Epic doing Epic things?

Frankly that "Epic Online Services" is eventually what caused me to stop launching epic games, even with the free games every week or whatever. I have zero interest installing a piece of epic software that runs 24/7.
At this point, I just wait for the game to come to STEAM or I won't play it on PC.
Look into Legendary (https://github.com/derrod/legendary).

It allows you to run the Epic Games Store without the launcher installed at all. You can just go to the website and pick up the free games. Epic still knows you are playing the game, but they don't get to track your entire computer like they get with the launcher.
 
Once Epic stops deleting games with a uninstall of the client it will be nice. Right now I have 600+ gigs devoted to Epic on a 2 TB Sata ssd but I have another drive backing up the 600 gigs Incase I lose the install due to a Format of Windows 11. Even if you place the games on a fugitive drive they will delete . You can prevent this by renaming the Epic games folder to Epic Games 2 or something before you uninstall the client.
 
I go back and forth on this.

I do own a large number of games like this, which I have played the community edition of for one reason or another (usually due to forced launcher/account issues, or bribed exclusives, because I wanted the devs to get paid.

With The Outer Worlds and Metro Exodus I played the "community edition" during the year long Epic exclusive, and then bought the games as soon as they came to Steam, despite having already finished them. Fair is fair. I played it, I paid for it.

But then I realized, if they get my money, they have no incentive to change their ways.

You have to create the incentive for them to do the right thing.
If you want to play the "do the right thing game" then to punish the developer you DON'T BUY THE GAME! Two dicks don't make an undick.
 
In what way? It is essentially like Steamworks, just doesn't require Steam only.
What do you mean what way? Epic requires all self published games that want to be on other stores simultaneously to implement cross play. Small devs might not have the capacity to fulfill that requirement while they might still want to be on multiple storefronts.
Evidently it does, because you're okay with Valve/Steam locking games to a single client and buying out independent studios and their in development games. :p
Nuance matters, paying devs hush money under the table is not the same as buying them outright. And valve isn't locking any dev to steam, they choose to be there.
 
What do you mean what way? Epic requires all self published games that want to be on other stores simultaneously to implement cross play. Small devs might not have the capacity to fulfill that requirement while they might still want to be on multiple storefronts.

Nuance matters, paying devs hush money under the table is not the same as buying them outright. And valve isn't locking any dev to steam, they choose to be there.
Epic says EOS is just something you can drop into your game. I guess that explains why it breaks everything when developers add it to old games like Tomb Raider.
 
Frankly that "Epic Online Services" is eventually what caused me to stop launching epic games, even with the free games every week or whatever. I have zero interest installing a piece of epic software that runs 24/7.
At this point, I just wait for the game to come to STEAM or I won't play it on PC.
for what it's worth, i have it disabled on my machine and everything still works.

but i really only buy games on steam. only games i bought on there were Red Dead Redemption and Borderlands 3 because they were epic exclusives. but after my modem/router took a lightning strike and finding out you can't play any of your games w/out an internet connection, i said never again.
 
for what it's worth, i have it disabled on my machine and everything still works.

but i really only buy games on steam. only games i bought on there were Red Dead Redemption and Borderlands 3 because they were epic exclusives. but after my modem/router took a lightning strike and finding out you can't play any of your games w/out an internet connection, i said never again.

Yeah I rebought Satisfactory on Steam because of the no offline mode. It helped that it was just about what I paid on Epic with the $10 coupons they had at the time.
 
If you want to play the "do the right thing game" then to punish the developer you DON'T BUY THE GAME! Two dicks don't make an undick.
No, that just teaches them to use Denuvo and piracy protections.
 
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https://github.com/derrod/legendary
Epic has an open-store API so it is accessible through Heroic Games Launcher, Lutris, and Bottles currently, you don't need to install their launcher in Linux
Yea I don't want to depend on a guy called derrod to make me a working launcher.
and really why would you want to when there are better clients already available?
Because I want Epic to allow people to sell native Linux ports of their games, so I don't need to depend on Wine or Valve's Proton.
I am still not convinced that the Steam Deck wasn't a gimmick, should they release a V2 then I will acknowledge it as a thing until then its another one of Valve's fire-and-forget products, but now they do have another console they are about to release so who knows maybe they are serious this time around.
The Steam Deck is a gimmick, but a darn good one. Valve proved to the world many things with the Steam Deck. For one, they can make a cheap portable gaming PC. Two, they can do this with an x86 CPU and get the same battery life as the Nintendo Switch, while not slowing down when unplugged. Open enough that you don't need to use Valve's SteamOS but you can use whatever OS you want, including Windows.
 
