LG 48CX

displayport 1.4 https://www.anandtech.com/show/13060/asus-pg27uq-gsync-hdr-review/3

DisplayPort 1.4 was designed with just enough bandwidth to support 3840x2160 at 120Hz with 8bpc color, coming in at 25.81Gbps of 25.92Gbps of bandwidth

When using HDR paired with the P3 color space, where you’ll almost certainly want 10bpc color, there’s only enough bandwidth to drive it at 98Hz.

Without HDMI 2.1 it's probably going to be lacking some features for other 120hz VRR sources like the next generation of consoles too, and uncompressed hdmi 2.1 audio pass-through for eARC receivers.

https://www.hdmi.org/spec/hdmi2_1

HDMI Specification 2.1 feature highlights include:

  • Higher video resolutions support a range of high resolutions and faster refresh rates including 8K60Hz and 4K120Hz for immersive viewing and smooth fast-action detail. Resolutions up to 10K are also supported for commercial AV, and industrial and specialty usages.More Info...
  • Dynamic HDR support ensures every moment of a video is displayed at its ideal values for depth, detail, brightness, contrast and wider color gamuts—on a scene-by-scene or even a frame-by-frame basis.More Info...
  • The Ultra High Speed HDMI Cable supports the 48G bandwidth for uncompressed HDMI 2.1 feature support. The cable also features very low EMI emission and is backwards compatible with earlier versions of the HDMI Specification and can be used with existing HDMI devices.
  • eARC simplifies connectivity, provides greater ease of use, and supports the most advanced audio formats and highest audio quality. It ensures full compatibility between audio devices and upcoming HDMI 2.1 products.More Info...
  • Enhanced gaming and media features ensure an added level of smooth and seamless motion and transitions for gaming, movies and video. They include:
    • Variable Refresh Rate (VRR) reduces or eliminates lag, stutter and frame tearing for more fluid and better detailed gameplay.More Info...
    • Auto Low Latency Mode (ALLM) allows the ideal latency setting to automatically be set allowing for smooth, lag-free and uninterrupted viewing and interactivity.More Info...
    • Quick Media Switching (QMS) for movies and video eliminates the delay that can result in blank screens before content is displayed.More Info...
    • Quick Frame Transport (QFT) reduces latency for smoother no-lag gaming, and real-time interactive virtual reality

---------------------------------------------

And as already stated the alienware is a fake HDR panel with a 3% 400nit peak color volume window instead of 10%.. 260nit at 10%, with a 110 nit full screen... which is SDR color levels and detail-in-color limits really.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
CNET https://www.cnet.com/reviews/alienware-aw5520qf-monitor-review/
The Good - Games look spectacular and play that way at 120Hz over DisplayPort.

The Bad - It's way too expensive given the tradeoffs, which include no future-proofing with HDMI 2.1 and relatively low brightness.

The Bottom Line - The Alienware 55 OLED Gaming Monitor is a great gaming monitor, but the price premium over a standard OLED TV is hard to get past.

"the monitor has a wide color gamut -- 94% UHDA-P3 in my testing -- but you don't really get HDR. The monitor has such relatively low brightness, that HDR barely looks better. It's rated for a maximum of 400 nits, and that's for a window of about 3% of the screen, where normally the specification is a 10% window. Typically, as the window grows, the brightness drops, and in my testing the peak was closer to 300 nits for a 2% window, and typically about 260 nits for a 10% window. It gets as low as 110 nits at full screen. "

"It just feels like the Alienware 55 has shipped either too late or too early: A year ago, it would have seemed more amazing for the money, and a year from now it would probably have offered more for the money, like a better OLED panel and HDMI 2.1. "
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Vega said:
Would be hilarious if Ampere didn't come with HDMI 2.1 ports...
Click to expand...

I'd be mad. But this is not our only hope. There is another....

JAg0CqV.png

From Club3D(pg 37 in this catalog), using the RealTek chipset that was teased a long time ago, supposed to be out in June.
 
skypine27 said:
Help a fren out here guys:

Im about to pull the trigger on the Alienware AW5520QF, theyre 3K new on Ebay (US shipping) (inb4 no HMDI 2.1, you have to use it in a dark room, and you need a giant desk)

Why is this LG half the price? Whats the 1500 dollar difference here??
Click to expand...

I've seen the 55" Alienware as low as $2,500 just a few weeks back. I wouldn't buy it now the price randomly fluctuates from 2k~3k for no apparent reason.

