GK104 = GTX 680 (confirmed), paper launching soon [SA]

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xoleras

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http://semiaccurate.com/2012/03/05/nvidia-will-launch-gk104keplergtx680-in-a-week/

So, when is the GK104/GTX680 going to launch? Late last week, Nvidia sent out announcements to a lot of people asking if they could join the company for the launch on March 12th. Since they mentioned the GTX680 by name in the invites, and sites don’t have cards yet, it looks to be about as ‘real’ as recent AMD launches. No pretty pictures of the invite though, it looks like they once again forgot to send SemiAccurate one, but since we published most of the info a month ago, no big deal.S|A
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rumored performance, between 7950 and 7970 mentioned by numerous (10+) sources. GK110/112 appears to be saved for 700 generation, to hit late this year if nvidia isn't late. Nvidia doesn't have the greatest record with releasing products on time though?

Should be interesting to see how gk104 performs.
 
xoleras said:
http://semiaccurate.com/2012/03/05/nvidia-will-launch-gk104keplergtx680-in-a-week/



rumored performance, between 7950 and 7970 mentioned by numerous (10+) sources. GK110/112 appears to be saved for 700 generation, to hit late this year if nvidia isn't late. Nvidia doesn't have the greatest record with releasing products on time though?

Should be interesting to see how gk104 performs.
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Rumors I'm hearing are that it'll be faster than the 7970 by a healthy margin (15-20%)... but... they can compete on price easily with how overpriced the Radeon 7970 is if they can come in its ballpark even. Guess we'll see finally soon!
 
GoldenTiger said:
Rumors I'm hearing are that it'll be faster than the 7970 by a healthy margin (15-20%)... but... they can compete on price easily with how overpriced the Radeon 7970 is if they can come in its ballpark even. Guess we'll see finally soon!
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Just curious where your rumors are coming from?
 
DASHlT said:
Just curious where your rumors are coming from?
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XS and... HERE from Kyle's postings in a thread you responded to several times before & afterwards (http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1038447903&postcount=437) and therefore obviously have seen? Why would you even be asking when you already know :confused:?

GK104 45-50% faster than GTX 580
vs.
Radeon 7970 15-20% faster than GTX 580

1.15x vs. 1.45x performance = 26% difference in absolute speed. Therefore, I am guesstimating a little below what the rumors are, for the GK104's speed. Basic math.
 
Okay, fine, we'll see in a week GT. I guarantee more sources (10+) are stating between 7950 and 7970 performance, nothing Kyle said is confirmed, no offense to him of course. Charlie has seen a board in action and states the same (7950-7970) Nothing the other sources are "confirmed either", but can almost certainly guarantee it isn't 50% higher. You will see in a couple weeks, I promise :cool: I'm calling it: Close to 7950, between 7950-7970. Price range around 400 smackers for 2gb, not sure yet. ;)

Also, TX, that chart is completely wrong and is based off of the incorrect lenzfire specs. Kepler does not have hotclocking. That entire chart is a load of bullshit and i'm sure even GT will agree to that. In fact, notice that the chart you linked states the 680 is GK110. GK110 is not and will not be done until late Q3. Also, that chart shows hotclocks, kepler does not have hotclocks.
 
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So GK104 will be the highend part for Kepler? Thats new..
 
poj said:
So GK104 will be the highend part for Kepler? Thats new..
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It's meant to be the mid-range, but AMD set the bar so low that GK104 will be able to compete handily with Tahiti (79xx). High-end Kepler (GK110/112) will come later.
 
GoldenTiger said:
It's meant to be the mid-range, but AMD set the bar so low that GK104 will be able to compete handily with Tahiti (79xx).
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OH good grief this again. Just like nvidia set the bar low with GTX 480 which was 5-10% faster than 5870, cost 120$ more, and ran way hotter and louder. Not to mention it arrived 7 months later.

How convenient you forget these things :cool:

Not to mention the GTX 580 costing 170$ more than 6970 yet offered 10% more performance. Someone is going to say something about new node sizes and how nvidia offers CUDA or something, i'm expecting it ;)
 
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GoldenTiger said:
XS and... HERE from Kyle's postings in a thread you responded to several times before & afterwards (http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1038447903&postcount=437) and therefore obviously have seen? Why would you even be asking when you already know :confused:?

