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Dell U2410
- Thread starter Xcelerate
- Start date
For they money, I couldn't justify it.
You're brave. I no longer dare to present myself w/ a situation where I might find a stuck pixel.
Try this webpage http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/black.php and see if from square 6, 7, 8, .... you can see with grainess. You can switch mode while in the page to see the diference.
Like i said before, it is only in lighter black shades that the static dithering shows up. In the black background of this site for example, the static dithering is not there.
I've looked at gray windows (various sizes and shades of gray) using pattern generators like Calman Pattern Generator (used for calibration) and I see no signs of the dithering people are reporting on that lagom black level test page ... regardless of preset. Everything looks nice and smooth and solid.
I'm wondering whether this observation might be limited to that lagom test page.
In my experience to date, dithering on gray windows is not a problem on the U2410.
Re U2410 vs 2209WA ... unless you really want 1920x1200 resolution and a 24" screen, it's not worth upgrading ... unless you really want a wide gamut monitor with an sRGB preset.
I had a 2209WA and returned it because the right side of the screen had a weird orange tint that was just unacceptable. I actually tried two different 2209WA units, and they both had the same problem. It killed me because the 2209WA was an excellent buy and it calibrated quite accurately.
Well, guess what? My U2410 also has kind of a green tint on the left side of the screen and a pink tint on the right side. It's more subtle than on the 2209WA, but it's quite noticeable.
Picture quality wise, I really think the two monitors are comparable. I no longer have the 2209WA for a side by side comparison, but I've seen nothing so far on the U2410 that makes me go wow this is way better than the 2209WA after calibration.
Both monitors are crazy bright and you need to turn brightness way down. I will say that the white glow on the U2410 seems less obtrusive than on the 2209WA.
I haven't calibrated my U2410 yet, but the gamma is way off in custom color mode.
It's way too low (less than 2.2) especially at higher IRE levels. It remains to be seen whether calibration can fix this. The tftcentral reviewer said he couldn't get an accurate calibration in custom color mode. If I come to the same conclusion, this is going back to Dell.
I'm wondering whether this observation might be limited to that lagom test page.
In my experience to date, dithering on gray windows is not a problem on the U2410.
Re U2410 vs 2209WA ... unless you really want 1920x1200 resolution and a 24" screen, it's not worth upgrading ... unless you really want a wide gamut monitor with an sRGB preset.
I had a 2209WA and returned it because the right side of the screen had a weird orange tint that was just unacceptable. I actually tried two different 2209WA units, and they both had the same problem. It killed me because the 2209WA was an excellent buy and it calibrated quite accurately.
Well, guess what? My U2410 also has kind of a green tint on the left side of the screen and a pink tint on the right side. It's more subtle than on the 2209WA, but it's quite noticeable.
Picture quality wise, I really think the two monitors are comparable. I no longer have the 2209WA for a side by side comparison, but I've seen nothing so far on the U2410 that makes me go wow this is way better than the 2209WA after calibration.
Both monitors are crazy bright and you need to turn brightness way down. I will say that the white glow on the U2410 seems less obtrusive than on the 2209WA.
I haven't calibrated my U2410 yet, but the gamma is way off in custom color mode.
It's way too low (less than 2.2) especially at higher IRE levels. It remains to be seen whether calibration can fix this. The tftcentral reviewer said he couldn't get an accurate calibration in custom color mode. If I come to the same conclusion, this is going back to Dell.
I had the same issue which drove me nuts. I'm waiting for my replacement today. I'll send it to Dell if the replacement has the same issue.
kwatch ... are you also in the usa? how pronounced was this green/pink thing on your screen?
The pink tint on the right side of mine is more visible than green on the left. I'd almost consider the left side acceptable, but when you look at something like newegg.com the background color to the left of the center window is quite a different hue than the background color on the right. Same thing I noticed on the 2209WA.
I really don't want to go through this again, but I may request a replacement for comparison. It just really bugs me because it's much more expensive than the 2209WA.
The U2410 I have has no dead/stuck pixels, the screen is perfectly horizontal on the stand, the buttons work perfectly ... so I have none of the issues that some other people have encountered.
The pink tint on the right side of mine is more visible than green on the left. I'd almost consider the left side acceptable, but when you look at something like newegg.com the background color to the left of the center window is quite a different hue than the background color on the right. Same thing I noticed on the 2209WA.
I really don't want to go through this again, but I may request a replacement for comparison. It just really bugs me because it's much more expensive than the 2209WA.
The U2410 I have has no dead/stuck pixels, the screen is perfectly horizontal on the stand, the buttons work perfectly ... so I have none of the issues that some other people have encountered.
I have a question about calibration.