Quick comparison:

-The only advantage the Alienware has is DP 1.4 so you can get 4k 120hz VRR gaming right now instead of waiting until later this year for next gen GPU's to support HDMI 2.1 (2020 LG CX's can also do this now but possibly without G-Sync VRR people are still testing and bad chroma sub-sampling)
-Alienware also has RGB if that's your thing and a cool futuristic white plastic look (assuming you can even see the back of the TV, which is unlikely)
-The Alienware doesn't have HDR vs a 2019 LG C9 or a 2020 LG CX. Most new AAA coming out since 2018 support HDR now and the difference is noticeable vs non-HDR.
-The Alienware doesn't have HDMI 2.1 ports, which makes it already obsolete especially for next-gen consoles unlike the 2019 LG C9 or a 2020 LG CX that has HDMI 2.1
-The Alienware is almost 2x the price of the 2019 LG C9 or a 2020 LG CX that has HDMI 2.1
-The 2020 LG CX also comes in smaller 48" sizes or larger 65" & 77" sizes if that's your thing
 
MistaSparkul said:
If you get that Alienware the only thing you will be enjoying is 4k120Hz at 444 chroma for about a few months and that's it. Once new GPUs come out with HDMI 2.1 then the LG CX will have the same capability but until then it's limited to 420 chroma at 4k120Hz with current cards. I would say the Alienware would've been worth it when it came out last year but at this point we are so close to new GPUs do you really want to drop $3k now just to enjoy 444 chroma for a few months?
Click to expand...

Also, if I remember correctly, the AW monitor does not do HDR.
 
It's not well documented but the Alienware does do HDR, it's just limited to about 400 nits brightness for whatever reason. It says so in the manual.
 
Sancus said:
It's not well documented but the Alienware does do HDR, it's just limited to about 400 nits brightness for whatever reason. It says so in the manual.
Click to expand...

ick

After experiencing 700+ nits on the CX and 1300+ on the Q90R, 400 nits is weak for HDR. I would much rather have the CX or Q90R for media consumption.
 
improwise said:
I hope you like it more than I did, I returned within one day due to the problem with text rendering due to VA panel + BGR. But as a gaming monitor mostly it is probably nice. The only important thing is if you like it of course :)
Click to expand...

I have been using a Samsung 40" VA 4K as my home monitor for the last 3 years and I have no problem with the text, sure they're not as good as my 32" IPS 4K at the office but I have no problem once I got it set properly at 4:4:4. So far my experience with the Acer is similar and I havn't even gotten around to regedit clear font to BGR. Will play with it more but not too worried since we're getting extended return period with the quarantine so I have plenty of time to decide if I want to keep it.
 
Last edited:
Sancus said:
I'd be mad. But this is not our only hope. There is another....

View attachment 246684

From Club3D(pg 37 in this catalog), using the RealTek chipset that was teased a long time ago, supposed to be out in June.
Click to expand...

Will be interesting if it releases this summer. This site in the Netherlands says literally days:

https://www.centralpoint.nl/kabelad...active-adapter-m-f-art-cac-1085-num-12767833/

This is a curious statement in the catalog:

With its DP1.4 DSC 1.2 video compression technology, this adapter is able to convert DP1.4 video signals to HDMI™2.1, supporting video display resolutions up to 3840x2160 at 120Hz creating life like colors and movements with HDR giving users the ultimate visual experience.

I wonder if they are implying it compresses all signaling via DSC? Even though it's supposed to be visually lossless, could be a negative aspect to using it.
 
Wiz33 said:
I have been using a Samsung 40" VA 4K as my home monitor for the last 3 years and I have no problem with the text, sure they're not as good as my 32" IPS 4K at the office but I have no problem once I got it set properly at 4:4:4. So far my experience with the Acer is similar and I havn't even gotten around to regedit clear font to BGR. Will play with it more but not too worried since we're getting extended return period with the quarantine so I have plenty of time to decide if I want to keep it.
Click to expand...

Well, only you can be the judge of what you like and not like of course. Glad you seem to be happy with it!
 
AngryLobster said:
Rtings published their review and stated that the TV does not support LFC at any resolution. Gotta be a bug because it's a deal breaker otherwise especially for future consoles.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the heads up. Here is the link:

https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/lg/cx-oled

----------------------------

LFC
=======

No LFC (currently?). I don't think it exists on the C9 either.

I wouldn't run anything off of pc at 40fps and lower (which would usually at worst be a 70fps average graph with +/- 30fps variance) - but for sure consoles are in the shallow end of the pool all of the time.

