Buy used 1080 or Vega 64?

Discussion in 'Video Cards' started by Teenk9, Dec 20, 2019.

Buy a

Poll closed Dec 22, 2019.
  1. GTX 1080

    22 vote(s)
    57.9%
  2. Vega 64

    16 vote(s)
    42.1%
  1. kirbyrj

    kirbyrj [H]ard as it Gets

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    I've had both also, and the blower noise between the two is exaggerated. A blower card sounds like a blower card. If you prefer the tone of the blower on the 1080 vs the Vega 64, then buy the damn 1080. You can very easily modify the fan curve using Wattman on the Vega 64 which is built into the driver. You can't do that with the Nvidia card without a 3rd party app.
     
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  2. ManofGod

    ManofGod [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Well, I just ran mine at 100% fan speed and it was far less annoying and more normal than a 120mm fan at full speed or the Power Color RX580 at full speed, those are terribly noisy at full speed. The card did not even sound like a vacuum or anything, just a noisy droning sound.

    Edit: I am just saying, I had to intentionally run it at that speed because my card never reaches that in real life gaming situations. I played Shadow of the Tomb Raider back in August and never noticed the noise of the gpu overall.
     
  3. Archaea

    Archaea [H]ardForum Junkie

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    maybe you have a better fan model, or maybe AMD has since fixed their fan profiles.

    all kinds of reviews about way too loud of reference blower fans are a web search away. The Vega typically nearly tops the dB charts for spl under load at most any site that tracks and compares card volumes over history.


    LOTs of examples: I don't need to waste more time proving something thats already been proven so many times over by so many different independent reviews. This isn't parroting something someone said online in the way of unfounded rumor.


    kirbyrj

    I could find link after link after link of launch reviews complaining the Vega64 fan was way too loud. Find me one review saying a 1080 reference fan was too loud. Just one.

    if yours and ManofGod ’s are not - then somethings clearly different than the one I and my friends had. Good for you!

    ———
    https://gadgets.ndtv.com/laptops/reviews/amd-radeon-rx-vega-64-review-1793144

    “In testing, we found that our Radeon RX Vega 64 reference card ran extremely hot and loud. The blower fan makes a tremendous noise when the GPU is stressed, and there's an occasional high-pitched whine as well. It's especially noticeable when the fan is spinning up or down. Blasts of hot air can be felt several feet away from the rear vents when the fan is running at full speed. All of this is quite distracting in games, and unsuitable for quiet environments. “


    ———
    ManofGod, Im glad you got a good one and I’m glad you are happy with it. I have no more dog in this, I’ve said my peace. Bowing out and unsubscribing from this thread now. None of us have any need to have internet spats about something so inconsequential.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2019
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  4. Teenk9

    Teenk9 Gawd

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    Well, 1080 is ahead by a bit. I have to buy by tomorrow so half a day left to hear from more posters.
     
  5. ManofGod

    ManofGod [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Is $220 your strict budget?
     
  6. noko

    noko [H]ardness Supreme

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    Either one is a good buy at this time. As for drivers, I own 2 Vega FE's, both in operation, 1 Vega LC in the box and two 1080Ti's, besides a Nano - in use and gaming card I used now is 5700XT AE. Driver wise I prefer AMD due to a superior control panel, more frequent updates, superior features that are also very useful. Gaming wise for drivers -> Nvidia tends to be on top of things but not always but an edge there. I hate Geforce Experience and the spam it seems to generate if used where you have to provide even more information, log in to use it for what??? AMD you get everything and much more right in the drivers. You can look at review after review and see results and tell how many driver issues there are plus owning a Radeon 580 you already know.

    As for reference coolers, AMD Vega 64 LC are pretty damn quiet, much quitter than any Nvidia reference Pascal card - if one wanted quiet (not super quiet as a note) then that is a sure option. The Vega FE's are quiet with stock fan curve only going up to 40%, which for productivity type stuff is not an issue, gaming it will throttle some.