GK104 45-50% faster than GTX 580
vs.
Radeon 7970 15-20% faster than GTX 580

1.15x vs. 1.45x performance = 26% difference in absolute speed. Therefore, I am guesstimating a little below what the rumors are, for the GK104's speed. Basic math.
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Ehm, you know that Kyle spoke of canned benchmarks? Realworld it will be not that fast. Also, Tahiti XT can be faster than your 15-20%, it depends on the games that are benched. With SSAA, the 7970 is as much as 30% faster than the 580. But maybe GK104 is faster than I think, would be a positive surprise.
 
xoleras said:
Okay, fine, we'll see in a week GT. I guarantee more sources (10+) are stating between 7950 and 7970 performance, nothing Kyle said is confirmed, no offense to him of course. Charlie has seen a board in action and states the same (7950-7970) Nothing the other sources are "confirmed either", but can almost certainly guarantee it isn't 50% higher. You will see in a couple weeks, I promise :cool: I'm calling it: Close to 7950, between 7950-7970. Price range around 400 smackers for 2gb, not sure yet. ;)

Also, TX, that chart is completely wrong and is based off of the incorrect lenzfire specs. Kepler does not have hotclocking. That entire chart is a load of bullshit and i'm sure even mr nvidia himself GT will agree to that. In fact, notice that the chart you linked states the 680 is GK110. GK110 is not and will not be done until late Q3-Q4. Also, that chart shows hotclocks, kepler does not have hotclocks.
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I have nothing but rumors, same as you... I was pointing out that the ones I had seen stated it would be above the 7950/7970, just as you are saying the ones you saw said otherwise. No one can be "right" or "guarantee" anything here yet.

Not sure why you're calling me "Mr. nVidia GT"... I buy whatever works best, return what doesn't, and enjoy the rest :D.
 
boxleitnerb said:
Ehm, you know that Kyle spoke of canned benchmarks? Realworld it will be not that fast. Also, Tahiti XT can be faster than your 15-20%, it depends on the games that are benched. With SSAA, the 7970 is as much as 30% faster than the 580. But maybe GK104 is faster than I think, would be a positive surprise.
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"Canned benches" aren't really usually that different from my in-game experiences. In fact, I've found Hardware Canucks' mix of gameplay run-throughs and "canned" to best reflect what I see in my own rig with a given card. The "real-world" tests people mention aren't controlled testing (as it is referred to scientifically), so it's really not applicable to a raw percentage but rather an overall experience.

The 7970 is as little as 10% faster in some cases too, hence why I said an average of 15-20%. 10% to 30% gives an average of... 20%! :p
 
GoldenTiger said:
I have nothing but rumors, same as you... I was pointing out that the ones I had seen stated it would be above the 7950/7970, just as you are saying the ones you saw said otherwise. No one can be "right" or "guarantee" anything here yet.

Not sure why you're calling me "Mr. nVidia GT"... I buy whatever works best, return what doesn't, and enjoy the rest :D.
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Hey i'll happily eat crow if i'm wrong :cool: I'm just glad the rumors will finally be put to rest soon. I'm not limited to 1 brand and if its faster i'll happily buy 2, I bought GTX 580s as well because it was a good piece of hardware.

regarding benchmarks, I dunno. 6970 and GTX 580 are pretty similar in stuff like 3dmark11, while the GTX 580 is faster in most DX11 games.
 
xoleras said:
Hey i'll happily eat crow if i'm wrong :cool: I'm just glad the rumors will finally be put to rest soon. I'm not limited to 1 brand and if its faster i'll happily buy 2, I bought GTX 580s as well because it was a good piece of hardware.

regarding benchmarks, I dunno. 6970 and GTX 580 are pretty similar in stuff like 3dmark11, while the GTX 580 is faster in most DX11 games.
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I'm not saying anyone's right or wrong :). We'll see what turns out to be true, though, soon... for now everything's pretty much rumors & speculation.

Re: benchmarks, I mean in benches that are done with games... 3dmark11 is pretty good for comparing a similar or same-rig with different cards but I don't take it as gospel by a longshot. Benches done with games, either scripted sequences in the game to make sure it's almost identical stress on each card, or automated testing to guarantee that, seem to be very accurate.
 
GoldenTiger said:
XS and... HERE from Kyle's postings in a thread you responded to several times before & afterwards (http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1038447903&postcount=437) and therefore obviously have seen? Why would you even be asking when you already know :confused:?

GK104 45-50% faster than GTX 580
vs.
Radeon 7970 15-20% faster than GTX 580

1.15x vs. 1.45x performance = 26% difference in absolute speed. Therefore, I am guesstimating a little below what the rumors are, for the GK104's speed. Basic math.
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Those were Canned benchmarks....you cant honestly think Kyle would believe benchmarks that were canned do you?
 