I'm so tired of Valve spending 200 million R&D on some As Seen on TV bullshit that they always do, looking for their next money fountain, instead of just making👏the👏fucking👏game👏already👏

It's not even funny anymore they're spending more money avoiding it at this point
 
Yea I don't want to depend on a guy called derrod to make me a working launcher.

Because I want Epic to allow people to sell native Linux ports of their games, so I don't need to depend on Wine or Valve's Proton.

The Steam Deck is a gimmick, but a darn good one. Valve proved to the world many things with the Steam Deck. For one, they can make a cheap portable gaming PC. Two, they can do this with an x86 CPU and get the same battery life as the Nintendo Switch, while not slowing down when unplugged. Open enough that you don't need to use Valve's SteamOS but you can use whatever OS you want, including Windows.
Have you seen the names of the people who contribute to most Linux projects... If you are going to use that as your basis of approval then I would suggest throwing your devices in the nearest Ocean, it's the only way to be sure.
Developers don't have any restrictions saying they can't sell Linux native games, there just isn't enough demand to make it worth the resource expenditure for the developers.
As for the switch vs deck battery issue, they have the same run time, not the same life there is a difference there. 16Wh at 3.7V is a lot smaller than 40Wh at 7.7v, the Deck uses a far larger battery, if they ever make a V2 it will be my new emulation machine 100% it would tick all the boxes hands down, but in their own interviews on the topic, they say it is years away at the earliest as they are still working on increasing compatibility.
 
We should all hope that it's not and that it paves the way to a Windows alternative for gamers.
I honestly believe that Valve is trying to become the next console platform before Microsoft can get Gamepass to a place that becomes a problem for Valve.
 
We should all hope that it's not and that it paves the way to a Windows alternative for gamers.

The hardware is a gimmick, but the underlying software (Essentially, the new version of SteamOS) is very promising.
 
I honestly believe that Valve is trying to become the next console platform before Microsoft can get Gamepass to a place that becomes a problem for Valve.

They plainly stated this as far back as/as soon as Windows 8, but it was Microsoft Store lock in then and not Gamepass

Everything they do is just geared towards getting you to buy from Steam more, or if not, microtransactions or some shit, from their card games to VR to the Deck to Steam OS and Steam machines

Which I'm not knocking, but Steam is doing alright stop stuffing the pig already (like try making the game, or again just something other than some As Seen on TV bullshit to get you to just buy from Steam more)
 
They plainly stated this as far back as/as soon as Windows 8, but it was Microsoft Store lock in then and not Gamepass

Everything they do is just geared towards getting you to buy from Steam more, or if not, microtransactions or some shit, from their card games to VR to the Deck to Steam OS and Steam machines

Which I'm not knocking, but Steam is doing alright stop stuffing the pig already (like try making the game, or again just something other than some As Seen on TV bullshit to get you to just buy from Steam more)
Developing a game is hard work, you need a good idea, you need a team that can do it, you need to spend years throwing money at it in hopes it pays off, and most of the time the best you can hope for is to break even with enough to fund your next idea. Fortnight and the likes are notable exceptions but they certainly are the exceptions not the rule.
Valve doesn't want to do that right now, they make bank profiting on other people's work, and they are not much different than Apple and their app store in that respect, why do work when you can collect such a massive passive income?
 
Developing a game is hard work, you need a good idea, you need a team that can do it, you need to spend years throwing money at it in hopes it pays off, and most of the time the best you can hope for is to break even with enough to fund your next idea. Fortnight and the likes are notable exceptions but they certainly are the exceptions not the rule.
Valve doesn't want to do that right now, they make bank profiting on other people's work, and they are not much different than Apple and their app store in that respect, why do work when you can collect such a massive passive income?