    Predominantly on Vega, increasing HBM2 speeds gives more performance gains then GPU clock speeds, decrease GPU voltage (if you can) increase HBM2 speed and you can see 10-15% performance gains with very little power increase. Increasing GPU frequency and voltage and you start having a furnace.

    1. The Vega FE's both HBM2 will OC to 1100mhz, GPU speed around 1600mhz (just not enough cooling for the GPU to push the frequency up), registry entry has to be made to use the current gaming drivers where you have all the same functions as the gaming cards. Do not know why AMD are so restrictive here but rather easy to do
    2. The Vega 64 LC OC sucks at default temperatures but being a liquid cooled cooler and it works extremely well, cooling the die and HBM down to less than 60c (real easy to do) and then the memory for games will do 1050mhz and the GPU clock maintains above 1700mhz, undervolting this chip is severely limited
      1. I was pushing 600w out of the wall pushing the Vega 64 LC to it's limits on an ITX motherboard, 6700K at stock speeds, DDR4 3200 and one SSD (no HD) 3 fans OCing this card, never saw a card pushing so much power before, at least 475w+ lol ---> ahmmm not worth it but was very fun
    3. 1080Ti's - OC to around 2060mhz, mem also does well up to +100
    The main reason why I use the 5700XT AE over the 1080 Ti's for gaming is that I had issues with the 1080 Ti's with the 144hz Samsung HDR monitor, poor HDR support plus Fresync just works much better with AMD (Edit: to be more fair, I've have not tried the 1080Ti with the Samsung in over 6 months so this could very much be mute now). So the 1080Tis are mining RVN -> may sell them in the near future. If you can put up with Nvidia BS (like Geforce experience) then gaming wise they are still top notch cards.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2019
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  7. Imhotep

    Imhotep Gawd

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    I have 1080 Ti's more vega 64's than i'd like to admit and if I had to pick now v64 would be my choice. In compute tasks it outpaces the 1080Ti with less power draw, so if you like to tinker V64 is hands down your choice ;)
     
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  8. IdiotInCharge

    IdiotInCharge [H]ardForum Junkie

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    If the purpose is purely gaming as clarified by the OP, between the two GPUs listed, the Nvidia GPU is going to be faster and quieter. That's really just the difference between their respective design targets, with the Vega being more compute-focused and, as typical with AMD designs, a bit less performance per watt on the same process node.
     
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  9. Teenk9

    Teenk9 Gawd

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    For used card, yes. More and I'd rather buy new.
     
  10. Imhotep

    Imhotep Gawd

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    If the op decides to run them in Freesync - Gsync the difference is of no importance. VRM design wise and compute there is no argument vega is a better choice.
     
  11. N4CR

    N4CR [H]ardness Supreme

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    Archaea I run dual 180mm sleeve bearing fans at 700rpm and some super silent Noctua 120mm on a passive fin pitch scythe ninja 939 rev 1. I know what quiet and loud is. Normally my hdds are the loudest thing in my rig by far. I can hear a rat crawling around in the bush with skylights open.

    Undervolted with stock fan curve v64 was surprisingly quiet. It gets hot for my liking like 1080 will, but it's not that bad stock curve+UV, low whoosh. If it was pulling 250W + maybe it's another story, or when I set the blower to 60 degrees then yes it's loud aft high pitched, more so in summer.
    Later models undervolt better with silicon ramp, most I've seen are this way. Comparing launch v64 is not as relevant as one built a year or two later.

    OP can keep a look out for LC model perhaps..
     
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  12. Teenk9

    Teenk9 Gawd

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    I'd love to buy a non-reference V64 or 1080 but it would be much more than $220 I was able to negotiate for these.
     