GoldenTiger said:
Look at the last line of my post again.
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Not that I dont believe you, Right now we have nothing to go on about rumors.

But I took Kyle's thread as sarcasm, Canned benchmarks do not show proper performance when any 1 company can cheat in banned benchmarks.

Real Gameplay is what I want. Yea I could go around and other hardware websites reviews, but some of them just run a time-demo, Where Hardocp accually plays the game like any other gamer would do to test the card.

Either way Looks like next week we will have reviews.
 
So what's going to happen then, no GK100/110? I thought the GK104 was meant to be a mid-end card but now it's suddenly 50% faster than their last high-end and called the 680. Will they save the GK110 for the 780 later this year?

Also, could this 50% stuff be from that changed design they did, with software PhysX being taken over by the new GPU thus heavily increasing fps in only those games? I.e. it could end up 20-30% faster than the 7970 in PhysX titles, but significantly slower in other titles?
 
Raap said:
So what's going to happen then, no GK100/110? I thought the GK104 was meant to be a mid-end card but now it's suddenly 50% faster than their last high-end and called the 680. Will they save the GK110 for the 780 later this year?

Also, could this 50% stuff be from that changed design they did, with software PhysX being taken over by the new GPU thus heavily increasing fps in only those games? I.e. it could end up 20-30% faster than the 7970 in PhysX titles, but significantly slower in other titles?
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Thats what im thinking. Its the Physx titles that will be 50% faster then the 580 GTX.

Of course this is all speculation.
 
Raap said:
So what's going to happen then, no GK100/110? I thought the GK104 was meant to be a mid-end card but now it's suddenly 50% faster than their last high-end and called the 680. Will they save the GK110 for the 780 later this year?

Also, could this 50% stuff be from that changed design they did, with software PhysX being taken over by the new GPU thus heavily increasing fps in only those games? I.e. it could end up 20-30% faster than the 7970 in PhysX titles, but significantly slower in other titles?
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I'm not so sure about this physx stuff. Physx titles still have the CPU doing all of the collision detection and such,while the GPU does various physx "special effects" like you can see in Batman: AC. It is pretty much impossible to do all physics on the GPU due to latency issues. The CPU can do it faster, I'm not sure if GK104 does something radically different in this respect.
 
xoleras said:
I'm not so sure about this physx stuff. Physx titles still have the CPU doing all of the collision detection and such,while the GPU does various physx "special effects" like you can see in Batman: AC. It is pretty much impossible to do all physics on the GPU due to latency issues. The CPU can do it faster, I'm not sure if GK104 does something radically different in this respect.
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http://semiaccurate.com/2012/02/01/physics-hardware-makes-keplergk104-fast/

Totally possible. Not saying Charlie is correct, but he was right what 104GK looked like in January...
 
xoleras said:
I'm just saying, GPU physx doesn't perform all physics. Stuff like collision detection and all that other stuff still has to be done by the CPU, and there's no way the GPU can do that faster because of latency issues.

Should be interesting to find out whats really going on here.
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Yea cant wait....looks like next week is the week
 
So I keep seeing GK104 = GTX 680. What's the GK100/GK110 going to be called? GTX 690? And then GTX 690x2 or something for the 2-chip card?
 
"Well everything being equal, a 7970 die is about 66% of the size of the GTX680. And we know that the 7970 has a TDP of 250W, so unless Nvidia has some insanely good power optimizations overt the 7970 (i don't think it will as the 7970 is pretty damn efficient), we are looking at around 350W TDP for the GTX680, so twin 8 pins with not a whole a lot of OC headroom. Ohh and the card will need a huge cooler, so I am guessing about 12+ inch length or a standard triple slot design. We are going to go back to the 5870 and 480GTX days, sure the 480 was faster, but at what cost..."
..
 
GoldenTiger said:
It's meant to be the mid-range, but AMD set the bar so low that GK104 will be able to compete handily with Tahiti (79xx). High-end Kepler (GK110/112) will come later.
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Wow...what an NV fanboy post if I ever read one...I'm sure it it will be unbeatable because you've got one in your hands right?
 
fps4ever said:
Wow...what an NV fanboy post if I ever read one...I'm sure it it will be unbeatable because you've got one in your hands right?
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Funny how your posts seem to be on the opposite end of the GPU fanboy spectrum, as well.

The point is, a ~25% stock increase in performance for a much more expensive part over the previous generation is nothing special. The only saving grace is the overclocking performance which brings it up to the level it should have been in the first place.