If you change the custom color controls (saturation, hue, gain and offset) does it affect the AdobeRGB and sRGB presets? In other words, is it global or just for custom color mode?
Obviously, things like contrast and brightness are global. I don't think you can adjust these controls per preset, right?
I want to experiment with custom color calibration, but I don't want to screw up the other presets.
If you change the custom color controls (saturation, hue, gain and offset) does it affect the AdobeRGB and sRGB presets? In other words, is it global or just for custom color mode?
Obviously, things like contrast and brightness are global. I don't think you can adjust these controls per preset, right?
I want to experiment with custom color calibration, but I don't want to screw up the other presets.
I haven´t had the green/pink issue, unless it´s something that can crop up later in it´s life. My U2410 didn´t arrive with any problem except the issue with the arm of the base unit being slightly off fully horizontal. Mine is European so it´s built in the Czech Republic whilst US units are built in China. I´m wondering if there are differences depending on where the monitor is built.
I did an input lag test on my Dell 2005FPW and it came out average of 30ms if memory serves correct, so this screen should be capable of better, especially in gaming mode.
Pink tint on the top right really bothers me on white or light gray background. I do not have any dead or stuck pixles. I'm in So. California.
First off, thank you for testing for us!
Secondly...Wow, 30ms? That's horrid. I seem to recall Dell's manufactured rating being something like 12ms for the 2005FPW, while I think a 3rd party review claimed between 16-24.
Just so I can do my own little test, would you mind sharing how you set up your experiment?
10e, I know from your many posts on this forum how thorough and knowledgeable you are in regards to LCD monitors. So I also wanted to ask you about talk of the U2410 using a grainy matte, similar to the older IPS' like the 2005FPW (which I don't know what they're talking about, since I don't notice any "grain" or noise to speak of)....can you elaborate on that? I know you own a 2005FPW, but am unsure if you actually had a U2410 to personally test drive...
Input lag is not response time. Response time's only part of the total delay in frames. Reponse time determines how fast a given pixel can switch whereas input lag determines the total time it takes for a frame to be displayed after being rendered by the video card. TN's typically have the least amount of input lag followed by IPS and then PVA. If you recall, the 2408 had crazy near 60ms of input lag when first released. It was an S-PVA. From the TFTcentral review, the 2410 in gaming mode hits an avg of 16ms input lag which would be a real boon for a gamer that prefers the consistency only an IPS can offer.
The best way to test would be having a CRT next to the LCD and run a timer on both. Snap a pic and use the CRT for reference. I recently had a chance to compare my 2007WFP with a large 21" CRT @ 100+ hz and 200 FPS in counter strike source. The difference in mouse movement was quite jarring. The CRT felt organic and extremely fluid. It was a wonderful feeling and definitely noticeable. It's more about the feel of the mouse as opposed to the 1-3 frame delay IMO. Having a super snappy response with the mouse adds A LOT to the die hard FPS shooter fans gaming experience.
The best way to test would be having a CRT next to the LCD and run a timer on both. Snap a pic and use the CRT for reference. I recently had a chance to compare my 2007WFP with a large 21" CRT @ 100+ hz and 200 FPS in counter strike source. The difference in mouse movement was quite jarring. The CRT felt organic and extremely fluid. It was a wonderful feeling and definitely noticeable. It's more about the feel of the mouse as opposed to the 1-3 frame delay IMO. Having a super snappy response with the mouse adds A LOT to the die hard FPS shooter fans gaming experience.
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I received my replacement this afternoon. I'm not happy with it at all. It has the same pink tint on the right and one dead pixel. I can live with one dead pixel but not with the color un-uniformity. I'm returning this for a refund. I guess I need to find a new 24" LCD monitor.
Hi everyone, this is my first post...well I was waiting for this monitor, and I´m ready to leave TN´s behind, the only thig is since I have and old TN 19" 4:3 1280 x 1024 monitor, I would like to see how actually 1080 and 720p movies are shown.
Can you please upload a pic of the U2410 with a movie?
My concern is about the black bars...if they are too big or not..
EDIT: last thin, since the main use will be watching movies...what about the viewing angles, anyone saw colour shifts?
Thanks a lot everyone!
Can you please upload a pic of the U2410 with a movie?
My concern is about the black bars...if they are too big or not..
EDIT: last thin, since the main use will be watching movies...what about the viewing angles, anyone saw colour shifts?
Thanks a lot everyone!
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night_2004
2[H]4U
- Joined
- May 31, 2007
- Messages
- 2,229
If you're worried about the black bars, get one of those new 16:9 monitors. Oh wait, I think almost all of those are TN .
.If you're worried about the black bars, get one of those new 16:9 monitors. Oh wait, I think almost all of those are TN
That doesn't change much. Most good movies are 2.39:1, so big black bars either way.