  13. N4CR

    N4CR [H]ardness Supreme

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    Where are you based? Reason I ask is you might have some luck buying used here..

    https://hardforum.com/threads/wtb-vega-64.1988828/#post-1044431395
    Read the last post. 30 bucks gets you aftermarket V64..
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2019
  14. Nebell

    Nebell [H]ard|Gawd

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    Man just looking at that photo... 1080Ti is 55% faster than 980Ti and 1070 is faster than 980Ti.
    Meanwhile 2080 is barely faster than 1080Ti and 2080Ti is 12% faster than 2080.
    While 1080Ti is 30% faster than 1080.

    Not the mention the insane price increase.
     
  15. Teenk9

    Teenk9 Gawd

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    Well the 1080 seller just made the decision for me. Offered the card for $180. I'll be picking up tomorrow!
     
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  16. IdiotInCharge

    IdiotInCharge [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Yeah, Nvidia stayed on the same node while increasing size to increase performance and add features, pushing their largest die to the largest that's ever been produced.

    AMD moved to 7nm... and still haven't caught up in features or performance, and have just barely reached performance per watt parity -- on their second iteration of said new node.

    We're really waiting on AMD to get around to putting their tech to work for consumers, you know, perhaps ahead of Nvidia rather than trailing two years behind.
     
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  17. FlawleZ

    FlawleZ Gawd

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    That's a steal. Can't go wrong there for that price.
     
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  18. ManofGod

    ManofGod [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Yeah, that is a no brainer but, whatever you do, cover your butt and get proof that it works. :) I bought a Vega 64 Strix for $200 here on the [H] about 2 months ago.
     
  19. ManofGod

    ManofGod [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Dude, they produced an entirely new architecture, released two fantastic cards, released some lower end to mid ones and will eventually be releasing higher end ones. They also have RDNA2 coming out sooner rather than later and all well becoming competitive again and making money in just under 3 years. Thankfully, they got rid of Raja, that helped immensely.
     
  20. IdiotInCharge

    IdiotInCharge [H]ardForum Junkie

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    ... debatable...


    ...was a typical assed-up AMD release, with coolers, drivers, and firmware all barely qualifying as beta releases...


    I know your religion demands that you believe this, but we have exactly zero evidence that RDNA2 will be competitive against Nvidia's aging Turing GPUs let alone the upcoming Ampere line.


    Every product that AMD releases for the next few years will have had Raja's hand in them.
     
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  21. ManofGod

    ManofGod [H]ardForum Junkie

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    LOL! Nope, it was not assed up at all but, they did have some issues. As for RDNA2 being competitive, RDNA1 is already competitive so, logic........ :rolleyes: Also, nope, Raja's hand in AMD's products is no more, thankfully. Also, there is nothing debatable about RDNA being entirely new and that is because it is. As for my faith in the One True and Holy GOD, not really sure what you are getting at there.
     
  22. IdiotInCharge

    IdiotInCharge [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Fans jacked, stock cooler on the worst side of AMDs releases, BIOS jacked, drivers jacked... completely assed-up to the point that reviewers were rating it a no-buy on release.

    Logic is AMD is two years behind in performance and performance per watt and features. Maybe when Nvidia releases their next round, AMD will catch up to Nvidia's current products. Maybe.

    Product cycles take longer than that. You know this, but the burden of admitting it may be too high -- regardless, it will be years before AMD runs out of products that Raja influenced.

    So that's why it's low on features and performance :ROFLMAO:

    Now that it isn't Raja, have you gotten that Dr. Lisa Su shrine completed yet? Pictures man, curiosity is killing us!
     
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  23. rmfa

    rmfa Limp Gawd

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    I have both Vega 64 and 1080 reference. 1080 all day long. This uses way less power, is faster in nearly all cases and doesn't make any noise. I use them a lot for VR and the 1080's frame times are also incredible vs the V64. Don't get me started on AMD's drivers. They are (and always have been) miles away from Nvidia's. They are a lot better than they used to be but still not as refined as the green team.
     
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  24. Teenk9

    Teenk9 Gawd

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    Been testing the 1080 today, huge boost from the RX 580 it replaced. Amazingly it's much quieter than the 580 at load.
     
