confirmed: AMD's big Navi launch to disrupt 4K gaming

chameleoneel

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Yeah, I haven't heard to much but I was really hoping to hear some improvements on encoding, they are so far behind Intel and NVIDIA in this it's hard to recommend them for anyone that needs to do transcoding. I run mostly AMD GPU's but I can't rationalize putting one in my plex server that runs headless, the other 99% of the GPU is useless, I just need encoding/decoding and AMD pulls up the rear. My other 6 desktops run AMD GPU's (4 are Intel, 2 AMD), and 3 of my 5 laptops are nvidia :). I just buy w/e does what I need it to do at the time for the $ I can afford and most are for my kids so $/perf is/was most important. It seems their new cards can keep up with raster @ 4k, hopefully their RT isn't to horrible and they have some slight improvements to encoding and most importantly, they are available ;).
AMD's HEVC is reportedly quite good. but their H.264 is way behind in quality, at streaming bitrates. (under 10,000kbps).
 

JoseJones

Gawd
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Didn't Lisa Su or someone from AMD say big Navi was going to be a "4k killer"? The new XBox X will game at 4k 120fps in at least some selected titles so, why can't big Navi? I've got nutbags attacking me for even mentioning big Navi at 4k 120fps - what's up with that?

Xbox Series X Graphics Performance: "The idea behind these specs is to allow the Xbox Series X to support 4K gameplay at 60 fps across all new games, as well as 8K or 120 fps gameplay for some select titles."

"Xbox Series X Key features: 4K at 60 Fps, 8K, 120 Fps, ray-tracing, fast load times"
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/xbox-series-x-specs-price-features

Xbox Series X can game in 4k at 120fps in at least some games why can't "Big Navi"
https://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/optimized

Xbox Series X's retail box touts 4K 120FPS gaming
https://www.tweaktown.com/news/75082/xbox-series-xs-retail-box-touts-4k-120fps-gaming/index.html

; )
 

Bankie

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Didn't Lisa Su or someone from AMD say big Navi was going to be a "4k killer"? The new XBox X will game at 4k 120fps in at least some selected titles so, why can't big Navi? I've got nutbags attacking me for even mentioning big Navi at 4k 120fps - what's up with that?

Xbox Series X Graphics Performance: "The idea behind these specs is to allow the Xbox Series X to support 4K gameplay at 60 fps across all new games, as well as 8K or 120 fps gameplay for some select titles."

"Xbox Series X Key features: 4K at 60 Fps, 8K, 120 Fps, ray-tracing, fast load times"
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/xbox-series-x-specs-price-features

Xbox Series X can game in 4k at 120fps in at least some games why can't "Big Navi"
https://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/optimized

Xbox Series X's retail box touts 4K 120FPS gaming
https://www.tweaktown.com/news/75082/xbox-series-xs-retail-box-touts-4k-120fps-gaming/index.html

; )

Yeah my old GTX1080 could do 4k/120 in games like Smite or League of Legends too...
 

cybereality

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I think the bigger titles are doing 30 fps and possibly not full 4K (checkerboard, etc.) but lighter/older games might get 4K120.

I'm sure Big Navi could do at least that, it should be noticeably better than the APU in consoles.
 

LukeTbk

n00b
Joined
Sep 10, 2020
Messages
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Didn't Lisa Su or someone from AMD say big Navi was going to be a "4k killer"? The new XBox X will game at 4k 120fps in at least some selected titles so, why can't big Navi? I've got nutbags attacking me for even mentioning big Navi at 4k 120fps - what's up with that?
I am not sure where are you going with that, 4K 120FPS does not mean much without specifying games and graphics, I am sure some stuff can run a 4K -120 fps with any video card that has a displayport 1.3 or more output.

But to an minimum of 120 FPS in 4K in what will be somewhat old game in 2021 is hard even with 3090 in SLI:
https://www.techspot.com/news/86956-dual-nvidia-rtx-3090s-sli-neat-but-certainly.html

I would imagine console will let people choose between high graphic 30 FPS 4K, or lower graphic 60 FPS 4K mode type of typical scenario for bigs game and 4K-120 FPS for platformer.
 

Marees

Gawd
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Messages
754
AMD yet to reveal all their cards, claims RedGamingTech

His "sources" claim AMD has a 3090 competitor in the works !!