I wonder if LFC would be any different once hdmi 2.1 sources are out. HDMI 2.1 has more features like ALLM, QMS, QFT, Dynamic HDR in addition to VRR so perhaps the VRR implementation could be a bit different over HDMI 2.1. Rtings couldn't have tested for that since no hdmi 2.1 sources exist yet. I doubt it will add LFC by nature of the hdmi 2.1 signaling but I'm still curious about that possibility and in firmware updates as well as the whole chain from the hdmi 2.1 output and console graphics/frame rate output end too.
 
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Seems BFI at 120 Hz is not so great. From the review: "When the TV is set to 120Hz, the BFI isn't timed well and causes duplication in motion, which you can see here."

Regarding input lag they got interesting results. About 1ms more than LG C9 but this might be within margin of error. 4K @ 120 Hz is 11ms input lag which IMO nobody is going to notice. The more interesting thing is 4K with VRR is 23ms input lag, which might be a bug. Personally I could not notice that amount of input lag with my previous Samsung KS8000. Firmware updates might improve the situation along the way.

HDR brightness also seems to be slightly higher on C9 in some situations.

Overall the CX series does not seem to be worth buying unless you want the 48" model. It's practically identical to the C9. Seems like my 65" C9 purchase on sale at the start of the year was a really good choice.
 
Vega said:
I use a Aquacomputer Cuplex Kryos Next CPU block and two Hardware Labs Black Ice Nemesis 420 (6x 140mm high pressure Noctua fans) in an open bench custom setup.
Click to expand...
Thanks, I was curious since I saw you mention it :D. Very cool!
 
I'm buying the 48CX the second it becomes available. Can't wait to get back down to the 48" size and the additional features will be a huge upgrade from my 55B7.
 
Lateralus said:
I'm buying the 48CX the second it becomes available. Can't wait to get back down to the 48" size and the additional features will be a huge upgrade from my 55B7.
Click to expand...

which features are you looking forward to using once you get one?
 
As a newb/tech simpleton (in relation to some of this forum), is there anything I should be genuinely concerned about with this TV for gaming/media that I am actually going to notice? I did hear something about black crush, which I'm hoping can be avoided with adjustments to the settings?

I see all this discussion about bugs and missing features and "deal breakers" on this thread and then I see a mixed score of 9.0 on RTINGs and 9.4 for gaming....
 
Vega said:
Will be interesting if it releases this summer. This site in the Netherlands says literally days:

https://www.centralpoint.nl/kabelad...active-adapter-m-f-art-cac-1085-num-12767833/

This is a curious statement in the catalog:

With its DP1.4 DSC 1.2 video compression technology, this adapter is able to convert DP1.4 video signals to HDMI™2.1, supporting video display resolutions up to 3840x2160 at 120Hz creating life like colors and movements with HDR giving users the ultimate visual experience.

I wonder if they are implying it compresses all signaling via DSC? Even though it's supposed to be visually lossless, could be a negative aspect to using it.
Click to expand...

"Should be coming around June" according to their forums https://insights.club-3d.com/thread/display1-4-to-hdmi-2-1-2/

If this thing works well I'm getting a CX and using it with my 1080ti. No need to wait for the 3k series.
 
DrekkenRidge said:
As a newb/tech simpleton (in relation to some of this forum), is there anything I should be genuinely concerned about with this TV for gaming/media that I am actually going to notice? I did hear something about black crush, which I'm hoping can be avoided with adjustments to the settings?

I see all this discussion about bugs and missing features and "deal breakers" on this thread and then I see a mixed score of 9.0 on RTINGs and 9.4 for gaming....
Click to expand...

If you've never used an OLED TV before, you're going to be blown away. Every display tech has its issues, and OLED is no different. However, nothing is game-breaking. "Deep and Vibrant" is how I would describe this TV.

Go for it. 98% chance it will knock your socks off.
 
AngryLobster said:
The real question here is how come Nvidia is not following their own Gsync Compatible guidelines. I thought LFC was mandatory for it to make it on that list of monitors.
Click to expand...

I thought so too, this is strange. Hopefully a software issue that can and will be fixed.
 
Sancus said:
https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/lg/cx-oled rtings review is up, for those interested
Click to expand...
Seems to be identical to C9 with software upgrade and for some unknown reason HDMI 2.1 bandwidth reduced to 40gbps

Only new interresting feature is 48" model though as much as I do not really need 55" it would be hard to justify paying more for less which is the case right now, especially since I do have enough space for 55"...
 
Ouch, looks like LG messed up the 120 hz BFI.

And the 4K/120 input lag is higher, and the VRR input lag quite a bit higher yet... :(

Looks like I will be sticking with my 38LG for the foreseeable future.
 
madpistol said:
If you've never used an OLED TV before, you're going to be blown away. Every display tech has its issues, and OLED is no different. However, nothing is game-breaking. "Deep and Vibrant" is how I would describe this TV.