We know from history though Valve doesn't have a problem making games when they want to make a game for the sake of making a game, not counting some coin machine B.S. they pump out, they just got a taste of the high life and making games is beneath them now

edit: Look at Alyx and that was just to get you to buy VR - now imagine if they really tried :/
 
We know from history though Valve doesn't have a problem making games when they want to make a game for the sake of making a game, not counting some coin machine B.S. they pump out, they just got a taste of the high life and making games is beneath them now

edit: Look at Alyx and that was just to get you to buy VR - now imagine if they really tried :/
I know that but they have also basically fired all their developers and writers, In the last 3 years they have let go more than 1/3rd of all their developers and just didn't renew more than half of their contracted ones. Their actions there make it pretty clear they aren't actively pursuing any game development there they claim they have some "exciting projects in the works"
I am afraid they are NFT games, Gabe has said a few things there but none of them were a NO we are not doing this, they were things like the current ones are too sketchy or too volatile or we couldn't trust the sources, things like that.
They have also made comments about how the risk to reward for developing was too high for games right now, but NFT games have almost 0 risks because they are so cheap to make, so there is only a chance for a reward, and it falls right there in line with their past attempts like card games and the likes. I want to think this is me being paranoid, that seems to be a thing that is happening as I get older.
 
What do you mean what way? Epic requires all self published games that want to be on other stores simultaneously to implement cross play. Small devs might not have the capacity to fulfill that requirement while they might still want to be on multiple storefronts.

Corssplay is how it works by default. That is why I am wondering how it "makes it harder for small devs". Steamworks, while great, is the thing that introduced locking games to a single client. Essentially all Epic requires is that people can sell on other clients as long as all versions of the game are compatible with each other. This is a good thing. You acting like it is a bad thing doesn't make sense.

Valve has no policy that requires Steamworks, but they offer Steamworks which prevents other stores from being compatible with it. You cannot use Steamworks on Epic, Origin, Uplay, etc.

Nuance matters, paying devs hush money under the table is not the same as buying them outright. And valve isn't locking any dev to steam, they choose to be there.

Aren't you the person who complained about Epic buying out the Rocket League developers? And what is "hush money"? Microsoft, Sony, Valve do exactly the same things. They'll make a business decision without inviting the public along for the process. I'm confused at what Epic needs to do. Valve buying in development games = good. Epic buying in development games = hush money. Valve locking games into their eco system = good. Epic requiring games be compatible with all PC stores = bad. Valve locking games to Steam only = good. Epic locking games to EGS = bad. I'm confused.

The only difference between what Valve and Epic do is Epic partakes in MS/Sony style exclusivity, but they don't lock games from other platforms (Xbox/PS), just lock it to their client and typically that is a timed exclusivity. EA and Ubisoft do the same (yes, including their non-developed games). Valve just locks them for life if they use Steamworks. Or developers have to spend a lot of time and money reworking the game so it isn't dependent on Steamworks. Which as you put it :

Small devs might not have the capacity to fulfill that requirement while they might still want to be on multiple storefronts.

Ironic.


I know that but they have also basically fired all their developers and writers, In the last 3 years they have let go more than 1/3rd of all their developers and just didn't renew more than half of their contracted ones. Their actions there make it pretty clear they aren't actively pursuing any game development there they claim they have some "exciting projects in the works"

Valve is a technology company, not a gaming company. Steam is mainly based around gaming of course but that is their bread and butter. Which is why they try hard to lock games fully into Steam. Steamworks is fairly good, but is designed to make it too complicated to move your game elsewhere should you desire. They need that revenue steam so they can pursue other things like VR, Steam Boxes and their odd tablet thingie that is too big to be a portable console but less functional than a real laptop.

Gabe essentially does what he wants. It doesn't always make sense though. These excellent ideas come from Mr "Playstation is a waste of everyone's time", and "we'll never do a single player game again" (in favor of selling digital items like hats in TF2 and monetizing mods) only for him to reverse those stances in a few years.
 
