

Can I ask what dedicated GPU? Unless you're running some form of low power iGPU with an additional high power dedicated GPU this really shouldn't be an issue? I know the newer Nvidia drivers support such configurations out of the box.

Secure boot is also usually not an issue unless you run a laptop missing the necessary keys, which does happen.
 

infinity9

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Can I ask what dedicated GPU? Unless you're running some form of low power iGPU with an additional high power dedicated GPU this really shouldn't be an issue? I know the newer Nvidia drivers support such configurations out of the box.

Secure boot is also usually not an issue unless you run a laptop missing the necessary keys, which does happen.

940MX I was actually suprised that it didn't boot. Using the restricted drivers instead of the open source fixed it. I do not think this is something an average user would either have the patience for or be able to figure out.
 
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940MX I was actually suprised that it didn't boot. Using the restricted drivers instead of the open source fixed it. I do not think this is something an average user would either have the patience for or be able to figure out.
You had problems like I did because that’s not a dedicated gpu it’s slaved to intel and requires a little different configuration than most.
 

infinity9

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You had problems like I did because that’s not a dedicated gpu it’s slaved to intel and requires a little different configuration than most.

Well it is a dedicated GPU just not setup that way. I remember the Lenovo I had with the same issue. It had a selectable graphic card. But honestly the graphics card is the least of my issues. Font rendering and mouse wheel are my real peeves.
 

B00nie

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940MX I was actually suprised that it didn't boot. Using the restricted drivers instead of the open source fixed it. I do not think this is something an average user would either have the patience for or be able to figure out.

An average user wouldn't be able to update windows drivers either. So as long as linux isn't being offered as out of the box experience it will be 'hard to use'. Just as it would be if people were stuck with windows install media and told to install their own.
 
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With respect to Linux and battery life, well, let's all be honest: even diehard ball-breaker Linux aficionados can't or won't admit that Linux-based power management tools simply don't cut the mustard, as the saying goes, compared to their Windows or even OSX/macOS (only on Apple-branded/sold hardware, of course) battery life results but that's generally because with Windows and OSX/macOS there's money involved: the driver and hardware/software developers are being paid healthy salaries by big companies to get the best efficiency and performance (most of the time) out of the platforms they're developing for.

Case in point, and this is MY CASE EXPERIENCE so please understand that before proceeding, from just last summer and some testing I did:

Dell Latitude E6400, pure Intel hardware platform (CPU/Chipset/Wi-Fi/NIC/etc) + 9-cell main battery + 12-cell slice battery (the 9-cell has 11% wear on it meaning it has 89% charge capacity from the original specs and the 12-cell has 3% wear meaning it's got 97% charge capacity), laptop has a 7200 rpm Hitachi 500GB hard drive as the only internal storage + 4GB of DDR2 800 RAM

Under Windows 7, using Dell's balanced power profile and their power management software (not the native Windows aspects) I can readily and easily get 19 hours of powered on non-plugged in actual use from that laptop, with 40% screen brightness (it has an LED backlit display) and Wi-Fi active and in use pretty much constantly. This is a consistent and fairly regular thing with this setup, actually, and I've yet to be able to beat it with any other hardware/software configuration of any kind from any manufacturer with equipment that I've personally owned.

I installed Arch Linux on the same laptop on the same hard drive last summer and did everything I was personally capable of doing including reading hundreds if not thousands of posts on the Arch Linux forums, across multiple other forums, and using every piece of documentation and most every piece of Linux power management tweaks anyone could ever hope to do and the best I was ever able to manage was about 8.75 hours.

I did the same thing with Ubuntu, best case was 11.3 hours. Gentoo? 10.3. Linux Mint MATE? About 9.5.

And so on and so forth, and it's not really an issue for me really because I know based on my own experience and capabilities that Linux just can't match the battery life of Windows running on the same laptop - as stated, the OSX/macOS long battery life is only going to be achieved with actual Apple hardware because of the tweaking and tuning they do on their own native platform.