Staypuft said:
GTX780?
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It would be odd for them to change the first digit within the same generation, but could be.
 
MavericK96 said:
It would be odd for them to change the first digit within the same generation, but could be.
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Yeah, I have been reading that it might be late this year though... so maybe considered next gen to match up with AMD 8xxx? I dunno, just thinking it makes sense in their scheme of things.
 
fps4ever said:
Wow...what an NV fanboy post if I ever read one...I'm sure it it will be unbeatable because you've got one in your hands right?
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Not what I said, so.... have fun with your imagination. I already went over speed in post 4, son.
 
So are we thinking the GTX-680 will be approx 25% faster than the high end 7970 ?

I still have the 5870 single GPU, looking for an upgrade this Spring, the 7970 is much faster than my 5870, but for $550 I don't see it being that big of an upgrade, I think the 7970 is like 50% faster than my 5870, and for $550 I would like to get even more of a performance upgrade. So the GTX-680 should be like 75% faster than my 5870 ? That would be worth the upgrade price, and last longer before I need to upgrade again.
 
GK110/112 is the new GT300. :p

I'm sure everyone's hopeful that GK104 will be more reasonably priced and cause price drops on the 7000-series.
 
MavericK96 said:
So I keep seeing GK104 = GTX 680. What's the GK100/GK110 going to be called? GTX 690? And then GTX 690x2 or something for the 2-chip card?
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GK110 isn't even close to being done. I imagine 700 series. It just taped out and like Fermi probably has a TON of issues, nvidia loves being over ambitious and taking forever during the design phase.

This is speculation but if it were to release before November, I would be shocked.
 
Zorachus said:
So are we thinking the GTX-680 will be approx 25% faster than the high end 7970 ?

I still have the 5870 single GPU, looking for an upgrade this Spring, the 7970 is much faster than my 5870, but for $550 I don't see it being that big of an upgrade, I think the 7970 is like 50% faster than my 5870, and for $550 I would like to get even more of a performance upgrade. So the GTX-680 should be like 75% faster than my 5870 ? That would be worth the upgrade price, and last longer before I need to upgrade again.
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Most leaks are indicating around 7950 performance, although we will see soon enough. There have been at least 10 leaks indicating 7950 levels of performance, from those who have used samples.
 
xoleras said:
I'm just saying, GPU physx doesn't perform all physics. Stuff like collision detection and all that other stuff still has to be done by the CPU, and there's no way the GPU can do that faster because of latency issues.

Should be interesting to find out whats really going on here.
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I thought the point was that they found a way to offboard all that stuff (at least for games that use the Physx API, which is a lot more than use hardware Physx). I still don't see how that improves frame rates dramatically though, since so few games are CPU limited, at least for good CPUs.

Phishy714 said:
"Well everything being equal, a 7970 die is about 66% of the size of the GTX680. And we know that the 7970 has a TDP of 250W, so unless Nvidia has some insanely good power optimizations overt the 7970 (i don't think it will as the 7970 is pretty damn efficient), we are looking at around 350W TDP for the GTX680, so twin 8 pins with not a whole a lot of OC headroom. Ohh and the card will need a huge cooler, so I am guessing about 12+ inch length or a standard triple slot design. We are going to go back to the 5870 and 480GTX days, sure the 480 was faster, but at what cost..."
..
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Where did you see that die size? The PCB picture that was floating around had a die size that was smaller than Tahiti (or right at the same size). Not bigger. GK110 will probably be bigger, but that's a while away still. Rumors also pin it at 6+8 power, so the same as the 7950 and 7970.
 
fps4ever said:
Yeah, your totally unbiased...and um, yeah that is what you said because I quoted it from THAT post...
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It isn't what I said, despite you thinking so due to a skewed perspective. I would repeat what I said but your skill to warp and take things out of context is great. It was a followup to an earlier post, stating it's based on info Kyle mentioned, and that I was speculating off of that. Have a good day.
 
I laugh at the tools who are still fanboys for brand name :rolleyes: Like seriously in the year 2012 who the fuck gives two sh!ts which company developed your video card ? When I am spending my hard earned $500 on a new VideoCard I am looking at the performance benchmarks first and foremost, and maybe energy efficiency too. But brand name is meaningless.

Over the years ATI + nVidia trade off the top dog spot every couple years it seems, one year ATI is the best, then another year nVidia is the best, I have owned both brands and they are both great. I just pruchase based on benchmarks only, giving two flying fucks which company developed the card.

Right now as of March 2012, the ATI 7970 is the top single GPU card, in April it could be the nVidia GTX-680.
 
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