 

Marees

Gawd
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Sep 28, 2018
Messages
754
3 SKUs rumored for RDNA 2

  1. 275w - 80 CU @ 256bit (16 GB) ~= RTX 3080
  2. 225w - 40 CU @ 192bit (12 GB) ~> RTX 3070
  3. 150w - 32 CU @ 128bit ( 8 GB) ~< RTX 2080ti
EDIT:
custom 80 CU skus from AIBs likely to have unlimited power target targetting 3090 performance (& price) ??

https://twitter.com/3DCenter_org/status/1313659345721200640?s=20

( So what happened to the 60 CU sku ? Did the short price gap between RTX 3080 & RTX 3070 scupper AMD's plan for a 60 CU sku or was it never in the works !? )

A twitter user today published on social media the preliminary specifications of what seems to be a custom AMD Navi GPU based on RDNA 2 architecture.

16GB GDDR6
255W TGP

~2.4 GHz (Game Clock)

The TGP (total graphics power) of 255W is more than likely for the custom AIB variant. Bear in mind that TGP is not equal to TBP (total board power). The TBP will be higher as it accounts for all components on the PCB. Also keep in mind that Big Navi has a USB Type-C connector, which on RTX 20 series required 30W alone.

https://videocardz.com/newz/amd-nav...hz-game-clock-250w-tgp-and-16-gb-gddr6-memory
 

cybereality

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1602973969662.png
 

StaticShoes

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I'm just going to sit here schlumped with my face close to the monitor waiting for Brent's assessment of these cards. I will cross my fingers this release will be kittens and rainbows because if AMD can have a product that is available and worthy of purchase they will have won a spot in my computer, ...........maybe.
 

griff30

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I'm just going to sit here schlumped with my face close to the monitor waiting for Brent's assessment of these cards. I will cross my fingers this release will be kittens and rainbows because if AMD can have a product that is available and worthy of purchase they will have won a spot in my computer, ...........maybe.
If you can get one before the unwashed masses of crypto miners drive the price of the cards "to the moon...
 

NKD

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Aug 26, 2007
Messages
8,160
If you can get one before the unwashed masses of crypto miners drive the price of the cards "to the moon...

Actually this time. Nvidia has better hand in crypto I believe. RDNA is more gaming oriented so I think gamers might have a better shot lol. Since ampere is more compute oriented this time around. Almost like amd and nvidia swapped hands haha.
 

Marees

Gawd
Joined
Sep 28, 2018
Messages
754
A twitter user today published on social media the preliminary specifications of what seems to be a custom AMD Navi GPU based on RDNA 2 architecture.

16GB GDDR6
255W TGP

~2.4 GHz (Game Clock)

The TGP (total graphics power) of 255W is more than likely for the custom AIB variant. Bear in mind that TGP is not equal to TBP (total board power). The TBP will be higher as it accounts for all components on the PCB. Also keep in mind that Big Navi has a USB Type-C connector, which on RTX 20 series required 30W alone.

https://videocardz.com/newz/amd-nav...hz-game-clock-250w-tgp-and-16-gb-gddr6-memory

Update from same twitter user:

AIB Navi 21 XT cards can go upto 290 watts TGP (memory + gpu & not the rest of the card)

(AIB cards are expected to release in 2021 as per Tweaktown's sources)

If AMD really has a Navi 21XTX card up its sleeve, then power target is likely to be higher than 290 watts TGP for that card

Patrick Schur (@patrickschur_) Tweeted:
- Max. TGP of Navi 21 XT is 290 W.
- AIB partners are testing different TGP for their cards.
- The ~2.4 GHz was achieved with an AIB partner card. So assume that the card was slightly overclocked.
https://twitter.com/patrickschur_/status/1317855621157392393?s=20
 

Ready4Dis

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Messages
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Actually this time. Nvidia has better hand in crypto I believe. RDNA is more gaming oriented so I think gamers might have a better shot lol. Since ampere is more compute oriented this time around. Almost like amd and nvidia swapped hands haha.
Absolutely not true, the 3080 is not very good at crypto (it's decent at hash rate, but sucks power) and the 3090 is an even worse investment. The 5700 is still the best, followed by the 5700XT... NVIDIA cards were much further down. The 3080/3090 are finally getting decent hash rates, but they do so using more power, which is not optimal for crypto. You want the most hashes per watt and nvidia cards are not (and haven't really been) where it's at. The only reason people were scooping up nvidia cards during the mining craze was because AMD cards were sold out, and even though they weren't the best, they were better than nothing.