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Valve is a technology company, not a gaming company. Steam is mainly based around gaming of course but that is their bread and butter. Which is why they try hard to lock games fully into Steam. Steamworks is fairly good, but is designed to make it too complicated to move your game elsewhere should you desire. They need that revenue steam so they can pursue other things like VR, Steam Boxes and their odd tablet thingie that is too big to be a portable console but less functional than a real laptop.

Gabe essentially does what he wants. It doesn't always make sense though. These excellent ideas come from Mr "Playstation is a waste of everyone's time", and "we'll never do a single player game again" (in favor of selling digital items like hats in TF2 and monetizing mods) only for him to reverse those stances in a few years.

I was going to say this.

Valve was a developer at one point, but that started being de-empahsized almost as soon as the first Half-Life was released.

Titles since then (Half Life 2 and episodes, portal, etc.) really seem more like a matter of seeding the system (Steam Store, Steam VR, Valves Marketplace, etc.) than the intent of being a game developer. The games are a means to an end, not the product in and of itself.
 
I was going to say this.

Valve was a developer at one point, but that started being de-empahsized almost as soon as the first Half-Life was released.

Titles since then (Half Life 2 and episodes, portal, etc.) really seem more like a matter of seeding the system (Steam Store, Steam VR, Valves Marketplace, etc.) than the intent of being a game developer. The games are a means to an end, not the product in and of itself.

The HL2 episodes at least were a monetization scheme - but still for the aspect of games - the idea was cheaper dev time/turn around = games out cheaper and more often = more profit - unfortunately once someone had the idea of "why don't we just do this for Steam" that's all they thought about

And I say Portal was still more about the games than TF2 even at launch was - because that's what then started Valve down their microtransaction bender

Just sucks cause they were competent at games - and HL was one of my favorite franchises - like who would give a damn if Deep Silver invented Steam instead and disappeared from making games, really? Sorry not sorry any Deep Silver fans :p edit: publisher but whatever you get my point :p :p
 
Have you seen the names of the people who contribute to most Linux projects... If you are going to use that as your basis of approval then I would suggest throwing your devices in the nearest Ocean, it's the only way to be sure.
I appreciate people who do these projects, but I want native Linux support, and not some hack job. Valve's proton is a stepping stone, and not the final stop to Linux gaming. Epic doesn't even have a stone, let alone a stepping stone.
Developers don't have any restrictions saying they can't sell Linux native games, there just isn't enough demand to make it worth the resource expenditure for the developers.
Valve does it, for good reasons. Look at all the trouble Epic has with Apple and Google.
As for the switch vs deck battery issue, they have the same run time, not the same life there is a difference there. 16Wh at 3.7V is a lot smaller than 40Wh at 7.7v, the Deck uses a far larger battery,
The Switch goes into half speed mode when you unplug it from power, where the GPU loses half it's performance and the CPU loses a little. The Deck can drain battery quickly when under full load but if you lower settings then it lasts about the same as a Switch, and still looks better too.
if they ever make a V2 it will be my new emulation machine 100% it would tick all the boxes hands down, but in their own interviews on the topic, they say it is years away at the earliest as they are still working on increasing compatibility.
At the moment the Deck has the biggest library of games... ever, for a portable game console. Compatibility is just to match what a Windows PC can do.
 
I appreciate people who do these projects, but I want native Linux support, and not some hack job. Valve's proton is a stepping stone, and not the final stop to Linux gaming. Epic doesn't even have a stone, let alone a stepping stone.
I thought you were talking about the store itself not the actual content of the store. Heroic Launcher and its associated project does Epic and GoG, so you can use it to sign into your accounts buy crap or launch it, I mean the emulation layers needed is a different problem but at least the stores and launchers work.
Valve doesn't make games anymore they just take a cut from those who do, so if people there are selling Linux native then good.
And I know the Deck is awesome for what it is, but Valve has a nasty habit of releasing awesome stuff and then just forgetting about it, Odroid made a sweet little handheld that is managing my current mobile needs, so the only thing that the deck would get me is support for some newer consoles that I mostly use for multiplayer anyways so not a high priority for me really. My biggest issue with the Deck is my PC or laptop does everything it does but better, so my only interest there is for emulation.
 
https://www.pcgamer.com/epic-games-store-self-publishing/

So Epic is taking a swing at Valve and trying to get more small publishers in the store, their rules are simple and mostly unobjectionable.
I mean steam has me on lock because... <gestures at the back catalog of unplayed games>
But I will always welcome competition to the market, and the more ideas the better.