  25. ManofGod

    ManofGod [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I cannot agree with you except maybe on the VR stuff but then again, I have not done VR. The AMD drivers are usually neck and neck nowadays. As for being faster in nearly all cases, you are not correct but, even then, it is not significant one way or the other. That said, the OP got the best deal at $180 and if the Vega 64 had been that price, I think he would have had the best deal then as well.
     
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  26. Auer

    Auer [H]ard|Gawd

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    Grats on the 1080. Good deal.

    Much better choice, cooler, quieter, better gaming performance.

    I almost bought one, but ended up with a RTX 2070 and really glad I did.

    Vega's are a cult card at this stage, and will always have their followers. Whatever floats your boat.
     
  27. ManofGod

    ManofGod [H]ardForum Junkie

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    I cannot agree about the Vega's being a cult card at this stage, especially when seeing the results of this video:

    The 1080 does not have better gaming performance, just better is certain games, which is cool. The statement you made is a blanket statement which is not at all accurate. Also, I love that the person who produced this video overclocked both cards to their max, more or less, and it shows that if you play PUBG or Fortnite, the 1080 would do you better but, not in all games. Heck, and this is with a Vega 56 with a 64 bios flash.

    One thing is certain, the used card market is booming and there is something for everyone, no matter what you want or what you can spend. Thanks to AMD, we now have a booming PC market and yes, it is thanks to AMD since they finally brought competition back. :) (Something many were asking for many years.)
     
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  28. Dark12

    Dark12 [H]ard|Gawd

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    I sold my Vega 56 flashed to 64 because the blower was unbearable.

    Not picking sides here. Just sharing my experience.
     
  29. Rvenger

    Rvenger [H]ard|Gawd

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    The guy got a GTX 1080 for $180. It doesn't matter what the AMD option is at that price. lol


    AMD's latest drivers is killing the experience across the board. Crippling the 5700xt. I just thought I had a dead RX 570 yesterday only to find out it was the latest 2020 drivers black screening the card. At this point I am only recommending Nvidia until AMD fixes their shit. Its getting annoying.


    AMD CPUs are awesome. Graphics cards are meh, and their software blows chunks.


    ** Radeon VII owner here.
     
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  30. ManofGod

    ManofGod [H]ardForum Junkie

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    Really? The only issue I had is that with 19.2.2, the video card will get re detected multiple times on my Vega 64 system. Once they released 19.2.3, that problem was fixed and everything is good to go. At $180, either would have been good but, at $180 just for the 1080, the purchase was a no brainer.

    You could have had a bad fan because I have mine installed in a H200i case and never notice the blower fan. I guess we just have different experiences and that is about it. :)
     
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  31. Dark12

    Dark12 [H]ard|Gawd

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    Certainly could be!
     
  32. Rvenger

    Rvenger [H]ard|Gawd

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    Run 19.12.3. Watch the fun happen on your screen.
     
  33. Auer

    Auer [H]ard|Gawd

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    Different tolerances most likely, Some people hear/smell/see better/worse than others.

    Personally, I hate noise. Others may care less.
     
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  34. Dark12

    Dark12 [H]ard|Gawd

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    Ya or maybe certain pitches.

    Long gone are my days of 80mm Tornado fans. Lol

    My 2070 is whisper quiet and tops out at 62c so I couldn't be happier.
     
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  35. ManofGod

    ManofGod [H]ardForum Junkie

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    It is really only certain pitches I notice, not so much the level of noise. A woosh sound does not bother me but, having a certain pitch can be annoying, especially when I cannot track down that sound. In most ways, it is not the sound coming out of the machine but the reflection off the walls that make the most difference. In fact, I place my ears close to the machine and that sound is not there but, when I sit up, I notice it from time to time.