I have my monitor set to the sRGB preset, and when I view this page:
http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/black.php
the top row of black boxes are completely invisible, and there is dithering in the next two rows. Is this normal behavior for this monitor? If I set to Multimedia, I can see all the boxes and there is no dithering.
I'm aware other people have complained about dithering, but I haven't seen anyone mentioning the top boxes being invisible.
http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/black.php
the top row of black boxes are completely invisible, and there is dithering in the next two rows. Is this normal behavior for this monitor? If I set to Multimedia, I can see all the boxes and there is no dithering.
I'm aware other people have complained about dithering, but I haven't seen anyone mentioning the top boxes being invisible.
IsLNdbOi, The problem is that dell is also TN, so I will have problems with angles if ex, I wanna watch a movie from my bed...
Also that is the mine reason I was waiting for a good E-IPS monitor.....
My concern about the bars is, on my 19" (1280 x 1024) when I play any 1080 content I get huge black bars and the viewable area is small...
..
Thx!
Maguilla: take a movie and media player classic homecimena or vlc on a key to your local best buy and see for yourself. The bars will be much less than ur 4:3. 16:10 offers the most resolution on a 24" while keeping a fairly decent widescreen format.
Yup, I think I will do that....Or I will buy directly the U2410, Don´t know...
Ohh by the way..I´m from Argentina :$ I would love to have a bestbuy around...
Here I uploaded just a capture of my screen with 1080p Sunshine...
http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/7788/peli1080.jpg
As you can see the bars are huge...
Well I guess that if you say i will get smaller bars...I can call dell right away...
Again, Thanks everyone for the help
Ohh by the way..I´m from Argentina :$ I would love to have a bestbuy around...
Here I uploaded just a capture of my screen with 1080p Sunshine...
http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/7788/peli1080.jpg
As you can see the bars are huge...
Well I guess that if you say i will get smaller bars...I can call dell right away...
Again, Thanks everyone for the help
Thanks for reporting back kwatch. It's pretty much what I expected, having gone through the same thing with the 2209WA.
I guess I'll have to decide whether to keep the U2410 I have. Pink tint on the right side is the only issue I have, and it's not as bad as the 2209WA.
One interesting observation ... if I lean to the right, so I'm looking directly at the right side of the screen rather than at a small angle, most of the pink tint disappears. I'm really wondering whether it's got something to do with the optics of the anti-glare treatment.
The left side of the screen doesn't really have a green tint, it's just kind of less white than the right side, I guess a slight gray cast. I can clearly see it extends exactly halfway across the screen. It's exactly the same thing you see if you look at a white screen from an angle, just considerably more subtle. Again, it seems to be related to either the screen coating or maybe the backlight configuration. I really don't know if there are multiple backlights in this thing or where they're positioned.
I'd really like to know whether others are seeing this as well.
Of course, your eyes play tricks on you staring at a white screen. If I didn't notice any of this except while looking at test patterns I wouldn't care, but I notice it while working on a spreadsheet or a web page with a light background.
I'm going to take a crack at calibrating this thing in custom color mode to see how well the controls are implemented. The reviewer from tftcentral said he couldn't get accurate results. If I confirm his findings I guess I'm toast.
NEC has a new EA231WMi that uses an IPS panel that Dell sells for $409. You can get it about $40 cheaper elsewhere. The Dell tech specs incorrectly identify it as a TN panel. NEC's own announcement says it's IPS with an estimated street price of $379. There aren't any reviews out yet so I have no idea whether it will be color accurate. I can't even determine whether or not it's wide gamut.
Here ya go. I used the 1080p Sunshine trailer on Apple. It's being displayed full screen on a Dell 2007WFP (16:10). Sorry about the noise in the pic, but it was the only way I could see the bezel and crop it out.
Thanks a lot Jodiuh, yup, I can see the bars are smaller ,,, Yup definitely I will get this monitor
Thx again!
Hi there
I got U2410 today and tried it, I was very scared about the negative reports, but... I come from Dell 2001FP and I can say this:
1. There is the diethering issue, but I see it only in the test.
2. When I watched dell FP2001 ftom the top it was same color as from the front, here colour (specially light) change but not evenly, I can see color waving. Anybody else? THis was better on Dell 2001.
3. Changing the input really sucks :-( There should be at least a program for changing it on the desktop
4. The screen is not that bigger from the FP2001, at least not in height. Iguess the diagonal is 4" bigger but it doesn't show on the height.
5. The logo Dell really bothers me as it mirrors light. I'll put a sticker on it.
6. The stand goes up much less than 2001FP and it is too little for me :-(
Everything else I find great.