Except it's not competition that benefits end users. It's competition for 'developers'/'games'. And then, they want (dev/game) to be exclusive to their store, at least for a time period. But some, forever. This isn't a 'market', if I can't buy game X at the online store of my choice.

So, fuck off Epic, with your exclusives.

My experience with Epic:
Bought Crysis Remastered - ran into problems with binding keys, opened ticket to Crytek. Maybe 4 months later I get a reply.. a few back-n-forths. There is no fix for their busted game, so I am out $60, as it's sure as hell too far past any 'return' period. Checked the game a year later, still busted. Shitty 'Great PC game-ported to console-ported BACK to pc', some real bullshit...
Lots of free games... most of which are not installed at the moment:
Diabotical is installed - play at Lans with friends.
Brothers is installed, haven't played it yet. Single player adventure game.
Fortnite... don't play it. Last played was April 2018.
Nothing else is installed.
The BS with Rocket League going Epic exclusive after having been sold on steam for years...

I can just wait for games to get on Steam... not buying any more in the Epic store. If they are Epic exclusive, that's their business, but they will not be getting mine. Games can choose to release on all storefronts at launch if they want. Many do. Those are games I will buy. The shit Epic pulls isn't beneficial imho, for me the consumer, for dev's even.

There is certainly nothing 'free market' about pushing developers to be "exclusive", not for gamers anyway.
 
It's especially bad when a game has already made a player base on one platform, say your Rocket League example, and then selling out and switching platforms thanks to Epic throwing money at them.
They didn't "throw money at them". They outright bought them and made the game free.
Crying about a game being free is just sad.
Wahhhhh I spent $20 to buy it and enjoyed it for years, but now other people get to enjoy it for free. Wahhhh I have to click a different icon to play it. Pathetic. This is why people call gamers babies.
 
They didn't "throw money at them". They outright bought them and made the game free.
Crying about a game being free is just sad.
Wahhhhh I spent $20 to buy it and enjoyed it for years, but now other people get to enjoy it for free. Wahhhh I have to click a different icon to play it. Pathetic. This is why people call gamers babies.
Don't forget that Linux users that bought the game were told their port was totally depreciated and they would just have to be happy playing an old version of the game that's effectively useless. No doubt the usual Windows brigade are going to reply with their usual Windows crap as a result of pointing out such a fact, but the fact remains that it was a dick move on behalf of Tim Sweeney.

I will admit that I simply downloaded the Windows port of the game via Steam and it runs fine under Proton.
 
They didn't "throw money at them". They outright bought them and made the game free.
Crying about a game being free is just sad.
Wahhhhh I spent $20 to buy it and enjoyed it for years, but now other people get to enjoy it for free. Wahhhh I have to click a different icon to play it. Pathetic. This is why people call gamers babies.
At the end of the day a very sizeable portion of people don't like EGS, and they have nobody to blame but themselves for fostering that image. The Shenmue 3 stuff was especially scummy. Why don't they just offer a compelling service?
 
At the end of the day a very sizeable portion of people don't like EGS, and they have nobody to blame but themselves for fostering that image. The Shenmue 3 stuff was especially scummy. Why don't they just offer a compelling service?
I am still sitting slanted for their 1 year exclusive for MW5 Mercenaries. I mean I bought it there and all the expansions too and the odd other thing here and there so it worked and I should feel bad but waiting wasn’t something I wanted to do because the release date lined up with not only my mandatory time off but also during a time when the wife and kids were out visiting the in-laws….
 
I don't mind devs big or small on their own choosing to be on only one store front for all time

I don't even mind paid timed exclusivity at launch

Doing shit though like buying Rocket League and retroactively removing it from purchase from a storefront/Steam was a dick move and Epic can fuck off IMO

I wouldn't even mind buying Rocket League and Rocket League 2 only comes out on Epic's launcher

I don't even bother with the free games from them

They also came along/really started making waves after I was already done with launchers and launchers and launchers oh my, though
 
They didn't "throw money at them". They outright bought them and made the game free.
Crying about a game being free is just sad.
Wahhhhh I spent $20 to buy it and enjoyed it for years, but now other people get to enjoy it for free. Wahhhh I have to click a different icon to play it. Pathetic. This is why people call gamers babies.