    I am certain I do not notice it since most of the time, I turn on my computers and any noise does not even come to mind. (Most of the noise I hear is reflected off the walls of my Coolmaster Mastercase 500 system, since it has 5 case fans, 2 fans on the Noctua Cooler and 3 fans on the Vega 64 Strix cooler as well as my Seasonic 1kw PS.) It actually drives me nuts that I cannot track the noise down, since it must be something reflected off the walls. :D
     
  36. Auer

    Auer [H]ard|Gawd

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    https://www.amazon.com/BXI-Sound-Absorber-Absorption-Polyester/dp/B077Q2HYMW/
     
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  37. noko

    noko [H]ardness Supreme

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    The 1080 is a good gaming card no doubt about that and $180 is an excellent buy.

    Getting back to drivers, hmmm video did not show the fabled AMD driver issues . . . Do people who make these comments about AMD drivers even try or have an AMD card? I had issues with both Nvidia and AMD drivers and historically Nvidia drivers had periods of time where they just suck ass. Win 8 era mostly. AMD is constantly updating drivers, fixing bugs at a faster rate than Nvidia lately. Now if you have to have that new game on day 1 -> I would say Nvidia wins more here -> AMD if they have bugs on a new game it usually does not take long to fix for those, usually within 1-2 weeks.

    Today which is most important - AMD drivers are pure Awesome from a feature standpoint and I don't think anyone has properly reviewed what the new interface/drivers have in them -> They litterly blow away Nvidia crude limited feature set into oblivion:
    • Want to know your frame times in the game you just played - yep in the new drivers under advisors with graph after game play
    • Want to OC per game, modified settings per game, launch game, stream to phone -> do all those and much more no problem
    • Video record, use phone to start and stop video recording, monitor performance, look at graphs afterward, OC remotely (Auto setting OCs) -> yep
    • In game, stuck, frustrated and want to move on - Open Browser in game, find the pesky solution and game on
    • Stuff not talked about: Boost, Radeon Chill, easy Hotkey editor, driver upgrade in drivers, Snapshot all settings and profiles to export/inport, report wizard, report issues online
    Hands down I preferr AMD drivers for the most part over Nvidia convoluted interface and the GeFarce Spam Experience. Each company and game develeoper will have bugs on new software - that is how it is - all companies will normally get these issues fixed.
     
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  38. Auer

    Auer [H]ard|Gawd

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    Features matter less if you have black screens in apps like Lightroom (I did on AMD, never on Nvidia). I liked the features on AMD too, but it was other driver related issues that got in the way.

    In the end, it was simply not worth while for me to mess around with AMD's software.
     
  39. noko

    noko [H]ardness Supreme

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    Is that with the new driver or older versions? The new drivers had that issue for some when selecting Game profile but most did not have that with Standard profile. Do no know about 19.12.3

    Here is Nvidia driver today crashing on using Gsync for monitor, newest driver , 441.66. Second attempt worked.

    NVdrvCrash.jpg


    The driver still does not recognize the 10 bit panel and I have to manually select 10 bit in the drivers, otherwise the colors are F. . . Same issue that has not been fixed for over a year. I have not put the 1080Ti's back on the HDR panel to see if all the problems have been fixed and they were many. May do that today. This machine is mainly used for VR and mining, have not tried the 5700XT in VR but the Vega's did not remotely compared to the 1080TI's in VR.

    Using the hideous NV panel settings made me laugh today and Geforce Experience after one failed log in attempt put up three "I am not a robot checks" which when I failed again did the same thing over again - crapola. Ended up using my Google account to log in so both Google and Nvidia can collect data on my behalf, telemetry yea. At least Auto optimize newly added games is unchecked - hate that feature but some would probably like it. I still come away thinking Nvidia is very disjointed in their interfaces, lack many usable features and one has to used 3rd party applications to monitor, OC etc. Interface wise to me there is no comparison, AMD is much nicer and user friendly plus more key features.
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2019
  40. Auer

    Auer [H]ard|Gawd

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    In short, Nv drivers have never given me any grief, work or play. AMD has. I can't afford to sit around and play driver games.

    Telemetry means nothing to me. I dont mess with or tweak drivers. I need stable.