But here's the good thing that so many people always seem to miss:

You can get a laptop, running Windows (obviously I will never ever recommend Windows 10, for anyone, for any reason, forever), and get it up and running fairly simplistically and get the battery life one should expect and potentially even improve on it to various degrees with decreased brightness, etc. I can install Windows 7 clean, install the necessary drivers as required, then install the Dell power management software in under 30 minutes on my E6400 and get 19 hours of battery life, done.

I can then use that Windows host OS-based laptop to run VMware Player or Workstation and use Linux as a guest OS and get 95% of the performance of having it running on the bare metal hardware as the host OS and I still get almost 19 hours of battery life.

The best of both - or even all three - platforms simultaneously. ;)

I use Windows 7 Pro as my host OS and quite frequently run macOS High Sierra and Linux Mint MATE simultaneously on my Latitude E6420 and just a simple Sandy Bridge i7 dual core (2 cores 4 threads) and have no real issues to speak of. While I don't get 3D GUI acceleration in macOS obviously, that aspects works just fine with Linux Mint MATE (my E6420 has an Nvidia Quadro NVS discrete GPU).

So, for me, I do use Linux for some purposes just to have it around, but I also have macOS around too and I use it from time to time for testing purposes, and as stated, I can and do use all three of them at the same time on the same laptop without any real problems aside from some performance hit but that's primarily because my machine is ~6 years old now, a dual core (was thinking about dropping a true quad i7 in it if I can find one cheap enough), etc. I recently grabbed a Samsung 850 EVO SSD which obviously sped things up a bit but even so, a brand new laptop would be nice to have.

Been thinking about getting a ThinkPad T25, the 25th Anniversary edition, and I just might spring for it I can scrape the funds together this year (assuming I'll be able to find one, that is, as Lenovo will more than likely stop production soon, sadly). I know it's based on the T470 and I could get a T470 configured with a true quad and more RAM for less than the T25 cost but, the T470 just doesn't offer that classic ThinkPad keyboard as an option and Lenovo won't even sell the T25 keyboard as a spare part to anyone that's not known to be a T25 owner purchased through Lenovo either - kinda shitty but that's how it goes.

Anyway, a possible solution to really long battery life on factory laptops that come with Windows or macOS is just use Linux in a virtual machine. These days, with VT-x/VT-d and pass-through operation, you'll get near-native bare metal performance in the VM so, might as well get the battery life Linux just can't seem to provide as well and be done with it.

This post isn't meant to say "Just use Windows/macOS and run Linux in a VM..." - it's meant to offer a description and method towards getting maximum battery life and still being able to use Linux just the same way, give or take some situations where a bare metal installation is an absolute necessity.

Yes you have to deal with Windows/macOS in such situations but really, as stated multiple times before, no operating system is perfect in and of itself, ever, these are just options to get any given tasks done.
 
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B00nie

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Umm no. If you run your host on windows you compromise your whole system with all vulnerabilities known to man, including problems introduced by the Windows updater aka Microsoft itself. That's why the correct way is to run Windows as a guest.

Back when my work laptop was Windows based there was constantly problems and I had to tinker with Windows. After moving to OSX and virtualizing Windows, I no longer have to do anything except the specialized things that are Windows only, on Windows. I can easily snapshot windows when I test some software I expect to make registry changes and whatnot and roll back with 1 click if I detect a problem.

All data is also saved outside of Windows so rolling back won't cause a loss of data like it would if I used WIndows as a host and ran my apps on it.
 

heatlesssun

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VR's lagging a bit, that's about all.

Personally I see the fact that we have a struggling technology such as VR at all as a positive.

Michael Larabel from Phoronix, hardly a Windows fan boy, had a interesting take on the state of SteamVR on Linux just a couple of weeks ago: https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=steamvr-linux-eoy2017&num=1. I've not tried Linux VR in some months but Larabel's experience however mirrored my own. Almost a year into "beta" supposedly and the platform is still looks to be far away from mainstream production use with basic things missing like not being to update the firmware under Linux.

And as for the market itself, while I know you'll debate the numbers on the Steam survey, the numbers for VR users and Linux users are roughly in the same ballpark with VR users at .34% and Linux at .43% with Steam Linux support now entering its fifth year and Stream not even two years old.
 
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