Go for it. 98% chance it will knock your socks off.
Click to expand...

Thanks Sir. I'm going to start checking Best Buy for availability of the 48 daily. I know it's unlikely, but would feel better with burn-in protection.
 
Armenius said:
Unfortunately G-SYNC won't work without a GTX 16-series or RTX 20-series card, but you can still use BFI. Don't think that the adapter will change anything about that.
Click to expand...

Why do you think that? Wouldn't the 1080ti consider the active adapter as a DP 1.4 "gsync compatible" monitor, send that signal, and the adapter converts it to hdmi 2.1 VRR
 
sharknice said:
Why do you think that? Wouldn't the 1080ti consider the active adapter as a DP 1.4 "gsync compatible" monitor, send that signal, and the adapter converts it to hdmi 2.1 VRR
Click to expand...
Given there is a conversion of signals here... would this increase lag?
 
Vega said:
Ouch, looks like LG messed up the 120 hz BFI.

And the 4K/120 input lag is higher, and the VRR input lag quite a bit higher yet... :(

Looks like I will be sticking with my 38LG for the foreseeable future.
Click to expand...

They don't show 4k120Hz VRR input lag, just "4k with VRR" so I'm going to assume that's 60Hz. But I also see that 1440p120Hz VRR has higher input lag than 1440p120Hz so one can assume 4k120Hz VRR is also going to have higher lag which is quite a bummer. Thankfully I won't be using my CX for any online play and input lag numbers can always be improved through firmware updates just like they did for the C6 models.
 
MrDeas said:
which features are you looking forward to using once you get one?
Click to expand...

Mainly the 4K @ 120 Hz and VRR/G-Sync. The input lag, even though it appears to be higher at 4K/120Hz (excluding VRR) for now, is still HALF of what it is on my B7 at 4K/60Hz.

Comparing the rtings reviews between mine and the CX, it looks to be an upgrade across the board. Can't wait to get it. LG is also really good about releasing firmware updates, so it's very possible that some of the issues people are talking about will be addressed.
 
AngryLobster said:
Yeah I always aimed for 40FPS+ at native on my C9 as well and never bothered to test 1440p/120hz at low framerate to see if LFC worked but I'd still like it supported for scenarios like 30FPS cut scenes or random drops in super demanding games.

HDMI 2.1 feature list is great but support of each is dependent on manufacturer. I think I read the CX hardware supports QMS but it's not implemented yet and probably never will be given LG's atrocious software support.

If generic HDMI VRR does not support LFC (which is what Nvidia is using here for their Gsync compatible implementation) it makes sense that LG is advertising the CX as *Freesync compatible with a future update in anticipation of next gen consoles. Xbox One X does implement LFC via Freesync AFAIK.

The real question here is how come Nvidia is not following their own Gsync Compatible guidelines. I thought LFC was mandatory for it to make it on that list of monitors.
Click to expand...

I think LG is kinda ok with software support, in the past they released firmware updates to fix various things including reducing input lag. Hopefully we get the same treatment on the CX as I find the input lag figures with VRR enabled to be a little bit on the high side.
 
MistaSparkul said:
I think LG is kinda ok with software support, in the past they released firmware updates to fix various things including reducing input lag. Hopefully we get the same treatment on the CX as I find the input lag figures with VRR enabled to be a little bit on the high side.
Click to expand...

Meh. 20ms is fine with me, don't think I could blind test 20 vs 10 at all, tbh. For those playing competitive FPSes, you can always just turn off VRR. Many(all?) of them should be trivial to run at 4K120 minimum especially with a 3080TI when that comes out.
 
So they confirmed like I posted earlier that the 120hz BFI only works in game mode. gets thrown off in other modes
 
Sancus said:
Meh. 20ms is fine with me, don't think I could blind test 20 vs 10 at all, tbh. For those playing competitive FPSes, you can always just turn off VRR. Many(all?) of them should be trivial to run at 4K120 minimum especially with a 3080TI when that comes out.
Click to expand...

Yeah it's totally fine for me since I'll only be using the CX for slower single player stuff while my 240Hz monitor is used for online play. Just kinda puzzling why 4k has higher input lag than 1440p.
 
DrekkenRidge said:
As a newb/tech simpleton (in relation to some of this forum), is there anything I should be genuinely concerned about with this TV for gaming/media that I am actually going to notice? I did hear something about black crush, which I'm hoping can be avoided with adjustments to the settings?