3080 is about 20% better than a VII @ hash rate, but over 50% more power. Unless you're very constrained on physical space and have damn near free power, it's not worth it. And by free, I don't mean solar, because even solar farms are energy constrained by how much solar they can generate. I mean you're getting really dirt cheap as much as you can use power. It is about on par with a Vega 56 as far as hash/watt.

Some testing that I've found, these aren't mine but should represent close enough:
2080ti - 52.5MH/s - 180watts
3080 - 96MH/s - ~248watts
5700 - 51MH/s - ~140watts
VII - 81MH/s - ~210watts

If you divide it out, the 3080 has now caught up to the 5700 and 5700xt for hashes/watt (or WATTS per MH if you prefer).

Since ethereum is up a bit right now, lets do the math on payback:
@ 96MH/s you would gross $2.32 a day... I estimated $0.12 for electricity (that's what I pay on average), which leaves you about $1.72 per day. This is about $52 a month. If you find one at MSRP $700 / $1.72 = ~407 days. So if you were to invest in a 3080 for mining it would take you over a year of running it 100% (not including AC for your house or w/e other overhead) to get payback.
If you only paid $0.08 in electricity you'd end up netting $1.92 per day, so 700/1.92 = 364 1/2 days! So pretty much a year.

Anyways, all this to say, it's probably not on most miners top list so you just have to compete with bots. Of course the crypto market could boom again and all cards sell out and skyrocket, or it could tank and a massive influx of old cards (the hold outs) may hit used markets. This is only representitive of today, last week the #'s would have been worse, 3-4 months ago they would have been more favorable.
 

Marees

Gawd
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Sep 28, 2018
Messages
754
Update from same twitter user:

AIB Navi 21 XT cards can go upto 290 watts TGP (memory + gpu & not the rest of the card)

(AIB cards are expected to release in 2021 as per Tweaktown's sources)

If AMD really has a Navi 21XTX card up its sleeve, then power target is likely to be higher than 290 watts TGP for that card

Patrick Schur (@patrickschur_) Tweeted:

https://twitter.com/patrickschur_/status/1317855621157392393?s=20

Some power calculations done by Igor of Igor's Lab:

To get a fair comparison with NVIDIA now, you have to look at the whole thing in its entirety.

I had already done the math for the GeForce RTX 3090 and was almost right on the watt. With the actual GPU power (according to NVIDIA’s Thermal Design Guide) of 228 watts for the GeForce RTX 3090, I ended up with only 2 watts difference.

I transfer now the former calculation once to the GeForce RTX 3080 for better comparability:
that’s just a projection on my part, but it’s plausible.

Table02-1.jpg

So we see that the actual power consumption of the Navi21 XT should be about the same level as that of the GeForce RTX 3080!

what happens now with the board partner cards and the factory OC?

Table03-1.jpg

With the smaller version Navi 21 XL the calculation would look like this, because only memory with 14 Gbps is used and also the clock rate of the GPU is moch lower:

Table04-1.jpg

https://www.igorslab.de/en/amd-rade...availability-of-board-partner-card-exclusive/

Via twitter user Avery:
Avery (@Avery78) Tweeted:
The power consumption numbers here is very similar to what to information sent to me last week from people at 2 AIB's. I just didn't share the numbers, but said not much room for OC and also mentioned PWR ~ 3080. This means AMD are going all out :)
https://twitter.com/Avery78/status/1318559052780261379?s=20
 

NKD

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
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Messages
8,160
Some power calculations done by Igor of Igor's Lab:

To get a fair comparison with NVIDIA now, you have to look at the whole thing in its entirety.



View attachment 290831

So we see that the actual power consumption of the Navi21 XT should be about the same level as that of the GeForce RTX 3080!

what happens now with the board partner cards and the factory OC?

View attachment 290834

With the smaller version Navi 21 XL the calculation would look like this, because only memory with 14 Gbps is used and also the clock rate of the GPU is moch lower:

View attachment 290832

https://www.igorslab.de/en/amd-rade...availability-of-board-partner-card-exclusive/

Via twitter user Avery:
Avery (@Avery78) Tweeted:

https://twitter.com/Avery78/status/1318559052780261379?s=20

I think he is overestimating it so it doesn't look bad either way. Look at 5700xt its only 40w for rest of the stuff, yea they are using more memory. But he is being quiet liberal with his estimates. Not sure how we go from 185w 5700xt + 40 watt for rest to almost 80w+ for rest with RDNA 2. We shall see but I would expect overall it to be 30-40 less then what he is estimating.
 
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