I got U2410 today and tried it, I was very scared about the negative reports, but... I come from Dell 2001FP and I can say this:
1. There is the diethering issue, but I see it only in the test.
2. When I watched dell FP2001 ftom the top it was same color as from the front, here colour (specially light) change but not evenly, I can see color waving. Anybody else? THis was better on Dell 2001.
3. Changing the input really sucks :-( There should be at least a program for changing it on the desktop
4. The screen is not that bigger from the FP2001, at least not in height. Iguess the diagonal is 4" bigger but it doesn't show on the height.
5. The logo Dell really bothers me as it mirrors light. I'll put a sticker on it.
6. The stand goes up much less than 2001FP and it is too little for me :-(
Everything else I find great.
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Strange. No, the dithering is there as reported by me and several others. I can see it in games, movies and pictures. Just look at these pictures; http://en.community.dell.com/forums/t/19296038.aspx Are you sure you are looking close enough to the screen?
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Hi frameless,
The post on dell site it's mine, but it seems now when I want to log in, my account disapeard. It says no e-mail in their data base.
Does someone has an account on dell comunity forums to post a reply "If there are any news on that dithering ?" so ChrisM can give us an answer from the "lab" ?
you guys here are all just anal and picky...
for the price, and Dell's past success with its previous monitors, there's no reason why you would say no to the U2410, vs NEC or HP, and if you're looking for a "good 24inch IPS monitor".
the only other option is Apple's Cinema LED 24inch display (IPS) with display-port-only for $900 before tax/shipping. good luck.
just buy one U2410.
unsatisfied? problems? ship it back. It's simple as that. I bought a 2408wfp, wasnt satisfied. im not gonna say the problems or reasons, i just said "no i dont want it".
Next morning, UPS man knocked on my door, say "Hi im here to pick up the Dell package?" i was like what? already? that was fast.. i didnt even pack the monitor into the shipping box yet..
Shipping back to Dell was completely free, the UPS man gave me a UPS tracking tag given by Dell for the monitor, the tag labelled [estimated delivery back to Dell '7 days']
3rd morning after shipping it off, Dell phoned me, saying the full refund is in process already. After the weekend, monday, i had every cent back, shipping/tax everything. I spent zero dollars and there was no "15% restocking fee".
I'm grabbing this U2410 the moment Dell next has it on sale/coupons. If i dont like it, i'll send it back again.
whats so tough to decide whether you should get this monitor?
for the price, and Dell's past success with its previous monitors, there's no reason why you would say no to the U2410, vs NEC or HP, and if you're looking for a "good 24inch IPS monitor".
the only other option is Apple's Cinema LED 24inch display (IPS) with display-port-only for $900 before tax/shipping. good luck.
just buy one U2410.
unsatisfied? problems? ship it back. It's simple as that. I bought a 2408wfp, wasnt satisfied. im not gonna say the problems or reasons, i just said "no i dont want it".
Next morning, UPS man knocked on my door, say "Hi im here to pick up the Dell package?" i was like what? already? that was fast.. i didnt even pack the monitor into the shipping box yet..
Shipping back to Dell was completely free, the UPS man gave me a UPS tracking tag given by Dell for the monitor, the tag labelled [estimated delivery back to Dell '7 days']
3rd morning after shipping it off, Dell phoned me, saying the full refund is in process already. After the weekend, monday, i had every cent back, shipping/tax everything. I spent zero dollars and there was no "15% restocking fee".
I'm grabbing this U2410 the moment Dell next has it on sale/coupons. If i dont like it, i'll send it back again.
whats so tough to decide whether you should get this monitor?
Ok, here's my dilemma. I really don't mind the SRGB mode for regular windows and what not, it's fine. But when I jump in Batman his cape looks like it's from 1993 due to the dithering.
So I switch to game because of the lesser input lag and of course the dithering is now gone. But the entire monitor looks draped in red.
I've tried to calibrate it by turning down the red in windows, but it doesn't seem to affect the game. Then I turned it down in the nvidia control panel, but it's even more red in game.
I snagged the ICC file from tftcentral, but have no idea what I'm doing in Windows 7. It doesn't seem to change anything. Are the presets on this monitor that limited? What's the point if I can't change the colors? And why are they all so incredibly different?
So I switch to game because of the lesser input lag and of course the dithering is now gone. But the entire monitor looks draped in red.
I've tried to calibrate it by turning down the red in windows, but it doesn't seem to affect the game. Then I turned it down in the nvidia control panel, but it's even more red in game.
I snagged the ICC file from tftcentral, but have no idea what I'm doing in Windows 7. It doesn't seem to change anything. Are the presets on this monitor that limited? What's the point if I can't change the colors? And why are they all so incredibly different?