Yes, and since they were bought out they lost some licensing rights and a couple of the cars I bought were no longer available via steam or epic. Nowadays you might as well run it only thru Epic and to get your old stuff you had to link Steam to Epic accounts. I just uninstalled and have not played the game in years.
 
..They outright bought them and made the game free...
Crying about a game being free is just sad.
Wahhhhh I spent $20 to buy it and enjoyed it for years, but now other people get to enjoy it for free. Wahhhh I have to click a different icon to play it. Pathetic. This is why people call gamers babies.
Except they didn't have to make it "exclusive" to the Epic store... They bought it, it could have then been free everywhere.

But no, they were dicks about it.
 
Except they didn't have to make it "exclusive" to the Epic store... They bought it, it could have then been free everywhere.

But no, they were dicks about it.
Just another feeble attempt to lure people into the EGS system. And that's what they do. They buy out stuff that became popular on steam to go "Oh...you still wanna play it or the sequel? Well guess you have to come over here..."
 
No, I meant that pirating teaches devs to protect their work more which worsens the experience for their actual customers.
Then I have to idea why you replied to my comment. I was replying to Zarathustra that said pirating was the right thing to do since buying the game incentived developers to continue what he thinks are bad practices. I was telling him that by becoming a pirate he was a hypocrite. Here is the dialogue:

I go back and forth on this.

I do own a large number of games like this, which I have played the community edition of for one reason or another (usually due to forced launcher/account issues, or bribed exclusives, because I wanted the devs to get paid.

With The Outer Worlds and Metro Exodus I played the "community edition" during the year long Epic exclusive, and then bought the games as soon as they came to Steam, despite having already finished them. Fair is fair. I played it, I paid for it.

But then I realized, if they get my money, they have no incentive to change their ways.

You have to create the incentive for them to do the right thing.
If you want to play the "do the right thing game" then to punish the developer you DON'T BUY THE GAME! Two dicks don't make an undick.
 
Then I have to idea why you replied to my comment. I was replying to Zarathustra that said pirating was the right thing to do since buying the game incentived developers to continue what he thinks are bad practices. I was telling him that by becoming a pirate he was a hypocrite. Here is the dialogue:


If you want to play the "do the right thing game" then to punish the developer you DON'T BUY THE GAME! Two dicks don't make an undick.
Sorry, I misquoted/misunderstood somewhere along the way.
 
Then I have to idea why you replied to my comment. I was replying to Zarathustra that said pirating was the right thing to do since buying the game incentived developers to continue what he thinks are bad practices. I was telling him that by becoming a pirate he was a hypocrite. Here is the dialogue:


If you want to play the "do the right thing game" then to punish the developer you DON'T BUY THE GAME! Two dicks don't make an undick.
You not buying the game sends no message to developers other than to add micro-transactions to siphon as much money as they can from their existing customers. You pirating it sends the message that maybe the price is too high, or maybe you don't offer the product the way I'd like it. This is how World of Warcraft classic came to be as there was so many private servers that told Blizzard that it was time to offer this product. There are many occasions where developers even tell you to pirate their games.

I have rules to buying games, and if the game doesn't match my requirements then I'm pirating.
  • The game must run on Linux. Epic Store doesn't officially support Linux so any game exclusive on their store is getting pirated. I don't like doing their work to get a game to run on Linux. Valve has done this 1000x over.
  • The game must not cost $60 or more. I'm not paying that much for a video game.
  • Your game better not have micro-transactions or paid DLC. I don't even bother pirating games with micro-transactions but DLC nowadays does offer really good content and not having it does ruin the experience.
  • Your game better be good. I've learned not to listen to reviewers because I'm always right in the end of which game is worth my time or not. I always try before I buy. Especially with the silly return policies some of these stores tend to have, which Epic games requires less than 2 hours of play time, which I can spend 1 hour just on the character creation screen.
 
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