I see all this discussion about bugs and missing features and "deal breakers" on this thread and then I see a mixed score of 9.0 on RTINGs and 9.4 for gaming....
Click to expand...

For gaming a few cons as it stands now....

-- VRR has a black level bug so the blacks aren't the same awesome OLED black levels you get with Movies/Video. That has apparently existed since the inclusion of VRR in october 2019 on the LG C9 OLED and continues now.
-- VRR increases the input lag well over the 6ms LG quoted, at least according to the RTings CX review.
-- There is no guarantee that the assumed hdmi 2.1 output on the next gen of nvidia 7nm GPUs will allow for 10bit native output, but a lot of us are assuming that support will be there too. You need 10bit on this panel's 40Gbps bandwidth hdmi 2.1 port in order to get 4k 120hz 10bit 444 chroma rather than running 8bit dithered. Dithering helps cover up the banding but it's still there. It also is smudging out the original source material detail slightly. 10bit color is used for HDR material.
-- The VRR has no FRC or frame rate compensation which means once you go below I think 40fps you aren't going to get variable frame rate "g-sync" smoothing anymore and in the past on non FRC monitors this could even introduce judder and such making for a bad experience. FRC basically frame doubles horribly page-y frame rates that are sub 40fps or 30fps to stay in the variable frame rate Hz range of monitors.

For media...

- DolbyVision, HDR10, HDR Black levels outside of VRR should work correctly on a C9, but Dolby vision black levels are broken on a CX currently

- eARC pass-through of uncompressed audio formats does work on the C9 from Rtings' review of the C9 (DTS-Master, ATMOS, etc) but not on the CX , at least as of now
According to RTings:
eARC support : Yes
Dolby Atmos via TrueHD via eARC = Yes

DTS:X via DTS-HD MA via eARC = No

- 48Gbps hdmi 2.1 can send 12bit 4k 120hz 444 which will translate to 10bit on a C9, so there is less question there about nvidia 10bit support to the TV's native specs (10 bit 4k 444 120hz) if nvidia releases 7nm hdmi 2.1 gpus. The CX has 40Gbps so needs nvidia to support 10bit hdmi 4k 120hz 444 off of a hdmi 2.1 gpu. So far nvidia supprts 8bit and 12bit over hdmi but only supports 10bit over displayport.

-----------------------------------------------

They need to fix the
-VRR black level bug on both the C9 and CX
-Dolby Vision black level overall on the CX
-the uncompressed audio pass-through over eARC support on the CX
-confirm 10bit 4k 120hHz 444 VRR HDR support over hdmi 2.1 is coming from Nvidia (via Nvidia/LG partnership) for people considering buying it for that feature.

---------------------------------------------------

About the input lag, yes it is supposed to be around the same or drop slightly at higher rez, at least outside of VRR.
According to RTings, the C9 // E9 // CX have
6.8ms // 7.1ms // 6.8ms at 120hz 1080p
6.6ms // 6.9ms // 6.9ms at 120hz 1440p
NOT TESTED ....................120hz 4k

The C9 and E9 's input lag were not tested with VRR.
The CX is shown as
1080p VRR = 15.1ms
1440p VRR = 15.0ms
4k VRR...... = 23.3ms

That makes me wonder if there is some kind of buffering going on or if it's just overhead.
 
antonlissone said:
Given there is a conversion of signals here... would this increase lag?
Click to expand...
To get input lag you need to use quite a lot of RAM and it would not make any sense to put RAM chips to simple signal converter. There is no use for RAM in this kind of product.

Signal processing itself will always add latency but only minuscule amounts.
The most input lag I could ever suspect from this kind of device is one line because line could possibly fit in internal memory so like 1000ms/120/2160 = ~0,0039ms, but at the same time except decoding DSC there is no reason to load whole lines.
Just processing pixel by pixel is enough for these kind of device.
 
elvn said:
-VRR black level bug on both the C9 and CX
-Dolby Vision black level overall on the CX
Click to expand...

Whoa hold on a minute. The black level bug happens with VRR regardless of HDR or SDR? At first I thought this issue was only limited to HDR but if it happens in SDR as well then this is finally the dealbreaker in me getting a CX.
 
Armenius said:
Unfortunately G-SYNC won't work without a GTX 16-series or RTX 20-series card, but you can still use BFI. Don't think that the adapter will change anything about that.
Click to expand...


Honestly, unless you're playing competitive shooters, You can get by just fine with Fast Sync.

At my target or 1080p 120 hz , It's only slightly higher input lag than Gsync, and gives you the same effect. I've been using it quite happily on my C7 and GTX 960.
 
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